Google Focuses on Privacy, Facebook Gets Creepier

[Jtalk4456]

https://www.cnet.com/news/google-home-hub-says-no-to-smart-home-cameras-in-your-bedroom/

https://techcrunch.com/2018/10/08/facebook-portal/

 

This is a two part story, but both stories reflect where each company is heading in terms of privacy and give two different ideas of how the future will be.

TL:DR - Google doesn't put camera on it's home hub, facebook makes a video chat screen that follows you around the room...

 

I'm starting with Facebook, because we don't expect privacy from facebook, this story doesn't surprise me

Quote

Facebook launched the Facebook Portal -- a countertop video chat screen that zooms to always keep you in the frame.

To me this is creepy. Sure the concept makes sense for making video calls and the technology is nice, no doubts there. What bothers me and surely will bother most is the company in charge of it. Facebook is not known for being an advocate of data security and privacy. If almost anyone else launched a product like this, we'd debate the cost value, worry about the signal getting hacked by home robbers and others, but we'd not be worried as much about the company launching it. We would assume if it was used for bad, it would be by "bad guys". But coming from facebook, I sincerely worry devices like these could be used to analyze stuff in your house and recommend things to buy, allow law enforcement a camera in every home with facial recognition, etc. This really worries me. It does come with a clip on privacy shield, but the people who would be concerned enough about privacy to use it probably are too concerned about privacy to buy it in the first place. Also, a camera cover means nothing for the microphone.

To hear both sides of the story, I'm putting FB's comments about it, though I don't buy it for a second

Quote

“We had to build all the stacks — hardware, software, and AI from scratch — and it allowed us to build privacy into each one of these layers”. There’s no facial recognition and instead just a technology called 2D pose that runs locally on the device to track your position so the camera can follow you if you move around. A separate chip for local detection only activates Portal when it hears its wake word, it doesn’t save recordings, and the data connection is encrypted. And with a tap you can electronically disable the camera and mic, or slide the plastic privacy shield over the lens to blind it while keeping voice controls active.

There's some other minor details and reassurances from FB PR teams in the article, but i neither buy them nor care for the sentiments they give. One main reason is the timing. If they are so worried about privacy and people trusting them, why now? They are mid data breach scandal right now, they have been constantly in the press for one privacy issue or another, including many political issues. Why is now the time they chose to make and launch this thing? I believe it's because they think they will sell enough to people who don't think as much about privacy and can get away with it. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if we heard stories of these things leaving cameras and mics on even after disabling them. I may be wrong on their intentions and what will happen, but this is still awful timing.

 

On To Google:

We may joke around about them being the unofficial leaders of the world, but relative to other large tech companies, Google is relatively clean of scandals or privacy concerns. besides the android location thing, google is mostly, you get what you sign up for. Which is why I give them kudos for making the decision in this climate to put out a smart home hub with no cameras at all (that we know of, illuminati not quite confirmed XD).

And of course the alexa dot doesn't have a camera either, but for the price, the size and function of the device, and all the other features, I'm sure none of us would have been surprised if this came with a camera. If google had launched this with a camera, some would have been skeptical but most would just see another smart home device, again assuming that any bad outcome would be instigated by a "bad guy" somewhere. Most would have passed by without a second thought. Their intentional choice to leave the feature off speaks good for the company. not that this lets them off the hook for being our overlords, but I'm far less concerned for the moment that our google overlords are watching us in our bedrooms.

 

Quote

it raises a handful of thorny questions about how many cameras and microphones people want to have in their connected homes and how much they trust giant tech companies to protect their data and privacy in their most intimate spaces.

Quote

 

The device will go up against a growing list of competing smart displays, including the Amazon's Alexa-powered Echo Show and Echo Spot, the new Facebook Portal, and the Google Assistant-powered JBL Link View and Lenovo Smart Display. All five of those devices include cameras for video chats.

The Hub comes out at time when tech companies are facing greater scrutiny for how they manage users' data and how much of that information they keep. Just this week, Google shut down its unpopular Google+ social network after the company was forced to disclose a bug that put users' data at risk. Earlier this year, Facebook sustained a torrent of criticism after the data of millions of people landed in the hands of consultancy Cambridge Analytica, which exploited the information for targeted election ads.

Simultaneously, many of these same companies are asking consumers to add more and more cameras, mics and sensors to control their homes.

 

That last statement is the most telling, not only about the companies, but about the consumers who continue to buy these devices, regardless of all the privacy concerns. We are heading towards a point where privacy is a right we frequently hand over in search of convenience without a second thought. It's concerning to me as a father of 4 kids who will grow up in this world whether I like it or not. I don't doubt google will eventually have cameras and mics in every home as well, but their hesitation to do so right now gives me hope that they have more foresight and sense than we sometimes give them credit for. 

[Jtalk4456]

ummm... where's the discussion?

[suicidalfranco]

2 minutes ago, Jtalk4456 said:

ummm... where's the discussion?

waiting for someone to somehow make it all about how a fruity company is better than google

[Jtalk4456]

1 minute ago, suicidalfranco said:

waiting for someone to somehow make it all about how a fruity company is better than google

what? apple isn't even part of this

this is a story with serious implications for the future of privacy

[suicidalfranco]

1 minute ago, Jtalk4456 said:

what? apple isn't even part of this

exactly

[BuckGup]

Google as in the one that admitted they still track you everywhere you go even when you tell them no

[Jtalk4456]

Just now, BuckGup said:

Google as in the one that admitted they still track you everywhere you go even when you tell them no

like i said, "relatively" clean of scandal.

[ARikozuM]

"I have nothing to hide". 

 

Exceptions: Everything past the entrances to my house. 

[aezakmi]

1 hour ago, Jtalk4456 said:

There’s no facial recognition

 

1 hour ago, Jtalk4456 said:

runs locally on the device

 

1 hour ago, Jtalk4456 said:

you can electronically disable the camera and mic

[BuckGup]

24 minutes ago, Jtalk4456 said:

like i said, "relatively" clean of scandal.

Yeah no. Google has no regard for your privacy 

[Jtalk4456]

Just now, BuckGup said:

Yeah no. Google has no regard for your privacy 

in relation to facebook, they're better. The poll agrees. also given you don't believe they care for privacy, what reason would you attribute to the lack of camera?

[BuckGup]

19 minutes ago, Jtalk4456 said:

in relation to facebook, they're better. The poll agrees. also given you don't believe they care for privacy, what reason would you attribute to the lack of camera?

Because you already have a camera on your phone. It also has a microphone too. R&D costs, market studies showing no need, and the list goes on. If you want Google can own your, WiFi, security cameras, DNS, Phone Number, email, phone, browser, computer, operating system, and the list goes on and on. They don't need a camera 

[Jtalk4456]

11 minutes ago, BuckGup said:

Because you already have a camera on your phone. It also has a microphone too. R&D costs, market studies showing no need, and the list goes on. If you want Google can own your, WiFi, security cameras, DNS, Phone Number, email, phone, browser, computer, operating system, and the list goes on and on. They don't need a camera 

fair enough.

[Jtalk4456]

@BuckGup OK so we all know that google has multiple fingers in our data. I see no future where they don't still have data for most if not all the world. How far do you see facebook going. Do you think they will fall to the wayside like myspace and others, or do you feel that they are deep enough in peoples accounts that they will survive long past other social media sites?

[BuckGup]

18 minutes ago, Jtalk4456 said:

@BuckGup OK so we all know that google has multiple fingers in our data. I see no future where they don't still have data for most if not all the world. How far do you see facebook going. Do you think they will fall to the wayside like myspace and others, or do you feel that they are deep enough in peoples accounts that they will survive long past other social media sites?

Considering what went down a couple months ago and how most people forgot or still use Facebook even if their whole social media site dies they still have enough custome data collection tools made they could easily stay around selling tools or being contracted 

[Phentos]

Google loves your data like any other huge tech conglomerate. But Facebook is in a whole new level of absurdity and obsession when it comes to data collection. So when it comes to Google vs Facebook, I firmly believe Google is the lesser of two evils.

 

I deleted my Facebook account back in 2012 when you still could (supposedly) and have never once had second thoughts or regrets. I also firmly believe that Zuckerberg is a sociopath and I want nothing to do with anything he has his hands on.

[Jtalk4456]

6 minutes ago, Phentos said:

Google loves your data like any other huge tech conglomerate. But Facebook is in a whole new level of absurdity and obsession when it comes to data collection. So when it comes to Google vs Facebook, I firmly believe Google is the lesser of two evils.

The way I view it, the difference between overlords and evil overlords is important. I feel like google is trying to change the world in many ways that I agree with. Facebook, not so much. Being an overlord doesn't necessarily mean an evil overlord. remember the movie megamind. He thought he was evil but he cleaned up the city and reduced crime

[Phentos]

3 minutes ago, Jtalk4456 said:

The way I view it, the difference between overlords and evil overlords is important. I feel like google is trying to change the world in many ways that I agree with. Facebook, not so much. Being an overlord doesn't necessarily mean an evil overlord. remember the movie megamind. He thought he was evil but he cleaned up the city and reduced crime

Never saw Megamind, but I understand your point.

[EnergyEclipse]

Quote

There’s no facial recognition

[Jtalk4456]

Just now, EnergyEclipse said:

see the thing is, the device doesn't have facial recognition. But if the video is sent to the authorities, they can use facial recognition of the video they receive. So the FB Portal doesn't need facial recognition software, as long as the person getting the data has it

[Sakkura]

Quote

Google Focuses on Privacy

The same way a sniper focuses on a target?

[Jtalk4456]

7 minutes ago, Sakkura said:

The same way a sniper focuses on a target?

depending on your interpretation, sure. like i said they could have put a camera in this thing but they didn't. My guess is it's a pr move in light of fb

[Salv8 (sam)]

2 hours ago, aezakmi said:

the doubter doubt's himself while doubting this...

[Arika]

2 hours ago, aezakmi said:

 

4 hours ago, Jtalk4456 said:

you can electronically disable the camera and mic

Yeah, it's called "unplugging it from mains power" 

[Amazonsucks]

Neither company has any user privacy because monetizing the user is their business model. You are the product being sold.