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It was a matter of time - Tesla EVs Used to Mine for Crypto

Lightwreather
By Lightwreather
in Tech News
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Summary

When most people think of Tesla, they think of its bombastic and eccentric CEO Elon Musk and mid-range to high-end electric vehicles that can travel 270 to 400+ miles per charge. However, several people are leveraging the large lithium-ion battery packs inside their cars to mine for cryptocurrency, according to a new report from CNBC.

 

Quotes

Case 1

Quote

In the case of Chris Allessi, he uses a Bitmain Antminer S9 ASIC that is powered by his Model S’ main battery via a power inverter to mine for Bitcoin. Alessi also alleges that he used his car’s central processor, a pokey Intel Atom-based SoC, to mine for Monero using the built-in Tesla web browser. However, we’d imagine that it’s not worth the effort due to the more fruitful prospects of Bitcoin.

For Alessi, charging his Model S is free for the life of the vehicle using Tesla's vast Supercharging network. This perk was available to all new Tesla vehicles purchased before January 2017. So, in essence, he's able to mine for Bitcoin while not taking a hit on one of the most expensive components of the cryptomining equation: ongoing electricity costs.

While it's technically possible to mine for Bitcoin with all the requisite hardware, Alessi argues that it's not worth it in the end, adding, "And right now, even though the price for Bitcoin has gone up dramatically, so has the difficulty level."

Case 2

Quote

Siraj Raval, who owns a 2018 Model 3, claims he netted between $400 to $800 per month last year mining for Ethereum. Raval's setup is a bit more complicated. It involves hacking the Model 3's internal software to gain direct access to the CPU, then piggybacking five [unnamed] GPUs that tie into the vehicle's main battery.

"It's a computer with wheels," Raval claimed. "It's so simple to hack into this computer car."

But there's only one problem; unlike Alessi, Raval doesn't have access to unlimited Supercharging. So that means he must rely on charging from the grid at home, which of course, adds to his monthly utility bill. So whether Raval uses his Model 3 to mine or plugs a mining rig directly into a wall outlet at home, he's paying for the electricity used to mine for Ethereum.


My thoughts

Well, it was a matter of time until someone did this. In the quotes, 2 methods of mining on a tesla are reported on. But before you go ahead and try this (if you want to), a couple concerns I have, chief among them, there's the battery itself. Batteries, over the course of their lifetimes, eventually lose their capacity to hold a charge and thus, my first concern, Cryptomining is very likely going to increase the wear and tear of these batteries and thus drastically shorten their lifespan. Then, there's the ROI, Teslas are pretty expensive (From my POV, a non-car enthusist who know nothing about their pricing). But apparently there are people who've done it as a Proof-of-concept and believe it to not be worth it. But we all know there are people who'll do this anyway. Anyways, have fun with this one, and please avoid a flamewar (for the mods' sake)

 

Sources

Tom's Hardware
CNBC

"A high ideal missed by a little, is far better than low ideal that is achievable, yet far less effective"

 

If you think I'm wrong, correct me. If I've offended you in some way tell me what it is and how I can correct it. I want to learn, and along the way one can make mistakes; Being wrong helps you learn what's right.

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Now queue in people who feel the need to tell what people should do with their tesla's

One day I will be able to play Monster Hunter Frontier in French/Italian/English on my PC, it's just a matter of time... 4 5 6 7 8 9 years later: It's finally coming!!!

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19 minutes ago, J-from-Nucleon said:

Summary

When most people think of Tesla, they think of its bombastic and eccentric CEO Elon Musk and mid-range to high-end electric vehicles that can travel 270 to 400+ miles per charge. However, several people are leveraging the large lithium-ion battery packs inside their cars to mine for cryptocurrency, according to a new report from CNBC.

 

Quotes

Case 1

Case 2


My thoughts

Well, it was a matter of time until someone did this. In the quotes, 2 methods of mining on a tesla are reported on. But before you go ahead and try this (if you want to), a couple concerns I have, chief among them, there's the battery itself. Batteries, over the course of their lifetimes, eventually lose their capacity to hold a charge and thus, my first concern, Cryptomining is very likely going to increase the wear and tear of these batteries and thus drastically shorten their lifespan. Then, there's the ROI, Teslas are pretty expensive (From my POV, a non-car enthusist who know nothing about their pricing). But apparently there are people who've done it as a Proof-of-concept and believe it to not be worth it. But we all know there are people who'll do this anyway. Anyways, have fun with this one, and please avoid a flamewar (for the mods' sake)

 

Sources

Tom's Hardware
CNBC

"Sir, what do you plan to do with all those AAA batteries?"
"Mine bitcoin, of course!"

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Posted

Click-bait. That's where he's making money. Not from the energy he's already paying to charge the car and depreciation from added wear of battery charge/discharge cycles.

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10 minutes ago, Caroline said:

it's literally plummeted, gonna hit 15K in a couple months

It has? I haven't been paying attention to that market for a while

"A high ideal missed by a little, is far better than low ideal that is achievable, yet far less effective"

 

If you think I'm wrong, correct me. If I've offended you in some way tell me what it is and how I can correct it. I want to learn, and along the way one can make mistakes; Being wrong helps you learn what's right.

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1 hour ago, PeachGr said:

It's a PC that is spending electricity to mine, I don't know why it's on the news. I believe the only reason that people are interested is because "it's a Tesla thing"

I think it’s just news because it’s funny. This is the innocuous type of click bait where they’re just trying to covert chuckles into clicks. 
 

Some guy mining cryptocurrency on his car is pretty funny. 

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Posted

powered by battery? doesnt make sense, the wear and tear just isnt worth it imo

 

powered by chargers at work or chargers that are FoC to use? i can definitely see it happening

just like how some people mine on their laptop when they visit starbucks, and (from what i heard) mined enough for a cup of coffee during their stay

-sigh- feeling like I'm being too negative lately

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This is some idiotic "news". It was real news when an owner of an S in the free charging program was using it to mine for free

▓ƆԀ▓ S▓₱▓Ɇ▓c▓s▓: i7 6ʇɥפᴉƎ00K (4.4ghz), Asus DeLuxe X99A II, GT҉X҉1҉0҉8҉0 Zotac Amp ExTrꍟꎭe),Si6F4Gb D???????r PlatinUm, EVGA G2 Sǝʌǝᘉ5ᙣᙍᖇᓎᙎᗅᖶt, Phanteks Enthoo Primo, 3TB WD Black, 500gb 850 Evo, H100iGeeTeeX, Windows 10, K70 R̸̢̡̭͍͕̱̭̟̩̀̀̃́̃͒̈́̈́͑̑́̆͘͜ͅG̶̦̬͊́B̸͈̝̖͗̈́, G502, HyperX Cloud 2s, Asus MX34. פN∩SW∀S 960 EVO

Just keeping this here as a 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̌̅̒̾̈́̆͌̌̾̎̽̐̅̏́̈̔͛̀̋̃͊̒̓͗͒̑͒̃͂̌̄̇̑̇͛̆̾͛̒̇̍̒̓̀̈́̄̐͂̍͊͗̎̔͌͛̂̏̉̊̎͗͊͒̂̈̽̊́̔̊̃͑̈́̑̌̋̓̅̔́́͒̄̈́̈̂͐̈̅̈̓͌̓͊́̆͌̉͐̊̉͛̓̏̓̅̈́͂̉̒̇̉̆̀̍̄̇͆͛̏̉̑̃̓͂́͋̃̆̒͋̓͊̄́̓̕̕̕̚͘͘͘̚̕̚͘̕̕͜͜͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͠ͅS̷̢̨̧̢̡̨̢̨̢̨̧̧̨̧͚̱̪͇̱̮̪̮̦̝͖̜͙̘̪̘̟̱͇͎̻̪͚̩͍̠̹̮͚̦̝̤͖̙͔͚̙̺̩̥̻͈̺̦͕͈̹̳̖͓̜͚̜̭͉͇͖̟͔͕̹̯̬͍̱̫̮͓̙͇̗̙̼͚̪͇̦̗̜̼̠͈̩̠͉͉̘̱̯̪̟͕̘͖̝͇̼͕̳̻̜͖̜͇̣̠̹̬̗̝͓̖͚̺̫͛̉̅̐̕͘͜͜͜͜ͅͅͅ.̶̨̢̢̨̢̨̢̛̻͙̜̼̮̝̙̣̘̗̪̜̬̳̫̙̮̣̹̥̲̥͇͈̮̟͉̰̮̪̲̗̳̰̫̙͍̦̘̠̗̥̮̹̤̼̼̩͕͉͕͇͙̯̫̩̦̟̦̹͈͔̱̝͈̤͓̻̟̮̱͖̟̹̝͉̰͊̓̏̇͂̅̀̌͑̿͆̿̿͗̽̌̈́̉̂̀̒̊̿͆̃̄͑͆̃̇͒̀͐̍̅̃̍̈́̃̕͘͜͜͝͠͠z̴̢̢̡̧̢̢̧̢̨̡̨̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̲͚̠̜̮̠̜̞̤̺͈̘͍̻̫͖̣̥̗̙̳͓͙̫̫͖͍͇̬̲̳̭̘̮̤̬̖̼͎̬̯̼̮͔̭̠͎͓̼̖̟͈͓̦̩̦̳̙̮̗̮̩͙͓̮̰̜͎̺̞̝̪͎̯̜͈͇̪̙͎̩͖̭̟͎̲̩͔͓͈͌́̿͐̍̓͗͑̒̈́̎͂̋͂̀͂̑͂͊͆̍͛̄̃͌͗̌́̈̊́́̅͗̉͛͌͋̂̋̇̅̔̇͊͑͆̐̇͊͋̄̈́͆̍̋̏͑̓̈́̏̀͒̂̔̄̅̇̌̀̈́̿̽̋͐̾̆͆͆̈̌̿̈́̎͌̊̓̒͐̾̇̈́̍͛̅͌̽́̏͆̉́̉̓̅́͂͛̄̆͌̈́̇͐̒̿̾͌͊͗̀͑̃̊̓̈̈́̊͒̒̏̿́͑̄̑͋̀̽̀̔̀̎̄͑̌̔́̉̐͛̓̐̅́̒̎̈͆̀̍̾̀͂̄̈́̈́̈́̑̏̈́̐̽̐́̏̂̐̔̓̉̈́͂̕̚̕͘͘̚͘̚̕̚̚̚͘̕̕̕͜͜͝͠͠͝͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͝͝ͅͅͅī̸̧̧̧̡̨̨̢̨̛̛̘͓̼̰̰̮̗̰͚̙̥̣͍̦̺͈̣̻͇̱͔̰͈͓͖͈̻̲̫̪̲͈̜̲̬̖̻̰̦̰͙̤̘̝̦̟͈̭̱̮̠͍̖̲͉̫͔͖͔͈̻̖̝͎̖͕͔̣͈̤̗̱̀̅̃̈́͌̿̏͋̊̇̂̀̀̒̉̄̈́͋͌̽́̈́̓̑̈̀̍͗͜͜͠͠ͅp̴̢̢̧̨̡̡̨̢̨̢̢̢̨̡̛̛͕̩͕̟̫̝͈̖̟̣̲̖̭̙͇̟̗͖͎̹͇̘̰̗̝̹̤̺͉͎̙̝̟͙͚̦͚͖̜̫̰͖̼̤̥̤̹̖͉͚̺̥̮̮̫͖͍̼̰̭̤̲͔̩̯̣͖̻͇̞̳̬͉̣̖̥̣͓̤͔̪̙͎̰̬͚̣̭̞̬͎̼͉͓̮͙͕̗̦̞̥̮̘̻͎̭̼͚͎͈͇̥̗͖̫̮̤̦͙̭͎̝͖̣̰̱̩͎̩͎̘͇̟̠̱̬͈̗͍̦̘̱̰̤̱̘̫̫̮̥͕͉̥̜̯͖̖͍̮̼̲͓̤̮͈̤͓̭̝̟̲̲̳̟̠͉̙̻͕͙̞͔̖͈̱̞͓͔̬̮͎̙̭͎̩̟̖͚̆͐̅͆̿͐̄̓̀̇̂̊̃̂̄̊̀͐̍̌̅͌̆͊̆̓́̄́̃̆͗͊́̓̀͑͐̐̇͐̍́̓̈́̓̑̈̈́̽͂́̑͒͐͋̊͊̇̇̆̑̃̈́̎͛̎̓͊͛̐̾́̀͌̐̈́͛̃̂̈̿̽̇̋̍͒̍͗̈͘̚̚͘̚͘͘͜͜͜͜͜͜͠͠͝͝ͅͅͅ☻♥■∞{╚mYÄÜXτ╕○\╚Θº£¥ΘBM@Q05♠{{↨↨▬§¶‼↕◄►☼1♦  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Posted
1 hour ago, leadeater said:

Oh no! Now the wait times to get a Tesla will be ages... oh wait never mind lol

Oh no! This will increase the price of used Teslas... oh wait never mind lol

PLEASE QUOTE ME IF YOU ARE REPLYING TO ME

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Posted

Remember how everyone looked at how much driving car has on the clock with petrol cars? With EV's it'll be how much stupid crypto mining it has done...

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53 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Remember how everyone looked at how much driving car has on the clock with petrol cars? With EV's it'll be how much stupid crypto mining it has done...

How does mining crypto affect the performance of the car though? Other than battery lifespan, which wouldn't be an issue if it's plugged in while mining(?)

-sigh- feeling like I'm being too negative lately

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1 minute ago, Moonzy said:

How does mining crypto affect the performance of the car though? Other than battery lifespan, which wouldn't be an issue if it's plugged in while mining(?)

it will tho, take for an example, a laptop that you keep pluged in.

|:Insert something funny:|

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44 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

How does mining crypto affect the performance of the car though? Other than battery lifespan, which wouldn't be an issue if it's plugged in while mining(?)

I'm also very much sure cars were not designed to have 100% load for 24/7 on their internal components.

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4 hours ago, Moonzy said:

How does mining crypto affect the performance of the car though? Other than battery lifespan, which wouldn't be an issue if it's plugged in while mining(?)

 

3 hours ago, RejZoR said:

I'm also very much sure cars were not designed to have 100% load for 24/7 on their internal components.

The battery packs and DC control in these cars are of the highest grade, 24/7 would be no issue at all. That said how you are getting the energy does matter, if you are pulling the energy from the battery pack and the charging control doesn't allow current to bypass the battery pack, in this use case that shouldn't be allowed, then you end up putting a duty cycle load on the battery. Both discharge and charge duty cycle as the charger won't over charge any cell/cell group so they have to discharge to a low enough level to then be charged again so they'll be cycling at like 95%-98% charge which is actually not bad for a Li-Ion battery honestly.

 

It's still load on the battery though so do that for long enough and maximum range would get impacted.

 

Say you have 4x 250W GPUs running for 10 hours every day, that's roughly 60km-70km worth of extra driving every day you do that. 420km-490km a week, 1680km-1960km a month, 20160km-23520km a year. Actually not insignificant if you actually did it all 365 days a year.

 

Edit:

Also efficiency wise this is horrific.

 

110V/230V AC to high voltage DC conversion: ~95%

DC to DC conversion (in to battery):~98%

DC to DC conversion (out of battery): ~98%

DC to AC conversion (12V Inverter): ~92%

AC to DC conversion (PC PSU): 92%-95%

 

To supply 1kw you would be drawing ~1200W from the house AC which means 20% higher energy cost. Anyone actually doing this is not smart, like at all.

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Posted

I don't get it. Other than the "haha I hacked my car" factor, what's the benefit of hooking up GPUs to a car CPU and mine that way?

And the first case is basically just a guy using an inverter on wheels.

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3 hours ago, RejZoR said:

I'm also very much sure cars were not designed to have 100% load for 24/7 on their internal components.

The only concern I have with mining using the internal components is that you can't tweak the power limit(?) Making it inefficient to do so to begin with

So yea, I agree that mining with internal components is bad idea

 

But if it's the case of using an inverter to power an external rig and the car bypasses the battery when plugged in, then it's not really an issue

 

1 hour ago, leadeater said:

To supply 1kw you would be drawing ~1200W from the house AC which means 20% higher energy cost. Anyone actually doing this is not smart, like at all.

Unless you're doing this with free electric, it's probably not worth it

Like the guy abusing his free charge from Tesla

-sigh- feeling like I'm being too negative lately

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In one way people put in extreme amounts of engineering to make standby power consumption as low as possible (for any electronic part), in the other way people don't ever let their stuff standby because when it's not used it's mining stuff. Man we're literally working against ourselves.

If someone did not use reason to reach their conclusion in the first place, you cannot use reason to convince them otherwise.

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Seems rather similar to what people have done previously. Last year some guy put a mining rig in his BMW i8 https://www.tomshardware.com/news/the-fastest-rtx-3080-mining-rig-is-a-bmw-i8

Putting PCs or mining rigs in an electric vehicle isn't really a new idea. The difference here is that they also used the CPU built in to the Tesla, but that's probably less than worthless for mining and really only done it because they could.

 

Quote

For Alessi, charging his Model S is free for the life of the vehicle using Tesla's vast Supercharging network. This perk was available to all new Tesla vehicles purchased before January 2017.

My concern is if people start doing this then it might give car manufacturers an excuse to drop their free/subsidised charging or impose tough limits and restrictions on them.

CPU: Intel i7 6700k  | Motherboard: Gigabyte Z170x Gaming 5 | RAM: 2x16GB 3000MHz Corsair Vengeance LPX | GPU: Gigabyte Aorus GTX 1080ti | PSU: Corsair RM750x (2018) | Case: BeQuiet SilentBase 800 | Cooler: Arctic Freezer 34 eSports | SSD: Samsung 970 Evo 500GB + Samsung 840 500GB + Crucial MX500 2TB | Monitor: Acer Predator XB271HU + Samsung BX2450

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15 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

Unless you're doing this with free electric, it's probably not worth it

Like the guy abusing his free charge from Tesla

Yep, so long as the power is free then who cares about efficiency.

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7 minutes ago, Spotty said:

My concern is if people start doing this then it might give car manufacturers an excuse to drop their free/subsidised charging or impose tough limits and restrictions on them.

And entirely invalidate the warranty on the car because you modified it. Bolt on a turbo and change the fuel injectors while a car is under manufacturer warranty and watch how far you get with a warranty claim lol. This is pretty much equivalent to that.

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Just now, leadeater said:

And entirely invalidate the warranty on the car because you modified it. Bolt on a turbo and change the fuel injectors while a car is under manufacturer warranty and watch how far you get with a warranty claim lol. This is pretty much equivalent to that.

I clean the 85 cents worth of loose coins out of the console before I take my car in to the dealership/mechanic, you really think people are going to go in for their service with a boot full of graphics cards?

 

Would manufacturers be able to know that you were using the car to mine cryptocurrency with if you take the GPUs/inverter out? I'm assuming there's a lot of power logging that goes on in electric cars and it might show some funky power data when the car wasn't driving but I don't think they'd ever be able to prove you were using it to mine with. If they ask just say you had a portable camping fridge that was running to keep your drinks cool. The one mining on the Tesla CPU might be possible to detect though if they notice the system software has been modified and that is probably something they would check.

CPU: Intel i7 6700k  | Motherboard: Gigabyte Z170x Gaming 5 | RAM: 2x16GB 3000MHz Corsair Vengeance LPX | GPU: Gigabyte Aorus GTX 1080ti | PSU: Corsair RM750x (2018) | Case: BeQuiet SilentBase 800 | Cooler: Arctic Freezer 34 eSports | SSD: Samsung 970 Evo 500GB + Samsung 840 500GB + Crucial MX500 2TB | Monitor: Acer Predator XB271HU + Samsung BX2450

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