Tommy Hilfiger are Filthy Scammers

[papajo]

2 hours ago, Neroon said:

Look for it?

I have better things to do with my life and also I don't need to my point is valid even if there is no EXACT 100% same backpack on aliexpress since we are talking about a BACKPACK there are millions if not billions of places in the world who poses basic skills and tools to create such a simple concept a BACKPACK. its not a satellite lol...

P.S Quality doesnt mean expensive especially when we are talking about simple stuff like backpacks I went to school  almost 30 years ago I had a polo backpack which I paid like 40 euros on it and it wasnt on sale or anything that backpack lived through hell and beyond  and back then we had books lots of them and heavy.. and I bought it from a store in my village so the middle man of the middle man and where I am from there is VAT as well... so you dont need to spend big bucks to have a backpack made out of quality materials 

 

2 hours ago, Neroon said:

Btw the main difference between the backpack and this set, is that besides that the backpack is I believe like 175 to produce, and thus the margins are much slimmer, but it's also about quality.

No the main difference is that (at least if you are not a child/hardcore ltt fan ) that you knowingly pay an inflated price to get something in order to support your creator (actually typing this made me feel stupid since this belongs to the hardcore fan category either way since linus is a huge money machine and doesnt need such kind of support in the sense that if nobody buys ltt stuff then they wont have money to make more videos its just an additional cashcow but I digress).

While in the Tommy Hifiger case you just pay to get something because you trust the brand or because (and this is something I already touched in my previous post but forgot to elaborate a little further) it is actually not a bad deal to get 3 things for 150 given our horrendous pc market and what it mutates into... like things are so overpriced that I believe the fact that in the video they claimed that they tried to find the other 3 items in sale prices is just an other sad indication of the mysery of the PC market THEY COULDNT ACTUALLY FIND ANYTHING DECENT AT THE SAME PRICE lol..hence they resorted to pretend that "the items may retail for more but deals of them are not hard to catch" and this says a lot about the state of the pc/tech market.

My younger self form 2010 could easily find big brand products that would cost half the price of the HT set but be like 100% better and higher quality (and frankly I still have such stuff working to date) their only "negative" would be that they would not have RGB...

rgb was the first gate of hell, once they realized that if they slap cheap 10 cent RGB leds that people would buy the same stuff but double the price then the downhill towards our current state started and the manufacturer's quest to find more ways (besides RGB) to exploit the kids and the rest of us begun and oh god have they found scams and tricks. 

like ony the nzxt keyboard costs (which as I already said is a bad value for money as everything else in this industry) as much as the entire tommy hifinger set and frankly I really doubt that even if the logitech mouse the steelseries headset and the nzxt keyboard can be found at sale/""""Bargain"""" (the many quotes are deliberate) price that their total price wont be at least $200 

+ you get warranty and availability (thats an other plus compared to buy the same chinese stuff from alibaba good luck to handle an RMA to china for cheap headphones and also the waiting time for delivery is huge.. ) 


And do not get me wrong I am not defending the set it is cheap sh1t what I am saying is that I dont understand all the "pikachu face" in the forum since the same $/value ratio that this set has is more or less the norm nowadays in anything sold in the PC/gamingPC industry (read my previous post for more on what I mean) 

So this is just an other similar value product proposition same sh1t different day(or brand) lol 


 

[LinusTech]

1 hour ago, papajo said:

I have better things to do with my life and also I don't need to my point is valid even if there is no EXACT 100% same backpack on aliexpress since we are talking about a BACKPACK there are millions if not billions of places in the world who poses basic skills and tools to create such a simple concept a BACKPACK. its not a satellite lol...

P.S Quality doesnt mean expensive especially when we are talking about simple stuff like backpacks I went to school  almost 30 years ago I had a polo backpack which I paid like 40 euros on it and it wasnt on sale or anything that backpack lived through hell and beyond  and back then we had books lots of them and heavy.. and I bought it from a store in my village so the middle man of the middle man and where I am from there is VAT as well... so you dont need to spend big bucks to have a backpack made out of quality materials 

 

No the main difference is that (at least if you are not a child/hardcore ltt fan ) that you knowingly pay an inflated price to get something in order to support your creator (actually typing this made me feel stupid since this belongs to the hardcore fan category either way since linus is a huge money machine and doesnt need such kind of support in the sense that if nobody buys ltt stuff then they wont have money to make more videos its just an additional cashcow but I digress).

While in the Tommy Hifiger case you just pay to get something because you trust the brand or because (and this is something I already touched in my previous post but forgot to elaborate a little further) it is actually not a bad deal to get 3 things for 150 given our horrendous pc market and what it mutates into... like things are so overpriced that I believe the fact that in the video they claimed that they tried to find the other 3 items in sale prices is just an other sad indication of the mysery of the PC market THEY COULDNT ACTUALLY FIND ANYTHING DECENT AT THE SAME PRICE lol..hence they resorted to pretend that "the items may retail for more but deals of them are not hard to catch" and this says a lot about the state of the pc/tech market.

My younger self form 2010 could easily find big brand products that would cost half the price of the HT set but be like 100% better and higher quality (and frankly I still have such stuff working to date) their only "negative" would be that they would not have RGB...

rgb was the first gate of hell, once they realized that if they slap cheap 10 cent RGB leds that people would buy the same stuff but double the price then the downhill towards our current state started and the manufacturer's quest to find more ways (besides RGB) to exploit the kids and the rest of us begun and oh god have they found scams and tricks. 

like ony the nzxt keyboard costs (which as I already said is a bad value for money as everything else in this industry) as much as the entire tommy hifinger set and frankly I really doubt that even if the logitech mouse the steelseries headset and the nzxt keyboard can be found at sale/""""Bargain"""" (the many quotes are deliberate) price that their total price wont be at least $200 

+ you get warranty and availability (thats an other plus compared to buy the same chinese stuff from alibaba good luck to handle an RMA to china for cheap headphones and also the waiting time for delivery is huge.. ) 


And do not get me wrong I am not defending the set it is cheap sh1t what I am saying is that I dont understand all the "pikachu face" in the forum since the same $/value ratio that this set has is more or less the norm nowadays in anything sold in the PC/gamingPC industry (read my previous post for more on what I mean) 

So this is just an other similar value product proposition same sh1t different day(or brand) lol 


 

I will personally give you $10,000 if you can find our backpack or our screwdriver on aliexpress or some other direct from China marketplace. 

 

Now there's no excuse. 

 

Do it. 

[Fendrick]

50 minutes ago, LinusTech said:

I will personally give you $10,000 if you can find our backpack or our screwdriver on aliexpress or some other direct from China marketplace. 

 

Now there's no excuse. 

 

Do it. 

Solidarity, love it.

[Kid.Lazer]

6 hours ago, LinusTech said:

I will personally give you $10,000 if you can find our backpack or our screwdriver on aliexpress or some other direct from China marketplace. 

 

Now there's no excuse. 

 

Do it. 

You might want to put a time cap on that challenge. At some point in the distant future it might happen.

[chocolatekarma]

How on earth does a thread about a crappy peripheral set turn into one about backpacks and screwdrivers?

[Kid.Lazer]

26 minutes ago, chocolatekarma said:

How on earth does a thread about a crappy peripheral set turn into one about backpacks and screwdrivers?

Welcome to the internet. You must be new here.

[tkitch]

1 hour ago, chocolatekarma said:

How on earth does a thread about a crappy peripheral set turn into one about backpacks and screwdrivers?

some people think LTT merch is overpriced, instead of just expensive products.

(Especially the backpack and screwdriver, they assume they're 10-20$ items with a boatload of markup, because haters gonna hate)

[Middcore]

1 hour ago, chocolatekarma said:

How on earth does a thread about a crappy peripheral set turn into one about backpacks and screwdrivers?

The backpack and screwdriver are just an irrational bete noire for some people here, and others will turn literally any topic into an opportunity to ramble about the nefarious conspiracy against PC gamers they're unshakably convinced exists. 

[Neroon]

5 hours ago, papajo said:

I have better things to do with my life and also I don't need to my point is valid even if there is no EXACT 100% same backpack on aliexpress since we are talking about a BACKPACK there are millions if not billions of places in the world who poses basic skills and tools to create such a simple concept a BACKPACK. its not a satellite lol...

P.S Quality doesnt mean expensive especially when we are talking about simple stuff like backpacks I went to school  almost 30 years ago I had a polo backpack which I paid like 40 euros on it and it wasnt on sale or anything that backpack lived through hell and beyond  and back then we had books lots of them and heavy.. and I bought it from a store in my village so the middle man of the middle man and where I am from there is VAT as well... so you dont need to spend big bucks to have a backpack made out of quality materials 

 

No the main difference is that (at least if you are not a child/hardcore ltt fan ) that you knowingly pay an inflated price to get something in order to support your creator (actually typing this made me feel stupid since this belongs to the hardcore fan category either way since linus is a huge money machine and doesnt need such kind of support in the sense that if nobody buys ltt stuff then they wont have money to make more videos its just an additional cashcow but I digress).

While in the Tommy Hifiger case you just pay to get something because you trust the brand or because (and this is something I already touched in my previous post but forgot to elaborate a little further) it is actually not a bad deal to get 3 things for 150 given our horrendous pc market and what it mutates into... like things are so overpriced that I believe the fact that in the video they claimed that they tried to find the other 3 items in sale prices is just an other sad indication of the mysery of the PC market THEY COULDNT ACTUALLY FIND ANYTHING DECENT AT THE SAME PRICE lol..hence they resorted to pretend that "the items may retail for more but deals of them are not hard to catch" and this says a lot about the state of the pc/tech market.

My younger self form 2010 could easily find big brand products that would cost half the price of the HT set but be like 100% better and higher quality (and frankly I still have such stuff working to date) their only "negative" would be that they would not have RGB...

rgb was the first gate of hell, once they realized that if they slap cheap 10 cent RGB leds that people would buy the same stuff but double the price then the downhill towards our current state started and the manufacturer's quest to find more ways (besides RGB) to exploit the kids and the rest of us begun and oh god have they found scams and tricks. 

like ony the nzxt keyboard costs (which as I already said is a bad value for money as everything else in this industry) as much as the entire tommy hifinger set and frankly I really doubt that even if the logitech mouse the steelseries headset and the nzxt keyboard can be found at sale/""""Bargain"""" (the many quotes are deliberate) price that their total price wont be at least $200 

+ you get warranty and availability (thats an other plus compared to buy the same chinese stuff from alibaba good luck to handle an RMA to china for cheap headphones and also the waiting time for delivery is huge.. ) 


And do not get me wrong I am not defending the set it is cheap sh1t what I am saying is that I dont understand all the "pikachu face" in the forum since the same $/value ratio that this set has is more or less the norm nowadays in anything sold in the PC/gamingPC industry (read my previous post for more on what I mean) 

So this is just an other similar value product proposition same sh1t different day(or brand) lol 


 

Look the whole "you can buy this almost indestructible backpack for 40 bucks" story, is getting pretty tiring. No one here will ever say that you can't buy a really strong backpack for that amount of money. No one is saying that the LTT backpack is the best deal on the planet. Why? Because there are fantastic backpacks for low prices, I had an Eastpak that just kept going, absolutely fantastic quality. And 250 for a backpack is a lot.

 

But that doesn't mean your argument is valid. A 40 dollar backpack is not gonna do what the LTT backpack does. Strong material is not the same as proper padding, lots of pockets etc.

You are comparing a compact Kia with a BMW SUV, and claim the Kia is just as good or even better because they are cheaper to buy (and maintain - let's be fair), and sure they can both transport people and all that, but that doesn't mean they are the same, it doesn't mean they can do the same thing.

The LTT backpack is a luxury item, it's not meant to stick your schoolbooks in. 
You don't need to like it, or think it's worth the money, but don't compare it to simple backpacks or the price of massive corporations that sell millions of bags, and can produce at much lower prices.

 

People can make their own decisions as to what to buy, as someone who has spend more on a camera bag, I can understand why people spend a lot of money on the bag that does exactly what they want. I see it as a niche product, and yes plenty of fans will buy it, and guess what, that's their decision. Like I said I don't take issue with expensive stuff, I take issue with overpriced crap. Afaik their backpack is not crap at all, so who am I to say it's wrong to buy or sell that bag.

 

As for inflated prices in general, I'd have to strongly disagree. When I look at the majority of their stuff, I can only say they are competitive actually. For example Ikea's deskpad (90x40) is 20 euro, my 120x40 LTT one was 30 and way higher quality, stitching all around instead of those rough sides etc. T-shirts, well you can obviously get cheap ones for like 5-10 bucks, but if I want a nice print, I easily pay 20, as are LTT's. The screwdriver, man how do you even price that? You could argue it's more expensive than most of the competition, then again it offers features that no one else can beat, like literally, check project farm, and I'd strongly argue it was the best in the test (the nr1 missed out on a lot of features and was like double in price).

Now as for my personal favourite, the Swacket, it's a 100 dollars, this could be a lot of money for some for a jacket for sure, for me it was definitely among the more expensive ones that I bought, but I never saw anything like it, it's by far my favourite jacket I've ever worn/tried. Knowing how fantastic it is, I think 100 bucks is a steal, if that was sold by a well known brand, it would easily be 200+

You want to call me a fan, go right ahead, because I am actually a fan of their products, I didn't do my first order as a fan, I got convinced by Luke and Linus (mostly Luke) on the Swacket, with him naming every issue I've had with jackets, and this solving them, and I wanted a deskpad, so I ordered.
Now I got an order underway with the screwdriver, jerryrig knife and deskpad (the large one with the discount deal), because they are good deals.

Do I like that it supports the company vs some random company that exploits their employees? Sure, but I bought them because I wanted it.

 

So let's talk Linus. He's a rich dude, this is something we all know, no need to pretend he isn't. He also seemingly pays his employees a good wage, gives them a seemingly good workplace, where very experienced and highly in demand people stay to work, and he reinvests loads of money in projects like the Lab, that has no way of making back that money anytime soon, and with that he offers something the tech community desperately needs. This video is proof of the worth the Lab will have. Knowing how a mouse performs, if it's sensor gives reliable readings, is absolutely vital. You want to look at a guy who's probably been working 80 hours a week for the last 10 years, as some rich douchebag, go ahead, by all means don't buy things to stuff his pockets, or for any other reason, don't buy the stuff, don't watch his channel or block their ads etc. But don't paint him as some evil overlord that we shouldn't buy from because he's rich, because guess what, almost all your stuff are come from companies with rich ceo's.

 

Wait you think 150 for that trash is acceptable? Sheesh...

  

4 hours ago, LinusTech said:

I will personally give you $10,000 if you can find our backpack or our screwdriver on aliexpress or some other direct from China marketplace. 

 

Now there's no excuse. 

 

Do it. 

Guess who's got two thumbs and is going to open his aliexpress store once his screwdriver gets in!

[rcmaehl]

37 minutes ago, Neroon said:

So let's talk Linus. He's a rich dude, this is something we all know, no need to pretend he isn't. He also seemingly pays his employees a good wage, gives them a seemingly good workplace, where very experienced and highly in demand people stay to work, and he reinvests loads of money in projects like the Lab, that has no way of making back that money anytime soon, and with that he offers something the tech community desperately needs. This video is proof of the worth the Lab will have. Knowing how a mouse performs, if it's sensor gives reliable readings, is absolutely vital. You want to look at a guy who's probably been working 80 hours a week for the last 10 years, as some rich douchebag, go ahead, by all means don't buy things to stuff his pockets, or for any other reason, don't buy the stuff, don't watch his channel or block their ads etc. But don't paint him as some evil overlord that we shouldn't buy from because he's rich, because guess what, almost all your stuff are come from companies with rich ceo's.

You OBVIOUSLY haven't seen this HORRIFYING expose on Linus
 

https://fb.watch/iaNlFp3R9F/

_{^{Watch this get Poe's law. I'm calling it now}}

[SA-Zap]

The Readgear A-15 and this Tommy mouse looks exactly same xD

[papajo]

18 hours ago, LinusTech said:

I will personally give you $10,000 if you can find our backpack or our screwdriver on aliexpress or some other direct from China marketplace. 

 

Now there's no excuse. 

 

Do it. 

Well to do that properly this isn't enough since I would have to first check if the offer displayed on the link is what you get and everything as described etc which means that I would have to buy a bunch of stuff with fast delivery pay customs and then spent time to check it.. 

But anyway I accept the challenge am I restricted only to AliExpress or am I allowed to source something equal or better from anywhere in the world as long as it is cheaper? 

Edit lol i just woke up when I replied I can see now that you mentioned only direct order froms China in general, cool Ill post an update within the next couple of days or even today depending on my schedule. 

Edit 2: Actually 10 seconds just doing a preliminary keyword search brought this up but I am sure I can find a better deal but it suprized me how easy it was to find something almost identical looking with a lower price and better matterials

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003173243438.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.47.775f2267GJYtIs&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id"%3A"12000027466912022"}&pdp_npi=2%40dis!EUR!405.69!202.85!!!!!%40212279b716742966673062894d06b7!12000027466912022!sea&curPageLogUid=3vyIY5l0woYP















here is the LTT one for direct comparison 

[Spotty]

33 minutes ago, papajo said:

But anyway I accept that challenge am I restricted only to AliExpress or am I allowed to source something equal or better from anywhere in the world as long as it is cheaper? 

You've completely missed the point.

 

You claimed in another post that you can get the LTT backpack on aliexpress and that it would probably come from the same place LTT gets their products from.

On 1/20/2023 at 7:42 PM, papajo said:

On 1/20/2023 at 7:13 PM, Luscious said:

their name on the LTT backpack and sells it FOR LESS

I am pretty sure you can already do that if you search on AliExpress probably they get them from the same place lol 

 

Linus challenged you to find other sellers selling the LTT backpack or LTT screwdriver. If the manufacturer they are using is stealing their design, manufacturing, and selling it without their permission that would be a huge issue.

I really don't know how you can seriously make the claim that you could buy the LTT backpack on aliexpress from other sellers, but then try to back it up by claiming that you could probably find different backpacks or screwdrivers for sale. Nobody is doubting that there are other backpacks or screwdrivers in the world.

[papajo]

11 minutes ago, Spotty said:

You've completely missed the point.

 

You claimed in another post that you can get the LTT backpack on aliexpress and that it would probably come from the same place LTT gets their products from.

Have I? You are a mod and can see my edits I assume so here are my post that I post before Linu's post so you can tell if I changed the context of something. 

What I said is this: 

 

 

19 hours ago, papajo said:

21 hours ago, Neroon said:

Look for it?

I have better things to do with my life and also I don't need to my point is valid even if there is no EXACT 100% same backpack on aliexpress since we are talking about a BACKPACK there are millions if not billions of places in the world who poses basic skills and tools to create such a simple concept a BACKPACK. its not a satellite lol...

  But maybe you meant this comment prior to the one above?

On 1/20/2023 at 10:42 AM, papajo said:

I am pretty sure you can already do that if you search on AliExpress probably they get them from the same place lol 

Well obviously I can not prove if linus sources something from the same place I find a similar backpack (And obviously I wouldnt reasonably suggest that linus 100% gets it from a aliexpress listing my point was -as one can tell from the entirety of my posts about this in this topic - that the they source it from somewhere ("somewhere" here means not a bespoke place but rather a factory that probably sells its own stuff on alibaba and whatnot) and sell it at an inflated price compared to similar quality/style/usecase items. 

[ImorallySourcedElectrons]

9 hours ago, SA-Zap said:

The Readgear A-15 and this Tommy mouse looks exactly same xD

I do wonder how the Tommy Hilfiger is put on the plastic in this instance, that would really be the driving factor for how much it cost them to get that mouse done. Wonder if they went the IMD route or cheaped out on that as well. It'd be really funny if the Tommy Hilfiger would wear out after only a month of actual usage.

 

23 hours ago, papajo said:

I have better things to do with my life and also I don't need to my point is valid even if there is no EXACT 100% same backpack on aliexpress since we are talking about a BACKPACK there are millions if not billions of places in the world who poses basic skills and tools to create such a simple concept a BACKPACK. its not a satellite lol...

Engineer who formerly worked in aerospace here: the satellite is easier to design in some ways. You rarely have to put those in volume production, you have a sizeable budget to go for cherry-picked parts that were all 100% manually inspected, you have hundreds of people checking over your work, and then you build two or three and select the absolute best one to actually launch after an extensive testing campaign that cost more than all the hardware combined. This is then going to be operated in a quasi-frictionless vacuum by a bunch of highly skilled people with a strong technical and scientific background.

 

Meanwhile, a backpack underwent some non-representative tests, has QA that can't afford to check every little stitch, was boxed up by someone who probably doesn't care too much, was shipped across the world in a container by a company that couldn't care less if it got dinged up or lost, and is going to be used by Kevin from down the street. And we all know how smart the Kevin in this scenario is.

 

So please, don't compare things to satellites or space hardware.

Edited January 21, 2023 by ImorallySourcedElectrons

[Avocado Diaboli]

3 hours ago, papajo said:

Edit 2: Actually 10 seconds just doing a preliminary keyword search brought this up but I am sure I can find a better deal but it suprized me how easy it was to find something almost identical looking with a lower price and better matterials

Jesus Christ you seriously waste too much energy on this nonsense. All over a fucking backpack nobody's forcing you to buy. Seriously, I'm on the record of saying most of the stuff Linus sells is overpriced from a pure consumer perspective. That's why I'd never buy it. But damn, leave it at that, anybody with any modicum of understanding of how resource procurement, production and sales works can tell you that small run, boutique stuff always costs an order of magnitude more than what some cheap mass production outfit with 0 QC can churn out. Believe me, I know. The raw components in most of my audio gear cost pennies. But a decent, boutique guitar pedal that isn't built on an assembly line will still run you over $150 on the low end. That's just how the economics work.

 

Again, if you think it's too expensive, don't buy it. I'm not in the business of defending Linus, never have been. But fuck me, you're a broken record about shit that doesn't affect you in the slightest. If you're really keen on proving something, buy that shitty backpack you linked, buy one from LTT store, cash in your $10k check and you're still making a profit. Stop backpedalling and start putting your money where your mouth is, because otherwise this is just pathetic.

[Gokul_P]

18 hours ago, Kid.Lazer said:

You might want to put a time cap on that challenge. At some point in the distant future it might happen.

it is like a  bounty programm so it helps Linus also so idk think it need any time limit. if somebody use their product schematics to make the product and sell it and if somebody report to Linus he can take it down so its a win-win for linus and the one reported it . 

[manikyath]

2 hours ago, papajo said:

Well obviously I can not prove if linus sources something from the same place I find a similar backpack (And obviously I wouldnt reasonably suggest that linus 100% gets it from a aliexpress listing my point was -as one can tell from the entirety of my posts about this in this topic - that the they source it from somewhere ("somewhere" here means not a bespoke place but rather a factory that probably sells its own stuff on alibaba and whatnot) and sell it at an inflated price compared to similar quality/style/usecase items. 

just to preface: i dont own *any* LTT merch, my only stake in this is that i watch LTT, i own several €200-ish laptop bags, a €50-ish 'random brand' backpack, and all of my tools are ranging from 'cheapest at the store' to actually expensive name-brand tools.

beyond that i have some 'second-hand' experience on what goes into making custom products (i.e. not just printing a logo on something you get on aliexpress), i've got a good idea about the costs of manufacturing samples in the process of perfecting the design, and the economy of scale (i.e. ordering 100k units as opposed to ordering 4k units.)

 

from experience, i can tell you this;

- you can make an EXTREMELY similar looking and feeling product for €50 and for €200. the difference is that making GOOD padding in your product requires many iterations, which increases the costs of the design phase significantly. beyond that, my €50 backpack is 10 years old.. so is  one of the expensive laptop bags.. and the difference becomes VERY apparent over the years. an item built to last is just simply more expensive, and it SHOWS eventually.

- buying a product 'built for the masses' will always be cheaper than something built for a target audience. linus is (potentially to a fault) extremely nitpicky about his merch, which just simply drives up cost, both in materials and manufacturing (more layers, more stitches, more rivets) and in the design stage (more sample iterations).

- the cost of designing something is INSANE compared to the  cost of the end product, even with a prohibitively expensive backpack. (which.. it is. no arguing there.) the issue here also is that the backpack is a very niche item in the grand scheme of backpacks. a regular backpack manufacturer could just produce 100k items and bleed them out over the course of a few years to reach ROI eventually, but if you 'only' have 4K units to spread the design budget over, it just simply raises unit price. that's how it works.

- OF FREAKING COURSE the backpack is sourced from an external company. no one is arguing you there, in fact linus has pretty much mentioned it every time he talks about backpack and screwdriver manufacturing. that is simply how manufacturing works. the argument here is that it is one designed by LMG, and manufactured to the exact specification defined by LMG. you wont find "the LTT backpack" on aliexpress, because the specification by which the backpack is made will not end up on aliexpress.

you might find *vaguely similar looking* backpacks there for FAR cheaper, but i guarantee you they are built far cheaper, and dont have the same level of design work behind them. if that design work matters to you or not - that's personal preference. but the fact is that there *is* design work that needs to be paid for.

- they are doing shipping and handling in canada. the cost of that is *extreme* compared to directly shipping from an 'export optimized' country such as china, just their cost for storing the stock of the backpacks might be a measurable impact on the cost of producing and selling backpacks.

 

beyond that, some remarks..

- the similarity of the backpack you showed from aliexpress honestly ends at it being a 'rectangular style' backpack. it's like linking a moto G to say the iphone is overpriced. you "might" be correct, but the argument made is simply irrelevant to the topic.

- no one is saying the screwdriver or backpack are 'a good deal'. the hurdles of smaller production runs are just prohibitive. both items are designed to be what (linus) would consider his perfect backpack and screwdriver to be. the point to be made here isnt that it is this or that, the point to be made here is that there is a merch team at LMG working their butts off to make both items as close to linus's dream as possible. saying that "you can just find it on aliexpress" is not only a punch in the gut for linus, it's a punch in the gut of all the people who are working hard behind the scenes to make it as good as it can be. you're not arguing the validity of the backpack, you're arguing if those people "actually did something" in those months they were working on the product. if you dont like the concept of LTT merch, dont buy it. no one will blame you for that. like i said, i dont own any merch either, because to me (being in the EU, so shipping and import tax..) it is just too cost prohibitive to get it. but just DONT go and handwave the hard work of many people because you just "assume" all merch is chinesium plus logo print.. and somehow all of the talks on screwdriver and backpack revisions would be some cheap facade too, then?

- "inflated price" is an EXTREMELY shallow way to look at it. yes... a lot of 'influencer merch' are stock products with a logo printed on them. in fact... there's an entire industry around printing company logo's on stock products. in fact.. most of goobay's products are exactly that. how do i know? i found some of them on logo-printing services by accident... and goobay's logos are always printed, even if the product's casing might have some text embossed. BUT... the moment they work with the manufacturer to make design changes that require a custom production run on their end. (just to make it as simple as: "move this pocket down one inch") comparing the price of the merch to the price of the stock item becomes VERY difficult, because custom production runs just cost more money than a comparable amount of the stock item. even if we assume v1 of the backpack that linus showed off was a stock item, there have been enough changes in the meantime to warrant the assumption it is a custom production run. wether that production run is moving a pocket or a 90% different design is essentially irrelevant, because the additional manufacturing cost would be comparable.

- it's merch.. it's sold as a means to support the creator. THAT'S THE FREAKING POINT.

- i cant make direct comparisons on the backpack, but the screwdriver was reviewed by project farm, against the megapro which it was based on, if i'm not mistaken. yes, the cost is double that of the megapro, but see pretty much the entire rest of this post as for why that may be the case.

 

i suggest you read trough all this and dont reply. i dont want an argument, i dont even want to 'win' an argument. i want you to realise that your statements were potentially harmful to people who do hard work making an honest wage, and themselves have no media presence. linus offering you 10K to find the backpack on a direct-from-manufacturer marketplace isnt some 'influencer flex', it's to drive the point home that there is a team of people working on them, and claiming their work is irrelevant is 'a bad take'.

 

your opinions on merch are your own, my opinions on merch are my own. but opinion and fact should be held separate. if you are extremely opposed to LTT merch, i actually want you to hold to that opinion, but make that opinion about the necessity of it, rather than about worthlessly fighting established facts, because that will result in this cesspit.

 

also, this:

18 minutes ago, Gokul_P said:

it is like a  bounty programm so it helps Linus also so idk think it need any time limit. if somebody use their product schematics to make the product and sell it and if somebody report to Linus he can take it down so its a win-win for linus and the one reported it . 

if the LTT backpack showed up on aliexpress, this is grounds for LMG to break contract with the manufacturers, or have grounds for legal action if it was a different manufacturing exactly copying the design.

in a way, the 10K is worth a lot less than being aware of potential fake merch, because that is potentially harmful to the image of LMG merch. (and be honest.. it would make a REALLY good video  )

 

EDIT: PS: in case it's unclear, the first 2/3rd of this post are just there to support the last third, where my actual opinion on the matter is. if anyone's cursary reading.. that's where the meat is.

[papajo]

1 hour ago, ImorallySourcedElectrons said:

Engineer who formerly worked in aerospace here: the satellite is easier to design in some ways. You rarely have to put those in volume production, you have a sizeable budget to go for cherry-picked parts that were all 100% manually inspected, you have hundreds of people checking over your work, and then you build two or three and select the absolute best one to actually launch after an extensive testing campaign that cost more than all the hardware combined. This is then going to be operated in a quasi-frictionless vacuum by a bunch of highly skilled people with a strong technical and scientific background.

 

Meanwhile, a backpack underwent some non-representative tests, has QA that can't afford to check every little stitch, was boxed up by someone who probably doesn't care too much, was shipped across the world in a container by a company that couldn't care less if it got dinged up or lost, and is going to be used by Kevin from down the street. And we all know how smart the Kevin in this scenario is.

Well I am a physicist not an engineer(but have lots of technical experience/background)  but I agree with what you said except from what's underlined. 

Simply because I just happen to have parents in the fur industry and also had a friend who was into fashion designing I am more acquainted with how apparel and its accessories are made. 

I cant agree with what's underlined not because I disagree with you that most satellite (because its not one use case/set of machines ) designs especially in terms of their electronics componentry  may be trivial for people in certain industries and the hardest/more time consuming and/or costly part is to meet the specs and standards and timeframe of  various agencies but despite that a backpack(or any piece of clothing)  is still far easier to design 

here is a backpack design 

You literally cut a material into these shapes and sew it together that's it (obviously some experience and craftsmanship is needed to assure that bonds are tight and going to last etc but so is everything in life e.g cooking) 

I doubt this is harder or equally challenging compared to figure out how to design in gerber format etch your pcb (or buy the necessary machines and program the laser/projectors to draw that design on your pcb)  and then solder (or purchase and program a machine that can SMD components) 

first needs a piece of paper some proper measurements and a sewing machine the other process is a lot more involved is all that I am saying. 

[Neroon]

On 1/20/2023 at 9:42 AM, papajo said:

I am pretty sure you can already do that if you search on AliExpress probably they get them from the same place lol 

This is what you wrote.

4 hours ago, papajo said:

Have I? You are a mod and can see my edits I assume so here are my post that I post before Linu's post so you can tell if I changed the context of something. 

 

 

Also the fact you posted another backpack that looks absolutely different, and claim it's similar, is pretty damn ridiculous.

Obviously they are both backpacks in a similar shape, but that's where things end.

 

You are making a fool out of yourself.

[Middcore]

5 hours ago, papajo said:

Well obviously I can not prove if linus sources something from the same place I find a similar backpack (And obviously I wouldnt reasonably suggest that linus 100% gets it from a aliexpress listing my point was -as one can tell from the entirety of my posts about this in this topic - that the they source it from somewhere ("somewhere" here means not a bespoke place but rather a factory that probably sells its own stuff on alibaba and whatnot) and sell it at an inflated price compared to similar quality/style/usecase items. 

 

 

 

[ImorallySourcedElectrons]

2 hours ago, papajo said:

Well I am a physicist not an engineer(but have lots of technical experience/background)  but I agree with what you said except from what's underlined. 

Simply because I just happen to have parents in the fur industry and also had a friend who was into fashion designing I am more acquainted with how apparel and its accessories are made. 

Should have stopped at "physicist not an engineer", that explains a great many things about your replies. Between theoretical design and practical manufacturing there are a lot of differences and steps. By the same logic you're applying here I can also design and build a satellite by sketching out some diagrams and getting aluminium from a DIY store, PCBs from some questionable Chinese pooling service, and a roll of kapton tape. Just toss it all together and you have your satellite right there!

 

2 hours ago, papajo said:

I cant agree with what's underlined not because I disagree with you that most satellite (because its not one use case/set of machines ) designs especially in terms of their electronics componentry  may be trivial for people in certain industries and the hardest/more time consuming and/or costly part is to meet the specs and standards and timeframe of  various agencies but despite that a backpack(or any piece of clothing)  is still far easier to design 

here is a backpack design 

You literally cut a material into these shapes and sew it together that's it (obviously some experience and craftsmanship is needed to assure that bonds are tight and going to last etc but so is everything in life e.g cooking) 

I doubt this is harder or equally challenging compared to figure out how to design in gerber format etch your pcb (or buy the necessary machines and program the laser/projectors to draw that design on your pcb)  and then solder (or purchase and program a machine that can SMD components) 

first needs a piece of paper some proper measurements and a sewing machine the other process is a lot more involved is all that I am saying. 

I can also sketch down the design of an electronic circuit that will mostly work on the first go, just like you're showing for this backpack, but between that and actually manufacturing something you're going to be busy for a while if you want to do it right. How are you going to orient the fabric to achieve the optimal strength and shape retention? Will you fold the material over to get stronger seams? What sort of pull out strength do you require of the stitching? Are you going to bond the seams with adhesive? Which UV dose must the synthetic parts be able to take without yellowing? By which standard do we test the waterproofing? How often do we perform these tests? Once per lot, random sample over multiple lots? etc. I know jackshit about consumer textiles, and even I know those sort of things are going to be important if you want to tie a decent warranty policy to your product.

 

You really got to consider the cost of making a good product, not just a product, quality standards and the associated cost of testing and inspection drive up your actual cost. Additionally, I'd like to think Linus tries to make sure things aren't made in some sweatshop, which usually means you need third party inspectors if you're working with suppliers in China, Vietnam, or Bangladesh, those also have to be paid, etc.

[creesch]

9 hours ago, papajo said:

Well to do that properly this isn't enough since I would have to first check if the offer displayed on the link is what you get and everything as described etc which means that I would have to buy a bunch of stuff with fast delivery pay customs and then spent time to check it.. 

 

So what you are saying is basically that you can't as easily get something of similar quality for a much lower price on aliexpres. 

 

Something you then reinforce by showing a product that barely is any cheaper. And likely will be more expensive once shipping and import taxes are applied. A product you will have a hard time getting any support on and is made of entirely different materials. You are very clearly arguing for the sake of arguing here and not based from actual experience.  

[kingboy101]

i have more proof this is a scam
i have a 600 inr mouse that has the exact same layout buttons side buttons even the light on the bottom is the same and  also there is a software (not made by tommy) the mouse name is (the one i have) is regear a15. its just a random trash mouse. search it up on google 

[papajo]

16 hours ago, creesch said:

 

So what you are saying is basically that you can't as easily get something of similar quality for a much lower price on aliexpres. 

 

Something you then reinforce by showing a product that barely is any cheaper. And likely will be more expensive once shipping and import taxes are applied. A product you will have a hard time getting any support on and is made of entirely different materials. You are very clearly arguing for the sake of arguing here and not based from actual experience.  

Its close to $100 cheaper and is better in every way from functionality(e.g has PCB to charge your phone, has more space, has space to isolate wet stuff etc)  to materials(e.g it has genuine bovine leather where the ltt one uses a material called repreve which marketing pitch is that it is eco friendly but the bottom line is that it is cheap because it is made out of recycled 1use bottles or whatnot aka garbage )  and aliexpress includes import charges in the prices whatever extra taxes (E.g state specific) apply to the linus backpack as well, and the aliexpress one has free shipping.

and as I said this was a 10 second search I am pretty sure there are even better deals out there.