Core i7 7700k Confirmed Benchmarks- Zero IPC gains over Skylake

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

4 minutes ago, Lays said:

I'll probably just keep my MOCF, I'm sure it'll be just as good, plus I need Sata ports out the wazoo, I have 3 hdd and 2 ssd and plan on getting more lol

 

Same here, i have 2 ssd and 3 hdd that needs to go in to my build. Along with one m.2 drive. 

 

 

 

 

[MageTank]

8 minutes ago, Lays said:

I'll probably just keep my MOCF, I'm sure it'll be just as good, plus I need Sata ports out the wazoo, I have 3 hdd and 2 ssd and plan on getting more lol

Yeah, besides. You don't need a board with a gimmick feature to turn AVX off. You can do that yourself, lol. 

[FRN]

9 minutes ago, MageTank said:

Yeah, besides. You don't need a board with a gimmick feature to turn AVX off. You can do that yourself, lol. 

Gimmick features like M.2 cooling! Don't be surprised if one day we'll be able to overclock m.2 drives.

[Orangeator]

Intel has no competition, why should they release improved products? They are just making smart business decisions. AMD better hit a home run with Ryzen or we are all screwed.

[Vode]

Well slightly higher clockspeed and less power out of box. Same IPC. As expected.

[Dackzy]

Okay the same shit I have said for a long time, it is just a core clock bump....

 

(I told you so)

[raphidy]

2500k won't die. Gonna wait mainstream 6 cores then.

[patrickjp93]

13 minutes ago, raphidy said:

2500k won't die. Gonna wait mainstream 6 cores then.

The scary thing is if games actually start using AVX then a 2500K will be just as good as a 6-core anyway, either that or RAM will become the bottleneck in gaming. That would be hilarious!

[AlTech]

17 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

Higher power efficiency allows greater overclocking. And greater battery life in the mobile world.

No, I am not defending Intel. I am just saying the fact of reality. Maybe Intel is smart in that they are taking advantage of the lack of competition, to address the design issue of their CPU in being so power hungry.

 

 

 

Intel? Power hungry?

 

Oh please. The only time I've ever felt "Gee, this CPU is power hungry" is in a laptop i7. Not a desktop. Although, I would be open to a generation where they maintain the performance but provide a huge efficiency improvement and provide lower prices.

[DELTAprime]

Just looking at the title, did anyone at this stage really expect an IPC gain? I thought it was settled months ago that IPC would be within margin of error to Skylake.

[Drak3]

54 minutes ago, DELTAprime said:

Just looking at the title, did anyone at this stage really expect an IPC gain? I thought it was settled months ago that IPC would be within margin of error to Skylake.

Pat was still claiming that Kaby would have an IPC improvement.

[DELTAprime]

1 minute ago, Drak3 said:

Pat was still claiming that Kaby would have an IPC improvement.

Oh, well that's Patrick for you.

[TidaLWaveZ]

I'm actually quite happy that intel keeps justifying my 5820k purchase, by the time a worthy upgrade within my price range comes up I'll have gotten more than 5 years out of my processor.

[done12many2]

Man, things really seem to be shaping up out there for this chip.  More and more folks continue to confirm 5 GHz overclocks with just a little work.  I don't have much need for a 4 core chip, but I'm really thinking about doing a 7700k build for the hell of it.

 

 

 

 

[Dybre]

I was going to hold off upgrading my z87/4770k setup for kabby lake guess I will see what comes out next year. 

[Drak3]

1 hour ago, done12many2 said:

Man, things really seem to be shaping up out there for this chip.  More and more folks continue to confirm 5 GHz overclocks with just a little work.  I don't have much need for a 4 core chip, but I'm really thinking about doing a 7700k build for the hell of it.

 

 

 

 

No real stability testing occured on their OCs. I doubt they will be any better at overclocking than Skylake, seeing as Kaby is just Skylake factory OC'd, with some newish features.

 

It's also possible Intel binned review samples to help build hype.

[done12many2]

6 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

No real stability testing occured on their OCs. I doubt they will be any better at overclocking than Skylake, seeing as Kaby is just Skylake factory OC'd, with some newish features.

 

It's also possible Intel binned review samples to help build hype.

 

The fact of the matter remains.  Even the AIDA64 (the accepted LTT community stress testing for some reason) at 5.0 GHz in the first video is better than 95% of Skylake chips could do, so I'd call it better.

 

Either way, I just placed a pick up order with Micro Center and I'll be picking up a 7700k along with a z270 board this evening.  I'm pretty sure it's going to OC better than the 6700k I used to have, which was damn good itself.

 

I try not to backseat drive much. 

[MageTank]

2 minutes ago, done12many2 said:

 

The fact of the matter remains.  Even the AIDA64 (the accepted LTT community stress testing for some reason) at 5.0 GHz in the first video is better than 95% of Skylake chips could do, so I'd call it better.

 

Either way, I just placed a pick up order with Micro Center and I'll be picking up a 7700k along with a z270 board this evening.  I'm pretty sure it's going to OC better than the 6700k I used to have, which was damn good itself.

 

I try not to backseat drive much. 

Find me one of those 5ghz review chips that didn't use the AVX multiplier offset. I can hit 5ghz on Skylake if I remove all of the heat out of the equation, lol. 

[done12many2]

3 minutes ago, MageTank said:

Find me one of those 5ghz review chips that didn't use the AVX multiplier offset. I can hit 5ghz on Skylake if I remove all of the heat out of the equation, lol. 

 

Like I said in my post just before yours, I'm picking one up tonight so I'll be able to tell you more sometime tomorrow.  Nobody's making mention of using the AVX offset.  I think it's an assumption on both of our parts to say whether or not they have to use it to run 5 GHz plus.

 

This give me an excuse to fill an extra Case Labs case that I've been wondering what to do with.  

[MageTank]

Just now, done12many2 said:

 

Like I said in my post just before yours, I'm picking one up tonight so I'll be able to tell you more sometime tomorrow.  Nobody's making mention of the AVX offset.  I think it's an assumption on both of our parts to say whether or not they have to use it to run 5 GHz plus.

Really? Nobody? 

http://www.anandtech.com/show/10959/intel-launches-7th-generation-kaby-lake-i7-7700k-i5-7600k-i3-7350k/8

Quote

Overclocking perceptions will change with Kaby Lake, due to the new AVX Offset feature to be found in the BIOS of each Z270 motherboard. AVX instructions are known to cripple a good overclock, reducing the stability and making it harder to push the non-AVX code if that is the limitation. With Kaby Lake, a user can apply an AVX offset (e.g. -10x) which will reduce the multiplier when an AVX instruction occurs. This means that if an overclock of 4.8 GHz is reached and an AVX Offset of 8x is in play, then the AVX instruction will run at 4.0 GHz, generating less heat and keeping the system stable.

We will have a dedicated overclocking piece going over all our OC results, but the short of it is that all three of our K-SKUs (retail parts) happily reached 4.8 GHz AVX at a reasonable voltage. The i7-7700K was able to hit 4.9 GHz with an AVX offset of -10, and our i5-7600K hit 5.0 GHz even with AVX turned on.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/Intel-Core-i7-7700K-Review-Kaby-Lake-and-14nm/Overclocking-Kaby-Lake

Quote

With base clock-aware frequency and voltage curves, and a new AVX offset ratio to lower AVX clock speed to avoid the thermal constraints those instructions can create, Intel thinks that the overclocking capability of Kaby Lake should be higher than older architectures.

https://techreport.com/review/31179/intel-core-i7-7700k-kaby-lake-cpu-reviewed

Quote

Unlocked Kaby Lake chips also inherit Broadwell-E's AVX Offset feature. That setting lets tweakers run the chip at lower speeds under heavy AVX2 workloads while maintaining higher frequencies when those instructions aren't being executed, possibly increasing the light-load frequency gains one can achieve with a given chip. If those issues held you back from taking your Skylake CPU to its maximum potential, Kaby Lake might break those shackles.

 

Quote

In terms of getting the clock (5ghz), so the first option we have to change is the AVX core instruction ratio negative offset. This is an option you might have heard about already from Broadwell-E, because this option allows you to overclock higher in a normal circumstance for normal gaming clock higher because normal games don't use AVX. AVX is an instruction inside the CPU which allows the CPU to work more efficient and be faster in the calculation, however it's also putting much more load on the CPU, which in the result you can clock lower. So with the AVX instruction offset, you can force the CPU to clock lower automatically if it detects AVX.

Now, English isn't Der8auer's first language, so forgive any grammatical errors in that quote, I wrote it word for word the way he spoke it in the video. He's a highly respected overclocker, and he personally believes this higher clock speed on Kaby Lake to be the result of this AVX offset multiplier. Why do I believe him? Because I can already see the results with my 6700k. If I run less stressful stress tests (non-AVX stress tests) I can pass at much higher frequencies. However, if I run XTU (Linpack) or Prime95, I tend to fail quickly. You can also completely disable the instruction set within windows itself, and see a huge difference in temperatures and overall stability. 

 

I do appreciate that you are willing to take the time out of your day to overclock and share the results, just keep in mind this information, so that you can test it yourself. Something tells me it's going to play an important part in obtaining 5ghz as easily as these reviewers did. 

[done12many2]

31 minutes ago, MageTank said:

Really? Nobody? 

 

I was referring to no mention in the videos links that I provided.  

 

Agreed that the use of AVX plays a HUGE role in CPU temps and stability of high overclocks.  I also agree that AVX offset is cheating the system, so to speak.  I believe I already mentioned that earlier in this thread.

 

I went from my 5960x to a 6800k, and further on to a 6950x in the search for balance between single core and multi core performance that worked for me.  In the end, I got rid of the Broadwell-E chips because of the fact that they did require the use of AVX offsets as I hunted for the perfect overclock.  I ended up going back to my 5960x and switching to a per core overclock and life's been good.   It continued to bug me that my kids' Skylake builds were much snappier (thanks to single core performance) than my 5960x rig, so the per core OC fixed that issue.

 

I'm hoping that Skylake-X brings about a change in that area, but for now, I'll run two systems.  The Kaby Lake will be my general use / gaming rig and the x99 rig will handle that AVX stuff was keep talking about.    I originally had a split setup with a 6700k, but got rid of it and haven't HAVE missed it since.  I know better this time around.

 

 

Quote

I do appreciate that you are willing to take the time out of your day to overclock and share the results, just keep in mind this information, so that you can test it yourself. Something tells me it's going to play an important part in obtaining 5ghz as easily as these reviewers did. 

 

If it doesn't hit 5 GHz without delidding or use of an AVX offset, it'll simply go right back to where it came from.  Other than the improved 4k encoding/transcoding, which I really don't need since I'm keeping the x99 rig, a sub 5 GHz Kaby Lake chip would net me no more than a Sklake chip.  At that point, I could save a good bit by returning the 7700k and going that route again.

 

Or maybe if it didn't hit 5 GHz without offsetting AVX, I could see how high it can go with an aggressive offset since I don't need it.  Who knows, but it'll be fun to find out.

[ZmOnEy132]

I understand that the 7700k provides no gains over the 6700k at the moment but would it be a good idea if I was starting with a new build to get a 7700K? Will they possibly add better support in the future for it in including better Z270 Motherboards and drivers? Newegg has both CPU's for the same price at the moment so that isn't a difference. Only thing I haven't looked into is the mobo difference in terms of pricing and compatibility however if the new would provide better in the long run I wouldn't mind spending extra on a good mobo. Any advice is appreciated

[MageTank]

1 minute ago, ZmOnEy132 said:

I understand that the 7700k provides no gains over the 6700k at the moment but would it be a good idea if I was starting with a new build to get a 7700K? Will they possibly add better support in the future for it in including better Z270 Motherboards and drivers? Newegg has both CPU's for the same price at the moment so that isn't a difference. Only thing I haven't looked into is the mobo difference in terms of pricing and compatibility however if the new would provide better in the long run I wouldn't mind spending extra on a good mobo. Any advice is appreciated

When it comes to both being the same price, always pick the newer of the two options. It will likely have longer support/additional features. If Skylake was cheaper by a decent enough margin, then by all means, go with Skylake, but for the same price, Kaby is the obvious choice. As for motherboards, they are interchangeable. You can use a Kabylake CPU in a Z170 board without taking advantage of the newer chipset features, and vice versa by using a Skylake CPU in a Kaby Z270 board. Ideally, you would want a Z270 board alongside a Kaby CPU to get the best of both. 

 

I would say determine a budget, then get the best components that fit within that budget. That's the best way to do things when making purchasing decisions like this. If you need help selecting which components you might need, feel free to state your budget in one of the build planning subforums and ask people for assistance on hardware selection. From there, they will offer up different hardware configurations that fit your budget. 

[imreloadin]

I wonder how many of the Intel supporters ragged on AMD when they released the FX-9590? This is essentially the same thing, you know minus the millions of dollars spent in R&D that went into the "optimizing" of Kaby Lake...

[ZmOnEy132]

22 minutes ago, MageTank said:

When it comes to both being the same price, always pick the newer of the two options. It will likely have longer support/additional features. If Skylake was cheaper by a decent enough margin, then by all means, go with Skylake, but for the same price, Kaby is the obvious choice. As for motherboards, they are interchangeable. You can use a Kabylake CPU in a Z170 board without taking advantage of the newer chipset features, and vice versa by using a Skylake CPU in a Kaby Z270 board. Ideally, you would want a Z270 board alongside a Kaby CPU to get the best of both. 

 

I would say determine a budget, then get the best components that fit within that budget. That's the best way to do things when making purchasing decisions like this. If you need help selecting which components you might need, feel free to state your budget in one of the build planning subforums and ask people for assistance on hardware selection. From there, they will offer up different hardware configurations that fit your budget. 

Awesome thanks for the advice. I'll definitely look into it.