Gaming Performance Tested On 'Worn Out' RTX 2080 Ti Mining Card

[Blademaster91]

32 minutes ago, Stahlmann said:

As if warranty is even a concern when you're buying a used, probably several years old mining card.

Warranty is a concern for me even buying something used, although I won't be buying a used RTX 3000 series card because I can assume most of them were used for mining.

30 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

I think it's funny that a lot of people who hate on miners are gamers that just want the latest and greatest hardware for:

1) Bragging rights.

2) To play some flavor of the month game at slightly higher settings than before.

 

I've seen a lot of people complain they can't find a GPU while they have a RTX 20 series that plays games just fine, but most people are on mid range GTX 10 series which in a lot of newer titles performs worse than a PS5.

 Then again I've seen a lot of people saying gaming a waste of time and anyone that wants to upgrade and buy a single GPU must be entitled.

32 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

It's basically like saying "the shadow quality in my games are more important than you making some money".

That's why I said gamers were self entitled earlier.

So what makes miners more entitled to having dozens of cards as opposed to someone that wants to buy a GPU to enjoy a game especially while being stuck inside because of covid? I don't get that logic, but hey miners good gamers bad right?

[Moonzy]

6 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

So what makes miners more entitled to having dozens of cards

we are not...?

we never said you guys shouldnt buy the cards though

well, probably some did, but probably miniscule and extremists

 

by all means, buy a gpu for your gaming needs if you think it's worth it

[leadeater]

21 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

but most people are on mid range GTX 10 series which in a lot of newer titles performs worse than a PS5.

Well I'm still getting by with a 290X running 2560x1600 so 

[LAwLz]

28 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

I've seen a lot of people complain they can't find a GPU while they have a RTX 20 series that plays games just fine, but most people are on mid range GTX 10 series which in a lot of newer titles performs worse than a PS5.

Then again I've seen a lot of people saying gaming a waste of time and anyone that wants to upgrade and buy a single GPU must be entitled.

Oh the horrors of only having a GTX 10 series graphics card. How terrible. It must be painful to have to switch settings down to medium to get decent framerates in the latest COD game or whatever the flavor of the month is these days... I really feel your and everyone else's pain.

 

 

30 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

So what makes miners more entitled to having dozens of cards as opposed to someone that wants to buy a GPU to enjoy a game especially while being stuck inside because of covid? I don't get that logic, but hey miners good gamers bad right?

They aren't more entitled to it.

The one who buys it the quickest and/or pays the most should get it if you ask me. That's why I don't get why people are mad at scalpers either.

Scalpers exists because demand outweighs supply. Some people will be without graphics cards because not enough exists, plain and simple. Scalpers take advantage of that situation and as a result the ones who pay the most are the ones who get the limited supply. If someone wants to buy a graphics card for 500 and someone is willing to pay 600 for it, then I think the one paying 600 deserves to get it. The problem is that right now the one only willing to pay 500 for it gets pissy and whines online how it is unfair because they for some reason deserve the card more, in their own eyes.

 

I don't think neither miners nor games are good/bad. In my eyes they are equal, but right now I am seeing a lot of bitching and moaning from gamers who think they are for some reason more entitled to get graphics cards than miners, even if miners are willing to pay more or buys them quicker. Boohoo.

That's why I might seem like I am "hating on gamers" right now. I would be replying exactly the same way if the forum was full of miners complaining about how "gamers are buying all of their mining cards". You don't deserve special privileges just because you think your use of a graphics card is more valid than someone else's.

 

 

Also, are you implying that you need a new graphics card in order to enjoy playing some games? You don't. Turn the settings down. If the game is good then it should be an enjoyable experience regardless. If you can't play some new, graphically demanding AAA game even with settings turned down then play something else instead. There are countless of great games that you can play. You don't always have to play the latest game.

[LAwLz]

20 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Well I'm still getting by with a 290X running 2560x1600 so 

You're not a tech enthusiast or gamer if your CPU or GPU is older than 3 years.

Come on leadeater, be a good boy and buy more things. Consume. Consume. Consume... and don't forget to use the coupon code LINUS at checkout for 5% off!

[Kisai]

5 hours ago, leadeater said:

Well I'm still getting by with a 290X running 2560x1600 so 

Streamers require more than a mid-tier video card if they use the same machine to stream that they play on. The entire video compositing process is rather inefficient on the GPU and the CPU.

 

A 290X is roughly a GTX 1060 Mobile in performance, so I would have a hard time believing you get 2560x1600x60hz on that.

 

 

[StDragon]

Why is it always a pissing contest with streamers?

 

/rimshot

[Moonzy]

2 hours ago, Kisai said:

Streamers require more than a mid-tier video card if they use the same machine to stream that they play on. The entire video compositing process is rather inefficient on the GPU and the CPU.

if you're making money, you can easily justify the marked up costs

are you going to spend $1,000 on a card or lose $10,000 a month waiting for the price to drop to MSRP? (number pulled from air, idk how much streamers are making)

 

2 hours ago, Kisai said:

A 290X is roughly a GTX 1060 Mobile in performance, so I would have a hard time believing you get 2560x1600x60hz on that.

depends on the game, i guess

could always turn down resolution too

 

but each peep have diff expectations, so cant really say that they're all willing to turn down resolution to play games

but the question is if they're willing to pay for the prices for the better experience, and in today's climate that would be a steep price

[MageTank]

35 minutes ago, Kisai said:

Streamers require more than a mid-tier video card if they use the same machine to stream that they play on. The entire video compositing process is rather inefficient on the GPU and the CPU.

 

A 290X is roughly a GTX 1060 Mobile in performance, so I would have a hard time believing you get 2560x1600x60hz on that.

 

 

Let's not use "require" too generously here. There are plenty of means to boost ones streaming performance on the cheap without having to overhaul ones entire system with a new GPU. Intel users with iGPU's have the luxury of using Quick Sync for a pretty hefty boost in performance while leaving their dGPU/CPU performance relatively unscathed.

 

AMD users with cheap APU's and a dGPU can employ similar tricks (albeit slightly more complicated of a setup) and get by just fine as well. Those without iGPU's will have to compromise a bit on their encoding settings, but I wouldn't say a new GPU would be required by any means. I know people that still stream on GTX 1070's with Ryzen 1600's just fine playing AAA titles.

 

At the end of the day, @LAwLzhit the nail on the head with their assessment. Nobody is entitled to a new GPU. My money isn't worth more than yours, and the money of a miner isn't worth more than a gamer. Whomever has the drive and determination to get something will ultimately get it in the end. People that expect the rest of the world to adapt to their unfortunate situation and make it better for them are in for a rude awakening in life. 

 

I want a 3080, not because my 2080 Ti isn't fast enough, but because I want HDMI 2.1 support and I am petty enough to upgrade for that simple feature alone. Am I willing to pay what scalpers are currently charging for reference PCB 3080's? No, but others are, and I respect the hustle of the scalpers and the determination of those willing to pay what I am not. Am I jaded by the miners buying up all the inventory before I even get off work to stand in line for a card? Not in the slightest. There is an economy to this, and I'll get my card eventually when they get done with it. I am not in need of a new GPU. No gamer is in need of a new GPU. We may want one, but none of us need one.

 

At the end of the day, it's all a matter of wants vs needs, and those that cannot discern between the two are ultimately the ones that are going to remain angry at this situation.

[StDragon]

14 minutes ago, MageTank said:

There is an economy to this, and I'll get my card eventually when they get done with it. I am not in need of a new GPU. No gamer is in need of a new GPU. We may want one, but none of us need one.

The industry doesn't revolve around your upgrade cycle. At any given moment you have people entering into the PC gaming scene as there are leaving.

 

What nVidia is doing is sacrificing long-term growth for short-term gain. This generational HW gap will have long-lasting effects that will carry the momentum into PC gaming development.

 

As the phrase goes "Winter is coming", and it's going to be a very cold spell until people either hold out or abandon the industry and move onto consoles are just move out.

[MageTank]

11 minutes ago, StDragon said:

The industry doesn't revolve around your upgrade cycle. At any given moment you have people entering into the PC gaming scene as there are leaving.

 

What nVidia is doing is sacrificing long-term growth for short-term gain. This generational HW gap will have long-lasting effects that will carry the momentum into PC gaming development.

 

As the phrase goes "Winter is coming", and it's going to be a very cold spell until people either hold out or abandon the industry and move onto consoles are just move out.

I am well aware that the industry doesn't revolve around my upgrade cycle. I'll repeat myself again for clarity:

 

No gamer is in need of a GPU. Gamers want GPU's, they do not need them. Need implies they cannot go without. I am confident if I take away the GPU from every gamer, they'll continue to survive in this world. I might walk away quite bruised and depending on which part of the south I attempt this in, a little shot at, but they'll be alive to complain about their lack of a GPU.

 

My problem stems from people trying to justify their wants by labeling them as needs under the guise of "I need this for work" or "I need this because the pandemic is stressing me out". If people want to have a petty fight over moral supremacy of mining vs gaming, I am all for watching that dumpster fire of a conversation go down, but I dislike the notion that people are going to try to get away with misrepresenting their wants for a new GPU as needs.

[StDragon]

4 minutes ago, MageTank said:

My problem stems from people trying to justify their wants by labeling them as needs under the guise of "I need this for work" or "I need this because the pandemic is stressing me out".

Such hyperbolic statements are endless from people; I pretty much ignore them. But it is somewhat relative to the industry in discussion. If a gamer wants to play on AAA game titles at max res and refresh rates, yeah, a card is "needed".

 

But, if we're going to go down to the hardcore definition of "need" vs. "want", I'll do you one better.... No one "needs" a toilet, but many "want". In reality, you can survive by digging a hole in the ground and dropping a deuce. Many 3rd world nations do it just fine.

 

Sometimes you have to illustrate absurdity by being absurd.  

[MageTank]

1 minute ago, StDragon said:

Such hyperbolic statements are endless from people; I pretty much ignore them. But it is somewhat relative to the industry in discussion. If a gamer wants to play on AAA game titles at max res and refresh rates, yeah, a card is "needed".

 

But, if we're going to go down to the hardcore definition of "need" vs. "want", I'll do you one better.... No one "needs" a toilet, but many "want". In reality, you can survive by digging a hole in the ground and dropping a deuce. Many 3rd world nations do it just fine.

 

Sometimes you have to illustrate absurdity by being absurd.  

I think you already made my point for me with this sentence, lol. A gamer wants to play a game on AAA settings at max res and high refresh rates, they do not need to do so. They don't "need" a high end card to do that, they "want" a high end card to be able to do that. 

 

As for the toilet analogy, you're speaking to a man that has grown up camping in southern Ohio all his life with family from the hills of West Virginia. I won't go into details about how more demanding calls of nature are handled, but know that we walked away from those situations alive... just with our legs a little wider from one another than normal, lol.

 

Also, I can't tell if you are agreeing or disagreeing, so I am stuck in a loop of repeating my point until I can figure out which of the two is true. Either way, I enjoy your banter.

[Kisai]

1 hour ago, MageTank said:

Let's not use "require" too generously here. There are plenty of means to boost ones streaming performance on the cheap without having to overhaul ones entire system with a new GPU. Intel users with iGPU's have the luxury of using Quick Sync for a pretty hefty boost in performance while leaving their dGPU/CPU performance relatively unscathed.

 

 

Ha.. good luck using the iGPU for encoding. It’s more likely to freeze up the computer. AMD users don’t even have one.

 

iGPU performance is also a joke, so don’t tell me you are willing to stream at 360p just to not have a dGPU. Never mind being able to collaborate with others.

 

 

[Mark Kaine]

On 2/24/2021 at 8:06 PM, StDragon said:

He de-soldered caps to test a theory of signal filtering. In addition worn out capacitors aren't the same as failed (removed).

Exactly, also no offense to Bauer guy, im sure he knows a lot about overclocking and shit but he doesn't strike me as someone who knows a lot about the inner workings of technical equipment - how would he, he's not an engineer (or is he lol) 

[leadeater]

3 hours ago, Kisai said:

A 290X is roughly a GTX 1060 Mobile

lol not it isn't

 

3 hours ago, Kisai said:

Streamers require more than a mid-tier video card

Well it's a good thing most people do not stream and if I were I'd not use the same computer to stream anyway.

[Mark Kaine]

2 hours ago, MageTank said:

No gamer is in need of a GPU

oh god please no, not the nihilistic take again. 'just use your imagination lul' 

 

you also don't need a car, a house or a toilet, you want these things (well at least I hope so in the latter case!) 

[StDragon]

1 hour ago, Kisai said:

Ha.. good luck using the iGPU for encoding. It’s more likely to freeze up the computer. AMD users don’t even have one.

 

iGPU performance is also a joke, so don’t tell me you are willing to stream at 360p just to not have a dGPU. Never mind being able to collaborate with others.

 

 

I'm not sure if it's a software/driver issue as to why it would freeze up with a iGPU. But technically, Quick Sync will do HW video encoding. See encode/decode ability chart in link below

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Quick_Sync_Video

 

 

[Mark Kaine]

23 minutes ago, StDragon said:

Quick Sync will do HW video encoding.

*amd outside rainy window. jpg*

[LAwLz]

13 hours ago, leadeater said:

Well it's a good thing most people do not stream and if I were I'd not use the same computer to stream anyway.

And those who do stream already has a system that is capable of doing so. They might not be able to stream at the highest quality or whatever but so what? 

 

You wanting to get slightly better settings when streaming is not some admiral goal that should be prioritized over someone else's wants. 

[leadeater]

2 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

And those who do stream already has a system that is capable of doing so. They might not be able to stream at the highest quality or whatever but so what? 

 

You wanting to get slightly better settings when streaming is not some admiral goal that should be prioritized over someone else's wants. 

Sounds to me all the GPU shortages must be due to damn streamers wanting to get that latest NVENC encoder!

[Lurick]

13 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Sounds to me all the GPU shortages must be due to damn streamers wanting to get that latest NVENC encoder!

I personally blame @Energycore because birbs are the root of all evil!

[Moonzy]

8 minutes ago, Lurick said:

I personally blame @Energycore

how dare you pin the blame on my kouhai like that

I personally blame @Moonzy, just look at the amount of ampere GPU he own, he's the root of all evil and he should be banned for defending mining like it's some sort of cult.

 

also, i can't help but to wonder why does a streamer deserve a GPU more than anyone else

if you're saying that it'll ruin their career if they don't have a GPU, then is your career worth less than $3000? for a 3090 or something

sure, it sucks that you have to pay more to get your work done, but the amount of money you don't earn if you don't have it is far worse...? I don't account.

[leadeater]

45 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

if you're saying that it'll ruin their career if they don't have a GPU, then is your career worth less than $3000? for a 3090 or something

Sorry I'm still stuck on the fact that somehow they are a streamer without a GPU already??????

[Kisai]

8 hours ago, leadeater said:

Sorry I'm still stuck on the fact that somehow they are a streamer without a GPU already??????

Please go actually watch a game streamer. The average twitch stream is 720p or less. Particularly due to Twitch's ingest being a maximum of 6mbits, and twitch doesn't transcode streams unless you're a partner. Youtube is quickly eating Twitch's lunch.

 

RTX 30 series do not yet support AV1 encoding, so I'm not personally missing the 30 series, but that's around the corner. https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/news/rtx-30-series-av1-decoding/

Quote

• We are working with Twitch on the next generation of game streaming. AV1 will enable Twitch viewers to watch at up to 1440p 120 FPS at 8mbps; a feasible bitrate that can reach most home-broadband and 5G users.

You definitely are not doing that on any existing iGPU. 

 

https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/media-at-microsoft/av1-hardware-accelerated-video-on-windows-10/ba-p/1765451

 

Quote

Microsoft co-founded AOM with the goal of creating transformative, , open-source video codecs together with other leading technology companies.

 

Here are the components required to experience hardware accelerated AV1 video on Windows 10:

• One of these new GPUs or CPUs:
  • 11th Gen Intel Core processors with Intel Iris X^e Graphics 
  • NVIDIA GeForce RTX 30 Series GPUs
  • AMD Radeon™ RX 6000 Series Graphics (coming soon)
• Windows 10 build 1909 or later
• The AV1 Video Extension
• A web browser or other application with hardware acceleration support for AV1, including apps built on top of Media Foundation
• As is common with new features like this, you may need to update your graphics driver from time to time to get the latest features and improvements.

 

Once you have those pieces in place, you will see the benefits of hardware accelerated AV1 video as streaming services roll out more video content encoded with AV1.

That is hardware accelerated AV1 decode. None of those support AV1 encode.

 

https://9to5google.com/2021/01/27/youtube-av1-netflix-requirement/

Quote

There’s no date attached to this right now, but Synaptics mentions that AV1 will be required by YouTube and Netflix, the two biggest streaming platforms in the world, at some point. Why mention? It comes as Synaptics announces its VideoSmart VS640 SoC that supports hardware decoding of the AV1 standard. 

 

So if you're streaming content, and it now has to involve AV1 ingests, SOL. No iGPU is going to support that.

 

Quicksync has largely been a joke for encoding. Under Windows 7 you couldn't use the iGPU for encoding unless you were also using it as main GPU, and under Windows 10 you can only use it if the iGPU is turned on an plugged into an active monitor.

 

Quote

In order to enable QuickSync encoding and decoding, you'll have to follow some steps. First off, go into the BIOS of both Host and Client machines and ensure the iGPU is enabled even if you're primary display adapter is PEG. Also enable the virtualisation, and all other iGPU options available in your BIOS. This is important, as we're going to create a virtual display adapter to force QuickSync on.

 

Getting quicksync to work is incredibly more involved. Never mind AMD's iGPU.