Apple threatens to kill Unreal Engine on iOS, Fornite may never return

[pas008]

i gotta love this

digital world where we wanted to cut out the middle men but its just new middle men with large if not larger cut

and have freedom and options with our devices but now even more restricted

 

if we want to keep games priced at 60 bucks this 30% needs to be divided or we will start seeing 100 for new games

not cheap making games now days and new companies dont have a chance

 

hey I sell your product that you worked hard on but I get over a quarter of the sales and hardly no expenses because you can do that and I am only one that can sell it here

this is what it is plain and simple, mafia style shit

[snowflow22]

23 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

Third party app stores without a jailbreak do exist, and you can install web apps just fine. You would have to define an application as being explicitly a program from the App Store. 

How do you think fornite can be run as a web application? That thing requires whole unreal engine to be rendering graphics for you. They will have to take this stance back.

[Kisai]

20 minutes ago, snowflow22 said:

How do you think fornite can be run as a web application? That thing requires whole unreal engine to be rendering graphics for you. They will have to take this stance back.

Nope.

 

https://docs.unrealengine.com/en-US/Platforms/HTML5/GettingStarted/index.html

[mr moose]

3 hours ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Epic wants to run their own App Stores, basically, so they're playing a really slimy game with their PR. However, they aren't necessarily wrong with the issues with Apple and the slightly different ones with Google. They've also, clearly, "gamed" out the scenarios and are willing to take the monetary hit in the current run.

 

There's a background issue to keep an eye on with this. When they showed UE5, they basically admitted the EGS on PC was being all but put into mothballs as they move to selling an inter-connected platform with Unreal Engine. Basically, they're going to take a different direction from Valve, but they've finally given in and started building systems like Valve has for years. The Apple/Google vs Epic stuff is a logical result of that shift. Epic is going to be selling wholly integrated platforms to developers, who aren't going to want to fork over 6x as much to Apple as they do Epic for the being "free" on the App Store.

All I am saying is regardless of what games epic and apple re playing or what their intentions are, it does not change the fact that apples behavior and control over ios developers is anti trust.

[EChondo]

Personally, I'm siding with Apple here.

 

I don't like their products nor platform and how restrictive they are, but it is their platform, so to me you play by their rules. It's the same thing here on these forums, there are rules and policies in place for a variety of different reasons and if you don't follow them, then you're not going to be around for much longer.

 

Apple is going full nuke mode here and I don't blame them. They want to protect their ecosystem and this whole thing from Epic is a direct attack.

 

Everyone here can agree/disagree all day, but it doesn't seem that Apple and Epic will be settling this out of court, so we'll have to see what the courts decide and go from there.

[mr moose]

11 minutes ago, EChondo said:

Personally, I'm siding with Apple here.

 

I don't like their products nor platform and how restrictive they are, but it is their platform, so to me you play by their rules. It's the same thing here on these forums, there are rules and policies in place for a variety of different reasons and if you don't follow them, then you're not going to be around for much longer.

 

Apple is going full nuke mode here and I don't blame them. They want to protect their ecosystem and this whole thing from Epic is a direct attack.

 

Everyone here can agree/disagree all day, but it doesn't seem that Apple and Epic will be settling this out of court, so we'll have to see what the courts decide and go from there.

The difference is on these forums you are not forced to use only these forums whilst paying a fee for the pleasure.

 

 

[Helpful Tech Witch]

8 hours ago, Commodus said:

The concern with Epic is that it's not really pushing to open up iOS, despite its claims to the contrary; it just wants to take home more of the money,

And the multi system price drop, so they are losing money, just makes them more money?

[Helpful Tech Witch]

14 minutes ago, EChondo said:

Personally, I'm siding with Apple here.

 

I don't like their products nor platform and how restrictive they are, but it is their platform, so to me you play by their rules. It's the same thing here on these forums, there are rules and policies in place for a variety of different reasons and if you don't follow them, then you're not going to be around for much longer.

 

Apple is going full nuke mode here and I don't blame them. They want to protect their ecosystem and this whole thing from Epic is a direct attack.

 

Everyone here can agree/disagree all day, but it doesn't seem that Apple and Epic will be settling this out of court, so we'll have to see what the courts decide and go from there.

Oh, c'mon. Apple is on the middle of 2 anti trust problems. Do you really think that if it was so clear that Apple were the good guys, epic's lawyers would've approved this movement?

[EChondo]

23 minutes ago, mr moose said:

The difference is on these forums you are not forced to use only these forums whilst paying a fee for the pleasure.

Yes, and people can leave these forums whenever they want, just like Epic can leave the Apple App Store and Google Play Store whenever they'd like.

 

19 minutes ago, TheTechWizardThatNeedsHelp said:

Oh, c'mon. Apple is on the middle of 2 anti trust problems. Do you really think that if it was so clear that Apple were the good guys, epic's lawyers would've approved this movement?

Never said Apple were the good guys here, just the team I agree with the most.

 

Frankly Apple should open their store up a bit more, but Apple response here is justified with how Epic is acting, and again, we'll have to wait for the courts to decide who wins here.

 

Have a nice day you two

[Helpful Tech Witch]

2 minutes ago, EChondo said:

Yes, and people can leave these forums whenever they want, just like Epic can leave the Apple App Store and Google Play Store whenever they'd like.

 

Never said Apple were the good guys here, just the team I agree with the most.

 

Frankly Apple should open their store up a bit more, but Apple response here is justified with how Epic is acting, and again, we'll have to wait for the courts to decide who wins here.

 

Have a nice day you two

I agree, but replace app store with iOS.

[mr moose]

8 minutes ago, EChondo said:

Yes, and people can leave these forums whenever they want, just like Epic can leave the Apple App Store and Google Play Store whenever they'd like.

and lose half the mobile market.  that's not a choice people want to make, and if they are forced then it isn't a choice at all.

 

[The Sloth]

3 hours ago, EChondo said:

I don't like their products nor platform and how restrictive they are, but it is their platform, so to me you play by their rules. It's the same thing here on these forums, there are rules and policies in place for a variety of different reasons and if you don't follow them, then you're not going to be around for much longer.

 

Would you side with microsoft, in 2001? Just because thare are rules, that doesn't mean the rules are fair or can't be challanged. 

Apple is facing a bunch of antitrust lawsuits for a reason, hopefully they open up the OS a bit more. 

 

 

3 hours ago, EChondo said:

Apple is going full nuke mode here and I don't blame them. They want to protect their ecosystem and this whole thing from Epic is a direct attack.

 

same thing could be said about microsoft in the 2000s. 

[Doqtori]

On 8/17/2020 at 11:21 PM, Darpyface said:

Right now Apple is being sued for being a monopoly with it's app store being the only way to download apps unlike Android.

Apple has a monopoly... On Apple.

[mr moose]

8 minutes ago, Doqtori said:

Apple has a monopoly... On Apple.

Superficially it sounds wrong, but that's the problem, people are being superficial about it.  Apple has a monopoly on half the mobile market in the US, France, UK, Canada, Australia and sweden.   Probably a few other countries too but I couldn't be arsed looking beyond those as they all share similar legal systems.  

 

So yeah, when 1 company controls who can sell apps literally to half the market and apply the terms & conditions, fees and  monetization  structure of those apps it becomes a monopoly.

[Video Beagle]

21 hours ago, spartaman64 said:

and when i own the device i should be able to do whatever i want with the device.

And you can. You can do whatever you want with your specific iPhone that you 1) want and 2) you're able to.

That you don't know how to change the OS on an iPhone isn't Apple's problem.  It's a piece of tech in your hands...you're limited by what you know and whining that Apple doesn't make it easy for you.

[Video Beagle]

4 hours ago, mr moose said:

Apple has a monopoly on half the mobile market

that's not how this works.  that's not how any of this works.

[mr moose]

50 minutes ago, Video Beagle said:

that's not how this works.  that's not how any of this works.

 

Absolutely it is how it works, but nice of you to cut out all the explanation and fail to explain why you don't think it works that way.  Perhaps you could link me to authority on the subject (government trade commission or law library) that details how it fails to be a monopoly.  I mean we have linked to several now that clearly show it is, there are several cases now taking apple to court (including one that was green lit by a judge to go to trial) because the accusations and evidence satisfy the criteria that anti trust is occurring,   

 

I know some people really don't want it to be the case, god only knows why, all consumers should be fighting for more options not less. 

[Jotoco]

1 hour ago, Video Beagle said:

And you can. You can do whatever you want with your specific iPhone that you 1) want and 2) you're able to.

That you don't know how to change the OS on an iPhone isn't Apple's problem.  It's a piece of tech in your hands...you're limited by what you know and whining that Apple doesn't make it easy for you.

It is not like Apple goes out of their way to make it as impossible as they can to do anything they don't like. 

 

Apple is not just a walled garden. The walls are 200ft tall, electrified, with spikes, guard dogs, a moat and laser turrets. 

[Vishera]

On 8/17/2020 at 8:21 PM, Darpyface said:

Anti-trust laws about phones and how they're an everyday sometimes essential service can mean that Apple might lose control of what can be installed on their phones.

Not only that will happen if Epic wins,That case could be used to lift a walled garden from any electronic device with a store like Playstation,XBOX and Nintendo devices.

[Jotoco]

4 hours ago, Vishera said:

Not only that will happen if Epic wins,That case could be used to lift a walled garden from any electronic device with a store like Playstation,XBOX and Nintendo devices.

Harder. 

 

Phones are general computacional devices with many purposes. 

 

Videogames are videogames. 

[Vishera]

26 minutes ago, Jotoco said:

Phones are general computacional devices with many purposes. 

 

So are gaming consoles,you can browse the web,watch Netflix and play music,you don't have to game on them.

For example many people bought game consoles to be used as a home theater system.

[Kisai]

37 minutes ago, Jotoco said:

Harder. 

 

Phones are general computacional devices with many purposes. 

 

Videogames are videogames. 

That's not true at all. You can watch Netflix on everything. Consoles with BD drives can watch BD movies and people have bought Playstations entirely for use as BD-players/Netflix players.

 

[Lord Vile]

11 minutes ago, Kisai said:

That's not true at all. You can watch Netflix on everything. Consoles with BD drives can watch BD movies and people have bought Playstations entirely for use as BD-players/Netflix players.

 

Didn't the US army buy a boatload of PS3's to run Linux on them? 

[Kisai]

14 minutes ago, Lord Vile said:

Didn't the US army buy a boatload of PS3's to run Linux on them? 

Yep, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3_cluster

 

Though that in itself is kind of a special case since the PS3 CPU was in the same family as the Power4 CPU, and the SPE's were kinda like special purpose DSP's.

Quote

In November 2010 the Air Force Research Laboratory created a powerful supercomputer, nicknamed the "Condor Cluster," by connecting together 1,760 Sony PS3s which include 168 separate graphical processing units and 84 coordinating servers in a parallel array capable of performing 500 trillion floating-point operations per second (500 TFLOPS).^[21] As built the Condor Cluster was the 33rd largest supercomputer in the world and would be used to analyse high definition satellite imagery.

The other clusters were really small clusters like 8 systems. The AFRL used the GPU though, which was basically a GeForce 7800 GTX which was quite a feat in 2005. 

 

[Lord Vile]

1 minute ago, Kisai said:

Yep, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3_cluster

 

Though that in itself is kind of a special case since the PS3 CPU was in the same family as the Power4 CPU, and the SPE's were kinda like special purpose DSP's.

The other clusters were really small clusters like 8 systems. The AFRL used the GPU though, which was basically a GeForce 7800 GTX which was quite a feat in 2005. 

 

Can use consoles for allsorts not just gaming