Apple, Intel, and Nvidia Suppliers Stop Production Due to China Mandated Power Shutdowns

[Dracarris]

44 minutes ago, Kisai said:

Compare that to Hydroelectric dams which are basically infinite as long as it sits in a geographically stable environment and the turbines are maintained. 

On the topic, China is building enormous hydro power plants with the capacity to replace 7 NPPs (60 GW). While this one is still in planning, the Baihetan dam already went into production, outgrowing the already gigantic Three Gorges dam.

[wONKEyeYEs]

18 hours ago, CommanderAlex said:

As a result, TSMC and UMC semiconductor fabrication plants will continue to operate as normal.

But they are Taiwanese not Chinese aren't they?

[Mooshi]

If only China could burn seized mining rigs like coal.

[CarlBar]

It's not surprising, Rising sea levels could give china absolute hell in the future if things aren't reigned in, and as the biggest single polluter by far it has a lot of ability to make things happen.

[Distinctly Average]

14 hours ago, poochyena said:

I heard about this earlier in an anime convention vendor/artist alley thread. Sounds like its going to affect nearly everyone in one way or another.

 

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This is technically true but I always hate the phrasing since the only reason for this is because companies from other countries outsource their manufacturing to China.

It is also true because they have the largest population on the planet. If you take the whole of Europe, America and Russia you still have less people than China. It really should be calculated in energy per person and by that measure China is actually ranked about 80 in list. China use 5132 Kwh per person per year. UK use 4496 Kwh per person per year, USA use 12,154 Kwh per person per year. 

 

China are the fastest growing user of solar in the world, fastest growing user of wind in the world. To see they are at least trying to do something about coal has to be a good thing even if it does impact consumerism in the west. My only worry is how this will affect the workforce there. Hopefully they will not end up struggling financially as a result.

 

Sadly, here in the UK there has recently been an attempt to open a new coal mine. Not sure it will happen, hopefully not.

[Dracarris]

Chinas energy consumption per capita is actually really low, the US have around 3x theirs and the worst offenders more than 8x.

[CommanderAlex]

1 hour ago, wONKEyeYEs said:

But they are Taiwanese not Chinese aren't they?

TSMC has a 12-inch wafer GIGAFAB located in the Jiangsu Province, China under the name TSMC Nanjing Company Limited, Fab 16, as well as an 8-inch wafer fab under the name TSMC China Company Limited, Fab 10 located in Shanghai, China. 

 

UMC has a 12-inch wafer lab (known as FAB 12X) located in Xiamen, China. There is another 8-inch wafer fab (known as HeJian, Fab 8N) located in Suzhou, China.

 

 

They only make up a small portion of their portfolio of fabs, where they are mainly in Taiwan, with locations in the US and Japan as well. 

TSMC Fab Locations: https://www.tsmc.com/english/aboutTSMC/TSMC_Fabs

 

UMC Fab Locations: https://www.umc.com/en/Html/fab_information

[Mihle]

3 hours ago, Kisai said:

This is one of the few situations where "excess" electricity being generated is even possible. However nobody really knows how long a geothermal well lasts, with estimates being 30 years. Compare that to Hydroelectric dams which are basically infinite as long as it sits in a geographically stable environment and the turbines are maintained. 

 

Where have you seen that number?

I highly doubt that it anywhere near correct, may be it's true for the water already in the earth coming up (steam, but I doubt Iceland geothermal does much impact on the earth's temperature, you can probably pump water down basically forever.

Everywhere I have seen geothermal mentioned it is considered renewable.

 

Tho I don't know for sure, don't have enough knowledge, happy to be proven wrong.

[tikker]

21 hours ago, CommanderAlex said:

several days each month

  Dang that's not small. The other day I also read that besides the chip shortage we're now also starting to face a component shortage (capacitors, resistors etc.) due to factories having been operating at low power or not at all due to lockdowns.

 

I understand the reasoning, but RIP affordable computers for the next few years I guess

[CommanderAlex]

Just now, tikker said:

  Dang that's not small. The other day I also read that besides the chip shortage we're now also starting to face a component shortage (capacitors, resistors etc.) due to factories having been operating at low power or not at all due to lockdowns.

 

I understand the reasoning, but RIP affordable computers for the next few years I guess

Another thing is, it appears the component manufacturers in these regions will be affected greater than say, TSMC, so I would think there would be a bigger disparity in the substrates required for the silicon being manufactured at TSMC. 

[Kisai]

37 minutes ago, Mihle said:

Where have you seen that number?

I highly doubt that it anywhere near correct, may be it's true for the water already in the earth coming up (steam, but I doubt Iceland geothermal does much impact on the earth's temperature, you can probably pump water down basically forever.

Everywhere I have seen geothermal mentioned it is considered renewable.

 

Tho I don't know for sure, don't have enough knowledge, happy to be proven wrong.

https://www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/12/7/2786/pdf

 

Quote

Keep in mind that no geothermal plant out there is old enough to get a good lifecycle estimate. The geothermal plant used in that document is Chiusdino 1 and is 10 years old, and also does district heating.

What happens is eventually the well degrades. Now I don't know if they can just re-drill the well or if it has to be abandoned once it no longer supplies sufficient circulation. If it has to be abandoned that makes it a risk to the public. That's all you need are people being disappeared down abandoned wells.

 

[Mihle]

20 minutes ago, Kisai said:

https://www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/12/7/2786/pdf

 

Keep in mind that no geothermal plant out there is old enough to get a good lifecycle estimate. The geothermal plant used in that document is Chiusdino 1 and is 10 years old, and also does district heating.

What happens is eventually the well degrades. Now I don't know if they can just re-drill the well or if it has to be abandoned once it no longer supplies sufficient circulation. If it has to be abandoned that makes it a risk to the public. That's all you need are people being disappeared down abandoned wells.

 

If they actually run out you can just plug the well.

 

I haven't found anything on lifetime expected on Iceland ones, but they have at least one, Krafla,  that has been running since 1977 (44 years) and second turbine started up in 1999. 

For reference, it has produced 60 MW since that second turbine.

Haven't found any expected life time of it, but as they are apparently planning to expand it to 150 MW or something it can't be anywhere close to done.

 

I think this is a situation of geothermal being basically infinite some locations, like Iceland, but not others, and to me that is logical, I think I remember being told that once actually.

 

Even with a lifetime of 30 years it's better than coal or other things.

 

[soldier_ph]

TIL China kinda cares about the environment.

[Monkey Dust]

1 hour ago, tikker said:

  Dang that's not small. The other day I also read that besides the chip shortage we're now also starting to face a component shortage (capacitors, resistors etc.) due to factories having been operating at low power or not at all due to lockdowns.

 

I understand the reasoning, but RIP affordable computers for the next few years I guess

DDR5 coming in probably won't help either. This might be as good as it gets right now for the next 18 months Though I guess GPUs could come down and offset increases elsewhere.

[leadeater]

2 hours ago, Mihle said:

If they actually run out you can just plug the well.

 

I haven't found anything on lifetime expected on Iceland ones, but they have at least one, Krafla,  that has been running since 1977 (44 years) and second turbine started up in 1999. 

For reference, it has produced 60 MW since that second turbine.

Haven't found any expected life time of it, but as they are apparently planning to expand it to 150 MW or something it can't be anywhere close to done.

 

I think this is a situation of geothermal being basically infinite some locations, like Iceland, but not others, and to me that is logical, I think I remember being told that once actually.

 

Even with a lifetime of 30 years it's better than coal or other things.

 

I think these/what is being talked about is the lifespan of the power plant/facility not the source of energy. Everything has a designed life, they can be run much longer than that in many different ways including doing nothing and just using it longer.

 

Things ages and degrade and well as better technology and methods develop, also a 60MW production could become practically speaking useless so you'd want to remove that and replace it with 200MW or w/e.

 

The geothermal energy itself in most cases has an unlimited lifespan outside of geological shifts and changes that disrupt or change the environment. It can go away but there is basically zero way to know and the time scales are so long in general it's basically not worth factoring in.

 

A Wind Turbine can't run forever for both of the above reasons, same with a wave generator, same for solar. Renewable energy is referring to the energy itself not the mechanisms we use to utilize that energy. If I burn a log the log is gone, if I burn oil the oil is gone, if I burn coal the coal is gone. Given sufficiently long enough time these will replenish but this is over generations to thousands of years where as the sun comes up every day.