Kickstarter hires reporter to probe startup that collapsed after raising $3.4M

[Samfisher]

Source : http://arstechnica.com/business/2015/12/kickstarter-hires-reporter-to-probe-startup-that-raised-3-4m-then-collapsed/

 

 

 

Kickstarter just hired an freelance tech reporter to look into the implosion of Europe's largest-ever Kickstarter campaign, the Torquing Group mini-drone.

 

After raising $3.4 million dollars, and delivering only 600 out of 15,000 drones the CEO left and the company soon collapsed.  The hired journalist, Mark Harris, had this to say :

 

 

The company wants to help the backers of this failed project get the information they are entitled to under their agreement with the project creator. They would like to uncover the story of Zano, from its inception to the present, and decided that the best way to do that was to hire a journalist. The primary audience for the story is the 12,000+ backers of the project, although I will also make the story publicly available once I’ve completed it, most likely in the middle of January.

 

Kickstarter is paying for the whole thing upfront.  What are you expecting to see in the report?  What do you think actually happened to the company?

 

[Aytex]

the guy ran off with the money

[EposVox]

Awful management, then a lack of management.

[Josephdalepi]

can they do this for the tango? there have been something like 4 crowdfunding campaigns and no one has gotten their pc yet

[silberdrachi]

I'm willing to bet that a good 90+% of kickstarters are set up by people who have never started a company before. And on top of that many of them just miscalculate the amount of money they will get from the time anyway. There was a guy who was pretty common on Tested (the website/youtube page) who explained it in one of the podcasts about all the things like fees, taxes and the costs of the "gifts" (with shipping of course). Just because you have a great idea doesn't mean you can build a business around it, or at the very least you should try and get some outside advice before trying.

 

So as for my guess I'm going to go with 90% chance of stupidity and 10% chance of malice.

 

That being said, I'm glad Kickstarter seems to be seeing that they are going to get a bad rap with all these big "success stories" failing, they shouldve just done it about 2 years ago. Their brand has been irrevocably harmed, in my opinion and i now almost never go there. Too little, too late.

[Misanthrope]

Here's my report: While I usually don't condone victim blaming, you gave money away to an obvious scam: what the fuck did you expect? Actual projects with actual chances of being viable and grounded in reality get actual fucking investors and bank loans, they don't just beg on the internet to strangers.

[thekeemo]

Here's my report: While I usually don't condone victim blaming, you gave money away to an obvious scam: what the fuck did you expect? Actual projects with actual chances of being viable and grounded in reality get actual fucking investors and bank loans, they don't just beg on the internet to strangers.

Some people dont like the idea of being in debt

[silberdrachi]

Here's my report: While I usually don't condone victim blaming, you gave money away to an obvious scam: what the fuck did you expect? Actual projects with actual chances of being viable and grounded in reality get actual fucking investors and bank loans, they don't just beg on the internet to strangers.

 

I agree with you within reason. There are a lot of projects that do fine making a couple thousand dollars to do a limited run of something. Those are things that really wouldnt happen without the community involvement because the scale isnt large enough for a loan or an investor. I think the real issue are these brand new ideas that get hundreds of thousands (or millions) of dollars and have no clue what to do with it.

[Misanthrope]

I agree with you within reason. There are a lot of projects that do fine making a couple thousand dollars to do a limited run of something. Those are things that really wouldnt happen without the community involvement because the scale isnt large enough for a loan or an investor. I think the real issue are these brand new ideas that get hundreds of thousands (or millions) of dollars and have no clue what to do with it.

 

The exceptions do not disprove the rule here: if you find a project that succeeds likely:

 

1) You just got lucky

 

2) This was done by a famous personality that didn't really need crowd funding but would of course rather get money for free than risk their own name by asking for investors or a loan that could actually demand something in return, as well as part of the profits.

 

Basically all of this "retired" game devs for example could easily get the money elsewhere, but as long as idiots are giving money away for free without requiring anything in return why not take advantage?

 

Some people dont like the idea of being in debt

As I mentioned above, everyone would prefer free money with no collateral, no interest, no profit sharing, just free money. I don't care if you don't like debt. it exists for a reason: TO AVOID THIS SCAMS.

[Yoinkerman]

I agree with you within reason. There are a lot of projects that do fine making a couple thousand dollars to do a limited run of something. Those are things that really wouldnt happen without the community involvement because the scale isnt large enough for a loan or an investor. I think the real issue are these brand new ideas that get hundreds of thousands (or millions) of dollars and have no clue what to do with it.

 

Lunches and massages and "business" trips don't buy themselves.

[SilicateWielder]

It was the government, totaly, they did it -is swiped away by the gov't-

[pagani123]

first you shouldn't kick start a lot of things there are exceptions (like books or something where you dont spend a ton of money) second you never want to buy a quadcopter that is controlled by your smartphone there almost all crap 

[Snadzies]

 

The exceptions do not disprove the rule here: if you find a project that succeeds likely:

 

1) You just got lucky

 

2) This was done by a famous personality that didn't really need crowd funding but would of course rather get money for free than risk their own name by asking for investors or a loan that could actually demand something in return, as well as part of the profits.

 

Basically all of this "retired" game devs for example could easily get the money elsewhere, but as long as idiots are giving money away for free without requiring anything in return why not take advantage?

 

 

https://www.kickstarter.com/fulfillment

 

Now this was done buy an outside person asked by Kickstarter to survey and analyze the responses so I'm sure some people will call BS on this but if the figures are true then about 10% of projects never end up completing their project and giving the people who donated their rewards.

 

There are a LOT of things that are backed and delivered on through kickstarter, it is only a small number of such items that the greater public takes notice of, good or bad, and you are far more likely to hear about the failed ones because no one hardly ever mentions when things go as planed because that is boring and no one will read about that.

You don't tell your friend about the hundred cars/drivers you passed that day, you tell'm about the one asshole who was zig zagging through traffic like a maniac and cut you off.

[Bittenfleax]

Some people dont like the idea of being in debt

I would say all people not some  :lol:  :lol: 

[Pesmerga]

I wonder why people still trust kickstarter projects after so many failures and moneygrabs.

[Misanthrope]

https://www.kickstarter.com/fulfillment

 

Now this was done buy an outside person asked by Kickstarter to survey and analyze the responses so I'm sure some people will call BS on this but if the figures are true then about 10% of projects never end up completing their project and giving the people who donated their rewards.

 

There are a LOT of things that are backed and delivered on through kickstarter, it is only a small number of such items that the greater public takes notice of, good or bad, and you are far more likely to hear about the failed ones because no one hardly ever mentions when things go as planed because that is boring and no one will read about that.

You don't tell your friend about the hundred cars/drivers you passed that day, you tell'm about the one asshole who was zig zagging through traffic like a maniac and cut you off.

 

That's just how many people don't get anything. How many people get something below their expectations? How many people get a product with a fraction of the promised features? And most important of all, How many projects just keep delaying things instead of disappearing? Kickstarter have been around for a while but the majority of the projects are fairly recent to be declared "dead" as of yet.

 

And even if none of that is correct, none of it invalidates my point: This people actually could mostly get investors and/or bank loans for their projects, it really isn't about projects that just "wouldn't happen" without the help of the community, it's just about people liking free money with virtually 0 fucking accountability. This is something that as a principle I can never be ok with.

[ShadowCaptain]

SNIP

 

Agreed, though crowd funding does have its merits and it makes sense in certain ways it seems very easy to abuse

[dragosudeki]

That's just how many people don't get anything. How many people get something below their expectations? How many people get a product with a fraction of the promised features? And most important of all, How many projects just keep delaying things instead of disappearing? Kickstarter have been around for a while but the majority of the projects are fairly recent to be declared "dead" as of yet.

 

And even if none of that is correct, none of it invalidates my point: This people actually could mostly get investors and/or bank loans for their projects, it really isn't about projects that just "wouldn't happen" without the help of the community, it's just about people liking free money with virtually 0 fucking accountability. This is something that as a principle I can never be ok with.

All projects whether kickstarted or not usually get delayed... Look at the entire game industry as an example if you need one.

 

As far as I know, the key difference between getting actual investors and kickstarter is that actual investors would have a share of the company, where as kickstarters only really have to give back products or incentives upon the project's completion. I would say kickstarter is better due to the fact that you will have people who invest to be the early market of the company. In fact, the same thing could also happen even when they just get actual investors. Its just the true reality of investment that some things go wrong because of a numerous amount of reasons (and not just cause it is a kickstarter). I don't disagree with your point, but I also don't want to put a blanket over the people/companies who are actually attempting to do something honestly.

[The Benjamins]

All projects whether kickstarted or not usually get delayed... Look at the entire game industry as an example if you need one.

 

As far as I know, the key difference between getting actual investors and kickstarter is that actual investors would have a share of the company, where as kickstarters only really have to give back products or incentives upon the project's completion. I would say kickstarter is better due to the fact that you will have people who invest to be the early market of the company. In fact, the same thing could also happen even when they just get actual investors. Its just the true reality of investment that some things go wrong because of a numerous amount of reasons (and not just cause it is a kickstarter). I don't disagree with your point, but I also don't want to put a blanket over the people/companies who are actually attempting to do something honestly.

 

I agree, I think people should stop looking at kickstarter as a store, but as a investment company. If and when I back something on kickstarter I am willing to lose the money I put in. I think people that want a guarantee from kickstarter should not use it. But kickstarter should police the project to the best of their ability to fight fraud.

[Misanthrope]

All projects whether kickstarted or not usually get delayed... Look at the entire game industry as an example if you need one.

As far as I know, the key difference between getting actual investors and kickstarter is that actual investors would have a share of the company, where as kickstarters only really have to give back products or incentives upon the project's completion. I would say kickstarter is better due to the fact that you will have people who invest to be the early market of the company. In fact, the same thing could also happen even when they just get actual investors. Its just the true reality of investment that some things go wrong because of a numerous amount of reasons (and not just cause it is a kickstarter). I don't disagree with your point, but I also don't want to put a blanket over the people/companies who are actually attempting to do something honestly.

Your attitude of giving the benefit of the doubt is morally commendable, but easy to exploit. So maybe not to my extreme degree of distrust but some healthy scepticism is in order.