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How relevent is Ray tracing?

Acupunker
By Acupunker
in Graphics Cards
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I'm trying to decide on a new GPU. I'm heavily considering the RTX 2070 Super or the Radeon 5700 XT. I'd like to keep my GPU budget around the $400-700 range. I'm looking more for the longevity and relevance of the system overall in the next 2-4 years, which leads me towards the Nvidia cards. However, the price and performance of the AMD card is intriguing. I've built multiple systems in the past and am recently getting back into PC gaming. So, is the Nvidia card worth the price with the technology it has on board currently? Any thoughts or recommendations would be appreciated!

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For the $700 range, you're in 2080 territory which AMD doesn't have a player for (yet) so you'd be faced with Nvidia regardless

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2 minutes ago, Acupunker said:

I'm trying to decide on a new GPU. I'm heavily considering the RTX 2070 Super or the Radeon 5700 XT. I'd like to keep my GPU budget around the $400-700 range. I'm looking more for the longevity and relevance of the system overall in the next 2-4 years, which leads me towards the Nvidia cards. However, the price and performance of the AMD card is intriguing. I've built multiple systems in the past and am recently getting back into PC gaming. So, is the Nvidia card worth the price with the technology it has on board currently? Any thoughts or recommendations would be appreciated!

Don't hold your both give it another 2 years and Ray Tracing wil be much more evident in game.

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There are a handful games that are taking advantage of it now, but my gut is that it will be a few years before it's widespread. I wouldn't pay much more for ray tracing unless I was planning out a couple years. That being said, I agree with Fasauceome that at the top end of your price range you'll be going with Nvidia anyways.

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The bigger question is how needed are RT and tensor cores needed for ray tracing. I see ray tracing as staying for good but AMD showed off software based ray tracing that didn't require addition hardware so I'd say it'll probably continue to evolve like any other rendering mechanic.

▓ƆԀ▓ S▓₱▓Ɇ▓c▓s▓: i7 6ʇɥפᴉƎ00K (4.4ghz), Asus DeLuxe X99A II, GT҉X҉1҉0҉8҉0 Zotac Amp ExTrꍟꎭe),Si6F4Gb D???????r PlatinUm, EVGA G2 Sǝʌǝᘉ5ᙣᙍᖇᓎᙎᗅᖶt, Phanteks Enthoo Primo, 3TB WD Black, 500gb 850 Evo, H100iGeeTeeX, Windows 10, K70 R̸̢̡̭͍͕̱̭̟̩̀̀̃́̃͒̈́̈́͑̑́̆͘͜ͅG̶̦̬͊́B̸͈̝̖͗̈́, G502, HyperX Cloud 2s, Asus MX34. פN∩SW∀S 960 EVO

Just keeping this here as a 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̌̅̒̾̈́̆͌̌̾̎̽̐̅̏́̈̔͛̀̋̃͊̒̓͗͒̑͒̃͂̌̄̇̑̇͛̆̾͛̒̇̍̒̓̀̈́̄̐͂̍͊͗̎̔͌͛̂̏̉̊̎͗͊͒̂̈̽̊́̔̊̃͑̈́̑̌̋̓̅̔́́͒̄̈́̈̂͐̈̅̈̓͌̓͊́̆͌̉͐̊̉͛̓̏̓̅̈́͂̉̒̇̉̆̀̍̄̇͆͛̏̉̑̃̓͂́͋̃̆̒͋̓͊̄́̓̕̕̕̚͘͘͘̚̕̚͘̕̕͜͜͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͠ͅS̷̢̨̧̢̡̨̢̨̢̨̧̧̨̧͚̱̪͇̱̮̪̮̦̝͖̜͙̘̪̘̟̱͇͎̻̪͚̩͍̠̹̮͚̦̝̤͖̙͔͚̙̺̩̥̻͈̺̦͕͈̹̳̖͓̜͚̜̭͉͇͖̟͔͕̹̯̬͍̱̫̮͓̙͇̗̙̼͚̪͇̦̗̜̼̠͈̩̠͉͉̘̱̯̪̟͕̘͖̝͇̼͕̳̻̜͖̜͇̣̠̹̬̗̝͓̖͚̺̫͛̉̅̐̕͘͜͜͜͜ͅͅͅ.̶̨̢̢̨̢̨̢̛̻͙̜̼̮̝̙̣̘̗̪̜̬̳̫̙̮̣̹̥̲̥͇͈̮̟͉̰̮̪̲̗̳̰̫̙͍̦̘̠̗̥̮̹̤̼̼̩͕͉͕͇͙̯̫̩̦̟̦̹͈͔̱̝͈̤͓̻̟̮̱͖̟̹̝͉̰͊̓̏̇͂̅̀̌͑̿͆̿̿͗̽̌̈́̉̂̀̒̊̿͆̃̄͑͆̃̇͒̀͐̍̅̃̍̈́̃̕͘͜͜͝͠͠z̴̢̢̡̧̢̢̧̢̨̡̨̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̲͚̠̜̮̠̜̞̤̺͈̘͍̻̫͖̣̥̗̙̳͓͙̫̫͖͍͇̬̲̳̭̘̮̤̬̖̼͎̬̯̼̮͔̭̠͎͓̼̖̟͈͓̦̩̦̳̙̮̗̮̩͙͓̮̰̜͎̺̞̝̪͎̯̜͈͇̪̙͎̩͖̭̟͎̲̩͔͓͈͌́̿͐̍̓͗͑̒̈́̎͂̋͂̀͂̑͂͊͆̍͛̄̃͌͗̌́̈̊́́̅͗̉͛͌͋̂̋̇̅̔̇͊͑͆̐̇͊͋̄̈́͆̍̋̏͑̓̈́̏̀͒̂̔̄̅̇̌̀̈́̿̽̋͐̾̆͆͆̈̌̿̈́̎͌̊̓̒͐̾̇̈́̍͛̅͌̽́̏͆̉́̉̓̅́͂͛̄̆͌̈́̇͐̒̿̾͌͊͗̀͑̃̊̓̈̈́̊͒̒̏̿́͑̄̑͋̀̽̀̔̀̎̄͑̌̔́̉̐͛̓̐̅́̒̎̈͆̀̍̾̀͂̄̈́̈́̈́̑̏̈́̐̽̐́̏̂̐̔̓̉̈́͂̕̚̕͘͘̚͘̚̕̚̚̚͘̕̕̕͜͜͝͠͠͝͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͝͝ͅͅͅī̸̧̧̧̡̨̨̢̨̛̛̘͓̼̰̰̮̗̰͚̙̥̣͍̦̺͈̣̻͇̱͔̰͈͓͖͈̻̲̫̪̲͈̜̲̬̖̻̰̦̰͙̤̘̝̦̟͈̭̱̮̠͍̖̲͉̫͔͖͔͈̻̖̝͎̖͕͔̣͈̤̗̱̀̅̃̈́͌̿̏͋̊̇̂̀̀̒̉̄̈́͋͌̽́̈́̓̑̈̀̍͗͜͜͠͠ͅp̴̢̢̧̨̡̡̨̢̨̢̢̢̨̡̛̛͕̩͕̟̫̝͈̖̟̣̲̖̭̙͇̟̗͖͎̹͇̘̰̗̝̹̤̺͉͎̙̝̟͙͚̦͚͖̜̫̰͖̼̤̥̤̹̖͉͚̺̥̮̮̫͖͍̼̰̭̤̲͔̩̯̣͖̻͇̞̳̬͉̣̖̥̣͓̤͔̪̙͎̰̬͚̣̭̞̬͎̼͉͓̮͙͕̗̦̞̥̮̘̻͎̭̼͚͎͈͇̥̗͖̫̮̤̦͙̭͎̝͖̣̰̱̩͎̩͎̘͇̟̠̱̬͈̗͍̦̘̱̰̤̱̘̫̫̮̥͕͉̥̜̯͖̖͍̮̼̲͓̤̮͈̤͓̭̝̟̲̲̳̟̠͉̙̻͕͙̞͔̖͈̱̞͓͔̬̮͎̙̭͎̩̟̖͚̆͐̅͆̿͐̄̓̀̇̂̊̃̂̄̊̀͐̍̌̅͌̆͊̆̓́̄́̃̆͗͊́̓̀͑͐̐̇͐̍́̓̈́̓̑̈̈́̽͂́̑͒͐͋̊͊̇̇̆̑̃̈́̎͛̎̓͊͛̐̾́̀͌̐̈́͛̃̂̈̿̽̇̋̍͒̍͗̈͘̚̚͘̚͘͘͜͜͜͜͜͜͠͠͝͝ͅͅͅ☻♥■∞{╚mYÄÜXτ╕○\╚Θº£¥ΘBM@Q05♠{{↨↨▬§¶‼↕◄►☼1♦  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12 minutes ago, Acupunker said:

700 range

The Founders Edition RTX 2080 Super straight from nvidia for 699$.

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Compute DXR isn't so bad... I've been having fun with it in Retro Resolutions across Various Singleplayer Games.

GTX 10 series got it for free and I use PS3 resolutions pretending its like a PS3 PRO (960x540p up to 1280x720p) with Great Fidelity, let down by RES, but playable in a sense. Quake2, MetroEx and BFV all had 30-40fps ranges (it can go higher but I mean under DXR bottleneck loads), maybe a blip below if it stutters a tad under compute load but recovers well enough.

 

I can't wait for it to be feasible on Better Modern Midrange GPUs.

 

GTX1080ti is twice as good as the GTX1070, so it must have decent enough (Vsync 30hz like say a Console DXR game in few years) hopefully better results at a higher resolution than used below..

3 RTX settings enabled. LOWRES Upsampled.

12 minutes ago, BuckGup said:

The bigger question is how needed are RT and tensor cores needed for ray tracing. I see ray tracing as staying for good but AMD showed off software based ray tracing that didn't require addition hardware so I'd say it'll probably continue to evolve like any other rendering mechanic.

 

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depends on the games you play, i wanna say it's very optional, but now that i've seen it in metro with upcoming watchdog and  cyberpunk 2077, i'm not playing those games with DXR off. but the consoles next gen are gonna have ray tracing anyway, if there was ever a year to wait, this would be it.

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All great info and suggestions! It's a tough decision. I'm going to be splitting my gaming time between PC and console (don't hate!). Feels like saving a bit on the GPU and maybe taking some of that $$ to put towards more RAM or other components might be the way to go

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Considering that AMD will soon™ release top end NaVi cards) which if the numbers of RX 5700 and RX 5700XT are anything to go by) I would wait a bit longer and either get RTX cards when nvidia slashes prices again or the AMD card that beats it. 

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I wouldn't build a system just for ray tracing, however it just so happens the best GPU's at the moment have it.
At no point did RT factor into me buying my cards. Set a price in your mind, say $600 and find the best performing card at that price.

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10 hours ago, xg32 said:

depends on the games you play, i wanna say it's very optional, but now that i've seen it in metro with upcoming watchdog and  cyberpunk 2077, i'm not playing those games with DXR off. but the consoles next gen are gonna have ray tracing anyway, if there was ever a year to wait, this would be it.

The consoles will support software raytracing... not exactly the same as hardware accelerated. I doubt they will even be able to get a lot out of it since it's basically using adapted current amd hardware. It's just promo talk or another box to tick off.

 

Like the current consoles support 4k. movies or checkerboard rendered games. So not exactly the real deal either.

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Depends on how much of your life you want not to be ray traced. 

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1st gen real time ray tracing, that in the 20 series RTX cards... isnt worth it. The performance hit is to high.

 

IMO if ur looking at the kind of budget u have, u should consider a used 1080ti or the AMD 5700XT

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I would say ray tracing is going to be more and more relevant in the future. Even Minecraft is supposedly undergoing the RTX treatment, but it mostly depends on what games you play.

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10 hours ago, Acupunker said:

All great info and suggestions! It's a tough decision. I'm going to be splitting my gaming time between PC and console (don't hate!). Feels like saving a bit on the GPU and maybe taking some of that $$ to put towards more RAM or other components might be the way to go

Yeah, some of this is subjective at the end of the day, but say if you're only gaming at sub-4k @60-120hz I would just look at your best price:performance ratio for achieving that (probably the 5700 xt).  Don't bank on the future to justify what you purchase today - likely by the time ray tracing is a really big deal the 2000 series will be obsolete.  It shouldn't dictate your purchase decision.

 

Get RTX 2070 Super or higher only if you either need to be hitting a certain fps/setting or you're a dev/enthusiast.

Sometimes I get builder's itch

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10 hours ago, Biggerboot said:

Yeah, some of this is subjective at the end of the day, but say if you're only gaming at sub-4k @60-120hz I would just look at your best price:performance ratio for achieving that (probably the 5700 xt).  Don't bank on the future to justify what you purchase today - likely by the time ray tracing is a really big deal the 2000 series will be obsolete.  It shouldn't dictate your purchase decision.

 

Get RTX 2070 Super or higher only if you either need to be hitting a certain fps/setting or you're a dev/enthusiast.

Much appreciated! I've been pricing some 5700 xt and the 2070 super from different manufacturers. I think I like the idea of the 'future-tech' but with splitting my time between PC and console gaming, I'm not sure if spending the extra dough is worth it. I also don't plan on 4K gaming for the next year on PC either

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On 9/9/2019 at 1:05 AM, SkilledRebuilds said:

GTX1080ti is twice as good as the GTX1070, so it must have decent enough (Vsync 30hz like say a Console DXR game in few years) hopefully better results at a higher resolution than used below..

3 RTX settings enabled. LOWRES Upsampled.

Yesterday, I received Control free for buying RTX card.

 

I played it on the resolution of 2560x1440 and render resolution set at 2560x1440 with quality all max, Ray-Tracing all enabled with setting all max and DLSS disabled. It runs 35-40 FPS averge (mini 30 and high 45).

 

If I enable DLSS, it runs more than 60 FPS but I don't like render resolution upsampled.

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Laptop collection #3 : Toshiba T2130CS | 486DX4 75MHz | 32MB EDO | 520MB IDE | internal floppy drive | 10.4" STN 640x480 256 color | Win3.1 with MS-DOS 6.22

And 6 others computers (Intel Compute Stick x5-Z8330, Giada Slim N10 WinXP, 2 Apple classic and 2 PC pocket WinCE)

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Posted

It is about to get a whole lot more relevant.  It still needs more inclusion in games, but man I am a believer after control.  Metro and BF5 were kinda neat, but it still was kinda just meh.  Big performance hit for not that big of a difference in game.

 

But with implementation in control, and them building the game from the ground up to be awesome with RTX, I am loving it.  It just looks fantastic and was done so well.  With big AAA games including it (and if they have it at launch, not 6 months later when everyone is done with the game) it will become more of a thing.  Cyberpunk might be the point where everyone really wants it I would think, as it is so highly anticipated and its going to look absolutely sick with RTX.

 

Also the performance hit, while big, is getting a little better.  A 2070 non super can do 1080p with RTX and get 60fps on medium RTX settings (a sweet spot, as you get all the environment reflections), 45-50 everything completely maxed on control (all this is with no DLSS, as DLSS is garbage).  This is probably the most taxing RTX scenario that has been put to the test so far in terms of a AAA title (glass and reflections everywhere).  Definitely not only playable, but smooth.  

 

 

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The Box:  3900x + RTX 3080 /  32 gb 3000mHz RAM / B550 MSI mortar 

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10 minutes ago, Zberg said:

Cyberpunk might be the point where everyone really wants it I would think, as it is so highly anticipated and its going to look absolutely sick with RTX.

This is definitely not the reason I'm contemplating saving up for a 2080 Ti, I swear.

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On 9/9/2019 at 8:20 AM, TrainFan2019 said:

I would say ray tracing is going to be more and more relevant in the future. Even Minecraft is supposedly undergoing the RTX treatment, but it mostly depends on what games you play.

Minecraft is already available to raytrace in if you go for the SEUS PTGI shaders... And it works just fine on the 5700 XT. (hardware restricted is bull****)

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Problem with any new 'feature' in regards to graphics is that it is always overdone in the 1st gen of games. In this case reflections are over emphasized, floors and surfaces to shiny. Sure it shows of the 'feature' but it isnt realistic, which in this case kind of takes away from the whole point of the 'feature'.

 

Ray Tracing will be worth it once a newer generation of GPU's can handle it at higher frame rates and games start using it more extensively but also more subtly.

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as long as its locked to nvidia i dont see it taking off just like how physx didnt take off and imo physx was much cooler than ray tracing. as a game dev you dont really want to be developing a feature that will split your player base

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