Gamers Nexus alleges LMG has insufficient ethics and integrity

[Drone971]

1 minute ago, Kolchak said:

The comment was not constructive criticism.

i think the "you are acting like an a***hole" is very constructive. Linus and his team need to hear that and stop that. What can be more constructive than hearing from your audience that you are acting wrong?

[HiTechLowSpec]

2 hours ago, plume said:

have you ever been on twitch or the younger side of youtube (ei. what I thought linus was targeting with the clickbait title and colorful thumbnail)? If this was xQC's or Dream's forum, there would be at least 50 spam comments with meme for every legible ones.

Welcome to the YouTube algorithm. Most of the successful YouTube creators that I watch have to use those stupid thumbnails and titles.

[Shlouski]

15 minutes ago, ScoggsUK said:

God forbid you ever get to do jury service....

 

Yeah it's scary, but so many people are like this. 

 

I read a few post on the Internet from one side of the story, so now I know everything, let's punish them. 

[Kolchak]

1 minute ago, Drone971 said:

i think the "you are acting like an a***hole" is very constructive. Linus and his team need to hear that and stop that. What can be more constructive than hearing from your audience that you are acting wrong?

How they are acting wrong and how they can correct it for the community, works better then "you're an asshole".

[Shin-Gouki]

I think at this point I am going to walk away from this whole thing, wait for some of the dust to settle and try to extrapolate what I believe this situation really is. There is a lot of heat here (to use a term from my old Pro Wrestling Days) and a lot of people adding fuel to this fire from a few angles now.

Hopefully enough factual evidence comes forward that we can get a clear picture but as of right now this is literally a Fire Tornado and I'm evacuating from it.

[HiTechLowSpec]

2 hours ago, RandomDude843 said:

223 pages, damn. Since we are still discussing this, what would you guys feel if they post a video saying “we have fired the employee responsible for the auction mistake and we have updated our processes. We are sorry blabla”

 

Would this be better than minimizing the situation and covering it up?

 

I think we're getting to the point that nothing short of a public execution would be acceptable.

[adarw]

I was here:D

[soundstage]

On 8/15/2023 at 2:55 AM, LinusTech said:

There won't be a big WAN Show segment about this or anything. Most of what I have to say, I've already said, and I've done so privately.

To Steve, I expressed my disappointment that he didn't go through proper journalistic practices in creating this piece. He has my email and number (along with numerous other members of our team) and could have asked me for context that may have proven to be valuable (like the fact that we didn't 'sell' the monoblock, but rather auctioned it for charity due to a miscommunication... AND the fact that while we haven't sent payment yet, we have already agreed to compensate Billet Labs for the cost of their prototype). There are other issues, but I've told him that I won't be drawn into a public sniping match over this and that I'll be continuing to move forward in good faith as part of 'Team Media'. When/if he's ready to do so again I'll be ready.

To my team (and my CEO's team, but realistically I was at the helm for all of these errors, so I need to own it), I stressed the importance of diligence in our work because there are so many eyes on us. We are going through some growing pains - we've been very public about them in the interest of transparency - and it's clear we have some work to do on internal processes and communication. We have already been doing a lot of work internally to clean up our processes, but these things take time. Rome wasn't built in a day, but that's no excuse for sloppiness.

Now, for my community, all I can say is the same things I always say. We know that we're not perfect. We wear our imperfection on our sleeves in the interest of ensuring that we stay accountable to you. But it's sad and unfortunate when this transparency gets warped into a bad thing. The Labs team is hard at work hard creating processes and tools to generate data that will benefit all consumers - a work in progress that is very much not done and that we've communicated needs to be treated as such. Do we have notes under some videos? Yes. Is it because we are striving for transparency/improvement? Yeah... What we're doing hasn't been in many years, if ever.. and we would make a much larger correction if the circumstances merited it. Listing the wrong amount of cache on a table for a CPU review is sloppy, but given that our conclusions are drawn based on our testing, not the spec sheet, it doesn't materially change the recommendation. That doesn't mean these things don't matter. We've set KPIs for our writing/labs team around accuracy, and we are continually installing new checks and balances to ensure that things continue to get better. If you haven't seen the improvement, frankly I wonder if you're really looking for it... The thoroughness that we managed on our last handful of GPU videos is getting really incredible given the limited time we have for these embargoes. I'm REALLY excited about what the future will hold.

 

With all of that said, I still disagree that the Billet Labs video (not the situation with the return, which I've already addressed above) is an 'accuracy' issue. It's more like I just read the room wrong. We COULD have re-tested it with perfect accuracy, but to do so PROPERLY - accounting for which cases it could be installed in (none) and which radiators it would be plumbed with (again... mystery) would have been impossible... and also didn't affect the conclusion of the video... OR SO I THOUGHT...

 

I wanted to evaluate it as a product, and as a product, IF it could manage to compete with the temperatures of the highest end blocks on the planet, it still wouldn't make sense to buy... so from my point of view, re-testing it and finding out that yes, it did in fact run cooler made no difference to the conclusion, so it didn't really make a difference.

 

Adam and I were talking about this today. He advocated for re-testing it regardless of how non-viable it was as a product at the time and I think he expressed really well today why it mattered. It was like making a video about a supercar. It doesn't mater if no one watching will buy it. They just wanna see it rip.  I missed that, but it wasn't because I didn't care about the consumer.. it was because I was so focused on how this product impacted a potential buyer. Either way, clearly my bad, but my intention was never to harm Billet Labs. I specifically called out their incredible machining skills because I wanted to see them create something with a viable market for it and was hoping others would appreciate the fineness of the craftsmanship even if the product was impractical. I still hope they move forward building something else because they obviously have talent and I've watched countless niche water cooling vendors come and go. It's an astonishingly unforgiving market.

 

Either way, I'm sorry I got the community's priorities mixed-up on this one, and that we didn't show the Billet in the best light. Our intention wasn't to hurt anyone. We wanted no one to buy it (because it's an egregious waste of money no matter what temps it runs at) and we wanted Billet to make something marketable (so they can, y'know, eat).

 

With all of this in mind, it saddens me how quickly the pitchforks were raised over this. It also comes across a touch hypocritical when some basic due diligence could have helped clarify much of it. I have a LONG history of meeting issues head on and I've never been afraid to answer questions, which lands me in hot water regularly, but helps keep me in tune with my peers and with the community. The only reason I can think of not to ask me is because my honest response might be inconvenient. 

 

We can test that... with this post. Will the "It was a mistake (a bad one, but a mistake) and they're taking care of it" reality manage to have the same reach? Let's see if anyone actually wants to know what happened. I hope so, but it's been disheartening seeing how many people were willing to jump on us here. Believe it or not, I'm a real person and so is the rest of my team. We are trying our best, and if what we were doing was easy, everyone would do it. Today sucks.

 

Thanks for reading this.

Hey Linus,

Your wall of text is garbage at best. If you are making videos as a reviewer of another company's product, you need to own up to the mistakes you are making. If you don't, you lose credibility for good. In this instance, you have lost credibility for your entire company. No one cares about what thoughts you had or what goes on in the room you are in if you can't state facts and stick to factual numbers for any product review. I request you to stop using the word 'review' in any and all videos that you make going forward. Please stick with entertainment videos which you do best because technical and engineering concepts are not your strengths.

 

Lastly, your company has been irresponsible by selling off or auctioning off engineering sample units of another company. Shame on you!

[dustypaws]

3 minutes ago, HiTechLowSpec said:

I think we're getting to the point that nothing short of a public execution would be acceptable.

Nah... I think a most of us could do with Linus and the upper management eating some humble pie in public.

Edited August 16, 2023 by dustypaws

[faluff]

2 hours ago, RandomDude843 said:

223 pages, damn. Since we are still discussing this, what would you guys feel if they post a video saying “we have fired the employee responsible for the auction mistake and we have updated our processes. We are sorry blabla”

 

Would this be better than minimizing the situation and covering it up?

 

I really really really really hope the "firing" part won't be a thing, as this would prove again that they are ignoring the real issue (processes) and instead blame it on a random employee.

[LordMustangGT]

Why would Steve need to confront you about making a story about you? This is what he does, calls people out. I've been watching you since the garage days and NCIX days. Your videos have gone WAY!, down hill. You've said you know, and you're working on it, but, nothing has change. I went from, I can't wait to watch your videos, to watching maybe 1 in 10. They are that bad, or that pointless. 

[aminit]

XQC reaction to the drama
 

He raise good points here and there but in the end I think we share the same conclusion.

[joaopt]

the liar is really betting we will forget and this is going away if he ignores it. He's even a bigger clueless millionaire then previously imagined

[adarw]

1 minute ago, aminit said:

XQC reaction to the drama
 

He raise good points here and there but in the end I think we share the same conclusion.

nah bro, gambling man should look at himself first. 

[joaopt]

5 minutes ago, adarw said:

I was here:D

 

you already are doing more then Linus

[Dom1252]

2 hours ago, RandomDude843 said:

223 pages, damn. Since we are still discussing this, what would you guys feel if they post a video saying “we have fired the employee responsible for the auction mistake and we have updated our processes. We are sorry blabla”

 

Would this be better than minimizing the situation and covering it up?

 

I doubt they'd fire Linus, because he's the responsible one, but that technically could solve some issues

 

Better would be if they'd actually did something productive and tried fixing things 

[Mrpizzaeater145]

i feel like right now posting what you know will get u beat up in the forum.

[HiTechLowSpec]

22 minutes ago, MyNameWontFi said:

If the prototype is in the hands of a competitor right now, reimbursing them the cost of that prototype doesn't fix the problem. 

This has been covered repeatedly in this thread. Billet Labs doesn't want it back and it's not in the hands of a competitor. Billet wants the compensation that they and Linus had agreed to earlier.

 

Why people keep insisting on plowing the same row over and over is beyond me.

[Nathat23]

2 minutes ago, joaopt said:

the liar is really betting we will forget and this is going away if he ignores it. He's even a bigger clueless millionaire then previously imagined

>Linus should respond now

>Linus should think carefully about a response and plan of action

 

Pick one.

 

It's oblivious something is happening over there since there hasn't been an upload for yesterday.

[AndreiArgeanu]

I don't think the GN video puts that much new into light. It's been painfully obvious that every LMG channel (except Mac Adress, or to a lesser extent) hastily put videos out for quite a long time, either the quality or content of the video fall apart when that happens. The review errors I've seen something here and there so I'm not entirely surprised but the video does put everything into perspective. It's obvious action needs to be taken. Even though a lot of the employees have expressed interest as shown in the GN video to have more time to make higher quality videos, nothing has changed. There's only so much you can blame on "growing pains". You should stop, meet with an appropriate team and create an action plan to fix issues that have been raised and ideally also tell your audience the actions your company will take and the commitments it will tend to before trying to cast stones at GN. Yes, they could have handled this privately, or done things differently but you need to handle your problems first instead of trying to defend or deflect any kind of criticism or statements made about the company you work at.

[Aiken Drum]

25 minutes ago, MrDKOz said:

In terms of the GN video it's hard for me to know entirely, but if I was in GN's shoes I think I would've handled it a bit differently. From what I can tell LTT and GN were on good terms for quite a while and then all of a sudden GN drops this video without reaching out to LTT prior?

Steve put up a video some time in the last year, iirc, where he specifically told both viewers and LTT that, because LMG had become an actual, sizable member of the industry, rather than just a critic thereof, he would no longer be treating LMG any differently from how he treated other large companies like Corsair, Asus, Newegg, etc. He specifically said that LMG would not be receiving any special treatment just because they knew each other or had previously been on friendly terms.

Linus had no reason to feel blindsided by Steve's recent response. He'd been put on notice, very publicly, of the change in their relationship status.

[joaopt]

Just now, Nathat23 said:

>Linus should respond now

>Linus should think carefully about a response and plan of action

 

Pick one.

 

It's oblivious something is happening over there since there hasn't been an upload for yesterday.

 

if he needs time, has to think carefully and probably get some PR firm involved, it isn't genuine, that's the issue. And we all seen his true colours, the lying and gaslighting

[bvvfbQsy5DmWyzTwcSLMWCMYYS]

This is such a shame. My viewership of LTT relied 90% on the heck yea, a small independent Canadian group that is committed to being truthful, and have that Canadian honesty.

 

But these recently surfaced facts just undermine that whole logic..

I'm tempted to continue watching the fun-content of the channel(s), but can't honestly feel like taking much of the review-content seriously at all in the future.

[mrparker]

Just now, Aiken Drum said:

Steve put up a video some time in the last year, iirc, where he specifically told both viewers and LTT that, because LMG had become an actual, sizable member of the industry, rather than just a critic thereof, he would no longer be treating LMG any differently from how he treated other large companies like Corsair, Asus, Newegg, etc. He specifically said that LMG would not be receiving any special treatment just because they knew each other or had previously been on friendly terms.

Linus had no reason to feel blindsided by Steve's recent response. He'd been put on notice, very publicly, of the change in their relationship status.

The specific context to his quote was involving Linus's handling of the Backpack warranty if I recall - he was very vocal about that and contrasted it to GN's warranty.

[AndreiArgeanu]

5 minutes ago, adarw said:

nah bro, gambling man should look at himself first. 

The react machine that adds nothing of value. I have no respect for XQC and quite a few other reactors like him.