Ubuntu 18.04 LTS: Bionic Beaver

[Drak3]

10 minutes ago, ScratchCat said:

Try a rolling release then, I have not had issues with major upgrades but smaller frequent updates may help.

I have.

 

11 minutes ago, ScratchCat said:

I have not used Linux on a multi GPU system so I cannot comment on that but GPU support is not great under Linux if you are using open source drivers

Well, since I first played with Linux, drivers for HD7000 have been rock solid.

 

If only one is active.

 

And the iGPU needs to be disbled if Intel.

[MEC-777]

Just installed this on my laptop (upgraded from 17.04). Liking it so far. Some things are better, somethings are buggy. But, that's to be expected upon a brand new release. 

 

For those who say "gnome is ugly" - Then customise it!!! That's a major advantage of Linux; the ability to make it your own!  

[Ithanul]

6 hours ago, Sauron said:

Of course, and it's not like there's a lack of flavors with all sorts of DEs - it's just that the main release of Ubuntu plays a big role in defining what the perceived "default" linux desktop experience is. A lot of new linux users start with vanilla Ubuntu and their first impact will inevitably influence their decision to stick around. Plasma is a lot more flexible without sacrificing any eye candy, I feel it would better express the big leap in user choice you get coming from windows or mac os.

Agreed.  KDE Plasma is more pleasant looking over Gnome.

 

11 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

Because for normal everyday use you shouldnt need to touch anything outside /home? If you need to then you are doing something wrong....

Highly agree, you don't go mucking into var/lib or other areas unless you really know what the hell you are doing.

 

3 hours ago, MEC-777 said:

Just installed this on my laptop (upgraded from 17.04). Liking it so far. Some things are better, somethings are buggy. But, that's to be expected upon a brand new release. 

 

For those who say "gnome is ugly" - Then customise it!!! That's a major advantage of Linux; the ability to make it your own!  

Very nice setup there.

[Drak3]

3 hours ago, MEC-777 said:

That's a major advantage of Linux; the ability to make it your own!  

So, why'd you make it OSX?

[NoOverflow]

1 hour ago, Drak3 said:

So, why'd you make it OSX?

Touché !

And why spend time for this ? Install Deepin Os or Manjaro Deepin

[2FA]

1 hour ago, Drak3 said:

So, why'd you make it OSX?

Today I learned that Gnome with a bottom dock is in fact OSX.

[Drak3]

1 hour ago, 2FA said:

Today I learned that Gnome with a bottom dock is in fact OSX.

Precisely.

 

1 hour ago, NoOverflow said:

And why spend time for this ? Install Deepin Os or Manjaro Deepin

To prove to Apple that a decent OSX can exist.

[jagdtigger]

22 hours ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

You see? We are already in the "user must be made to suit the OS" instead of "OS must be made to suit the user" territory... I'm not going to turn this thread into an OS philosophy debate, so I'll just leave it at stating that "should", "need", "normal", "everyday use", and "wrong" are all highly subjective in this context...

Then make you own distro, or run puppy linux... There is a metric but-ton of distros but aside from a few exception all of them restricts access outside of your home dir with good reasons. Editing system files is way in the advanced territory, if you hate CLI that much then you should hate win10 too. Because you need PS to do a simple thing like remove pre-installed uwp junk (they arent an integral part of the system so why the hassle to make them hard to remove?) which could be done on linux conveniently in a program with GUI  .

BTW you couldnt even bring up a valid point so its hardly an argument...

 

 

19 hours ago, ScratchCat said:

Linux is only stable on a small selection of hardware

I just laughed out loud on this... All of my PC's and laptops(3 machines in total, plus the RPI that is used as media player) run linux, no problems with them. Plus 2 server(one is built from consumer gear, the other is a RPI2, no need for ECC in my use case)) running 24/7 without any hick-ups or crash.

[Sauron]

17 hours ago, MEC-777 said:

For those who say "gnome is ugly" - Then customise it!!! That's a major advantage of Linux; the ability to make it your own!  

The problem is that to customize it you need to install multiple tools (which are extremely inconsistent I might add) and/or dive into a bunch of configuration files. Upon installation you get almost no customization options at all. I could get something very similar to your desktop in, say, MATE with minimal effort and no additional tools. Also, cross framework theming is basically non existant in Gnome - Plasma tries (and mostly succeeds) to make gtk applications look as close to your qt theming as possible, Gnome just ignores qt apps. Don't get me wrong, you can use and like whatever you prefer - but I and many others feel it's a bit of a wasted opportunity. Meanwhile, Ubuntu MATE is considered by many to be the best Ubuntu flavor (including the main release) and it already comes with unity-like themes, and yet it was ignored in favour of one of the least popular ones - in which case they could have at least gone with the objectively more powerful Plasma.

[SpaceGhostC2C]

I said I didn't want to bring an OS philosophy debate to this thread, that I'll avoid derailing this thread, which is about something else... but no, it seems some people can't let that happen. OK, let's put an end to this.

 

 

11 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

Then make you own distro, or run puppy linux...

 

What a way to summarize the giant circle-jerk the so-called linux community has become, or at least some people want it to become. It took just two persons, who have used Linux in the past, who like the overall idea of linux, and come to threads like this one pondering into using linux more in the future, making a simple comment, a mild constructive criticism of Linux on the desktop, to bring about all the worst tropes of the awful linuxer. ANd we start with the most blatant fallacy:

- "Don't like data collection in Windows 10? Found your own Microsoft, hire your own team and make your own Windows"

Damn, it must hurt to be so smart!

 

11 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

 Editing system files is way in the advanced territory, if you hate CLI that much

No, I don't, I  said a few posts ago that one of my best experiences was with CLI-only Debian... This all started when another user questioned the current state of Linux as a desktop OS and the whole point of having a GUI. The debate was never about whether CLIs are good or bad in themselves.

 

11 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

then you should hate win10 too. Because you need PS to do a simple thing like remove pre-installed uwp junk (they arent an integral part of the system so why the hassle to make them hard to remove?)

This is too god to be true... So, first, "I should hate Windows 10" (you seem to love the word "should")? You know what, I hate windows 10 without ever touching its CLI, I got enough other reasons, and I don't use Windows 10. I wish you knew how stupid it makes you look to try to pull such a blatant attempt at petty whataboutism, and not even hitting the target. 
But how could you know, right? I mean, I did say that in fact the decisions made by Microsoft for Windows 10 probably mean that eventually I'll make the switch from 7 to Linux anyway, but you were too busy masturbating to a penguin, so you wouldn't have noticed.

 

11 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

 

BTW you couldnt even bring up a valid point so its hardly an argument...

Sorry? I presented real-life experiences as arguments, and all you could reply was "no".

-"I have encountered this situation, which is why I still find Linux clunky"

-"No you haven't"

So I guess that "bringing up a valid point" consists in telling other people that they didn't experience what they say they experienced? Or is it "you shouldn't use you computer for what you want it to"?

I do what I do, you do what you do, people do what they do. I build computers and use software to accomplish what I want, not what someone decided "I should want". If an OS makes it easier in any way, I'll say it. If it makes it harder in any way, I'll say it. I don't care if you don't use the computer the way you do, or you think "I should do". I use it how I want to, which is the true meaning of "free computing".

 

But hey, the closest to a linux user that a current non-linux user can be dared to say they find the DE partially clumsy, they must get our tribal rage.

Next time you wonder why Linux market share is 2-3% in desktops, take a good long look at the fucking mirror.

 

Now get out of my sight.

[jagdtigger]

11 hours ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

What a way to summarize the giant circle-jerk the so-called linux community has become,

You wanted full access outside of /home right? I just given you the name of the only distro i know that allows that by default... Its one hell of a gamble but it seemed evident that you are ready to sacrifice security for convenience. After this i dont even care about the rest of your post........

[MEC-777]

On 2018-05-04 at 3:29 PM, Drak3 said:

So, why'd you make it OSX?

I didn't. It's still Linux. It merely looks similar just because of the bottom dock, but that's where the similarities end. I made it this way because that's the way I like it on my laptop. I like a clean, efficient desktop that gets out of my way for when I need to get work done. 

If I wanted OSX, I would have bought a Mac.

On 2018-05-04 at 4:35 PM, NoOverflow said:

Touché !

And why spend time for this ? Install Deepin Os or Manjaro Deepin

Because I choose and prefer Ubuntu over those others. Linux is all about choice. How much time do you really think it took me to make it look like that? lol. Not long at all. 

On 2018-05-04 at 4:37 PM, 2FA said:

Today I learned that Gnome with a bottom dock is in fact OSX.

Looking similar does not make it the same. That's like saying any DE with a bottom dock and apps button in the bottom left corner is in fact Windows.  

On 2018-05-05 at 5:46 AM, Sauron said:

The problem is that to customize it you need to install multiple tools (which are extremely inconsistent I might add) and/or dive into a bunch of configuration files. Upon installation you get almost no customization options at all. I could get something very similar to your desktop in, say, MATE with minimal effort and no additional tools. Also, cross framework theming is basically non existant in Gnome - Plasma tries (and mostly succeeds) to make gtk applications look as close to your qt theming as possible, Gnome just ignores qt apps. Don't get me wrong, you can use and like whatever you prefer - but I and many others feel it's a bit of a wasted opportunity. Meanwhile, Ubuntu MATE is considered by many to be the best Ubuntu flavor (including the main release) and it already comes with unity-like themes, and yet it was ignored in favour of one of the least popular ones - in which case they could have at least gone with the objectively more powerful Plasma.

Didn't take me very long to get the look and layout I prefer. However, I'm familiar with how to customise the DE and make the necessary changes. Granted, someone new to the OS will be presented with the limited customisation as you mentioned and not know how to make changes beyond that, I agree. I wish Canonical would add in more options for this, but they made their decisions for whatever reason. 

That being said, the option and ability to make it your own is still there if one chooses to. That was the main point I was trying to make.

[Drak3]

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

It merely looks similar just because of the bottom dock, but that's where the similarities end.

No, outside of Trackpad support and dock location, using Ubuntu and OSX have been identical experiences for me.

[2FA]

12 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

Looking similar does not make it the same. That's like saying any DE with a bottom dock and apps button in the bottom left corner is in fact Windows.  

Oh I know, I was being satirical. I do actually use Ubuntu 18.04 on my laptop.

[MEC-777]

20 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

No, outside of Trackpad support and dock location, using Ubuntu and OSX have been identical experiences for me.

If you're referring purely to the GUI experience, I can see how they are definitely similar. 

 

The perspective I'm coming from is where it really matters (to me) - and that is what is "under the hood" of the OS, is completely different, because it's open-source and OSX is not. I have no issue admitting that I like certain aspects of OSX (it is an efficient GUI layout with the dock and all, which I like). And here's the thing; I want and prefer Linux. I don't want and don't like OSX. 

[Drak3]

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

it's open-source and OSX is not.

Contrary to popular belief, Every under the hood aspect of OSX is, and always has been, open source. It's called Darwin.

3 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

I'm not sure how you can say it's "identical", when objectively it isn't.

Gnome and OSX's GUI are built around the same concepts, they work to achieve the same goals. There's only so many practical ways to design a GUI. After playing with both, digging around beyond day to day things, the experience is the same.

[MEC-777]

4 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Contrary to popular belief, Every under the hood aspect of OSX is, and always has been, open source. It's called Darwin.

Can you change or customise nearly any aspect of OSX? Can you run it on virtually any hardware combination within the last 15 years or so? 

6 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Gnome and OSX's GUI are built around the same concepts, they work to achieve the same goals. There's only so many practical ways to design a GUI. After playing with both, digging around beyond day to day things, the experience is the same.

I get that. It's like when Thermaltake and other brands started using similar design features as Fractal Design. There's only so many ways to design a mid-town chassis, etc. 

It's a matter of preference in the end. And I prefer Linux because I can do things with it that I cannot with OSX. That is the fundamental difference for me. 

[Drak3]

1 minute ago, MEC-777 said:

Can you change or customise nearly any aspect of OSX?

Yes.

 

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

Can you run it on virtually any hardware combination within the last 15 years or so? 

With as much reliability as I can any Linux distribution.

[suicidalfranco]

31 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Yes.

no

31 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

With as much reliability as I can any Linux distribution.

no

 

[jagdtigger]

36 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

With as much reliability as I can any Linux distribution.

Not really, building a hackintosh is a real pain because apple made sure that their OS is brutally picky about hardware.... In contrast ubuntu for example will run on pretty much anything x86/x64, except the bleeding edge stuff but thats not the OS's fault.

[MEC-777]

22 hours ago, Drak3 said:

Yes.

 

With as much reliability as I can any Linux distribution.

As suicidealfranco answered and jagdtigger explained; no, and no. 

[Drak3]

4 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

As suicidealfranco answered and jagdtigger explained; no, and no. 

Wrong, OSX is Darwin with closed source components. Those componenets are replaceable, and if it works with FreeBSD or Darwin, it'll work with OSX. OSX just keeps the capability locked by default.

 

Also, Linux has a long way to go before it can be realistically be called stable. It's good enough for day to day operations on x86 hardware, but so is hackintoshing.

[jagdtigger]

3 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Also, Linux has a long way to go before it can be realistically be called stable. It's good enough for day to day operations on x86 hardware, but so is hackintoshing.

Laughed out loud again. The internet is basically running on linux but you deem it as unstable, gg......

[Drak3]

3 minutes ago, jagdtigger said:

The internet is basically running on linux

The internet is ran by a small number of companies as well, and they ain't using the same shit freeware that desktop users use.

[suicidalfranco]

10 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

OSX just keeps the capability locked by default.

Then how is it open?

Tell the world how you can open it then, i'm curious to see how it's done.

15 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Also, Linux has a long way to go before it can be realistically be called stable. It's good enough for day to day operations on x86 hardware, but so is hackintoshing.

Linux can run on anything that has a chip in it, from old calculators, to the most modern of super computers, and can run those flawlessly without an hitch, and you're telling us that OSX, who is already finicky to run on current gen non-Mac machines, is as stable as Linux?

Or we talking about the same OSX where hackintosh laptops either don't have audio, or wifi, or bluetooth, or can't use the dGPU, or can't control the fans, or whatever common issues you can find tonyx86 forum?

 

Last time i checked: those are barely issues on Linux powered distros, and this can be done