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FBI Owns Half of All Child Porn Websites, and Actively Helps Improve Reliability and Speed of Them

LAwLz
By LAwLz
in Tech News
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Posted
2 hours ago, LAwLz said:

and another thing to set up scenarios where the crime can take place to begin with, actively help someone commit the crime, and then catch a minuscule amount of the people you helped.

It's called bait and switch :P

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2 hours ago, Misanthrope said:

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Posted

Surely this is facilitation? 

Regardless, I personally think the harm done by operating the site is greater than the harm prevented. Not sure what an alternative method of catching these people would be though.

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Posted

where are these sites even? clearweb or darknet?

everyone knows that child porn is highly illegal worldwide and most pedophiles probably use VPNs and tor anyway.

who are they targeting?

are they actively looking for new content or just trying to get the visitors?

 

just shutting down those sites would be better imo and scarvage whats left on the servers.

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1 hour ago, Sauron said:

That's not even the point. The child pornography "business" is a heinous crime not for the act of looking at the content per se, but because it fuels the creation of more - meaning more child abuse etc. The FBI is actively doing the worst part of the deal to supposedly catch the minor offenders.

The content will always be created by someone. How the FBI get's new footage is from someone else's data. It's the fact they are distributing it, and people "have access to it". So let's say a girl that was 7 years old gets recorded, and now she is 14 and understands what the hell is going on. Why the fuck is the FBI showing footage of her. This is a private matter, and now they made it "Public" to EVERYONE to see. First of all they shouldn't be showing this footage even if they are trying to catch the pedo. It should be clickbait type of stuff, and then monitor their internet usage. 

 

The method that I shown is a serious problem. People that are pedo can just do the method. THEY SHOULDN'T EVEN HAVE REAL CONTENT.

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Posted

To sum this thread up from what I've collected

 

1. The FBI is sharing child porn. This is good.

2. Hey What're the web addresses? 

3. Trump exists

4. Hillary will cause WW5

5. Civil war part 2

6. Darth Vader Disapproves your child porn

7. Someone wanted to make a Rap or rape music video

8. Back to FBI and Child porn websites. 

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2 minutes ago, fpo said:

To sum this thread up from what I've collected

 

1. The FBI is sharing child porn. This is good.

2. Hey What're the web addresses? 

3. Trump exists

4. Hillary will cause WW5

5. Civil war part 2

6. Darth Vader Disapproves your child porn

7. Someone wanted to make a Rap or rape music video

8. Back to FBI and Child porn websites. 

Well, it seems we at least have non-moderated course correcting technology at LTT. 

 

+1 everybody!

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Just now, ScootsMcgoots said:

How is this entrapment...I mean...you sorta know what you're doing if you end up on one of these websites. 

It's IMO easier to stumble on Child port accidentally, than download tor and go through hoops to find that kind of stuff. 

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2 minutes ago, ScootsMcgoots said:

Stock images on google don't count right? 

I'd link what I mean, but I don't think LTT condones distribution of Pornagraphic material, let alone Child-Pornographic material. And I mean like real stuff. No I don't seek it out, no I don't watch it if I stumble upon it. I won't make an further comments in this thread. Just saying it's very common to find. 

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2 hours ago, Sauron said:

What. The. Fuck.

 

So if I ever bribe a politician I can say I did it to see if he was corruptible when I'm brought to court? I can start a drug cartel to see who's willing to join? I can hire an assassin to frame him when he kills the target?

apparently, yes.

 

Unless they want to say that it's different; that they can do this but you can't; that they can follow a different set of rules than the rest of the population... oh wait, isn't there something about that? :dry:

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4 hours ago, DeadEyePsycho said:

Actually yes, they do. Especially undercover AFT and DEA agents.

Yes and no. Undercover agents do engage in criminal activity, but to keep the cover up. The most common deal, however, is the opposite: buying from people, then accuse them of selling, since selling is the offence anyway. Again, if you are infiltrating an organization, you may have to make some sales along the way, but that's very different to becoming the cartel's kingpin so you can build cases on the street dealers.

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This is NOT entrapment folks. Please learn about laws before claiming something violates one of them. Entrapment is forcing someone to break a law. If the FBI forced pedos and non-pedos tp visit those sites it would be entrapment. Operating them is not entrapment. It's no different than the police running an undercover sting operation and having officers pretend to be drug dealers or prostitutes. Or an FBI agent pretending to be a kid in order or to catch pedos, for that matter. As long as the action is voluntary it is not entrapment.

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this is exactly like that intelligence guy that convinces his friend to join ISIS and as soon as that works reports him to his superior. like what the hell did you just achieve? instead of preventing people from doing what we consider wrong you push them over the edge? how the hell is that a good system? instead make sure you offer them ways to stop them from watching REAL child pornography. animated stuff, links to self control resources, links to different kind of support groups in different area's. or just legalize fake child pornography and place anyone who access its on a watchlist. same result. stop encouraging people to break the law so you can arrest them.

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Posted

To be honest, This does not shock or surprise me at all.

There was murmurs 9-10 years ago that the majority of child porn spread on 4chan was the doing of the FBI, and that the FBI was somehow tracking who downloaded the image/video link.

 

 

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  • Author
8 hours ago, Energycore said:

It's called bait and switch :P

Except the switch never takes place.

So it's more like bait, then build an entire bait manufacturing plant, set up a bunch of shops and then just let the shops run.

 

3 hours ago, Derangel said:

This is NOT entrapment folks. Please learn about laws before claiming something violates one of them. Entrapment is forcing someone to break a law. If the FBI forced pedos and non-pedos tp visit those sites it would be entrapment. Operating them is not entrapment. It's no different than the police running an undercover sting operation and having officers pretend to be drug dealers or prostitutes. Or an FBI agent pretending to be a kid in order or to catch pedos, for that matter. As long as the action is voluntary it is not entrapment.

Please learn about laws before claiming something is not violating one of them.

Entrapment is NOT forcing someone to break the law.

Entrapment is:

Quote

An act by the police or their agents, such as informants, to induce a person to commit a crime for the purpose of prosecuting that person for that induced crime. If the judge or jury believes that the person was predisposed to commit the crime anyway, even when the government agent suggested the crime or even helped with its commission, they are unlikely to accept an entrapment defense. Entrapment defenses are difficult to mount for defendants with prior convictions.

 

-Nolo’s Plain-English Law Dictionary. Gerald N. Hill, Kathleen Thompson Hill. 2009

The police "forcing" a crime to happen is not a part of entrapment. "Induce" and "Force" are two completely different words. Induce means "to cause", "to lead by persuasion or influence". Simply encouraging a crime to happen is entrapment in some cases. Since the FBI was upgrading the servers and asking users to report errors with the new upload feature, you can make the case that they were asking people to upload material. Then it's up to the judge to decide if FBI's acts lead to more people uploading (and since the traffic skyrocketed after FBI took over, there is a real argument to be made there).

 

You can not just dismiss entrapment like that, because it is a very complex thing which often falls on what the individual judge thinks about a particular case.

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4 hours ago, LAwLz said:

Except the switch never takes place.

So it's more like bait, then build an entire bait manufacturing plant, set up a bunch of shops and then just let the shops run.

 

Please learn about laws before claiming something is not violating one of them.

Entrapment is NOT forcing someone to break the law.

Entrapment is:

The police "forcing" a crime to happen is not a part of entrapment. "Induce" and "Force" are two completely different words. Induce means "to cause", "to lead by persuasion or influence". Simply encouraging a crime to happen is entrapment in some cases. Since the FBI was upgrading the servers and asking users to report errors with the new upload feature, you can make the case that they were asking people to upload material. Then it's up to the judge to decide if FBI's acts lead to more people uploading (and since the traffic skyrocketed after FBI took over, there is a real argument to be made there).

 

You can not just dismiss entrapment like that, because it is a very complex thing which often falls on what the individual judge thinks about a particular case.

You are right that I used the wrong term. I should have said induced instead of forced. Using the terms interchangeably completely alters the context.

 

That said, I still don't think it applies here. A person isn't going to stumble on one of those sites and then stick around to look at the pictures or upload more child pornography if they are not already into that stuff.

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Pedophiles be like:

3ornka9rAaKRA2Rkac.gif

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Posted

Yeah as long as they are only reusing stuff they already seized and not engaging in new production I'm perfectly fine with it, it's a great tool to find paedophiles and I figured they were doing something like this. Likewise the improvement of the infrastructure makes sense to keep the illusion it's safe alive and pull in more paedophiles. The thing you have to understand is that where there is demand there will be supply. If the FBI took every site down, two more would rise in its place.

 

As for people calling it entrapment, entrapment only applies when law enforcement actively pushes you to commit a crime, passive enabling was ruled to not be entrapment. If someone is looking to commit a crime(watch child pornography, buy drugs, etc.) and police agencies participate so they can make an arrest once the crime has committed is perfectly legal and imo morally acceptable.

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Well the UK makes it extremely difficult to stumble upon CP we have a nationwide block called Cleanfeed.

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18 hours ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

What's next, reselling seized drugs to see who buys a lot? xD 

They do in fact hang around websites dedicated to selling illegal merchandise such drugs, posing as vendors, trying to bust people.

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15 hours ago, apm said:

where are these sites even? clearweb or darknet?

everyone knows that child porn is highly illegal worldwide and most pedophiles probably use VPNs and tor anyway.

who are they targeting?

are they actively looking for new content or just trying to get the visitors?

 

just shutting down those sites would be better imo and scarvage whats left on the servers.

playpen was a tor website so I assume somewhere on there. Sure there is a wiki or some other link site full of this sort of thing.

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1 hour ago, S.Stephenson said:

Well the UK makes it extremely difficult to stumble upon CP we have a nationwide block called Cleanfeed.

The people who were getting access to those kinds of websites don't get held back by nationwide blocks and don't stumble upon it.

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Why do we need to know about Child porn websites? Only messed up people would like to see them or know about them? Admittedly it is interesting to know but still... Little weird.

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19 hours ago, LAwLz said:

It's one thing to catch someone doing something illegal, and another thing to set up scenarios where the crime can take place to begin with, actively help someone commit the crime, and then catch a minuscule amount of the people you helped.

There's two ideas at play here:

  1. Honeypotting: Creating a "honeypot" to attract people, thus collecting useful information
  2. The same idea as police using police women as prostitutes to catch johns.

What bothers me more than that they are doing it, is that it means that someone from the FBI was paid to look at child porn (You can't run a website that you haven't seen...)

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