Are consoles actually as bad as most PC enthusiasts say?

[Misanthrope]

6 minutes ago, App4that said:

Mafia 3, Dues Ex MD, WatchDogs 2, Dishonored 2. All victims of developers having to neuter the game because of console. 

You could basically point at Ubisoft and their digging operation full of "gotcha!" E3 bullshit trailers to the list.

 

Even the Witcher 3 suffered a significant quality downgrade because of the consoles.

[Prysin]

5 hours ago, luegnicl said:

Most PC enthusiast I know say: Consoles are crap, consoles are cheap etc. How much of what PC enthusiasts say about consoles is actually true?

it's decent value for money. But that is where it stops and stops hard. No you will not get a PC with equal hardware at equal price point (PS4 Pro 399$). People in tech forums often compare ONLY the hardware, and forget that they need a legit OS and peripherals to match the console package. And the moment you add KB+M and a legit OS, PC aint cheaper or even in the ballpark of consoles.

[SteveGrabowski0]

8 minutes ago, App4that said:

Mafia 3, Dues Ex MD, WatchDogs 2, Dishonored 2. All victims of developers having to neuter the game because of console. 

Mafia 3 being a piece of shit isn't because of consoles. That's just a bad game. Might as well blame the Playstation for No Man's Sky while you're at it.

[SteveGrabowski0]

7 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

You could basically point at Ubisoft and their digging operation full of "gotcha!" E3 bullshit trailers to the list.

 

Even the Witcher 3 suffered a significant quality downgrade because of the consoles.

Witcher 3 pushed my 970 to its limits and I still had to turn settings down at 1080p, and that was when the 970 was the second best non Titan gpu on the market. I would have loved to have seen an E3 level Witcher 3, but what minuscule percentage of the market was going to buy SLI 970 or better to actually run that?

[Dabombinable]

3 minutes ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

Witcher 3 pushed my 970 to its limits and I still had to turn settings down at 1080p, and that was when the 970 was the second best non Titan gpu on the market. I would have loved to have seen an E3 level Witcher 3, but what minuscule percentage of the market was going to buy SLI 970 or better to actually run that?

The graphics got nerfed-look at the original trailer compared to the same areas in TW3 now at max settings.

[Misanthrope]

1 minute ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

Witcher 3 pushed my 970 to its limits and I still had to turn settings down at 1080p, and that was when the 970 was the second best non Titan gpu on the market. I would have loved to have seen an E3 level Witcher 3, but what minuscule percentage of the market was going to buy SLI 970 or better to actually run that?

Re: Crysis back when it came out. Hardware capable of maxing it was basically theoretical. As long as we have sliders and settings to tame it to playability, being "too much" for hardware is not an excuse not to push things.

 

I'm not saying this is necessary for all games I can concede some devs might aim for realistic goals but for fairly promoted displays of tech (The Witcher 3 was basically the face (and downfall) of Hairworks) they could have opened the gates.

 

Also it's a massive fucking game we're still playing today so when you have a game with significant longevity, aiming for non-existing hardware is not actually a terrible idea as long as you can tame it down.

 

[Prysin]

2 minutes ago, Dabombinable said:

The graphics got nerfed-look at the original trailer compared to the same areas in TW3 now at max settings.

you're such a nostalgia freak it is a wonder you ever got over being born.

[Simurgh]

5 hours ago, Sauron said:

And you ask this to a community of pc enthusiasts?

 

Jokes aside, I believe that consoles (not in general, specifically the ps4 and xbone) currently don't offer a compelling value as a personal game system. They are less powerful than a similarly priced pc and the value is even lower when you consider the arbitrary internet fee and game licensing prices. Many of the classic console advantages are not present, so as far as I'm concerned they aren't worth my money.

 

That doesn't mean they have NO value or that they CAN'T offer a decent experience, I simply think a custom pc is a better choice.

I just don't think that's true anymore, you can get a NEW PS4 or Xbox One for $200-250 right now and surprisingly boxed console games are getting cheaper. I bought Bloodborne, a triple A game from 1 year ago for $11 new and sealed... The worst thing is most definitely the payed internet, but IMO when building a PC it's pretty much the same as paying for the OS.  

[Prysin]

7 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

As long as we have sliders and settings to tame it to playability,

HERESY!

There is only ONE way to play a game. At MAX!

[Misanthrope]

2 minutes ago, Prysin said:

HERESY!

There is only ONE way to play a game. At MAX!

Don't you fucking talk to me about heresy in comic sans mr.

[Prysin]

3 minutes ago, Simurgh said:

I just don't think that's true anymore, you can get a NEW PS4 or Xbox One for $200-250 right now and surprisingly boxed console games are getting cheaper. I bought Bloodborne, a triple A game from 1 year ago for $11 new and sealed... The worst thing is most definitely the payed internet, but IMO when building a PC it's pretty much the same as paying for the OS.  

and in the case of PS4, the paid online service gives you 3-5 free games each month + special discounts on various games and downloadable content. In addition to more things.

[Prysin]

1 minute ago, Misanthrope said:

Don't you fucking talk to me about heresy in comic sans mr.

Don't you fucking mentioned moving that slider down from ma, mr.

[Misanthrope]

1 minute ago, Prysin said:

Don't you fucking mentioned moving that slider mr.

Ok we can both come to our senses: I'll get dual Titan X pascals and you delete comic sans from your fonts folder.

 

Agreed?

[App4that]

20 minutes ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

Mafia 3 being a piece of shit isn't because of consoles. That's just a bad game. Might as well blame the Playstation for No Man's Sky while you're at it.

Actually, YES! Sony paid Hello Games to not publish on the Xbox One, then push Hello Games to hype the game and keep a launch date. Had Hello Games told Sony to fuck off, the game would be a new release and the hype would have been far less. 

[Dabombinable]

7 minutes ago, Prysin said:

you're such a nostalgia freak it is a wonder you ever got over being born.

I won't get over false advertising. Just like I won't get over EVGA calling their 512MB Geforce 6200 Turbocache a 6200 without reference at all to Turbocache.

[Bleedingyamato]

8 minutes ago, Kloaked said:

Lol I was just wondering since you said you didn't notice many FPS issues on consoles. I wanted to see if you've actually played on a machine capable of higher fps and whatnot so that I can take what you said with more seriousness.

Ah.

 

Yeah I play on consoles and I've gotten back into PC since last spring when I got that desktop and upgraded it to include some better hardware like the SSDs and went from a 970 to the 1070.  

 

Most games I've played I can get high framerates though there are exceptions like Rise of the Tomb Raider where I get 60 or a bit less with every setting maxed. 

 

Though with Rise I'm not entirely sure what average fps I'd get since the benchmark in game shows this but in game near the start I'm pretty sure it's at least 60.   

Spoiler

Though depending what I'd actually see farther into the game I might slightly lower a few things to get at least 60fps.  

 

2 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

I think at some point Google retracted their statement, however, it was found that it had a serious security hole in that inadvertently exposed Far Cry 3: Blood Dragon was available on PC before any announcement or something was made. So Ubisoft had to release it.

 

Either way, UPlay is a steaming pile of crap.

I only have UPlay because last year I was given a code for Splinter Cell Blacklist that was for UPlay.

 

Is it security flaws or other things too that you don't like about it?

 

Sorry.  I'm not trying to annoy you by asking.  I'm just curious about it.   

 

 

[Bleedingyamato]

1 hour ago, App4that said:

I was there. But people forget where gaming comes from because of marketing. 

I may not be aware of the full history of gaming but has he heard of things like Pong?  ?

[Dabombinable]

1 minute ago, Bleedingyamato said:

I may not be aware of the full history of gaming but has he heard of things like Pong?  ?

That was the first widely successful game.

[Mira Yurizaki]

6 minutes ago, Bleedingyamato said:

I only have UPlay because last year I was given a code for Splinter Cell Blacklist that was for UPlay.

Is it security flaws or other things too that you don't like about it?

Sorry.  I'm not trying to annoy you by asking.  I'm just curious about it.  

The straw that broke the camel's back was around 2013, because of a laundry list of things Ubisoft did that were just utterly stupid

• Blacklist's multiplayer would not work
• UPlay's security issues
• The fact that game data was saved to UPlay's install directory (C:\Program Files (x86)\Ubisoft\UPlay) rather than the user folder.
• The fact that Ubisoft is pervasive in most digital distribution hubs, yet still requires their own damn software to run their games. As comment on TV Tropes put it best, at least EA doesn't sell their games on other services, and then suddenly forces you to use Origin to play them.
• When I popped in Assassin's Creed Black Flag for PS4, it actually required me to install UPlay on the console and register via a code to play the game.

[App4that]

4 minutes ago, Dabombinable said:

That was the first widely successful game.

Yeah we had a Lunar Lander cabinet at the local hardware store back in the late 70's. 

[Misanthrope]

3 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

The straw that broke the camel's back was around 2013, because of a laundry list of things Ubisoft did that were just utterly stupid

• Blacklist's multiplayer would not work
• UPlay's security issues
• The fact that game data was saved to UPlay's install directory (C:\Program Files (x86)\Ubisoft\UPlay) rather than the user folder.
• The fact that Ubisoft is pervasive in most digital distribution hubs, yet still requires their own damn software to run their games. As comment on TV Tropes put it best, at least EA doesn't sell their games on other services, and then suddenly forces you to use Origin to play them.
• When I popped in Assassin's Creed Black Flag for PS4, it actually required me to install UPlay on the console and register via a code to play the game.

This list might as well be named "Why I've hessitate to pick up the Assassin's creed Humble Bundle out right now"

[Simurgh]

12 minutes ago, Prysin said:

and in the case of PS4, the paid online service gives you 3-5 free games each month + special discounts on various games and downloadable content. In addition to more things.

I'd still much rather have free internet and pay for PS+ but yeah I got some good games, like NBA 2k16 which I've put many hours into.

[App4that]

14 minutes ago, Prysin said:

and in the case of PS4, the paid online service gives you 3-5 free games each month + special discounts on various games and downloadable content. In addition to more things.

Doesn't matter. A paywall is a paywall and they should be burned to the ground before they spread. 

[Dabombinable]

6 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

The straw that broke the camel's back was around 2013, because of a laundry list of things Ubisoft did that were just utterly stupid

• Blacklist's multiplayer would not work
• UPlay's security issues
• The fact that game data was saved to UPlay's install directory (C:\Program Files (x86)\Ubisoft\UPlay) rather than the user folder.
• The fact that Ubisoft is pervasive in most digital distribution hubs, yet still requires their own damn software to run their games. As comment on TV Tropes put it best, at least EA doesn't sell their games on other services, and then suddenly forces you to use Origin to play them.
• When I popped in Assassin's Creed Black Flag for PS4, it actually required me to install UPlay on the console and register via a code to play the game.

And that is why I won't go above an Original Xbox. I can just pop a game in and play it, or if I want to I can simply install if for later due to the upgrade to a 250GB HDD (which competes with current HDD in performance-its only 10 years old).

 

Edit: BTW, almost 50 games installed on it at the moment and only 119GB of space is used.

[SteveGrabowski0]

32 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

Re: Crysis back when it came out. Hardware capable of maxing it was basically theoretical. As long as we have sliders and settings to tame it to playability, being "too much" for hardware is not an excuse not to push things.

 

I'm not saying this is necessary for all games I can concede some devs might aim for realistic goals but for fairly promoted displays of tech (The Witcher 3 was basically the face (and downfall) of Hairworks) they could have opened the gates.

 

Also it's a massive fucking game we're still playing today so when you have a game with significant longevity, aiming for non-existing hardware is not actually a terrible idea as long as you can tame it down.

 

Look at it from the developer's perspective. They're making most of their money the first 3 months or so. What's the point of allocating a lot of resources toward the tiny fraction of ultra high end gamers with a Titan X or dual 970/980/290/290x when it's not going to make them more money? Blaming the consoles for them not making a game the GTX 980 couldn't handle doesn't make much sense. And Crysis 1 was a terribly optimized game. Even now it runs pretty badly due to how cpu bound it is. If that was supposed to be a forward looking game they should have made it scale to four cores. Kentsfield was already on the market so quadcores weren't theoretical by any means when that game released.