[SPOILERS]SW: The force Awakens discussion

[Murdoch]

I just copy that thing from my rant to my friends, and I called em scrubs cause they haven't watched episode 1-6. I forgot to edit it. And I know you guys are not one of them

 

Haha, ah ok. That makes more sense

[Mo_z_Art]

Watched it an hour ago and I have to say I enjoyed it but, if the next movies continue in the way this one is, I am going to be really disappointed.

As already said a million times all of the different parts of the story of VII were already used once and thus one already knows what is about to happen. We need innovation not recycling!

Also the movie felt to me as if the dark side has lost all of their darkness except for the colours of the clothes they wear. Like really there was nothing dramatic or cruel or really bad about them , they didn't emphasise this enough.

Also no way should have rey escaped from ren. If ones trained in the force he can feel it and thus feels where a stronger force (aka rey) is. So no hiding on the death star.

Also never ever is an untrained girl going to beat a trained sith (is he a sith?, or is there a different name now?). Even i hes injured and confused (though i think at the point of the fight he isn't anymore as he killed his father and thus chose the dark side). Look at what the training fights in previous movies looked like. The masters would have killed there students without a problem in no time if they weren't training!

[ManOfDisguise]

Kylo Ren is Uncle Ben spoiler alert

[WereCat]

When Ren took off his mask I was like "Is this young Snape?".

I liked the movie a lot.

[Bouzoo]

I assume Kylo was hitting his wound to produce pain (Which can fuel the darkside) and more importantly, to produce adrenaline, to keep him going during the extended fight.

 

I agree on that, I think his left side (more specifically left leg) was going numb, so pain was the only way for him to feel it.

[CatCloud]

Watched it an hour ago and I have to say I enjoyed it but, if the next movies continue in the way this one is, I am going to be really disappointed.

As already said a million times all of the different parts of the story of VII were already used once and thus one already knows what is about to happen. We need innovation not recycling!

Also the movie felt to me as if the dark side has lost all of their darkness except for the colours of the clothes they wear. Like really there was nothing dramatic or cruel or really bad about them , they didn't emphasise this enough.

Also no way should have rey escaped from ren. If ones trained in the force he can feel it and thus feels where a stronger force (aka rey) is. So no hiding on the death star.

Also never ever is an untrained girl going to beat a trained sith (is he a sith?, or is there a different name now?). Even i hes injured and confused (though i think at the point of the fight he isn't anymore as he killed his father and thus chose the dark side). Look at what the training fights in previous movies looked like. The masters would have killed there students without a problem in no time if they weren't training!

Few things I'd like to address.

I agree that innovation would be nice but I rather not have another episode 1-3 moment... Or another jar jar binks.

The dark side....? Kylo was the only "sith apprentice" around and he is unstable as fuck. Also not cruel? I think he showed enough cruelty right in the beginning when he had the troopers gun down that village, and how he treats all others around him.

Rey might not be trained in the force but she is still a capable fighter, far more than Finn In CQC as shown early in the movie so she doing decent with a saber isn't much of a surprise, also she taped into the force so it clearly made her "better" also Kylo was in a bad condition, not to mention he had to deal with Finn before fighting Rey. It might have tired him out abit.

Reminder: Kylo is not a sith Lord, or anything special. Yes he is more trained then Rey in the force but that wound crippled him enough to make him lose, pain and anger may fuel the dark side but Kylo is an amateur.... I doubt he knows how to channel all that pain and anger, heck I think it even backfired. Next movie I'm sure he will be more powerful now that he has cut his ties with his past.

Btw, Rey might be a force prodigy. Next movie might give us answers.

[killcomic]

I'm just sitting here waiting for the inevitable white boy that's going to whinge that there were too many non-whites and women and social justice warriors or something.

[Thylbanus]

I liked it, though they could have thrown the EU fanbois a nod and had Luke welcome Rey to "Tython", but whatever. 

[CatCloud]

Rey's actor was a bit crap, but apart from that, very good.

Hmm, how so? I think she did a good job.

[Serin]

I'm just sitting here waiting for the inevitable white boy that's going to whinge that there were too many non-whites and women and social justice warriors or something.

I thought there could have been a few more aliens in the main cast... Like properly developed aliens with cultures and ways of thinking different to that of the humans.

Maybe I'm expecting too much 'Trek in my 'Wars. 

[killcomic]

I thought there could have been a few more aliens in the main cast... Like properly developed aliens with cultures and ways of thinking different to that of the humans.

Maybe I'm expecting too much 'Trek in my 'Wars. 

Yeah, there was a couple of alien fighter pilots and one of them got killed. I'm pretty sure one of them was Nien Nunb.

[techswede]

Another thing i experienced in the theater was that when there is a shot of a star destroyer coming at you in 3D.. The temptation to reach out and touch it was intense.

[Snadzies]

I have to say I'm surprised that some people didn't see Han's death a mile away.

I can't remember the exact order but Ren talks about how he is conflicted and can feel the light side calling to him.

That told me he was likely going to do something pretty bad to push him over the edge.

I think in that same scene he looks at Vader's mask and calls him grandfather.

While that could have pointed to Luke being his father and would have made a cool mirror of the Luke -> Vader relationship but with the father trying to bring the son to the light side I figured he would be Han and Leia's kid.

With the confirmation shortly after that Ren is Han and Leia's kid it was just too perfect a plot device to have Ren kill Han, thus cementing his turn to the dark side.

 

Before ever seeing the movie I figured an original trilogy member was very likely to die as it is a convenient way to allow one of the new characters to slip into the missing slot the death would leave, it plays with the emotions with the fans seeing one of the 3 original trilogy heroes die and I figured there was no way Harrison Ford was going to reprise the roll for another movie so it was an easy way to remove that character from the story.

[patrick3027]

I know it isn't possible given JJ himself confirmed 30 years have passed since the Return of the Jedi but ...

Wouldn't it be cool if Rey was Obi-Wan Kenobi's daughter?

Edit: https://m.reddit.com/r/starwarsspeculation/comments/3xk21r/theory_after_my_3rd_screening_heres_my_theory_on/

EDIT 2: I think it's also important to mention the amazing job JJ Abrams did with the Han Solo character. I was expecting a Harrison Ford cameo but instead they involved him in the majority of the movie and managed to make him 'grow' as a character compared to the orginal trilogy, that was a fantastic decision.

It's a miracle this turned out to be a good movie considering the hype around it.

[DebatED Nothing]

I was expecting Han to die purely because Ford is so damn old now that they need to kill him off in universe before he can no longer reasonably act his character in universe, no one wants to see an old, decrepit Han Solo, and while I commend his ability to still pull of the character at his age, he's definitely "too old for this crap" now. 

[grahn]

I also accept Han dying (though that didn't take the shock away when I saw it on screen).  I also think him calling out Kylo by his real name - one shout of his name - had a lot of emotion in it.  That was the best part of that whole confrontation for me.  Then when he came face to face with him up close... that's when I knew... yep... he's dead.

 

Han's character arc was pretty much done in the original trilogy: from a lowlife smuggler to rebel hero.  He was done.  Nothing more to tell.  Luke and Leia still had stories to tell by the time Return of the Jedi ended: Luke resurrecting the Jedi order and Leia turning into a great political leader.

 

As for Rey... I still think he's Luke's daughter.  There's just too much red herring / hints on screen to not be a direct Skywalker descendant.  They took elements of Darth Caedus (Jacen Solo... Han & Leia's kid in the extended universe novels (yes I know it's not canon anymore) and turned him into Kylo Ren. His sister Jaina redeemed him but on screen I think they turned her into Rey.  So cousins, instead of twins.

 

But it can't be that obvious, can it?  This is Abrams after all.

[dalekphalm]

i don and i hope not, that would be too boring, if not generic, There are no hints of her being his Kid either. 

"She got the force" is not a good enough reason.

I Think she is just a poor kid that got sold off.

 

Sure there is the cellar scene with Lukes lightsaber but eeehh....no.

 

Who would be the mother?

There are tons of hints that Luke could be her father.

 

Also, there was a Podcast on YouTube with spoiler discussions with itmeJP, Jesse Cox, EGInControl, and Adam Koebel:

https://youtu.be/6YFYZhJ5Gbw?t=54m12s

 

Jesse Cox has seen the movie three times, and points out something MASSIVE, which I totally missed when I saw it.

 

What was Luke doing when Rey finds him? He was standing over a Tombstone.

 

Sure, it could just be some random rock, or an ancient tomb from some old dead Jedi or whoever else.

 

OR, that's his dead Wife. Or Rey's dead Mother... Or THEY ARE THE SAME PERSON!

 

Who would his wife be? Who knows. It's been 30 years dude. 10 minutes of flashbacks and backstory in Ep. 8, and we'd have everything we need to know about Rey's Mom/Luke's Wife. They could go EU style and make it Mara Jade (Though I doubt that, personally).

 

Some people think it's just a random grave, but I don't think so - even if it turns out not to be Rey's mother, I think it's still an important grave.

[DebatED Nothing]

-snip-

I'm pretty sure that she's Luke's daughter. She's got a powerful natural capability with the force, like Luke, she was "abandoned" on a desert planet by unknown parents like Luke, she has a natural gift for piloting, like Luke, she looks fairly like Luke (near enough to be a passable child in a film, for example Kylo looks nothing like Han or Leia, so Rey looking considerably more like Luke makes it plausible). Then again, she uses a staff, and the great leader (Snoke) character is potentially Darth Plaugeius, who also uses a staff a lot, so could there be some kind of link there? Interesting though at least

[DebatED Nothing]

One thing I found really weird was how I got the impression that Finn would be the main character from the adverts, and that he would be the Jedi in the film, which wasn't the case. Rey was definitely the Jedi, and while I understand them wanting to hide that fact because it makes for a decent twist, the fact that they decided to sell the film as having Finn as the main character is a bit weird in my opinion, and while I don't want to start some kind of conspiracy, could it be to do with them thinking a female protagonist wouldn't sell as well as a male one? *shrug* it's probably not that, and you could make a strong case for Finn being almost as important or just as important as Rey, but it seems weird to me.

[NeatSquidYT]

Hmm, how so? I think she did a good job.

Overacting in some places and her facial expressions when surprised/scared etc. were a bit shit IMO. Bit nit picky, but it did annoy me. She DID get better as the film went on, though.

[DebatED Nothing]

Overacting in some places and her facial expressions when surprised/scared etc. were a bit shit IMO. Bit nit picky, but it did annoy me. She DID get better as the film went on, though.

I agree that some scenes were pretty weak early on, but acting with so much CGI must be tough. "Now talk to the droid" "What droid?" "Use your imagination, we're putting it, the background, your outfit and the sun in in post". Not that I think CGI is all bad, it can make for some visually stunning scenes, but it must be tough for actors to act with a thing that's not there.

[dalekphalm]

One thing I found really weird was how I got the impression that Finn would be the main character from the adverts, and that he would be the Jedi in the film, which wasn't the case. Rey was definitely the Jedi, and while I understand them wanting to hide that fact because it makes for a decent twist, the fact that they decided to sell the film as having Finn as the main character is a bit weird in my opinion, and while I don't want to start some kind of conspiracy, could it be to do with them thinking a female protagonist wouldn't sell as well as a male one? *shrug* it's probably not that, and you could make a strong case for Finn being almost as important or just as important as Rey, but it seems weird to me.

I think the whole Finn/Rey thing was simple misdirection. They really made it seem like he was going to be the Jedi, simply to psych you out. I don't think it had anything to do with marketing a female Jedi protagonist or not.

 

Also, there's nothing to say that Finn isn't also force sensitive. If so, he's obviously not as innately strong as Rey, and she's the equivalent of the "chosen one" for this trilogy. But there are several moments in the film that could be interpreted as him being force sensitive.

 

Honestly I think it would be cool if he was too, but just not nearly as strong, etc.

[CatCloud]

There are tons of hints that Luke could be her father.

 

Also, there was a Podcast on YouTube with spoiler discussions with itmeJP, Jesse Cox, EGInControl, and Adam Koebel:

https://youtu.be/6YFYZhJ5Gbw?t=54m12s

 

Jesse Cox has seen the movie three times, and points out something MASSIVE, which I totally missed when I saw it.

 

What was Luke doing when Rey finds him? He was standing over a Tombstone.

 

Sure, it could just be some random rock, or an ancient tomb from some old dead Jedi or whoever else.

 

OR, that's his dead Wife. Or Rey's dead Mother... Or THEY ARE THE SAME PERSON!

 

Who would his wife be? Who knows. It's been 30 years dude. 10 minutes of flashbacks and backstory in Ep. 8, and we'd have everything we need to know about Rey's Mom/Luke's Wife. They could go EU style and make it Mara Jade (Though I doubt that, personally).

 

Some people think it's just a random grave, but I don't think so - even if it turns out not to be Rey's mother, I think it's still an important grave.

yeah im aware, but i took all of it with a grain of salt, Well time will tell thats for sure.

Also, ew ...JP....he makes me cringe too much when he streams.

[dalekphalm]

yeah im aware, but i took all of it with a grain of salt, Well time will tell thats for sure.

Also, ew ...JP....he makes me cringe too much when he streams.

*shrugs* He's a good producer. I like his Twitch Shows where he's not actually a "character" on screen, and just runs things from behind the scenes.

 

His streaming personality is very abrasive and very much a love or hate kind of thing, I'd say. I really love most of his RollPlay shows (Well... the non-D&D ones anyway), but that's because they have a few excellent GM's and good players.

 

Some of the other players are freaking horrible though - and I quite dislike his D&D GM, Neil - who coincidentally is also a super annoying RP player when he guests on other shows.

 

But yeah, as for the Daughter thing. Who knows? It could all be a giant misdirect. Or it could be a case like in Battlestar Galactica with Kara Thrace/Starbuck's father, and the Cylon Number Seven (Daniel), who were given these huge hints and really interesting tidbits and ended up being totally unimportant.

[EmeraldKiwi]

I thought the new death star thingy should have lasted.the old one lasted for two episodes I think, and they rekd this one all in one go. It was pretty cool though. I dunno. With Han dead, and Leia probably not going to last a full new episode, there isn't much left in the series unless someone new gets super cool and reks everyone on the Dark Side.