Wallmart kills OVERPOWERED Prebuilt PCs - [UPDATE - They're back!... Now with a $400 discount!]

[Taf the Ghost]

24 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Nah, GN must be lying, LTT has me reliably informed that it is definitely shit.

 

 

I really hope at least A few people will learn not to pre judge anything,  it really is frustrating when you can't have a decent conversation because every second comment is a naive regurgitation of some uniformed moron on the internet. 

Well, the SI cheaped out on the motherboard really hard, didn't make sure the GPU power cable was properly attached in at least several shipments, hot glued a Type-C to the motherboard and didn't make sure there was enough air flow to make the front 3 fans do anything useful. A no-spec sheet, generic, bare metal PSU should logically be assumed to be "too cheap" for the system.

 

It's not a great PSU, but it's not Tier 7, it seems. Which is actually surprising.

[79wjd]

15 minutes ago, seon123 said:

Group regulated, so it's crap. Not immediately dying and not going out of spec in unrealistically ideal circumstances ≠ fine. 

No. It's not crap. Full stop. 

 

It might be a poor choice. It might not match the level of hardware being marketed. But it is absolutely fine. It's not likely to die out of nowhere and it's not likely to take hardware with it -- as is the case with the vast majority of PSUs on the market. 

 

Don't be such an obnoxious snob. 

[mr moose]

48 minutes ago, seon123 said:

Group regulated, so it's crap. Not immediately dying and not going out of spec in unrealistically ideal circumstances ≠ fine. 

Which is highly uncommon,  PSU's are like engines in tools, the less work they do the longer they will last.  

 

34 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Well, the SI cheaped out on the motherboard really hard,

We don't have failure rates for that, remember this is not a custom pc for upgrading or anything like that.   So this is again making judgments on how good something is without any reasoning to substantiate such a claim. 

Quote

didn't make sure the GPU power cable was properly attached in at least several shipments,

Yep, not good QC on the labour, but that is different to the parts being of suitable quality.

Quote

hot glued a Type-C to the motherboard and didn't make sure there was enough air flow to make the front 3 fans do anything useful.

If you buy something this cheap they have to cut corners somewhere, not saying it's great, but remember that Linus's one did not over heat under normal use.

Quote

A no-spec sheet, generic, bare metal PSU should logically be assumed to be "too cheap" for the system.

No it's not logically to be assumed,  an assumption is what you do when you have insufficient evidence. The correct word here is "wrongly" assumed, because many quality products come in a generic form. It's just a bunch of tech enthusiasts are naive to how the industry works outside of the RGB and pedistool narrative.

 

Quote

It's not a great PSU, but it's not Tier 7, it seems. Which is actually surprising.

 

Tier butt smear,  people put way too much stock in tier lists.  like all products, if you don't overload a PSU and you don't use one that came with a $20 case they all have the basically  same failure rate. 

[Blademaster91]

18 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

No. It's not crap. Full stop. 

 

It might be a poor choice. It might not match the level of hardware being marketed. But it is absolutely fine. It's not likely to die out of nowhere and it's not likely to take hardware with it -- as is the case with the vast majority of PSUs on the market. 

 

Don't be such an obnoxious snob. 

But the power supply is total crap because it doesn't match the level of hardware being marketed. It may be fine for a cheap $500 PC with a GPU that doesn't need PSU power though shouldn't be acceptable for a $1,000 gaming PC, and when there are many other SI's that use reputable brands. I personally still wouldn't trust it, but i'd like to see GamersNexus do a PSU hot test to simulate when someone puts one of these walmart PC's with the back up against a wall.

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, Blademaster91 said:

 but i'd like to see GamersNexus do a PSU hot test to simulate when someone puts one of these walmart PC's with the back up against a wall.

What would be the difference between that and pushing it to 120% load and watching it safely shut down? 

 

The PSU is big enough for the designed end use without being weak link.  Not sure why people have a hard time accepting this.

[Taf the Ghost]

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

Which is highly uncommon,  PSU's are like engines in tools, the less work they do the longer they will last.  

 

We don't have failure rates for that, remember this is not a custom pc for upgrading or anything like that.   So this is again making judgments on how good something is without any reasoning to substantiate such a claim. 

Yep, not good QC on the labour, but that is different to the parts being of suitable quality.

If you buy something this cheap they have to cut corners somewhere, not saying it's great, but remember that Linus's one did not over heat under normal use.

No it's not logically to be assumed,  an assumption is what you do when you have insufficient evidence. The correct word here is "wrongly" assumed, because many quality products come in a generic form. It's just a bunch of tech enthusiasts are naive to how the industry works outside of the RGB and pedistool narrative.

 

 

Tier butt smear,  people put way too much stock in tier lists.  like all products, if you don't overload a PSU and you don't use one that came with a $20 case they all have the basically  same failure rate. 

Kyle (Bitwit) was able to solve most of the problems with the case for what should have been about 20 bucks in production costs. They wouldn't have even needed hot glue, as a result.

 

 

An SI that is making that many mistakes on a product running 1400-2100USD gets no benefit of the doubt. The fact GN had to use rather expensive electrical testing equipment just to find out that the PSU wasn't trash tier ends this discussion.

[79wjd]

20 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

The fact GN had to use rather expensive electrical testing equipment just to find out that the PSU wasn't trash tier ends this discussion.

That makes absolutely no sense. The fact that they CHOSE to look into the PSU with expensive equipment has no bearing on anything. 

[Spotty]

15 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Kyle (Bitwit) was able to solve most of the problems with the case for what should have been about 20 bucks in production costs. They wouldn't have even needed hot glue, as a result.

https://youtu.be/RM-mgyPaGoA?t=194

 

@Stefan Payne is going to lose his shit when he sees what Bitwit replaced the PSU with and talks about what a great review it got at Jonnyguru.com (... back in 2010!). Won't say which model it is so I don't ruin the surprise for Stefan, but he probably knows what it is

[seon123]

1 hour ago, 79wjd said:

No. It's not crap. Full stop. 

 

It might be a poor choice. It might not match the level of hardware being marketed. But it is absolutely fine. It's not likely to die out of nowhere and it's not likely to take hardware with it -- as is the case with the vast majority of PSUs on the market. 

 

Don't be such an obnoxious snob. 

Group regulated means it will go out of spec during the deep sleep states, since Haswell. It's also likely to go out of spec during normal use in a modern PC. IE, with near all the load on 12V, and close to no load on 5V. 

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

Which is highly uncommon,  PSU's are like engines in tools, the less work they do the longer they will last.  

I was referring to the loads where the minor rails are loaded as well as the 12V rail. This helps group regulated PSUs by a ton, and is not what happens in modern PCs. 

 

10 minutes ago, Spotty said:

https://youtu.be/RM-mgyPaGoA?t=194

 

@Stefan Payne is going to lose his shit when he sees what Bitwit replaced the PSU with and talks about what a great review it got at Jonnyguru.com (... back in 2010!). Won't say which model it is so I don't ruin the surprise for Stefan, but he probably knows what it is

I think we all know which decade old, group regulated, overpriced piece of crap that is

 

[Stefan Payne]

15 minutes ago, Spotty said:

is going to lose his shit when he sees what Bitwit replaced the PSU with and talks about what a great review it got at Jonnyguru.com (... back in 2010!). Won't say which model it is so I don't ruin the surprise for Stefan, but he probably knows what it is

Urgh, why is everyone still mention THAT unit??? 

What he did was basically recommending this 2010 unit for no reason. Every other unit would have been better.

Maybe even EVGA BT 450..

[Stefan Payne]

2 hours ago, 79wjd said:

No. It's not crap. Full stop. 

 

It might be a poor choice. It might not match the level of hardware being marketed. But it is absolutely fine. It's not likely to die out of nowhere and it's not likely to take hardware with it -- as is the case with the vast majority of PSUs on the market. 

 

Don't be such an obnoxious snob. 

Its group regulated, so its crap.

Every group regulated unit is crap, there is no discussion about that.

2 hours ago, mr moose said:

Which is highly uncommon,  PSU's are like engines in tools, the less work they do the longer they will last.  

when PSU manufacturers specify that they mean full wattage ad specified room temperature with 100% load 24/7, no.

 

Here is my Proof:

 

Where is yours?

2 hours ago, Taf the Ghost said:

A no-spec sheet, generic, bare metal PSU should logically be assumed to be "too cheap" for the system.

 

It's not a great PSU, but it's not Tier 7, it seems. Which is actually surprising.

If you don't know who Great Wall is, then maybe.

 

But, as Steve said in his video, Great Wall makes PSU for Corsair for example CS Series and the updated version of that called TXM

As well as the SF Series.

 

They also do jobs for example for LC-Power.

And here is a review of what might be the same Plattform as the one used in this PC:
https://www.computerbase.de/2015-06/40-euro-netzteile-500-550-watt-test/

 

And here a Seasonic S12II-Bronze (XFX XT500 (zweite Revision):

https://www.computerbase.de/2017-07/cooler-master-cougar-xfx-zalman-netzteil-test/3/#abschnitt_schutzschaltungen

 

It looks like the Great Wall PSU is acutally better than the Seasonic Bitwit replaced it with. But hey, it has a nice sounding Name on the Label, so  it must be better, right??

We're here in the "believe in Manufacturers" bullshit...

[Blademaster91]

33 minutes ago, Spotty said:

https://youtu.be/RM-mgyPaGoA?t=194

 

@Stefan Payne is going to lose his shit when he sees what Bitwit replaced the PSU with and talks about what a great review it got at Jonnyguru.com (... back in 2010!). Won't say which model it is so I don't ruin the surprise for Stefan, but he probably knows what it is

But is it less crap than the PSU the walmart PC comes with? I would still have more trust in the one Bitwit chose, even though its an outdated power supply and every OEM has an outdated or crappy unit.

41 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

That makes absolutely no sense. The fact that they CHOSE to look into the PSU with expensive equipment has no bearing on anything. 

Because they needed testing equipment to find out if some no name generic PSU that didn't have complete specs was bad. It still doesn't excuse choosing such a low end PSU along with the other things wrong with these PC's.

[Taf the Ghost]

@Stefan Payne

 

Manufacturers will generally produce to the spec they think they can sell. We have a 40+ year history, in computers, of low-quality PSUs. We lacked a spec sheet for the PSU and while Great Wall can make up & down the range of quality, we already had a system with lowest-cost possible parts in key areas. The only sign, from the outside, that it wasn't trash-tier was the fact it was actually branded. 

 

Which is why the PSU turning out to be better than expected is more of a sign of how good PSU quality, at the most basic, has gotten rather than the SI knowing how to choose parts properly. 

[Spotty]

2 hours ago, seon123 said:

Group regulated, so it's crap. Not immediately dying and not going out of spec in unrealistically ideal circumstances ≠ fine. 

I have to agree with this. Just because it didn't blow up doesn't mean it gets a pass.
Voltage ripple wasn't too bad, and the over current protection actually worked and shut off the unit which is always nice. Realistically that's all we know from the GN testing since OCP, Voltage Ripple, and Efficiency was all that was tested. (they're still working on their PSU testing, so they'll likely test more things in the future)
I'd say that it probably wasn't as bad as what a lot of people were expecting it to be, and there's definitely worse units out there... But it's still a very old group regulated unit and should be treated as such.

 

18 minutes ago, Stefan Payne said:

They also do jobs for example for LC-Power.

And here is a review of what might be the same Plattform as the one used in this PC:
https://www.computerbase.de/2015-06/40-euro-netzteile-500-550-watt-test/

Looking at the internal shot of the LC-Power and comparing it to the shot of the Great Wall GW-6000(80+) that Gamers Nexus posted to twitter, to my untrained eye, they look to be the same, with some minor differences such as the heatsink.

Really disappointed that Gamers Nexus didn't include a teardown in their PSU testing video, especially since they obviously opened it up.

Here's the Great Wall GW-6000(80+) that GN posted to Twitter. (Not sure if you've seen this yet @Stefan Payne)

Spoiler

Here's the LC-Power LC6560GP3 from the Article Stefan Payne linked to

Spoiler

 

From what I can tell the layout seems identical...
Though, that might not be anything to boast about, especially since the article was written in 2015, and mentioned that the LC-Power was a 6 year old unit, making it a 2009 unit. And the Great Walls design could be even older still... So I wouldn't go as far as saying that the S12ii was a worse unit to replace it with, but probably not much better to the point that it defeats the purpose of replacing it at all if you're just going to replace it with something that is equally old, crappy, and group regulated.

Quote

The LC6560GP3 has been available for almost six years, which is noticeable in some places. Still it is still a decent power supply. The many protective circuits intervene in a timely manner and reliably prevent worse. In practice, the LC6560GP3 also scores points with the best voltage regulation.

 

[79wjd]

59 minutes ago, Stefan Payne said:

Its group regulated, so its crap.

Every group regulated unit is crap, there is no discussion about that.

Group regulated PSUs might not be ideal, but for some very strange reason, computers weren't suddenly blowing up in significant numbers years ago.... 

 

So, again, no. That doesn't make it crap. That just makes it a bad choice -- far from the 'guaranteed' fire bomb that people are treating it like.

55 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

Because they needed testing equipment to find out if some no name generic PSU that didn't have complete specs was bad. It still doesn't excuse choosing such a low end PSU along with the other things wrong with these PC's.

Except it could have been a Titanium Corsair PSU that wasn't a known model and they would need the same hardware to prove that it too wasn't crap. 

 

I'm not saying it was a good choice, it's just not the doomsday device that people are trying to make it out to be.

[Canada EH]

On 12/5/2018 at 10:36 AM, dtaflorida said:

I didn't dig to much deeper tho as I mostly got what I wanted to know.

You wanting to buy a pc from Walmart?

[Stefan Payne]

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

But is it less crap than the PSU the walmart PC comes with? I would still have more trust in the one Bitwit chose, even though its an outdated power supply and every OEM has an outdated or crappy unit.

No, not really. Look at the Links I've Provided. The Voltage Regulation on the LC-Power that seems close to the Great Wall one is better than the Seasonic.

And also Protection works, something that isn't the case of the Seasonic.

 

And your Excuse is bullshit because not everyone has outdated or crappy units in their lineup. Some even phased out all group regulated stuff in ATX format with 400W and higher.

Be quiet for example. There is no group regulated be quiet that is not EOL by the Manufacturer that is sold today. Even the System Power is Indy...

For Corsair you have to go down to the VS Series.
Some other still have some Group Regulated stuff but they seem to get phased out left and right.

A thing you seem to miss is that the S12II-Bronze lacks Protection!

So if you short something, it will burn until the voltage of that Rail falls under the UVP threshold...

You can see that in the Link about the XFX XT, wich is the newest Seasonic S12II Variant Test I am aware of.

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

Because they needed testing equipment to find out if some no name generic PSU that didn't have complete specs was bad. It still doesn't excuse choosing such a low end PSU along with the other things wrong with these PC's.

True but what does make it low end?!
Just because you don't know the manufacturer of a unit, doesn't make it bad. The Problem I see with the Walmart thing is that there were people doing the shit who have no idea what they're doing.

 

1 hour ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Manufacturers will generally produce to the spec they think they can sell. We have a 40+ year history, in computers, of low-quality PSUs. We lacked a spec sheet for the PSU and while Great Wall can make up & down the range of quality, we already had a system with lowest-cost possible parts in key areas. The only sign, from the outside, that it wasn't trash-tier was the fact it was actually branded. 

That does NOT excuse the existance of such Products and manufacturers should be called out for making such shit.

Especially if we're talking about about lack of OCP on a pretty pricy unit from a "reputable Manufacturer".

YOU should call them out for that and tell everyone that its one of the most important features of a PSU!

 

And you see those "grey things" in OEM units all the time. And some of those units (like Delta DPS-500QB) are actually fairly good and better than most things you can buy as an enduser!!

 

1 hour ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Which is why the PSU turning out to be better than expected is more of a sign of how good PSU quality, at the most basic, has gotten rather than the SI knowing how to choose parts properly. 

That is true but to replace this Great Wall unit with a Seasonic S12II-Bronze variant with up to 620W makes no sense.

Its replacing it with the same shit, just in a fancier case with a fancier name...

 

Sad thing is that while people are aware that for example Cooler Master Master Watt Lite is not a good PSU, they believe the S12II-Bronze is, although both are about the same in voltage regulation and so on...

You'd bash the S12II if it came from Corsair for example...

[Stefan Payne]

51 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

Group regulated PSUs might not be ideal, but for some very strange reason, computers weren't suddenly blowing up in significant numbers years ago.... 

Just because that happens doesn't make it usable or viable at any time.

Computer Hardware is fairly tolerant towards really shitty voltages.

 

For example:

that PSU powered a PC just a week before. It was replaced because it couldn't power the Hard Drive and that one was pulsing!

 

 

So it doesn't necessarily blow up stuff but it kills them fairly quickly. So when a GPU dies every year, its most likely the PSU at fault...

And that is the Problem...

 

And what some bad System Integrators want. They want the PSU to kill the components after the Warranty Period is over.

 

 

51 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

So, again, no. That doesn't make it crap. That just makes it a bad choice -- far from the 'guaranteed' fire bomb that people are treating it like.

Except it could have been a Titanium Corsair PSU that wasn't a known model and they would need the same hardware to prove that it too wasn't crap. 

It makes it crap.

Every group regulated unit can be forced to have a +12V Voltage of over 12,6V and a +5V Voltage under 4,75V wich is in violation of ATX Specifications.

So yeah, it is bad.

 

But you're right, people treating this unit like they should the S12II because its actually worse, if Great Wall used a decent Suprvisior that actually comes with OCP on all rails and has OTP implemented as well.

 

51 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

I'm not saying it was a good choice, it's just not the doomsday device that people are trying to make it out to be.

Yes, they get blinded by the Case and a name they probably haven't heard of too many times...

And the sad thing is that this Great Wall PSU might be better than some "Named Brand" stuff from EVGA, Seasonic, Thermaltake and co...

 

 

1 hour ago, Spotty said:

I have to agree with this. Just because it didn't blow up doesn't mean it gets a pass.
Voltage ripple wasn't too bad, and the over current protection actually worked and shut off the unit which is always nice. Realistically that's all we know from the GN testing since OCP, Voltage Ripple, and Efficiency was all that was tested. (they're still working on their PSU testing, so they'll likely test more things in the future)
I'd say that it probably wasn't as bad as what a lot of people were expecting it to be, and there's definitely worse units out there... But it's still a very old group regulated unit and should be treated as such.

Exactly!
It had working protection, with OCP. OTP they probably didn't test.

So that makes it better than many lower end Solutions wich use 8pin Supervisiors...

As it didn't kill itself...

 

Though it doesn't make it a good unit as you can force the voltages to go out of spec. Would be nice to see GN test according to Intel specification of Haswell - 0A on +12V and maximum Load on minor rails. And vice versa for the other one....

That then shows why Group Regulated units are not good.

 

1 hour ago, Spotty said:

Looking at the internal shot of the LC-Power and comparing it to the shot of the Great Wall GW-6000(80+) that Gamers Nexus posted to twitter, to my untrained eye, they look to be the same, with some minor differences such as the heatsink.

Really disappointed that Gamers Nexus didn't include a teardown in their PSU testing video, especially since they obviously opened it up.

There seems to be some minor differences on the Secondary side, the position of the Caps is a bit different it seems...

But all in all it looks to be the same plattform without many major differences.

Though we don't know if they worked on the unit and improved it in ways we can't see...

 

1 hour ago, Spotty said:

From what I can tell the layout seems identical...
Though, that might not be anything to boast about, especially since the article was written in 2015, and mentioned that the LC-Power was a 6 year old unit, making it a 2009 unit. And the Great Walls design could be even older still... So I wouldn't go as far as saying that the S12ii was a worse unit to replace it with, but probably not much better to the point that it defeats the purpose of replacing it at all if you're just going to replace it with something that is equally old, crappy, and group regulated.

 

I would stil, because the Great Wall unit switched off under overload, while I'd give the Seasonic a FAIL in the Protection area.

The ones I know are the XFX XT wich had totally out of spec voltages under overload, before it shut of.

Or the Original Seasonic in the 350W (with DC-DC for 3,3V) - wich died while overloading the 3,3V Rail.

 

The Fancy Marketing Bullet Points like Wapanese caps and other stuff are irrelevant in this case as you need good electrical performance first before you put in "the good stuff"...

So I'd rather have a unit with a Mix from Man Yue, Kuan Kun, Chinsan and a protection Chip that supports OCP on all rails and UVP on +12V instead of Nippon Chemicon, Nichocn and Rubycon and an 8pin Chip like the HY-510N that doesn't come with OCP on any rail, not even UVO on +12V (due to shared VCC and +12V Protection stuff).

 

So in the end, do we agree that:
a) the Electrical Performance of the Great Wall and Seasonic is similar in terms of Voltage Regulation and Ripple?

b) the Protection of the Great Wall worked, while it is a big minus on the Seasonic?

[mariushm]

9 minutes ago, Stefan Payne said:

Be quiet for example. There is no group regulated be quiet that is not EOL by the Manufacturer that is sold today. Even the System Power is Indy...

[..]

A thing you seem to miss is that the S12II-Bronze lacks Protection!

So if you short something, it will burn until the voltage of that Rail falls under the UVP threshold...

You can see that in the Link about the XFX XT, wich is the newest Seasonic S12II Variant Test I am aware of.

True but what does make it low end?!
Just because you don't know the manufacturer of a unit, doesn't make it bad. The Problem I see with the Walmart thing is that there were people doing the shit who have no idea what they're doing.

[...]

That is true but to replace this Great Wall unit with a Seasonic S12II-Bronze variant with up to 620W makes no sense.

Its replacing it with the same shit, just in a fancier case with a fancier name...

 

Sad thing is that while people are aware that for example Cooler Master Master Watt Lite is not a good PSU, they believe the S12II-Bronze is, although both are about the same in voltage regulation and so on...

You'd bash the S12II if it came from Corsair for example...

You mention beQuiet with almost every post you make, you're a big fan boy... must be because they're German company and you're from Germany. Anyway...

 

Protection... you're picking things that in reality don't matter that much and you amplify them and think they're so serious... like "every group regulated power supply is crap" or in other threads you said a psu is bad because it can't handle deep sleep states ... as if the person can't just disable that in bios and have compuer consume a few watts more.

Over current protection (if that's what's missing) is overrated ... at what point are you going to set the threshold when video cards like vega56 can draw 400-450w in a few millisecond bursts?

 

The great wall psu is decent, it's OK, I even said that a page or two before when I saw the picture of the insides.

However, the Great Wall is, according to Steve who got the numbers from GW, only rated for 40A on 12v, which is 480 watts. Yeah, it trips and shuts down at 50A but nevertheless it's rated for 40A.

The Seasonic model is rated for 576w or 48A ... so technically the seasonic model is better. Not sure about the exact model, but in general Seasonic uses much higher quality capacitors (longer life, more reliable), often from 1st tier Japanese brands, and the fan used on that model is also from a known brand and of known quality.

the GW psu uses crap capacitors and cheap sleeve bearing fan that will most likely die in a few years.

 

You just posted something as I wrote this message, where you said that power supply died on you... I can see from the pictures shitty capacitors leaking, you have unstable 5v stand-by circuit there, and also the 5v and 12v filter capacitors on the output are leaking. All your fancy protections wouldn't have protected the PC from this. I'd rather have higher quality components inside than those protections. 

 

[Esper22]

On ‎12‎/‎3‎/‎2018 at 7:40 PM, mynameisjuan said:

Thing is the PSU looks cheap and is a no name brand but we have no clue on how reliable of a PSU it is. I WANT TO KNOW!!!!

 

it was actually tested by this guy and found to be at a min an 80%+ on par with an mid lvl 500w unit 

[mynameisjuan]

12 minutes ago, Esper22 said:

 

it was actually tested by this guy and found to be at a min an 80%+ on par with an mid lvl 500w unit 

I saw that and was quite impressed 

[mr moose]

4 hours ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Kyle (Bitwit) was able to solve most of the problems with the case for what should have been about 20 bucks in production costs. They wouldn't have even needed hot glue, as a result.

 

 

An SI that is making that many mistakes on a product running 1400-2100USD gets no benefit of the doubt. The fact GN had to use rather expensive electrical testing equipment just to find out that the PSU wasn't trash tier ends this discussion.

As I said, they chose to cut corners with the case. That means not spending the extra on making it better.

3 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

 

when PSU manufacturers specify that they mean full wattage ad specified room temperature with 100% load 24/7, no.

 

Here is my Proof:

 

Where is yours?

 

Proof of what?  I don't think you understand the discussion.   The PSU is not a bad one for the PC it was selected to run,  It isn't going to randomly blow up due to being "cheap" as is the claim many people are still trying to make.    

[mr moose]

4 hours ago, seon123 said:

 

I was referring to the loads where the minor rails are loaded as well as the 12V rail. This helps group regulated PSUs by a ton, and is not what happens in modern PCs.

 

But the insinuation is that this PSU is going to pack it in and die due to load, it won't because it is not being stressed (just like most PSU's that have sufficient headroom for the task).  Regulation type is largely irrelevant when the device is working inside its capabilities.

[seon123]

5 minutes ago, mr moose said:

But the insinuation is that this PSU is going to pack it in and die due to load, it won't because it is not being stressed (just like most PSU's that have sufficient headroom for the task).  Regulation type is largely irrelevant when the device is working inside its capabilities.

I think I formulated it poorly. Not dying, as one thing. And not going out of spec in ideal conditions was the other. 

So not dying was completely expected, and I don't expect the PSU to die. That does not make the PSU good by any means. 

The PSU going out of spec in real life conditions (with close to no load on the minor rails, and all the load on just the 12V rail), makes it bad. 

[mr moose]

Just now, seon123 said:

I think I formulated it poorly. Not dying, as one thing. And not going out of spec in ideal conditions was the other. 

So not dying was completely expected, and I don't expect the PSU to die. That does not make the PSU good by any means. 

The PSU going out of spec in real life conditions (with close to no load on the minor rails, and all the load on just the 12V rail), makes it bad. 

Does it do that?  Does it do it to the detriment of the PC?