Microsoft Phones Still losing money despite new devices :(

[AlTech]

1.99 for youtube app  :mellow:

It's better than youtube plus microsoft let's you have a 30 day free trial for all paid apps. So you can test if its worth it before buying.

 

It actually is worth it. it's better than the IOS app (used that in the past)  and its supporting and encouraging windows phone development,

 

Sorry my bad it's actually $0.99  here's the official store page for you to see how awesome it is.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/metrotube/9wzdncrfj1r3

[GoodBytes]

1.99 for youtube app  :mellow:

Reminds me of this funny web comic

Source: http://theoatmeal.com/blog/apps

The Oatmeal: http://theoatmeal.com/

[ThinkWithPortals]

Windows phones are bad and they should feel bad.

Kill the non-believer!

Jk, but I love Windows Phone. Almost more than Android, actually. As for iOS, it can go and die in a fire.

On-topic: Aww, that sucks. I like Microsofts' phones. I might be actually buying a Lumia 640, sunce I need a cheap smartphone that isn't iOS.

[wrath]

i think now windows phones are great they just need more apps and more people will use them.

I would use one if there were more apps that are on android

[SansVarnic]

That does not solve the issue people have though. Just look at me for example. I posted a list of 22 apps I am missing on Windows Phone. Sure it's not Microsoft's responsibility to put them there, but it is still an issue I only have if I were to change to Windows Phone. It is the same reason why a lot of people don't switch to GNU/Linux. The third party support is not there.

App support is a huge reason why people don't use Windows Phone and it does not really matter who is at fault because we are still left with a problem regardless.

 

In some ways it does solve some of the issue. Not necessary all of it as it wont please everybody since MS doesn't cater to the casual but more to the professional side of people.

If I wanted a laptop, Ill buy a laptop, Desktop, notebook, and so on. More or less a phone is just a phone and for the size it shouldn't have to be a pc. But now it is (the solution); MS has now come up with the Continuum software were I can take my phone and plug into a screen to utilize it like a mini PC.    This alone gives me no pause to buy this as it will give me so much more freedom for things as not having to carry my laptop around any more. The other thing as far as apps are concerned this opens the WP to the Win10 store which has more apps available and some of those apps are desktop full featured version that can be used on the new phones when attached to the screen interface as when the phone is attached bring up the Win10 desktop UI instead of the Phone UI. This is good.

 

Unfortunately I have to do some conjecturing here since I have not participated in the testing of the new software and I haven't had hand's on with the new phones yet.

I can give my take later when that happens though.

 

No sarcasm intended.

[SansVarnic]

Reminds me of this funny web comic

 

<snip snipitty snip snip>

 

Source: http://theoatmeal.com/blog/apps

The Oatmeal: http://theoatmeal.com/

So True and so funny.

[conspiravision]

I continue to wonder why this is a Topic.  If you bought a Windows phone, I'm Sorry, you've been fooled, move on.  Buy a real phone.  At this point you'd be better off buying a blackberry than a windows phone.

[AlTech]

I continue to wonder why this is a Topic.  If you bought a Windows phone, I'm Sorry, you've been fooled, move on.  Buy a real phone.  At this point you'd be better off buying a blackberry than a windows phone.

Sorry but no. Blackberry has 50% less market share than windows Phone. WIndows Phone is real it's better than IOS and Android in most ways. THe only exception is with regard to apps.

[LAwLz]

In some ways it does solve some of the issue. Not necessary all of it as it wont please everybody since MS doesn't cater to the casual but more to the professional side of people.

If I wanted a laptop, Ill buy a laptop, Desktop, notebook, and so on. More or less a phone is just a phone and for the size it shouldn't have to be a pc. But now it is (the solution); MS has now come up with the Continuum software were I can take my phone and plug into a screen to utilize it like a mini PC.    This alone gives me no pause to buy this as it will give me so much more freedom for things as not having to carry my laptop around any more. The other thing as far as apps are concerned this opens the WP to the Win10 store which has more apps available and some of those apps are desktop full featured version that can be used on the new phones when attached to the screen interface as when the phone is attached bring up the Win10 desktop UI instead of the Phone UI. This is good.

 

Unfortunately I have to do some conjecturing here since I have not participated in the testing of the new software and I haven't had hand's on with the new phones yet.

I can give my take later when that happens though.

 

No sarcasm intended.

How does that solve the issue of me missing over 20 apps if I were to move to Windows Phone? That is the issue most people got. It doesn't matter if it's Microsoft or the third party developers that are to blame for it because regardless of who you blame the issue remains. It's the same as with GNU/Linux.

 

If someone told you "I don't use GNU/Linux because I want to play games and most of those only works on Windows", what would you say? Would you say "that's not a problem because it is the developers fault, not the Linux foundation's". The person who want to play games doesn't care whose fault it is, all they care about is "does it play games? No? Then I won't use it".

Shifting the blame around to one or the other won't solve the issue.

 

 

 

Sorry but no. Blackberry has 50% less market share than windows Phone. WIndows Phone is real it's better than IOS and Android in most ways. THe only exception is with regard to apps.

Can you please give some examples of how Windows Phone is better than iOS and Android? You say that the only exception is regarding apps which implies that in every other way possible, Windows Phone is on par or better.

I disagree with that strongly and actually think it is laughable that someone would make such a claim. I wouldn't even make such a claim regarding any OS (desktop or phone/tablet).

[AlexGoesHigh]

What would be awesome is if Microsoft includes a Android emulator. This is not new for Microsoft. Visual Studio now has an Android emulator

https://www.visualstudio.com/en-us/features/msft-android-emulator-vs.aspx

I HIGHLY doubt that Windows 10 Mobile will have that, else Preview users would be using it, but maybe (crossing fingers) Windows 10.1 Mobile. (of course, you need to exclude games, and expect lower battery life and longer app startup, but hey Android apps)

Honestly, a full emulator would be terrible because of performance, besides ARM not having hardware accelerated virtualization, raw performance isn't there for it to be usable and not lag like hell. Blackberry did that and it went no where, also i'm sure project Astoria exist for this, i'm surprised you forgot they were doing that. 

[SansVarnic]

How does that solve the issue of me missing over 20 apps if I were to move to Windows Phone? That is the issue most people got. It doesn't matter if it's Microsoft or the third party developers that are to blame for it because regardless of who you blame the issue remains. It's the same as with GNU/Linux.

 

If someone told you "I don't use GNU/Linux because I want to play games and most of those only works on Windows", what would you say? Would you say "that's not a problem because it is the developers fault, not the Linux foundation's". The person who want to play games doesn't care whose fault it is, all they care about is "does it play games? No? Then I won't use it".

Shifting the blame around to one or the other won't solve the issue.

 

I was not blaming any one specifically nor am I shifting blame around. My original rant was about the fact that the apps that are available in Windows Phone and other Phone OS's are not properly supported on WP and the App Makers Suck for not following up properly. If they release an app on and OS they need to do the right thing and support it. My rant was also not directed at you either, if you took it that way. I just don't like that people in general want to sit there and complaint that WP sucks because of lack of the number apps. Its stupid and it doesn't matter if it is WP, iOS or Android, there are a lot of people that want to hate on each phone just because of stupid ideals that don't match little personality traits of theirs.

 

I don't hate iOS, I wont buy it because in my opinion it stinks only because of the cultist like following it gets and the ridiculous prices Apple puts on its products. I don't use Apple products for variety of other reasons that go back almost 20 years (for me) but I don't let it get me to the point I go all about saying Apple sucks... because they don't. Apple puts out very competent products that work and are popular. I also choose to use WP instead of Android as I don't care for the UI as I think its a clunky OS and since Google bought it up it hasn't improved much. Dont get me wrong Android has a lot of potential for a lot of things but it did have better potential before Google bought it and before the 3rd version. I find WP to be a vast improvement from Windows Mobile 4-6 and it is quite smooth and user friendly especially in the WP8.1.

 

I am being optimistic about the potential that exists with the implementation of WP10 and the possibility that with this more app makers will begin to support WP10.

 

If the apps you want or need do not exist on Window platform or never become available then the points I am making are not geared toward you. If you are one of the blind haters then maybe it does but that is up to you. There are other apps of similar sort that can do the same job or close to it for each OS. Shoddy apps aside WP offers quite a lot of decent apps as well. For you specifically maybe not as you have pointed out but in general who knows. But I ranted at those that blindly say things that have no basis for saying. A lot of opinion that I have seen lately are based off of 3 things; parroting others, fanboy-ism, and personal experience. The first is the common place, the second is not as common but close and the third I have seen but at least with the third I can listen to an glean something from.

 

 

*edit 

Ok, yes I did blame app makers for being lazy shits for not supporting their own stuff. You got me there.  :mellow:

[ZetZet]

Reminds me of this funny web comic

Source: http://theoatmeal.com/blog/apps

The Oatmeal: http://theoatmeal.com/

never paid more than 1 euro for coffee in my life and movie is 4eur for 2d, 6eur for 3d.

[Ansau]

never paid more than 1 euro for coffee in my life and movie is 4eur for 2d, 6eur for 3d.

 

Yet you paid for a ssd, which does the same thing as a hdd.

 

PD: Please, think twice before posting such lame arguments.

[ZetZet]

Yet you paid for a ssd, which does the same thing as a hdd.

 

PD: Please, think twice before posting such lame arguments.

no it does not. it does not even come close to a hdd, ssd is the best thing you could ever get in your computer. I would take a shittier gpu or cpu instead of ssd every day of the week.

 

I just don't like to pay for a service that's free on all other devices. 

[GoodBytes]

Honestly, a full emulator would be terrible because of performance, besides ARM not having hardware accelerated virtualization, raw performance isn't there for it to be usable and not lag like hell. Blackberry did that and it went no where, also i'm sure project Astoria exist for this, i'm surprised you forgot they were doing that.

Sorry let me clearer

I know about Microsoft Android/iOS to universal apps system, I even mentioned it on this thread.

What I wanted to say, is that it would be nice to have a third option where you have an Android emulator. As I mentioned, battery life would get a hit, performance would also get a hit. But it would be SOMETHING. Also, I have more trust in Microsoft doing a better job than Blackberry, simply because Microsoft has the expertise, and they have made a variety of VMs solutions before as well.

So you have 3 choices:

1- Native Universal App / Windows 8 Phone apps

2- Ported Android app (requires dev to do the work)

3- Emulated Android app (costs performance, and battery life, but simple apps should have no problem (performance wise)). You have something in hand that you can use and enjoy until the developer does option 2 or 1 for providing its user a better experience, something they'll be pressure to do, if they have a larger user base.

[GoodBytes]

I just don't like to pay for a service that's free on all other devices.

It's not a service. It's a person that spend a lot of time (many weeks/months) making an app. He has the right to sale it, to make a living.

Google can make their apps for free as the incentive for them, is that you watch ads using THEIR ads service, and make money on you. YouTube, you have YouTube ads, Google Maps, Google Search, etc. Your data is collected for selling, and targeted ads is provided based on your searches.

[Ansau]

no it does not. it does not even come close to a hdd, ssd is the best thing you could ever get in your computer. I would take a shittier gpu or cpu instead of ssd every day of the week.

 

I just don't like to pay for a service that's free on all other devices. 

 

Well, you clearly show us how little you know about how an improved experience you have with an app like Mytube or Metrotube compared to normal youtube.

 

And my point was to prove how little sense has your argument. You spend more money for a faster storage, and yet you criticize spending money on an app which removes adds, brings better features and full account support.

[LAwLz]

Honestly, a full emulator would be terrible because of performance, besides ARM not having hardware accelerated virtualization, raw performance isn't there for it to be usable and not lag like hell. Blackberry did that and it went no where, also i'm sure project Astoria exist for this, i'm surprised you forgot they were doing that. 

Project Astoria is not an emulator though. Astoria is a collection of APis that are mapped to Android APIs (I believe API level 19 but I am not 100% sure). So it's more of a software compatibility layer (which will require rewriting some parts). The benefits are that it won't have as big of a performance hit (if any at all) as an emulator but the drawback is that the developers will have to put in time and effort to port their apps still.

 

 

 

 

I was not blaming any one specifically nor am I shifting blame around. My original rant was about the fact that the apps that are available in Windows Phone and other Phone OS's are not properly supported on WP and the App Makers Suck for not following up properly. If they release an app on and OS they need to do the right thing and support it.

I think that is perfectly understandable. My guess is that a lot of developers that aren't updating their Windows Phone apps are abandoning them because it is not worth the time and effort to update them. They gave it a shot and acknowledged that the platform existed. When it didn't take off as planned they continued with the updates for a little while and then said fuck it, not worth the time.

Would it have been better if they didn't even try to give the platform a shot?

 

This is what I mean when I say I think Microsoft only got themselves to blame. They seem pretty serious about the platform now, but during the entire phase of Windows Phone 7 and 8 (they seemed to get slightly more serious with 8.1) the platform was garbage. and I don't say garbage like a "lol let's exaggerate because I don't like it". I mean it was several years behind in terms of hardware and software and Microsoft just didn't give a crap about it. iOS and Android were progressing at an incredible rate while Windows Phone stood still.

 

My rant was also not directed at you either, if you took it that way. I just don't like that people in general want to sit there and complaint that WP sucks because of lack of the number apps. Its stupid and it doesn't matter if it is WP, iOS or Android, there are a lot of people that want to hate on each phone just because of stupid ideals that don't match little personality traits of theirs.

That I can agree with. Like 19/20 people talking about phones have no idea what they are talking about.

You have to realize that app compatibility is the number 1 issue most people got with Windows Phone though. They don't just say it because they don't want to use WP. They say it because it is genuinely a major issue. And sadly it's a chicken-and-egg problem. The very same problem GNU/Linux have had for years. Customers don't want it because their programs don't work on it, and developers don't want to make the programs work because there aren't any customers for it. That problem has only gotten bigger and bigger as time goes on, which is why I keep saying it is Microsoft's fault. They had their chance and blew it completely.

[JuztBe]

Yet you paid for a ssd, which does the same thing as a hdd.

 

PD: Please, think twice before posting such lame arguments.

"Yet you paid for 100Mbps network speed, which does the same thing as 1Mbps."

"Yet you paid for Toyota Avalon, which does the same thing as first Golf"

PD: Please, think twice before posting such lame arguments.

[Bouzoo]

Well, you clearly show us how little you know about how an improved experience you have with an app like Mytube or Metrotube compared to normal youtube.

 

And why should he know anything about that? He never said the app is bad, he said he doesn't want to pay for something that is free on other platforms. 

[atrash]

Well, you clearly show us how little you know about how an improved experience you have with an app like Mytube or Metrotube compared to normal youtube.

 

And my point was to prove how little sense has your argument. You spend more money for a faster storage, and yet you criticize spending money on an app which removes adds, brings better features and full account support.

 

Tubecast on my phone works better than the stock android Youtube app. 

[Ansau]

"Yet you paid for 100Mbps network speed, which does the same thing as 1Mbps."

"Yet you paid for Toyota Avalon, which does the same thing as first Golf"

PD: Please, think twice before posting such lame arguments.

 

I'm not the one blaming to pay for an app. In fact, I've paid it

[don_svetlio]

Windows phones are bad and they should feel bad.

So far windows phone has been more useful to me than you, sooooooo, yeah.

[SansVarnic]

 I mean it was several years behind in terms of hardware and software and Microsoft just didn't give a crap about it. iOS and Android were progressing at an incredible rate while Windows Phone stood still.

 

You have to realize that app compatibility is the number 1 issue most people got with Windows Phone though. They don't just say it because they don't want to use WP. They say it because it is genuinely a major issue. And sadly it's a chicken-and-egg problem. The very same problem GNU/Linux have had for years. Customers don't want it because their programs don't work on it, and developers don't want to make the programs work because there aren't any customers for it. That problem has only gotten bigger and bigger as time goes on, which is why I keep saying it is Microsoft's fault. They had their chance and blew it completely.

I agree, MS did not get involved so much with the hardware aspect of the phones so much as focused on getting the OS up and running. When MS and Nokia partnered up it made a vast improvement for both with Nokia's failure OS and Windows fail in hardware they made a good match. One thing I am surprised by the most is that MS Windows Mobile was used mostly on Motorola devices and Motorola never picked up on using the WP OS on their phones instead went with Android. This is were MS messed up and didn't do a good job dealing with Motorola but most likely expected it to happen on its own since Motorola (still uses Windows Mobile 6) on some devices, the invoicing/ inventory stuff, MS probably figured it would be a no brainier and adopt WP7 automatically. Bad on MS for that screw up but then again this one of many things why MS replaced the CEO. 

 

I understand and I am glad you put it that way. It was the same with MS, IBM and Apple back in the day MS had it all in terms of software compatibility and IBM's pc production made it easy for distribution. Apple was stringent with their code and failed in being widely accepted. (We all know this story) Same with Linux today. (sorry not to parrot you) so I do understand.

 

I guess I am just frustrated mostly since everywhere I turn people are telling me to switch to something else "just because it sucks".  :angry:  :mellow:

*edit

But I do get the occasional "that's a windows phone? looks pretty cool, I thought windows phones were cheap things guess I was wrong" comment. Just shows how ignorant people can be. *shrugs*

[Mooshi]

This is what happens when you choose to be a jack of all trades instead of master of one. 

 

When people think of phones, they're either going to get an iPhone or something from either Samsung or HTC most likely if they refuse to support Apple. I've yet to hear one person in real life hype up Microsoft phones, but I've seen my fair share of iPhones and Galaxies. 

 

Then we have the console which isn't bad, but it isn't spectacular either. As far as power is concerned if you want a console, you're going to get a PS4. For unique titles that you're not going to see elsewhere you'd go to Nintendo for their strong first party. Microsoft did a solid job with the 360, but I'm seeing less and less of a reason for big M to even bother with consoles--especially now when 4k TVs are only going down in price while the consoles can't even do a steady stream of 1080p @ 60fps (a feat loads of PCs have been doing years). With Windows being the OS of choice for games, Microsoft is wasting their time with the Xbone and should seriously consider calling it their last console.

 

The one new thing I believe Microsoft is doing right is their surface series which now has pressure levels suitable for professional graphics work instead of nice doodles on the go. I've noticed during the Apple conference that not a single touch on levels of pen pressure which said everything artists needed to know. Meanwhile, the surface series can do 1024 levels (not quite modern 2048 levels of Wacom's latest, but it's still way better than the sub 300 many tablet types had before).

 

Just my 2c