Qualcomm Snapdragon 850 revealed - Exclusive for full Windows 10, not your phone.

[Inkz]

Didn't Asus just announce a phone yesterday that was using the 845 and also had a doc. Ouch, that kind of hurts.

[Bananasplit_00]

so can we have netboobs back now? 

[Nowak]

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

We don't even know how the performance is and people are assuming the performance sucks because PUBG probably won't on it. If these are as fast as an i3 it will be enough for most that also want a whole day on the battery.

If the Snapdragon 835 devices are anything to go by, it'll perform really badly. Microsoft has a really bad reputation as of this decade of overpromising and under-delivering with a product.

[Brooksie359]

10 hours ago, captain_to_fire said:

Well looks like Intel should be concerned now. Apple is going ARM for their laptops, Microsoft is pushing ARM for laptops and Intel failed in mobile with their attempt to push Atom to phones and tablets around 2012 to 2013.

--------------------------------------------------------------

 

Now that an ARM chip can now run full Windows 10, can it now emulate 64-bit Win32 programs? Saw this another article from Android Police:

 

In the realm of laptop-specific features, there's really not much to go on aside from the fact that Qualcomm is now promising native support in Windows 10 for ARM64 applications via the 64-bit Win32 SDK. There's also support for the 64-bit version of Microsoft's Edge Browser.

Maybe that is why they hired Jim Keller. They need someone with experience making good low power mobile cpus and he has it. I would not be surprised if they hired him for the very purpose to compete in the mobile market. 

[Drak3]

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

>Completely ignores that it has about 2x the battery life of most cheap i3 laptops.

Having twice the battery life doesn't mean jack shit if the CPU doesn't perform half way decent. Under Windows, it doesn't.

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

We don't even know how the performance is and people are assuming the performance sucks because PUBG probably won't on it.

30% faster than the 835. Which is still rather pathetic.

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

If these are as fast as an i3 it will be enough for most that also want a whole day on the battery.

I can only imagine the 850 being as fast as an i3 being true is if I downclock the i3.

[GoodBytes]

5 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Having twice the battery life doesn't mean jack shit if the CPU doesn't perform half way decent. Under Windows, it doesn't.

 

Sorry for not delivering the performance of a 28core 5GHz Intel desktop CPU, with 2x Titan V SLI, with all day battery life, fanless, no throttle, at under 500$. MS and Qualcomm should try harder

 

[Drak3]

Just now, GoodBytes said:

 

Sorry for not delivering the performance of a 28core 5GHz Intel desktop CPU, with 2x Titan V SLI, with all day battery life, fanless, no throttle at under 500$. 

 

A good starting point would be keeping pace with an i3-4030Y.

[kokakolia]

2 hours ago, Drak3 said:

A good starting point would be keeping pace with an i3-4030Y.

To what end? Are laptops still relevant in 2018?

[Drak3]

9 minutes ago, kokakolia said:

To what end? Are laptops still relevant in 2018?

Yes.

[Nowak]

Y'know, if this is "performance optimized", won't that mean shorter than the 22 hour battery life Microsoft promises? Perhaps more like Intel battery life than what you'd get on your phone. At that point there'd be no reason to choose an ARM-based Windows device over a normal Intel/AMD x86 PC.

 

Sorry but I'm not seeing a market for these things ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Drak3]

7 hours ago, NowakVulpix said:

Sorry but I'm not seeing a market for these things ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Pretty sure I gave you the market for these things.

[Cookybiscuit]

On 05/06/2018 at 12:26 PM, GoodBytes said:

Native 4K UHD video capture capture. Not only it can do 4K playback but also capture without the need of any software trickery.

In other words your system is a spying device even if you wipe Windows and run a non-botnet OS.

[GoodBytes]

7 hours ago, NowakVulpix said:

Y'know, if this is "performance optimized", won't that mean shorter than the 22 hour battery life Microsoft promises? Perhaps more like Intel battery life than what you'd get on your phone. At that point there'd be no reason to choose an ARM-based Windows device over a normal Intel/AMD x86 PC.

 

Sorry but I'm not seeing a market for these things ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Well battery life will depend on the manufacture of the system, in the end.

But I think the though process for Qualcomm, is that the fact that the newer chip consumes less power than the 835 despite being faster (we this many times in the recent years with GPUs), and the fact that the chip is an SoC (so, System on a chip), and smaller than Intel very own smallest CPUs, then the "motherboard", would only have a few chips for storage, RAM, part of the charging circuit (the rest is in the SoC itself) and port (USB, headphones, SD card reader, SIM card, etc.). Also, you have no big heatsink solution needed. You also don't need an external chipset, and all that. If you look at your phone, the system board is TINY, the rest is taken by the battery. So the thinking is that you have this tiny board on the system, and the rest is battery. So you can have massive batteries inside. Of course, battery will drives up cost, but hey! It will be "22h battery life" if not more (it will be probably less, as manufacture needs to keep at a price point, and so far the systems offered all have nice IPS high-resolution displays, and decently fast SSDs, and not shitty budget TN, Windows minimum supported resolution panels, and eMMC or a slow-ass, 2MB of cache 5400RPM HDD)

 

So over Intel based system you have, or I should say, potentially have:

• Instant wake up from sleep (like your phone. Microsoft tried to get that in the past, but things weren't moving with Intel to add support or this)
• LTE modem (Intel/AMD requires extra hardware) - Nice to have feature when you have terrible Wi-Fi and needs to get work done.
• No large cooling solution, or fans needed, allowing more space to make the system lighter or replace the saved space with battery.
• Entire system on a chip, so room for more battery, and not need a big board with 2x chipset, and a bunch of wiring and circuitry component everywhere
• Consumes less power, so you should have longer battery life for the same system powered by Intel/AMD CPUs (assuming that the battery is identical in capacity on both
• Technically, and as we speak, cheaper CPU, and no need to purchase a chipset also. (remember Intel makes double money: It's CPU and chipset that you HAVE to buy, and only from them. So I never see Intel being in any hurry to integrate it in their CPU).

Personally, I don't expect budget system with ARM based system, not now. Microsoft and OEMs are more interested in selling very long battery life system with LTE connectivity and instant wake up feature. So expect nice system with high-resolution IPS displays, large capacity batteries in a thin and light form factor. I also expect full Windows 10 powered phone once the adaptable interface system from Microsoft, called: CShell, would be completed (CShell will replace the current aged old, current one we have in our PC, the, non adaptable one: Shell32). On paper, CShell can bring animated wallpaper login/lock screen like smartphones today, allows the login screen to spread past 1 monitor, and adapt properly and live without hiccups, between modes in a convertible device. Again, that is on paper. Will it offer all this on day 1, we will see, maybe not. We might get the foundation of it, and the rest will come over time.

[Drak3]

5 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

Well battery life will depend on the manufacture of the system, in the end.

But I think the though process for Qualcomm, is that the fact that the newer chip consumes less power than the 835 despite being faster (we this many times in the recent years with GPUs), and the fact that the chip is an SoC (so, System on a chip), and smaller than Intel very own smallest CPUs, then the "motherboard", would only have a few chips for storage, RAM, part of the charging circuit (the rest is in the SoC itself) and port (USB, headphones, SD card reader, SIM card, etc.). Also, you have no big heatsink solution needed. You also don't need an external chipset, and all that. If you look at your phone, the system board is TINY, the rest is taken by the battery. So the thinking is that you have this tiny board on the system, and the rest is battery. So you can have massive batteries inside. Of course, battery will drives up cost, but hey! It will be "22h battery life" if not more (it will be probably less, as manufacture needs to keep at a price point, and so far the systems offered all have nice IPS high-resolution displays, and decently fast SSDs, and not shitty budget TN, Windows minimum supported resolution panels, and eMMC or a slow-ass, 2MB of cache 5400RPM HDD)

 

So over Intel based system you have, or I should say, potentially have:

• Instant wake up from sleep (like your phone. Microsoft tried to get that in the past, but things weren't moving with Intel to add support or this)
• LTE modem (Intel/AMD requires extra hardware) - Nice to have feature when you have terrible Wi-Fi and needs to get work done.
• No large cooling solution, or fans needed, allowing more space to make the system lighter or replace the saved space with battery.
• Entire system on a chip, so room for more battery, and not need a big board with 2x chipset, and a bunch of wiring and circuitry component everywhere
• Consumes less power, so you should have longer battery life for the same system powered by Intel/AMD CPUs (assuming that the battery is identical in capacity on both
• Technically, and as we speak, cheaper CPU, and no need to purchase a chipset also. (remember Intel makes double money: It's CPU and chipset that you HAVE to buy, and only from them. So I never see Intel being in any hurry to integrate it in their CPU).

Personally, I don't expect budget system with ARM based system, not now. Microsoft and OEMs are more interested in selling very long battery life system with LTE connectivity and instant wake up feature. So expect nice system with high-resolution IPS displays, large capacity batteries in a thin and light form factor. I also expect full Windows 10 powered phone once the adaptable interface system from Microsoft, called: CShell, would be completed (CShell will replace the current aged old, current one we have in our PC, the, non adaptable one: Shell32). On paper, CShell can bring animated wallpaper login/lock screen like smartphones today, allows the login screen to spread past 1 monitor, and adapt properly and live without hiccups, between modes in a convertible device. Again, that is on paper. Will it offer all this on day 1, we will see, maybe not. We might get the foundation of it, and the rest will come over time.

That's alot of shilling over products that have flopped at every turn. The market doesn't care about Windows on ARM, and is quickly losing interest in ARM based tablets. The latest iteration isn't going to change anything.

[captain_to_fire]

11 hours ago, NowakVulpix said:

Y'know, if this is "performance optimized", won't that mean shorter than the 22 hour battery life Microsoft promises? Perhaps more like Intel battery life than what you'd get on your phone. At that point there'd be no reason to choose an ARM-based Windows device over a normal Intel/AMD x86 PC.

 

Sorry but I'm not seeing a market for these things ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

If there’s a consolation at least with Windows 10 on ARM laptops and tablets is that they get free unlimited data from Sprint until the end of the year...at least in the US so there’s that. 

 

Since Google’s Android has pretty much given up on tablets, the only company that has given a damn about tablets other than Apple is Microsoft. It seems to me this is Microsoft’s way of dissuading potential iPad and MacBook users probably by saying “hey kid. Instead asking mom and dad to buy you and iPad and a MacBook Pro, why not just get this HP Envy x2 with Windows 10?” In some aspects W10 on ARM might be better than an iPad because iOS doesn’t support mice input nor does it have access to the full file system like the Mac or Windows. But think there’s performance compromises with putting a full fat Windows 10 on an ARM SoC not to mention Qualcomm only provides drivers up to two years. Then there’s the issue of apps. The Windows Store is growing but not that fast to actually compete with thousands of iOS apps in the App Store. 

 

If the rumors are true that Apple is indeed making an ARM based MacBook and was able to run Mac apps emulated but with very little performance penalty or even natively which is better, Microsoft might need to reconsider their business model with Windows, notwithstanding the fact that Apple is now bringing iOS apps (one of their big money makers) to the Mac. 

[Whiskers]

4 hours ago, Drak3 said:

That's alot of shilling over...

 

Let's not resort to this kind of thing, shall we? If this thread doesn't remain a civil discussion on both sides it will be closed. Accusing someone of "shilling" just because you have a difference of opinion is not acceptable.

[Nowak]

53 minutes ago, captain_to_fire said:

Then there’s the issue of apps. The Windows Store is growing but not that fast to actually compete with thousands of iOS apps in the App Store. 

It's growing, sure. But the overall app quality is still really low compared to iOS and Android, because Microsoft will approve literally anything on the store... which completely defeats the purpose in having an approval system.