Poland Memes on Article 13...Literally

[Fasauceome]

sauce

sauce II

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Poland has filed a complaint against the European Union’s copyright directive

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Poland has officially challenged the European Union’s recently-approved controversial copyright directive, according to Reuters, saying that the legislation would bring unwanted censorship. The country filed its complaint yesterday with the the Court of Justice of the European Union.

Finally, a louder voice to stand up to the EU with everyone who dissents. While people who oppose Article 13 well understand what it does to online culture, it seems some governments really don't get it. However, 

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Poland’s Deputy Foreign Minister Konrad Szymanski said that the “system may result in adopting regulations that are analogous to preventive censorship, which is forbidden not only in the Polish constitution but also in the EU treaties.”

It should be very clear that Article 13 crosses serious boundaries simply for the sake of protecting the rich. On top of that, it can be hijacked for political agendas, and the Polish government understands that.

Just to remind anyone who forgot about the core of the issue:

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 The legislation is designed to update copyright law, and contains a number of controversial clauses, such as Article 11, the so-called “link tax,” which will allow publishers to charge platforms such as Google to display news stories, and Article 13, which says that platforms would be liable for content that infringes on someone’s copyright.

 

 

As TheProfessional" puts it (1:10):

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The copyright system as we have right now is absolutely broken...{The system} is so broken, not just my channel, but there are so many YouTube channels out there where people are getting their videos flagged falsely...with these music companies, these music companies are the worst offenders, constantly abusing copyright.

Those who use YouTube already know, the system is utterly disastrous. Claimants are the deciders of the legitimacy of their claims, handling the funds of advertising withholding was only recently fixed, and the culture it creates is wretched.

 

Thank goodness for Poland being a voice for the average citizen to channel, it wouldn't matter to the EU if the citizens defied the laws (because they really couldn't) but a governing body on our side is a different story.

[PlayStation 2]

@Morgan MLGman

[AlTech]

Yes, this is so beautiful. As a European Union citizen (not just because I live in the UK) this is beautiful and amazing. I hope other member states do the same and join in.

 

Edit: And I hope that the EU Court of Justice/Supreme Court of Justice finds this law to be unconstitutional and unenforcable.

[TempestCatto]

1 minute ago, VegetableStu said:

Polandball

I fucking live for Polandball.

[thorhammerz]

2 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

inb4 memes on HOW DO I MOVE TO POLAND

^{... i just remembered Polandball is a thing ._.}

Can or cannot into space?

[justpoet]

Somehow hadn't heard of polandball before.  Thank you.  LOL

[Trik'Stari]

It's almost as if claimants should have to provided evidence of wrongdoing before action is taken.

 

An "innocent until proven guilty" system, if you will.

 

Why does this need to be said? Why in fuck do I actually need to be the one to point out that this is how the system should have worked from the fucking get go?

[Stefan Payne]

Well, lets hope there is a chance to get rid of this nonsense...

 

I somehow feel we are moving back to the DDR - wich is what the East realizes, who lived there. But the rest doesn't it seems...

[Loote]

I'm afraid it's a populist move, without real conviction. Hope they prove me wrong or succeed just because it's a right thing to do.

[Sauron]

It's a bit ironic that this comes from Poland considering their stance on other issues but I'll take it...

15 minutes ago, Loote said:

I'm afraid it's a populist move, without real conviction. Hope they prove me wrong or succeed just because it's a right thing to do.

My thoughts exactly

[Trixanity]

4 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

Well, lets hope there is a chance to get rid of this nonsense...

 

I somehow feel we are moving back to the DDR - wich is what the East realizes, who lived there. But the rest doesn't it seems...

Considering how many controversies along the lines of authoritarian and otherwise undemocratic actions taken in Eastern European countries I'm not exactly sure that having lived it makes them against it. It's seems to be more about "it's okay as long as it's my guy/team doing it and/or it benefits me" and since Poland is more inclined towards national sovereignty it seems only logical that they'd challenge the EU on trying to gain more control over member states. The EU has, after all, meddled a bit in Poland so I'm guessing this is either payback or there is something in it affecting the plans of the current government.

[Morgan MLGman]

6 hours ago, Dan Castellaneta said:

@Morgan MLGman

Funny how this isn't even news in Poland

54 minutes ago, Loote said:

I'm afraid it's a populist move, without real conviction. Hope they prove me wrong or succeed just because it's a right thing to do.

 

39 minutes ago, Sauron said:

It's a bit ironic that this comes from Poland considering their stance on other issues but I'll take it...

My thoughts exactly

 

It is a populist move and it won't succeed, we have a populist government that wins elections by giving away "free" money to people. This stuff isn't even news in Poland, it's something that will "disappear" soon from any headlines because the European election is over and they convincingly won it.

Note that Poland is led by a populist, propagandist party that was voted for by over 75% of people with little-to-no education (i.e basic education or none) and as a contrast, only under 25% of people with a university degree or better voted for them. The relatively poorer half of the country (eastern one) overwhelmingly chose them because of the thoughtless social programs.


To sum up: I think more countries should oppose Article 13. The fact that the Polish government claims that now means nothing because they can change their minds any minute and also, they just don't care so don't get your hopes up that this changes anything This isn't even a topic people debate here, trust me - if the first time I'm hearing about something happening in my country from LTT then it isn't big news  

[Sauron]

1 minute ago, Morgan MLGman said:

Funny how this isn't even news in Poland

 

It is a populist move and it won't succeed, we have a populist government that wins elections by giving away "free" money to people. This stuff isn't even news in Poland, it's something that will "disappear" soon from any headlines because the European election is over and they convincingly won it.

Note that Poland is led by a populist, propagandist party that was voted for by over 75% of people with little-to-no education (i.e basic education or none) and as a contrast, only under 25% of people with a university degree or better voted for them. The relatively poorer half of the country (eastern one) overwhelmingly chose them because of the thoughtless social programs.


To sum up: I think more countries should oppose Article 13. The fact that the Polish government claims that now means nothing because they can change their minds any minute and also, they just don't care so don't get your hopes up that this changes anything This isn't even a topic people debate here, trust me - if the first time I'm hearing about something happening in my country from LTT then it isn't big news  

completely agree

[leadeater]

6 hours ago, AluminiumTech said:

As a European Union citizen (not just because I live in the UK) this is beautiful and amazing

*EU introduces a law that would bring an end to memes*

UK: "Fuck that, we're out"

*UK leaves the EU*

 

Memes, the line not to be crossed 

[Sakkura]

6 hours ago, fasauceome said:

As TheProfessional" puts it (1:10):

Those who use YouTube already know, the system is utterly disastrous. Claimants are the deciders of the legitimacy of their claims, handling the funds of advertising withholding was only recently fixed, and the culture it creates is wretched.

Problem with that logic is, the new copyright directive actually puts in place measures to combat that particular issue. You can hate the link tax and "upload filters" all you like, but specifically regarding copyright disputes, the new directive is definitely an improvement:

 

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Member States shall provide that online content-sharing service providers put in place an effective and expeditious complaint and redress mechanism that is available to users of their services in the event of disputes over the disabling of access to, or the removal of, works or other subject matter uploaded by them.

Where rightholders request to have access to their specific works or other subject matter disabled or those works or other subject matter removed, they shall duly justify the reasons for their requests. Complaints submitted under the mechanism provided for in the first subparagraph shall be processed without undue delay, and decisions to disable access to or remove uploaded content shall be subject to human review. Member States shall also ensure that out-of-court redress mechanisms are available for the settlement of disputes. Such mechanisms shall enable disputes to be settled impartially and shall not deprive the user of the legal protection afforded by national law, without prejudice to the rights of users to have recourse to efficient judicial remedies. In particular, Member States shall ensure that users have access to a court or another relevant judicial authority to assert the use of an exception or limitation to copyright and related rights.

 

[Fasauceome]

3 hours ago, Sakkura said:

Problem with that logic is, the new copyright directive actually puts in place measures to combat that particular issue. You can hate the link tax and "upload filters" all you like, but specifically regarding copyright disputes, the new directive is definitely an improvement:

Ok but there's a problem with the wording of the provisions here

 

3 hours ago, Sakkura said:

put in place an effective and expeditious complaint and redress mechanism that is available to users of their services in the event of disputes

Problem 1: "hey the system is bad so you're gonna make a good one" as if directing a platform to implement a system this vaguely would actually bring an improvement

3 hours ago, Sakkura said:

Where rightholders request to have access to their specific works or other subject matter disabled or those works or other subject matter removed, they shall duly justify the reasons for their requests. 

Problem 2: "everyone's gonna do the right thing and cooperate like we say" but YouTube claimants already break the rules and unjustly claim videos. Why would this change anything?

 

3 hours ago, Sakkura said:

Complaints submitted under the mechanism provided for in the first subparagraph shall be processed without undue delay, and decisions to disable access to or remove uploaded content shall be subject to human review.

Again, just another unrealistic "hey make it better!"

 

Etc. Etc., The provisions just sound like they were written by someone who was so tone deaf about why the issues exist to begin with, they heard that the copyright system was messed up on YouTube and imagined the perfect system to fix it but not a realistic one.

[HarryNyquist]

13 minutes ago, fasauceome said:

The provisions just sound like they were written by someone who was so tone deaf about why the issues exist to begin with, they heard that the copyright system was messed up on YouTube and imagined the perfect system to fix it but not a realistic one.

Tone deaf doesn't describe it properly. More like "willfully ignorant due to $$$$$$$$$$"

[Sauron]

5 hours ago, leadeater said:

*EU introduces a law that would bring an end to memes*

UK: "Fuck that, we're out"

*UK leaves the EU*

 

Memes, the line not to be crossed 

Ironically Brexit is the ultimate meme

[Sakkura]

2 hours ago, fasauceome said:

Ok but there's a problem with the wording of the provisions here

 

Problem 1: "hey the system is bad so you're gonna make a good one" as if directing a platform to implement a system this vaguely would actually bring an improvement

 

Problem 2: "everyone's gonna do the right thing and cooperate like we say" but YouTube claimants already break the rules and unjustly claim videos. Why would this change anything?

 

Again, just another unrealistic "hey make it better!"

 

Etc. Etc., The provisions just sound like they were written by someone who was so tone deaf about why the issues exist to begin with, they heard that the copyright system was messed up on YouTube and imagined the perfect system to fix it but not a realistic one.

1. It's vague because it's a directive. You don't seem to understand how EU legislation works. And the "system" already in place on Youtube is bad, so some kind of solution to an already existing problem is a good thing. It's not that they create the problem and then try to patch it themselves, it's actually dealing with a problem that would exist regardless of the other parts of the directive.

 

2. The very fact that there are already copyright shenanigans proves the need for a better complaints and redress system. It's not sufficient for the only recourse to be "sue Youtube," especially not in a system like the US where court costs are onerous and you still have to pay even if you win an obvious case (so big companies can just use those costs as a deterrent against and punishment of legitimate complainants).

[Sauron]

6 hours ago, Sakkura said:

1. It's vague because it's a directive. You don't seem to understand how EU legislation works. And the "system" already in place on Youtube is bad, so some kind of solution to an already existing problem is a good thing. It's not that they create the problem and then try to patch it themselves, it's actually dealing with a problem that would exist regardless of the other parts of the directive.

 

2. The very fact that there are already copyright shenanigans proves the need for a better complaints and redress system. It's not sufficient for the only recourse to be "sue Youtube," especially not in a system like the US where court costs are onerous and you still have to pay even if you win an obvious case (so big companies can just use those costs as a deterrent against and punishment of legitimate complainants).

To be honest copyright law as it is now is a mess - something born to protect people's work from corporations willing to steal it for profit have had the opposite effect of allowing corporations a complete lockdown on IP they leech off of their employees and contractors. Yes, in the current system there need to be regulations against this but they can't prevent the ship from sinking.

[mxk]

this is interesting to see, at least for me since poland is such a crazy country.