Over 3 Million Graphics Card Sold To Crypto Miners in 2017

[Blademaster91]

1 hour ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

I have  an R9 280 which works just fine.

You can definitely survive without a Titan GTX1070 GPU.

It's hard to be picky about an R9 280 with crazy GPU prices,but "you don't need a GPU" is what every miner says lol. It's not difficult to avoid buying Apple & Samsung directly, both are partially to blame for the ram shortage. I also can't complain about a $200 amazon prime phone, though as this is a tech forum I guess some have to load facebook 1.5secs faster.

22 minutes ago, bimmerman said:

I was there last weekend buying speakers.

RX580 -- $850 (seriously)

1080 FE -- $590 (best deal from this list)

1070ti -- $650

1050ti - $350

1070 - $550

1060 - $450

prices have gone pants-on-head stupid. Do not buy a GPU right now.

Those prices are insane,but its better than almost everything out of stock, i went to bestbuy a few weeks ago and they only had a few RX 550,RX 560, 1060 3GB and 1050's.

[bimmerman]

Just now, Blademaster91 said:

It's hard to be picky about an R9 280 with crazy GPU prices,but "you don't need a GPU" is what every miner says lol. It's not difficult to avoid buying Apple & Samsung directly,I choose not to because they contribute to the ram shortage. I also can't complain about a $200 amazon prime phone, though as this is a tech forum I guess some have to load facebook 1.5secs faster.

Those prices are insane,but its better than almost everything out of stock, i went to bestbuy a few weeks ago and they only had a few RX 550,RX 560, 1060 3GB and 1050's.

My point is-- if you have a GPU and are able to play games now, resist the lure of OO SHINY and don't buy anything for the next few months. Turn down settings and save yourself from astronomical price gouging.

 

On the other hand, if you don't have a working GPU then the recommendation is the same: don't buy anything and do something else for a few months. No game is worth a $300+ markup on a GPU.

 

Now is a terrible time to jump into PC building, so don't. Make do with what you have, or buy a console or prebuilt if you must game and can't stand your current PC.

[NumLock21]

2 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

Yeah, lets compare a business decision and physical limitation to this idiocy with mining....

#idiot....

Learn how to detect sarcasm

#retard....

[Blademaster91]

1 minute ago, bimmerman said:

My point is-- if you have a GPU and are able to play games now, resist the lure of OO SHINY and don't buy anything for the next few months. Turn down settings and save yourself from astronomical price gouging.

On the other hand, if you don't have a working GPU then the recommendation is the same: don't buy anything and do something else for a few months. No game is worth a $300+ markup on a GPU.

Now is a terrible time to jump into PC building, so don't. Make do with what you have, or buy a console or prebuilt if you must game and can't stand your current PC.

True,if your GPU breaks it's at the worst possible time. Buying a used GPU is usually ok if you have to have your gaming PC and you don't care that it was probably used for mining and could break any time.

I'm still getting OOH SHINY over upgrading to a Coffee Lake or Ryzen but the price of faster ram isn't worth it either.  With news that gpu prices could increase even more through 2018, I agree a console or prebuilt is becoming more appealing.

[jagdtigger]

6 minutes ago, NumLock21 said:

Learn how to detect sarcasm

#retard....

Look at where i live....

[bcredeur97]

if the gamers are patient enough you may be able to find 1080ti's in dumpsters

LOL

might be a while tho.if the new gen cards are good enough, prices of last gen could indeed tank.

[leadeater]

5 hours ago, Misanthrope said:

I would argue that it's meaningless precisely because AMD and Nvidia's unwillingness to update it to reflect this increased costs to manufacture from their AIB partners, effectively lying by omission to the public about the actual cost of their products.

I don't see how it's lying, cost of materials has nothing to do with us and the manufacturer sets the price of the products. If they want to take less profit that's on them. Parts cost will always change slightly over time but that doesn't mean you need or should adjust the MSRP.

 

Why do you even care it costs more for EVGA to buy ram chips? If they don't charge you more for it what's the difference?

[leadeater]

13 hours ago, Misanthrope said:

But if they continue to have an MSRP that's like 380 for a 1070 even though they're now selling them at a higher price, possibly even at 380 as their base price, it means that it would be effectively impossible for any distributor or store to sell the card at MSRP regardless of the demand.

They are not selling them at a higher price, distributors are. You do know distributors have nothing to do with manufacturing the product and don't care what the build cost is?

 

Distributors know they can get a higher price for the product and they get limited supply for the demand that they get for them so they jack the price above MSRP, no one can stop them from doing this.

 

You're mistaking market price (what we pay) with wholesale price (what manufacturers sell them at).

[Zodiark1593]

1 hour ago, bimmerman said:

My point is-- if you have a GPU and are able to play games now, resist the lure of OO SHINY and don't buy anything for the next few months. Turn down settings and save yourself from astronomical price gouging.

 

On the other hand, if you don't have a working GPU then the recommendation is the same: don't buy anything and do something else for a few months. No game is worth a $300+ markup on a GPU.

 

Now is a terrible time to jump into PC building, so don't. Make do with what you have, or buy a console or prebuilt if you must game and can't stand your current PC.

*has desktop with decent GPU*

*plays Fable on Intel Atom netbook*

 

For less demanding titles, iGPUs are not terrible, though that is of no help to those building Ryzen systems. They need a dGPU pretty much, and if their current one breaks, time to stab the wallet.

[mr moose]

1 hour ago, dizmo said:

You have absolutely no way of knowing that and really, even if that was the case, it's still spurred on by mining so my point stands.

 

 

Nvidias last statement claimed gaming cards made up 59% of their revenue, and I have linked to other articles before that estimate the use of gaming cards in data centers to be at least 10%.

 

 

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12022/nvidia-announces-earnings-of-26-billion-for-q3-2018

https://www.forbes.com/sites/aarontilley/2017/09/15/nvidias-most-valuable-business-is-hidden-in-its-financials-says-analyst/#60f3dfdf624e

 

Not "absolutely no way of knowing" at all. It just means the figures all balance and nothing is extraordinary that cant be explained by other market trends.   I do agree mining has had an impact, it would be silly to say otherwise, I just wouldn't go trying to find absolute proof in the numbers.

[Razor01]

3 hours ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

Quote

 

I have  an R9 280 which works just fine.

You can definitely survive without a Titan GTX1070 GPU.

 

 

Yes people can but for many they want to upgrade and can't

 

3 hours ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

Yes, it was "VR for the masses".

 

Yeah it really doesn't do well for VR either....  Its right around gtx 970 in VR actually in many tests its just about the same than as a gtx 970 with re projection and missed frames, gtx 970 isn't a vr ready card.  Just marketing that's all that was, otherwise there was no reason to buy rx 480, it was a worse card than the gtx 1060, and AMD knew it so they spun that whole VR ready marketing slogan.

[leadeater]

20 minutes ago, mr moose said:

and I have linked to other articles before that estimate the use of gaming cards in data centers to be at least 10%.

Well I can confirm some of our departments are using gaming GPUs in their server clusters to do research.

[Razor01]

16 minutes ago, mr moose said:

 

Nvidias last statement claimed gaming cards made up 59% of their revenue, and I have linked to other articles before that estimate the use of gaming cards in data centers to be at least 10%.

 

 

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12022/nvidia-announces-earnings-of-26-billion-for-q3-2018

https://www.forbes.com/sites/aarontilley/2017/09/15/nvidias-most-valuable-business-is-hidden-in-its-financials-says-analyst/#60f3dfdf624e

 

Not "absolutely no way of knowing" at all. It just means the figures all balance and nothing is extraordinary that cant be explained by other market trends.   I do agree mining has had an impact, it would be silly to say otherwise, I just wouldn't go trying to find absolute proof in the numbers.

Its easy to find out the total number of graphics cards (horsepower) being used in mining, just have to look at the hash rates of popular coins algorithms, Eth and Zcash are the two most popular, than Moreno. 

 

Right now as for 2 years of total sales of Pascal based cards and Polaris and Vega based cards, is 80 million total.  The hashrates once ya add up the main algos, maximum cards being used to mine is something like 20 million for gtx 1070 and rx 480/580 level of hash rates, that is if older cards aren't being used to mine, and they are gtx 970 and higher are still good at mining, and GCN 1.0 and up are all still good at mining. 

 

@ most mining has done was increase demand by 20% of the total market.  Factoring in the upswing this quarter for mining 30% for this quarter alone it could be.  Even then though 30% increase doesn't not take the supply of graphics cards down to what it is now, There must be other factors involved.

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, leadeater said:

Well I can confirm some of our departments are using gaming GPUs in their server clusters to do research.

Looking at the market and trends in research/schools (university I visited last year had rows and rows of GTX machines and they weren't used for gaming or mining) etc.  I think the 10% figure is very  conservative.

[Razor01]

double post please delete.

[Razor01]

5 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Well I can confirm some of our departments are using gaming GPUs in their server clusters to do research.

TV station here we are using desktop GPU's now for many tasks, stuff we weren't doing before.  Things that were quadro only, like modelling, and few other things.

[leadeater]

5 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Looking at the market and trends in research/schools (university I visited last year had rows and rows of GTX machines and they weren't used for gaming or mining) etc.  I think the 10% figure is very  conservative.

Weird, it's like highly educated people actually understand what they are doing and their needs and will buy the best price products that meet those requirements i.e GTX and not Quadro (if they don't need Quadro features).

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, leadeater said:

Weird, it's like highly educated people actually understand what they are doing and their needs and will buy the best price products that meet those requirements i.e GTX and not Quadro (if they don't need Quadro features).

 

Just like educated gamer's are not going to waste money on a titan?  absolutely.

[Razor01]

Just now, leadeater said:

Weird, it's like highly educated people actually understand what they are doing and their needs and will buy the best price products that meet those requirements i.e GTX and not Quadro (if they don't need Quadro features).

most companies don't buy quadros they lease them.  At least the smaller companies in the past I worked for did.  Turn around times for those products are the life span of that generation, so its a better option.  Now for rendering farms and things like that (data centers), they will purchase quadros or desktop cards for them as you stated because they are being used 24/7 the cost is covered by the usage.

[leadeater]

36 minutes ago, Razor01 said:

most companies don't buy quadros they lease them.  At least the smaller companies in the past I worked for did.  Turn around times for those products are the life span of that generation, so its a better option.  Now for rendering farms and things like that (data centers), they will purchase quadros or desktop cards for them as you stated because they are being used 24/7 the cost is covered by the usage.

We have Quadro cards for things that require it like our VDI cluster, VMware Horizon requires and will only work with certified cards with certified drivers etc (ours are M6000 24GB from memory).

[Razor01]

Ah yes, virtualized clusters must need certification for all their hardware, pretty strict requirements from what I understand.

[SpaceGhostC2C]

3 hours ago, Blademaster91 said:

It's hard to be picky about an R9 280 with crazy GPU prices,but "you don't need a GPU" is what every miner says lol. It's not difficult to avoid buying Apple & Samsung directly, both are partially to blame for the ram shortage. I also can't complain about a $200 amazon prime phone, though as this is a tech forum I guess some have to load facebook 1.5secs faster.

I don't plan to install facebook in my  $70 Chinaphone. The point is that we aren't discussing needs here either way.

I don't see how companies "are to blame" by using resources to build a product and paying for it like everyone else. It makes as much sense to say that Samsung is "guilty" of expensive GPUs as it is to say that Nvidia is "guilty" of expensive smartphones...

[Donut417]

3 hours ago, bimmerman said:

don't buy anything for the next few months

Few months. This has been going on for a year. I dont see this being solved any time soon. The fact is, when the new cards come out, the same shit will happen. This shortage could go on for years. Some of us dont want to wait that long. 

[Blademaster91]

39 minutes ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

I don't plan to install facebook in my  $70 Chinaphone. The point is that we aren't discussing needs here either way.

I don't see how companies "are to blame" by using resources to build a product and paying for it like everyone else. It makes as much sense to say that Samsung is "guilty" of expensive GPUs as it is to say that Nvidia is "guilty" of expensive smartphones...

I was just saying a phone is a phone anymore,sorry to got off topic.

Samsung is as much to blame as the miners are for causing supply shortage,also guilty of price fixing without any effort in ramping up chip production until just recently.

9 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

Few months. This has been going on for a year. I dont see this being solved any time soon. The fact is, when the new cards come out, the same shit will happen. This shortage could go on for years. Some of us dont want to wait that long. 

If you have a gtx 980/980Ti or a 10 series card I don't see any point in upgrading if you're fine with 1080p or 1440p because there aren't many games coming out for PC any time soon that aren't console ports.

[bimmerman]

6 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

Few months. This has been going on for a year. I dont see this being solved any time soon. The fact is, when the new cards come out, the same shit will happen. This shortage could go on for years. Some of us dont want to wait that long. 

There aren't any other options. Wait for prices to change, hopefully for the better, or buy now and pay more.

 

I'm not going to build another computer if this pricing keeps up though. I only use my desktop to game, and if true midrange GPUs (i.e., 1060s, 580s) continue to be in the $400-$500 bracket, then I'm out. Those prices for that performance is not worth it to me.