Haier hits Home Assistant plugin dev with takedown notice [Update, see 2nd page]

[darknessblade]

Summary

Appliances giant Haier issued a takedown notice to a software developer for creating Home Assistant integration plugins for the company's home appliances and releasing them on GitHub.

 

Quotes

Quote

Appliances giant Haier issued a takedown notice to a software developer for creating Home Assistant integration plugins for the company's home appliances and releasing them on GitHub.

Haier is a multinational home appliances and consumer electronics corporation selling a wide range of products under the brands General Electric Appliances, Hotpoint, Hoover, Fisher & Paykel, and Candy.

Earlier this week, German software developer Andre Basche, who maintains plugins for the Home Assistant integration for Haier's hOn smart control app, claimed to receive a legal threat demanding the immediate removal of his tools from the GitHub platform.

Home Assistant is an open-source home automation platform enabling users to control and automate their smart home devices from a centralized interface. Apart from convenience and cost, Home Assistant offers superior security and privacy options not available on similar commercial apps.

The plugins offered in the GitHub repositories enable users to control Haier, Candy, and Hoover air conditioners, purifiers, dishwashers, induction hobs, ovens, fridges, washing machines, and dryers through Home Assistant.

According to a notice published by the repository owner, Haier claims these plugins cause the firm significant financial damage and violate copyright laws, requiring the developer to take them down to avoid further legal action.

"We are writing to inform you that we have discovered two Home Assistant integration plug-ins developed by you (https://github.com/Andre0512/hon and https://github.com/Andre0512/pyhOn) that are in violation of our terms of service," reads the notice from Haier Europe Security and Governance Department.

"Specifically, the plug-ins are using our services in an unauthorized manner, which is causing significant economic harm to our Company."

"We take the protection of our intellectual property very seriously and demand that you immediately cease and desist all illegal activities related to the development and distribution of these plug-ins."

 

My thoughts

This is nothing but a scummy move from a company that doesn't like local integrations for devices, and wants users to pay a large monthly fee, to use their devices they legally bought and own.

They want FULL control, and want to milk as much data from their consumers as they can. not forgetting that if you offend them in any way they can remote shut down your devices you legally own

 

There is a reason why open standards like Matter, threads or Zigbee should exist, and  manufacturers are forced to use them. its to prevent hundreds of walled garden apps for each smarthome device. 

 

Like with homeassistant you have 1 app for all your devices, not 100 because the manufacturer couldn't be bothered to combine it into one app. and that it does not force a always online DRM cloud subscription to use your device trough your smartphone.

 

 

Sources

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/haier-hits-home-assistant-plugin-dev-with-takedown-notice/#:~:text=According to a notice published,to avoid further legal action.

[Levent]

Nice, another Chinese company to my blacklist.

[Lunar River]

What is everyone's obsession with buying appliances that connect to the internet...

[darknessblade]

1 minute ago, Levent said:

Nice, another Chinese company to my blacklist.

True, I will NOT get any Haier products in the upcoming years, as long as they do not use a standard like zigbee, threads, or matter.

 

When it comes to 3rd party support by chinese companies, even a company like Tuya is more open with addons like "local tuya"

"YES you do need to update/request a renewal roughly every 6 months for your dev-account/project, if you use tuya products, but its less of a headache than having to use 5+ apps, with a shitty halfbaked official plugin"

 

Not forgetting most tuya products can be flashed by either Tasmota, Openbeken or ESPHome.

 

 

 

 

[Shimejii]

9 minutes ago, Lunar River said:

What is everyone's obsession with buying appliances that connect to the internet...

because most people that have 0 clue what this stuff can do think "Oh its so much easier". Dumb tech = best for appliances. I will not buy any appliance that has smart features if i can help it.

[OhioYJ]

1 hour ago, Levent said:

Nice, another Chinese company to my blacklist.

I think this is almost a Streisand Effect thing. Even as some who has messed with Home Assistant, and owner of a "smart home" I've never heard of Haier. Now I have and for the wrong reason. You can bet they won't be selling me anything. 

[SorryBella]

4 hours ago, Levent said:

Nice, another Chinese company to my blacklist.

Not like you want a Haier product in your life ever, all my Haier products just goes out the door obsolete within a year. They are the chinesium of chinesium in chinese tech.

[Donut417]

6 hours ago, Lunar River said:

What is everyone's obsession with buying appliances that connect to the internet...

I ask myself that every day. You need your washer machine radioing back your laundry habits, because thats what its doing. These devices tend to have horrible security. All I need is for my network to get compromised due to a crappy smart device.

[Fasterthannothing]

If a device can't integrate into home assistant without requiring integration of a external companies authentication or servers I've started staying away. Everything I've bought has been something with z wave or other local direct connection.

[thechinchinsong]

3 hours ago, SorryBella said:

Not like you want a Haier product in your life ever, all my Haier products just goes out the door obsolete within a year. They are the chinesium of chinesium in chinese tech.

Eh, they made decent stuff before their push to smart stuff too. All my aunts in China have had their Haier washing machines for like 2 decades so far not replacing them. Its mostly the useless push to "smart" stuff and planned obsolescence that affects everyone. You get what you pay for really.

[RejZoR]

19 hours ago, Lunar River said:

What is everyone's obsession with buying appliances that connect to the internet...

Some do make sense, but not all. Like for example, AC unit being online capable is useful, not gonna lie. Robot vacuum as well. I've recently bought "smart" wall sockets to remotely power on/off schedule or set warnings for devices plugged into them. I can do various setups with them, for example one use was to set a rule that this smart socket sends me a notification when power load drops to 1W for my 3D printer. 3D printer has no online capability and I essentially gave it one. When printer finishes, its power load drops and the smart socket sends notification to my phone for that rule so I know printing finished. Either I go inspect it or I remotely turn printer off so it doesn't run all night without doing anything, all without having to go to workshop late in evening or even during day if it's raining like crazy or snowing. Is it necessary? No. Is it very convenient, yes.

 

All these devices have in common that they don't need any other intervention or preparation. Another story are things like washing machines, dishwashers, ovens and stuff where you have to prepare 90% of operation ahead or after and all the online functionality is literally just for operation notification and nothing else really. You still need to fill them with dishes or laundry and take it out after. Is some of this convenient, yes. But most of the time you can live without it just fine.

 

My personal stupidest connectivity with app and online are electric toothbrushes and shavers. These have to top the chart of unnecessary app connectivity for sure.

[darknessblade]

On 1/19/2024 at 5:37 PM, RejZoR said:

Some do make sense, but not all. Like for example, AC unit being online capable is useful, not gonna lie. Robot vacuum as well. I've recently bought "smart" wall sockets to remotely power on/off schedule or set warnings for devices plugged into them. I can do various setups with them, for example one use was to set a rule that this smart socket sends me a notification when power load drops to 1W for my 3D printer. 3D printer has no online capability and I essentially gave it one. When printer finishes, its power load drops and the smart socket sends notification to my phone for that rule so I know printing finished. Either I go inspect it or I remotely turn printer off so it doesn't run all night without doing anything, all without having to go to workshop late in evening or even during day if it's raining like crazy or snowing. Is it necessary? No. Is it very convenient, yes.

 

All these devices have in common that they don't need any other intervention or preparation. Another story are things like washing machines, dishwashers, ovens and stuff where you have to prepare 90% of operation ahead or after and all the online functionality is literally just for operation notification and nothing else really. You still need to fill them with dishes or laundry and take it out after. Is some of this convenient, yes. But most of the time you can live without it just fine.

 

My personal stupidest connectivity with app and online are electric toothbrushes and shavers. These have to top the chart of unnecessary app connectivity for sure.

One benefit with smart-plugs when using it with 3D printers, is that when you put a Camera on the printer you can remote shut-down the printer in case it goes wrong, and it starts printing in the air/creating a GLOPTOP.

 

 

 

[mr moose]

They are well within their rights to protect their own IP and business model, if you don't like it then don't buy their products.  That's how a free market works. 

 

Now, if they were preventing you from writing your own software and hacking a device you purchased then that is a different story.

 

 

 

 

[LAwLz]

I always find it fascinating that whenever a Chinese company does something bad the comments are always full of people mentioning that fact, and saying things like "typical China" or whatever. But whenever it's a US company that does this (and there are plenty of examples of this) nobody ever goes "typical American company behavior" or "another US company to boycott". 

It's especially weird in this case since it was the European division of the company who did this, but let's not have that fact get in the way of justifying racism... 

 

 

Anyway, it will be interesting to see where this goes. It highly depends on how the program works whether or not it actually does something illegal. Personally I hope it isn't illegal, and that it stays up, hopefully discouraging other companies from attempting to go after plug-in developers. 

 

Does anyone know how they arrived at the idea that this plug-in causes them to lose money comes from? Does this plug-in give access to some services that are suppose to cost money, or is it just data harvesting? 

[Jinchu]

1 minute ago, LAwLz said:

I always find it fascinating that whenever a Chinese company does something bad the comments are always full of people mentioning that fact, and saying things like "typical China" or whatever. But whenever it's a US company that does this (and there are plenty of examples of this) nobody ever goes "typical American company behavior" or "another US company to boycott". 

It's especially weird in this case since it was the European division of the company who did this, but let's not have that fact get in the way of justifying racism...

Reminds me of "Prices are high because companies are greedy". Don't get me wrong companies are greedy, but they have been greedy for past 500 years, so the argument that something is more expensive now than five years ago does have nothing to do with the corporate greed.

[RejZoR]

9 minutes ago, Jinchu said:

Reminds me of "Prices are high because companies are greedy". Don't get me wrong companies are greedy, but they have been greedy for past 500 years, so the argument that something is more expensive now than five years ago does have nothing to do with the corporate greed.

They are just super ultra greedy today. Just the amount of shitty practices and paycheck disparity between workforce and leadership has never been this stupid high to a point it's equated with legalized slavery. Work hard and long and you too will get a handful of peanuts thrown at you. That's their moto today.

[Jinchu]

23 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

They are just super ultra greedy today. Just the amount of shitty practices and paycheck disparity between workforce and leadership has never been this stupid high to a point it's equated with legalized slavery. Work hard and long and you too will get a handful of peanuts thrown at you. That's their moto today.

The reason why they do it is that they can get away with that. If they were able to do that in 1970's they would have. If the were able to do that in the 1870's... wait that is exactly what they did then. Corporate structure has always been aimed at maximizing profit.

[Avocado Diaboli]

On 1/18/2024 at 10:14 PM, Lunar River said:

What is everyone's obsession with buying appliances that connect to the internet...

A smart appliance doesn't require an internet connection to be useful to you within your own network. Even just having a closed off local network that doesn't connect to the wider internet is useful for scheduling things through automation.

 

18 hours ago, mr moose said:

They are well within their rights to protect their own IP and business model, if you don't like it then don't buy their products.  That's how a free market works. 

 

Now, if they were preventing you from writing your own software and hacking a device you purchased then that is a different story.

Yeah, we know you love to say that every time a corporation tries to pull anti-consumer bullshit. "Just go to the next company that doesn't fuck you over" is basically your only mode. And it ignores that no such companies exist anymore. How's that free market working out for ya?

[Kisai]

On 1/18/2024 at 1:07 PM, darknessblade said:

Summary

Appliances giant Haier issued a takedown notice to a software developer for creating Home Assistant integration plugins for the company's home appliances and releasing them on GitHub.

 

Quotes

 

My thoughts

This is nothing but a scummy move from a company that doesn't like local integrations for devices, and wants users to pay a large monthly fee, to use their devices they legally bought and own.

They want FULL control, and want to milk as much data from their consumers as they can. not forgetting that if you offend them in any way they can remote shut down your devices you legally own

 

We should have seen the writing on the wall with John Deere's tractors and McDonalds Ice cream machines being constantly out of service.

 

Being unable to service, or even get proper diagnostic information out of a device about a failure, leads to service calls. Service calls make money for the company who sells the device.

 

Like, realistically it should be illegal to make hardware depend on internet access to work. Because that means the hardware is completely inoperable without internet, without power, and if the manufacturer goes out of business, it's now a paperweight.

 

On the plus side, this does push some innovation. Think about all the CANBUS II dongles (that sometimes damage the car) that provide services that you'd normally have to expensive diagnostic equipment for, or just getting basic data out of it to sync with video and GPS for a dashcam. Even insurance companies got in on this.

 

This goes doubly for services like Sony/Nintendo/Microsoft/Steam/iOS/Google's app stores. The user should have a means of restoring their purchases indefinitely, even if the seller of the program has removed it from sale. To do otherwise is theft of the license, and should demand a refund at full retail price.

 

 

[Godlygamer23]

1 hour ago, Avocado Diaboli said:

A smart appliance doesn't require an internet connection to be useful to you within your own network. Even just having a closed off local network that doesn't connect to the wider internet is useful for scheduling things through automation.

A network connection is not required in order to make the device automate itself. It can all be self-contained within the device itself.

[Avocado Diaboli]

15 minutes ago, Godlygamer23 said:

A network connection is not required in order to make the device automate itself. It can all be self-contained within the device itself.

Sure, but you can still interconnect things in ways to create automatic routines between devices. Or, you know, just to check into something remotely. For that to happen, you need some form of network connection.

 

As an example, my dad put up solar panels on his roof this year. He used an Arduino to time when the dumb water boiler should start heating up water, basically when the solar panels produce an excess in power, because the hot water at least acts as a rudimentary battery. And sure, he bought a dumb device and retrofitted it with smart capabilities. But having that out of the box and wrapped up nicely with a convenient front-end is much better than coding the damn thing from scratch yourself like he did, with the benefit of 40 years in software development.

 

He also put an ultrasonic sensor from a car into his oil tank and hooked up another Arduino to send him a message whenever the oil level drops below a certain threshold. Saves him time to go look into the tank himself to check if it's time to order a refill.

 

None of these solutions have any connection to the wider internet, they can work entirely on isolated local networks. But they serve simple purposes that he can check directly from his phone. A self-contained unit without a network connection requires you get in front of it yourself.

[jagdtigger]

Wait, aint oracle lost a court case against google using their API serving as a precedent?   Besides the company didnt achieve anything, that repo got cloned and downloaded a gazillion times already......

[Lunar River]

4 hours ago, Avocado Diaboli said:

A smart appliance doesn't require an internet connection to be useful to you within your own network. Even just having a closed off local network that doesn't connect to the wider internet is useful for scheduling things through automation.

What automation?

 

All appliances that I can think of require some kind of human input.

Washing machine: have to load it

Dish washer: have to load it

Dryer: have to load it

Fridge: I don't think I've done anything to my fridge since I bought it

Oven: still have to put food in it

Air conditioning: timers and sensors already exist to control when they come on and temperature control.

 

There is nothing that I can think of where having it app connected to the network of the house you're in that makes it anything more than a massive gimmick.

 

In which case my stance also includes: What is everyone's obsession with buying appliances that connect to your network?

[TheGreatestGazoo]

2 hours ago, Lunar River said:

In which case my stance also includes: What is everyone's obsession with buying appliances that connect to your network?

"Everyone" is not obsessed with connected appliances - that is a very general statement. I think what you may mean is why is every manufacturer obsessed with creating and marketing connected appliances. And the answer to that is obvious - money. For example, try buying a new TV that does not connect. I.E. "dumb TV" - they don't exist because the manufactures can harvest your data and sell it or sell direct advertising to your TV.

[jagdtigger]

15 minutes ago, TheGreatestGazoo said:

For example, try buying a new TV that does not connect.

AFAIK most (meaning almost all of them) dont require it. I was forced to buy a smart TV because only small ones available in normal versions without the "smart" junk. It has network access but it is isolated from the internet (even if it changes MAC address[doubt manufacturers would go that far risking a lawsuit]) it cant circumvent the firewall.......