The HomePod failed - long live the HomePod!

[HenrySalayne]

Summary

 

Apple discontinued the "big" HomePod back in March 2021 due to disappointing sales numbers. The HomePod Mini remained the only smart speaker in their product range. Today Apple announced to bring back the original (big) HomePod as the HomePod (2nd generation) with a few upgrades. While the original HomePod launched for $350, the price dropped to $300 in 2019 and the 2nd generation is launching for $300 as well.

 

Quotes

Quote

The second-generation HomePod features a virtually identical design as the full-size HomePod that was discontinued in March 2021, with a backlit touch surface and mesh fabric exterior. It features a four-inch high-excursion woofer, five tweeters, four microphones, an S7 chip for computational audio, a U1 chip for Ultra Wideband features like handing off music from an iPhone, and support for Spatial Audio with Dolby Atmos. The speaker also has Siri integration and Matter support for HomeKit and other smart home accessories.

[...]
A new sensor in the HomePod can measure temperature and humidity in indoor environments, and this feature is also being enabled on the existing HomePod mini.

[...]

Two second-generation HomePods can be paired for stereo sound, but one second-generation HomePod and one first-generation HomePod cannot.

 

My thoughts

It's pretty much the same speaker for the same price but it's now able to measure humidity and temperature. This could be a nice addition for home automation and it could replace dedicated thermostats. I'm wondering why Apple felt the need to first discontinue the product and now bring it back.

 

Sources

https://www.macrumors.com/2023/01/18/apple-announces-new-homepod/

https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2023/01/apple-introduces-the-new-homepod-with-breakthrough-sound-and-intelligence/

[WhitetailAni]

Heh, funny that they're using Apple Watch SoCs inside the homepods.

[jaslion]

From what I gather it's basically been made cheaper to make so that even if it's a low volume article it will make enough money.

[Commodus]

There is a more convincing case to be made for the HomePod now that it supports more services and devices (Matter hardware, for example), and I'm curious to know if this sounds noticeably better than the original. But $299 still makes it a bit of a tough sell if you aren't big on Apple Music or the general Apple ecosystem. I'd love it, in part because it isn't pitching products to you like Amazon does, but I suspect many people will be happy with a Sonos One.

[captain_to_fire]

It would’ve been better if Apple brought the AirPort Extreme and Time Capsule back from the grave. 

[Deadpool2onBlu-Ray]

On 1/18/2023 at 11:58 AM, HenrySalayne said:

Summary

 

Apple discontinued the "big" HomePod back in March 2021 due to disappointing sales numbers. The HomePod Mini remained the only smart speaker in their product range. Today Apple announced to bring back the original (big) HomePod as the HomePod (2nd generation) with a few upgrades. While the original HomePod launched for $350, the price dropped to $300 in 2019 and the 2nd generation is launching for $300 as well.

 

Quotes

 

My thoughts

It's pretty much the same speaker for the same price but it's now able to measure humidity and temperature. This could be a nice addition for home automation and it could replace dedicated thermostats. I'm wondering why Apple felt the need to first discontinue the product and now bring it back.

 

Sources

https://www.macrumors.com/2023/01/18/apple-announces-new-homepod/

https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2023/01/apple-introduces-the-new-homepod-with-breakthrough-sound-and-intelligence/

I am curious how two of these sound in a Stereo Setup with Dolby Atmos on an Apple TV 4k. I'd assume better than a soundbar at least, right?

[saltycaramel]

With the S7 this is going to be much faster to react than the original A8 Homepod.

[Timmahnz]

On 1/20/2023 at 11:23 AM, ShawtyT30beTHICCC said:

I am curious how two of these sound in a Stereo Setup with Dolby Atmos on an Apple TV 4k. I'd assume better than a soundbar at least, right?

Two HomePod minis in stereo plus a sub (via an AirPort extreme) do make for good movie experience. You really need the sub as the mini's lack and low end bass.

[tim0901]

They're re-releasing a failed premium product at the same price point, during an economic turn down, in a market segment that seems to be on the brink of collapse? I really don't get the logic here.

 

It's public knowledge just how much money Amazon is losing on Alexa, and notice that Google hasn't exactly been flooding the market with Nest devices either. Smart home devices aren't the huge money makers that tech companies expected them to be. And yet here Apple comes, with the worst assistant around and a product with a reputation of being overpriced, and they expect the struggling market to be favourable? Makes no sense to me.

[suicidalfranco]

5 hours ago, tim0901 said:

They're re-releasing a failed premium product at the same price point, during an economic turn down, in a market segment that seems to be on the brink of collapse? I really don't get the logic here.

 

It's public knowledge just how much money Amazon is losing on Alexa, and notice that Google hasn't exactly been flooding the market with Nest devices either. Smart home devices aren't the huge money makers that tech companies expected them to be. And yet here Apple comes, with the worst assistant around and a product with a reputation of being overpriced, and they expect the struggling market to be favourable? Makes no sense to me.

The things you can afford to do when you have a cult following may leave you speechless

[HenrySalayne]

6 hours ago, tim0901 said:

They're re-releasing a failed premium product at the same price point, during an economic turn down, in a market segment that seems to be on the brink of collapse? I really don't get the logic here.

 

It's public knowledge just how much money Amazon is losing on Alexa, and notice that Google hasn't exactly been flooding the market with Nest devices either. Smart home devices aren't the huge money makers that tech companies expected them to be. And yet here Apple comes, with the worst assistant around and a product with a reputation of being overpriced, and they expect the struggling market to be favourable? Makes no sense to me.

Apple might had a bunch of reasons to do it:

• low development costs
• customers were asking for something above the Mini
• it's stupid to have a "Mini" but not the full-size model (confusing product stack)
• customers were buying outside of the Apple ecosystem

Some products their selling don't make much sense (Mac Pro, I'm looking at you!)  but they are still serving a purpose in the grand scheme. Even if this product doesn't earn any money, it might take revenue away from the competition and it's binding costumers to the ecosystem.

[Obioban]

8 hours ago, tim0901 said:

They're re-releasing a failed premium product at the same price point, during an economic turn down, in a market segment that seems to be on the brink of collapse? I really don't get the logic here.

 

It's public knowledge just how much money Amazon is losing on Alexa, and notice that Google hasn't exactly been flooding the market with Nest devices either. Smart home devices aren't the huge money makers that tech companies expected them to be. And yet here Apple comes, with the worst assistant around and a product with a reputation of being overpriced, and they expect the struggling market to be favourable? Makes no sense to me.

HomePod Mini is selling well, so there may be a market for it. 

 

This actually is cheaper-- the OG was $350 before discounts, and in the last 5 years since it launched there's been a bunch of inflation-- in inflation adjusted money, it's probably closer to $100 cheaper. 

 

I have a bunch of sonos in ceiling speakers in my house and outside, but I'm still considering getting HomePods or HomePod minis for every room for the smart home functionality they enable. The smoke detector alert in particular-- a decent smart smoke detector costs more than a homepod mini, and the mini will give you the benefits of smart smoke detector with a dumb one... plus intercom, temp detection by room, and humidity detection by room. Once I've price justified a mini in every room (I may be there, mentally), any room where I want a speaker for music, that I don't have sonos in already, it probably makes sense to spend the extra for a full size homepod. 

[Obioban]

On 1/20/2023 at 2:37 AM, saltycaramel said:

With the S7 this is going to be much faster to react than the original A8 Homepod.

The S7 processor should be a HUGE improvement. 

[tim0901]

3 hours ago, HenrySalayne said:

Apple might had a bunch of reasons to do it:

• low development costs
• customers were asking for something above the Mini
• it's stupid to have a "Mini" but not the full-size model (confusing product stack)
• customers were buying outside of the Apple ecosystem

Some products their selling don't make much sense (Mac Pro, I'm looking at you!)  but they are still serving a purpose in the grand scheme. Even if this product doesn't earn any money, it might take revenue away from the competition and it's binding costumers to the ecosystem.

None of this makes the product make more sense to the customer though. Sure if Apple makes more money now then whoop de doo, hooray for capitalism I guess. But if I didn't want the last one, why would I want the new one, when it's basically the same thing at the same price? The changes they've made are borderline meaningless and in some ways a straight-up downgrade over the first one (less speakers & microphones and a downgrade to WiFi 4) and there's certainly not enough for hoards of owners of the original to rush out and upgrade. It making the manufacturer more money doesn't make it a better product.

 

1 hour ago, Obioban said:

HomePod Mini is selling well, so there may be a market for it. 

The original Homepod sold so utterly terribly that Apple was still selling units produced before its launch long after the day it was officially discontinued. That's how poorly the world saw it, even at $300. A software feature that allows it to detect fire alarms (which I can almost guarantee will be available on every other smart speaker brand within a few months EDIT: turns out it already is on Google!) isn't going to suddenly change the world's minds here. If it was an overpriced flop 5 years ago, why should it be any different now?

 

1 hour ago, Obioban said:

This actually is cheaper-- the OG was $350 before discounts, and in the last 5 years since it launched there's been a bunch of inflation-- in inflation adjusted money, it's probably closer to $100 cheaper. 

Compared to the original model's launch MSRP, yes the new model is cheaper. But the old model did get discounted after a year, and we can't just ignore that. And so compared to the price that the original model was actually sold at for most of the time it was available? It's the same price. And that's the comparison point that actually matters here - what it was actually sold for for the majority of its lifespan.

[hishnash]

4 hours ago, tim0901 said:

less speakers & microphones and a downgrade to WiFi 4

Less speakers does not automatically mean worse.  It might well sound better, not that there is much need for it to sound better by all accounts the original homePod was well above everything else within its size class at the time.

Given that all it can do is stream audio it would be completely fine. Wifi 4 is the duel band 2.4 and 5 GHz so any router or wifi network you deploy today will be compatible.  There is no need for the homePod to ever run at speeds greater than Wifi4, the last homePod might have had wifi5 spec but will have never pushed past wifi1 speeds.  

As to why users might be interested in these, I believe they are attractive to the same group of people who buy the larger Sonos speakers, TV sound bars etc. While a pair of these is not a good as a good 5.1 surround sound system a pair of these is a lot better than a soundbar (or even a 2.1 or 3.1 setup). 

With the original homePod all apple had going for it was the audio, today what they have is the homeKit ecosystem and unless you want to run your one server with homeBridge homeKit is still the only home controle ecosystem that runs local to your home (matter is on the roadmap for other vendors but I fully expect many of them to implement it through a remote server connection forwarding everything to the cloud). If you are setup in the HomeKit ecosystem and would like some better speakers for a room or have a large room were somthign like the HomePod mini is not quite enough for you then these are not a bad option. 

 

[Obioban]

13 hours ago, tim0901 said:

The changes they've made are borderline meaningless and in some ways a straight-up downgrade over the first one (less speakers & microphones and a downgrade to WiFi 4) and there's certainly not enough for hoards of owners of the original to rush out and upgrade. It making the manufacturer more money doesn't make it a better product.

 

The original Homepod sold so utterly terribly that Apple was still selling units produced before its launch long after the day it was officially discontinued. That's how poorly the world saw it, even at $300. A software feature that allows it to detect fire alarms (which I can almost guarantee will be available on every other smart speaker brand within a few months EDIT: turns out it already is on Google!) isn't going to suddenly change the world's minds here. If it was an overpriced flop 5 years ago, why should it be any different now?

 

Compared to the original model's launch MSRP, yes the new model is cheaper. But the old model did get discounted after a year, and we can't just ignore that. And so compared to the price that the original model was actually sold at for most of the time it was available? It's the same price. And that's the comparison point that actually matters here - what it was actually sold for for the majority of its lifespan.

If you have a google based home (and I'd never let google in my home), yes, you could use that. In fact, before google bought Nest, I had Nest Protects as my smoke detectors, so I didn't even need such a product. 

 

802.11n is 100% fine for streaming lossless audio, which is the most data these will ever stream. My Sonos speakers are all wired, and the first thing I noticed when I plugged them into the switch is that they're running on 10Base-T ethernet-- and that was also the last time I noticed it, as it doesn't impact their use whatsoever. 

 

Speaker sound quality is not a smart area to bet against Apple-- they're rarely not best in class. I'd be surprised if this isn't the best sounding unit by a wide margin, including over the OG full size HomePod. 

 

Lastly, it doesn't need to be a runaway commercial success to be a viable product. So long as they're not losing money on it, having a product that rounds out the lineup for people in the Apple ecosystem is a fine reason to release it.