Apple launches "vintage" repair program for Mac and iPhone

[DrMacintosh]

1 minute ago, williamcll said:

But will they fix iphone 4/4s?

Yes, eventually. Read the OP

[D13H4RD]

Can't help but feel that this is more to fan the Right to Repair flames 

[pas008]

sounds like a sales pitch to me

 

oh it will cost 80 to fix

if not we will give 40 credit

 

now they just acquired parts for those fixes

 

[Master Disaster]

Simply Apple trying to force even more owners to upgrade. Apple don't even repair current devices and tell owners the devices are beyond economical repair, there's no way they'll be repairing older devices.

[ZacoAttaco]

I think this initiative should be improved more so. I don’t understand why Apple won’t repair all of their devices, especially when they don’t want you using third party services. I get they it’s a big effort to store parts for all their devices but they shouldn’t flat out refuse to repair because it’s an older or ‘vintage’ product. 

[Blademaster91]

5 hours ago, pas008 said:

sounds like a sales pitch to me

 

oh it will cost 80 to fix

if not we will give 40 credit

 

now they just acquired parts for those fixes

 

Yeah as mentioned Apple doesn't even want your current device to be repaired and would rather tell you it costs the same to buy a new one. It doesn't make sense why they would want a bunch of parts around, besides rather than 3rd party shops having spare parts around, Apple can keep parts to themselves.

13 hours ago, Belgarathian said:

How is any of this bad news, Apple is literally extending first party support for products 7 years and older. Not too many other manufacturers of PCs or phones would have anything similar on offer?

 

Sure there might be another agenda, but it's still good for the consumer. We should be celebrating and supporting Apple to extend the coverage of this program!

Not many others have it since you can easily get replacement parts like batteries,screens,or keyboards yourself.

It is something at least but still PR and not exactly good for the consumer, even with this they're still likely going to charge you more than what the device is worth, and bad for 3rd party since most people are going to believe Apple is doing it to only benefit the consumer instead out of greed really making it more difficult for 3rd party repair shops to obtain certified parts.

[Dabombinable]

This would be better if they included the last models of their iPods. My 7th gen nano's battery drastically lost capacity after the first 18 months, and only manages 2 hours now. Kind of don't want to replace it as it survived being thrown at the road twice, without even the screen being scratched (the accessibility settings enabled themselves, and I couldn't figure out how to navigate it)

[Yeroh]

It's neat that they will offer repairs of older devices, but I can't think of many where it would make a whole lot of sense to do so.

 

I've found most of the Apple devices that I've had to last a lot longer than I'd actually want to use them, so usually anything considered "vintage" by Apple's own definition will be vastly outdated (from a technological perspective) anyway. Of course, repair cost will also be a factor. Since Apple's not exactly known for their budget-friendly pricing, I can't see this being an option for a lot of people.

 

Still, I guess having the option is better than not having it...

[jagdtigger]

1 hour ago, Kevaros said:

I've found most of the Apple devices that I've had to last a lot longer than I'd actually want to use them

The curve is starting to flatten out so there is no real reason to upgrade anymore. Its mostly eye-candy anyway... (Not to mention all the stupidity going on like removing the jack and replaceable batteries... Guess my S5 has a long road ahead .)

[Thaldor]

Let me guess. It's still going to be as expensive for the consumer and as profitable for Apple and if not then they "don't happen to have the parts the consumer needs in their inventory"?

 

Most probably they will the exact same "repair" routines as they use with modern devices. (example) Customer has dead SSD -> SSD is conencted to the mainboard with a screw -> customer needs a new SSD and a mainboard and that would be ~1000$+work -> broken parts are sent to some place to be refurbished -> turns out the mainboard "magically" is working and the SSD had just become loose -> parts go back to repair places to wait for the next customer who pais full price for them. Now only we are talking about devices that old that even changing the SSD or even something like the keyboard starts to be at the level of the value of the device. Also if the devices haven't been dead for a long time tey probably just need some internal love to be chooching away just fine (junk in the fan/heatsink, dried up thermal paste, some build up junk on the mainboard and connectors, loose connectors, junk in the keyboard; small things that happen to every laptop and computer with time).

 

Also, trust me on this one, every single device brought to Apple for this vintage "repair" has a moisture damage and needs a new mainboard, rendering every single repair not worth it. By this time people have breath enough around those devices that the moisture stickers have triggered and as we know they trigger way too easily (some phones, not if iPhones but might well also, moisture stickers trigger from only being handled with sweaty hands and most phones have stickers that trigger when you press it to your cheek with sweat or other moisture).

[corrado33]

On 11/1/2018 at 12:50 PM, Syntaxvgm said:

I need to get a g5. Used so many mac pros in that case and I've always wanted one. Either make some kinda new build in it or do something like this 
 

It's surprisingly difficult to put an ATX motherboard into one of those cases.... unfortunately. First off, Apple designed their mobos backwards. You open the RIGHT side of the case (when facing the front). Their PCI slots are at the bottom of their board... which means if you put a normal ATX board in it the PCI slots will be... UP. So you have to cut a bunch of holes in it. Also the IO shield is cut into the case, so you'll have to cut out the entirety of the back of the case and fabricate a normal looking PC back with a slot for the IO shield. Also that case used mostly 80 mm fans... and it was never known to to be quiet. 

 

I really wanted to build a PC in one of those cases... but it just seemed like too much work. (And they're still freaking expensive as hell.)

[DrMacintosh]

51 minutes ago, corrado33 said:

It's surprisingly difficult to put an ATX motherboard into one of those cases

 

[Syntaxvgm]

10 hours ago, corrado33 said:

It's surprisingly difficult to put an ATX motherboard into one of those cases.... unfortunately. First off, Apple designed their mobos backwards. You open the RIGHT side of the case (when facing the front). Their PCI slots are at the bottom of their board... which means if you put a normal ATX board in it the PCI slots will be... UP. So you have to cut a bunch of holes in it. Also the IO shield is cut into the case, so you'll have to cut out the entirety of the back of the case and fabricate a normal looking PC back with a slot for the IO shield. Also that case used mostly 80 mm fans... and it was never known to to be quiet. 

 

I really wanted to build a PC in one of those cases... but it just seemed like too much work. (And they're still freaking expensive as hell.)

I mentioned in another post that there's a place that sells conversion kits for g4s and g5s 

https://www.thelaserhive.com/shop/

They also have a bracket to front mount 2x120mm or 2x140mm fans. 

[jonrosalia]

im glad to see the availability of parts for my 2012 MacBook Pro I use it as my everyday and was starting to worry if I was getting the axe next and would have to try to find a good deal on a 2015 to replace it. I refuse to buy any of the new models because I don't like thin and light and hate the fact that they changed the keyboards out from the old "chiclet" style I wouldn't say no to a retina screen but its not a must have to me and the i5 3210m still runs everything I need on mobile I don't understand why people need a super powerful laptop its kinda dumb to me to make a i9 MacBook with 560 graphics. the new Vega 16 and 20 is the first time a MacBook got a real GPU but its going to be another release like the i9 launch with the thermal throttling on their to small cooler I would like them to release a "retro" MacBook Pro 13" with 7th gen intel the new Vega 20 GPU and a mega battery without soldering and some standard NVMe drive slots or at least the old Mac SSD slots so you can run dual ssd.

[DrMacintosh]

1 minute ago, jonrosalia said:

I would like them to release a "retro" MacBook Pro 13" with 7th gen intel the new Vega 20 GPU and a mega battery without soldering and some standard NVMe drive slots or at least the old Mac SSD slots so you can run dual ssd.

Unfortunately thick and large laptops don’t fit in with Apple’s hardware philosophy. Apple uses a variation of the the quadrant system that Steve created

 

The form of the portable Macs take priority over their function these days. 

 

Apple has wondered from this practice a little and imo it sounded like an interview by Rene Ritchie with Apples new head of Mac marketing Tom Boger, that the MacBook is in kinda a weird inbetween spot and probably won’t be around for much longer. 

 

But I doubt we will see a return to thicker portable machines. At Apple, the more portable you go, the more integrated the components have to be. 

 

For the desktop market though, that same interview did sound like Apple is willing to open up to user serviceable parts, just look at the Mac Mini, those systems are Pro machines now, not consumer entry models and because of that Apple decided to put SO-DIMS in them.  

And all of that just spells good news for the upcoming Mac Pro imo. 

 

[Thaldor]

31 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

For the desktop market though, that same interview did sound like Apple is willing to open up to user serviceable parts, just look at the Mac Mini, those systems are Pro machines now, not consumer entry models and because of that Apple decided to put SO-DIMS in them.  

And all of that just spells good news for the upcoming Mac Pro imo.

If the image from Apples website is correct, they have SO-DIMMs in there but them being user serviceable is a questionable. Depends on how much there's room between the sticks and the case and does they have normal locking system from both sides, also that cooler is going to be a much in the way. At worst you need to take the whole logicboard out of the case to swap those sticks and even at the best there's not much room to do the swap. Other ways the Mac Mini is old same story, apparently soldered storage, quite possibly screws that ain't common some would even say exotic, doesn't seem to have extra connectors anywhere for upgrades (appart from RAM upgrade, which a lot seems not to be for user servicing but for easier customization) and possibly needs special tools or a lot of work to get completely into pieces. And probably just taking the lid off to swap the RAM voids the warranty, as usual.

 

So, nope, doesn't spell that good for the Mac Pro. It might have socketed CPU, but to remove the cooler you need to take the logicboard out. It might have normal PCI-e slots, but addon compatibility is very limited, probably only to the parts you can get from Apple or resellers. It might have swapable GPUs, but very limited space or some sort exotic cooling that upgrading them isn't available for the user. It might have easily removable SSD, but it uses propietary connection (as all Apple devices at the moment) so no cheap storage upgrades. All in all, user service is possible (may need exotic tools) but not really worthwhile doing anything else than void the warranty and take the dusts out.

[DrMacintosh]

1 minute ago, Thaldor said:

they have SO-DIMMs in there but them being user serviceable is a questionable.

Its not, Tom Boger made it very clear in his interview and even on stage that they RAM is user serviceable. 

[jagdtigger]

3 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

Its not, Tom Boger made it very clear in his interview and even on stage that they RAM is user serviceable. 

Unless they put a sticker(/seal) on it like they did with the CPU....

[Thaldor]

22 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

Its not, Tom Boger made it very clear in his interview and even on stage that they RAM is user serviceable. 

Nowhere in the event or in the Rene Ritchies interview is stated that the RAM is user upgradeable. Only that it's on SO-DIMMs and so upgradeable.

 

Quote

Rene: Switching gears slightly, one of the things I really liked about the Mac Mini, the RAM. You can take that to an Apple Store or a certified Apple service center, and they can swap that out for you.

How do you determine when it's good to make something that's user accessible or expert accessible? For example, the storage, which you want to have connected to that T2 chip, there's a security layer there. How do you balance hobbyist interests with security and other concerns?

Tom: With the Mac Mini, the buyer for the Mac Mini is someone is more technically savvy, is more likely to want to upgrade their memory. It's typically a system that gets put in one place, and it just runs for a long, long time.

Mac Mini customers marvel at the reliability of their Mac Mini. They use it for years and years and years. They want at some point, typically along that lifespan, to upgrade the memory. It just made a lot of sense to offer the memory on SO-DIMMs.

Whereas other products like our notebooks especially where the products are on the go and they're in a backpack or whatever, where we have the memory soldered to the board. Obviously, you're trying to make the product really thin and light, and soldering it on the board saves space.

It's basically the application of that Mac, what it's going to be used for. We make those decisions on a per product basis.

Some other sites (like AppleInsider) say that it might be possible to upgrade the RAM by yourself, but they don't recommend it.

 

Quote

Is the RAM user-expandable?

Yes. The slots are SO-DIMM slots, and are mostly accessible to the user. In conversations with Apple corporate employees, we've been told that users with a "modicum of skill" can get to the pair of RAM slots.

Slots being SO-DIMM make it possible to use common RAM in Mac Mini, the question is how you get to put them in. And seriously, I want to see the day Apple once again uses screws that are common (pentalobe isn't common neither is the security torx 6 that they used in the 2014 Mac Mini), so at least there's that barrier. Next one is the space, speaking about this image right from the Apples Mac Mini page. Even if the upper locks are just under the case, accessing the left sockets upper lock is going to be a strech. There's some room above the sticks but it's hard to say if it's enough for them to unlock and being pulled out of the sockets without breaking anything. Smallest problem is that how users are going to install new sticks, if Apple is using their good quality parts, those socket locks are tight and require some force to lock the stick, there's a good chace that user must use quite a lot force to get those upper locks lock and most of that force will be aroud the middle part of the stick giving some chances to apply enough force to break something, one way around this is to lever the sticks in, but with that there's probably even more chance to cause damage at least to the case.

[DrMacintosh]

13 minutes ago, Thaldor said:

Some other sites (like AppleInsider) say that it might be possible to upgrade the RAM by yourself, but they don't recommend it.

What do those sites know? 

 

13 minutes ago, Thaldor said:

Nowhere in the event or in the Rene Ritchies interview is stated that the RAM is user upgradeable. Only that it's on SO-DIMMs and so upgradeable.

Those two things are not mutually exclusive. The memory is in slots and therefore can be upgraded by the user, full stop. 

[Bcat00]

15 hours ago, corrado33 said:

 

I hear ya, tried it myself and gave up partway in because I couldn’t find a metal sheet that doesn’t look off in terms of colour and sheen with the original

 

wasted 200$ buying the thing off a Craigslist seller

[Thaldor]

13 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

Those two things are not mutually exclusive. The memory is in slots and therefore can be upgraded by the user, full stop. 

They are also not inclusive. If we are frank, everything is upgradeable, even the CPU of the Mac Mini, you just need to know where to get replacement and how to desolder the old one and solder the new one in. Point is if we talk about user upgradeable, then that would include ease of access and not voiding the warranty and I don't see that happening with the Mac Minis RAMs (IMO there doesn't seem to be enough room to remove or install RAM sticks without taking the logicboard out of the case).

Quote

What do those sites know? 

Quoted AppleInsider for you. Probably they have some connections to know a bit more.

 

Also ZDNets sources directly state:

Quote

While we don't consider the memory directly end-user accessible, service providers can access the internals of the Mac mini to upgrade the memory.

 

There's a difference between upgradeable and user upgradeable. Upgradeable can mean anything, like iMac Pros CPU and RAM are upgradeable, they are in there sitting in normal sockets and are replaceable with normal out of the shelf parts, but to do that you need to take the whole machine appart. Older iMacs have user replaceable RAM, they have a nice little hatch under them which is hold by couple of screws (IIRC) and under that hatch is 2 slots with normal DIMM RAM sticks sitting in there and waiting to be replaced.

[Trik'Stari]

I'm sure this will be at a premium rate of course. Owing to the "difficulty" in finding parts etc.

[RejZoR]

Who comes up with dumb terms like this at Apple? Calling old and outdated electronic devices "vintage". Vintage is Commodore, Spectrum or Amiga. One might even consider original Nokia 3310 as vintage. iPhone 5 can't possibly be vintage on any level.