Should we support AMD?

[don_svetlio]

Pretty sure the hybrid boosts a lot better then the classified might be the reason why. Id believe it. Most things on water boost ridiculously high. Also my vid wasnt from teksyndicate, I dont think.

Well - not a lot of people use water

Hybrid kinda needs that and it's a bigger hassel to set up.

[Pizzatime6]

Well - not a lot of people use water

Hybrid kinda needs that and it's a bigger hassel to set up.

Hybrid dosnt need water its what made it awesome like the r9 295x2 cooling. Also not really just put the rad as a exhaust fan like my fried or a top mounted rad. Really easy to set up. Tubes are long enough to install the rad first usually. If my friends experience was anything to go by.

[TheMastr13]

If they make a product that fits my budget and performs well, I will buy it. Plain and simple

[don_svetlio]

Hybrid dosnt need water its what made it awesome like the r9 295x2 cooling. Also not really just put the rad as a exhaust fan like my fried or a top mounted rad. Really easy to set up. Tubes are long enough to install the rad first usually. If my friends experience was anything to go by.

Hmm - I guess I haven't updated myself with the Hydro Copper.

I'd honestly go for a 980 or Fury - 970 is just to gimped and unpleasing at this point

And Fury makes it feel more premium

[Pizzatime6]

Hmm - I guess I haven't updated myself with the Hydro Copper.

I'd honestly go for a 980 or Fury - 970 is just to gimped and unpleasing at this point

And Fury makes it feel more premium

The hybrid uses a AIO like the Furry X, The hydro copper is also very good and can be better then the hybrid depending on your water cooling gear setup. Fury is just a cool name lol. 980  feels less premium because it doesnt have a fancy name. Only way Id buy a 980 is if it was the hybrid, but to be honest I never upgrade my gpu unless its a Titan. Just the way iam but I dont upgrade for like 3 years. More then enough to save money to have my wallet raped for my obsession with owning titans.

[don_svetlio]

The hybrid uses a AIO like the Furry X, The hydro copper is also very good and can be better then the hybrid depending on your water cooling gear setup. Fury is just a cool name lol. 980  feels less premium because it doesnt have a fancy name. Only way Id buy a 980 is if it was the hybrid, but to be honest I never upgrade my gpu unless its a Titan. Just the way iam but I dont upgrade for like 3 years. More then enough to save money to have my wallet raped for my obsession with owning titans.

If I had a Titan I wouldn't upgrade for 6 years . . .

[Pizzatime6]

If I had a Titan I wouldn't upgrade for 6 years . . .

Lol I upgrade when I cant max out games with a single titan anymore. Idc if I cant max it out in 2k but at least 1080p.

[don_svetlio]

Lol I upgrade when I cant max out games with a single titan anymore. Idc if I cant max it out in 2k but at least 1080p.

I could still max my stuff with a 6850, not counting Withcer 3

[App4that]

It's a top-end Sapphire card

You got one for the Vapor like this? That shit is tight.

[don_svetlio]

You got one for the Vapor like this? That shit is tight.

None as of yet.

[Burusutazu]

No, it is up to AMD to save themselves, if they cannot, how can we as consumers trust them to continue providing quality products?

[Edgar R. Zakarian]

I could still max my stuff with a 6850, not counting Withcer 3

How many years ago? lol

But yeah, it's a great Card!

[Edgar R. Zakarian]

Prysin, on 28 Sept 2015 - 7:54 PM, said:

As for reasons to "support AMD"

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtJ293d9_es

 

 

CONSOLES ARE POWERED BY AMD!!!

 

ASLONG AS THEY USE X86-64 APUS, WE WILL GET LESS SHITTY PORTS. BECAUSE THE CONSOLE APUs USES A MODDED VERSION OF DX12/Vulcan/Mantle...

 

DO YOU WANT TO GO BACK TO EVEN SHITTIER PORTS? I DONT!!!

WOW, I'm looking forward to those games!

[Dabombinable]

WOW, I'm looking forward to those games!

Lets hope like hell PC actually don't get a shit port again. No matter what @Prysin says, AAA publishers will continue releasing half baked buggy ports/shit as long as people pre-order. No matter what CPU architecture is used in consoles.

 

Edit: Also, non gameplay trailers.

[Prysin]

Lets hope like hell PC actually don't get a shit port again. No matter what @Prysin says, AAA publishers will continue releasing half baked buggy ports/shit as long as people pre-order. No matter what CPU architecture is used in consoles.

Edit: Also, non gameplay trailers.

AAA publishers make shitty ports, primarily because until now, consoles has used separate APIs, havent even had keyboard and mouse support outside of their proprietary browser software, and by and large in general, HAVENT EVEN BEEN BASED ON X86, LET ALONE X86-64

Pre-order is not the reason why ports are shit. They planned to make shit ports in the first place.

Pre order is part of the hype train and a way of "securing" that hyped players get the game, PRIOR to seeing reviews.

Because they know that once critics have at it, their sales ALWAYS drops. Because NEVER, not even once, do all the critics only say nice things. They usually nitpick on stuff and blow the nitpicky stuff out of proportion, as if it was gamebreaking that character X had a mustace in the original trailer and not ingame....

[Dabombinable]

AAA publishers make shitty ports, primarily because until now, consoles has used separate APIs, havent even had keyboard and mouse support outside of their proprietary browser software, and by and large in general, HAVENT EVEN BEEN BASED ON X86, LET ALONE X86-64

Xbox Original, x86 console with a custom Pentium III/Celeron and a custom Nvidia dGPU-with the DirectX API (hence the name Xbox from the originally planned name DirectX box), the 360 and Xbone also use the DirectX API. And PowerPC based CPU that are far more powerful than x86 of the time-and even some of the newest x86 CPU- in the intermediate Xbox 360 and PS4. x86/AMD64 is actually holding consoles and PC back.

[Prysin]

Xbox Original, x86 console with a custom Pentium III/Celeron and a custom Nvidia dGPU-with the DirectX API (hence the name Xbox from the originally planned name DirectX box), the 360 and Xbone also use the DirectX API. And PowerPC based CPU that are far more powerful than x86 of the time-and even some of the newest x86 CPU- in the intermediate Xbox 360 and PS4. x86/AMD64 is actually holding consoles and PC back.

to some degree, yes X86/X86-64 is holding PCs back, but one thing that is holding powerPC back is intercompatibility with PC.

Which is why we have gotten shitty ports in the first place.

And another issue was the point you brought up "custom Nvidia GPU". Which means, it is not a semi custom, tweaked GPU. It is its own SoC GPU that has its own proprietary drivers used with a custom API that is tailored to the consoles hardware. PC is ALOT more "open", so trying to recode from one API that is locked tighter then a straight mans rear end into something that is free for all is bound to go wrong at some point.

As for the APU currently used in the consoles... given its power usage, it is far from holding stuff back... Sure, IPC wise it could be better (slighly improved, low clocked Phenom II), but performance per watt wise, it is pretty nippy.

the iGPU is pretty solid too, and once devs learn how to use the DX12 esque API that consoles use (yes, it is still a custom version API, but this one is closer to PC APIs then before) then we should see a huge benefit from porting, rather then it being shit.

Unfortunatly, due to the consoles having WASTLY different performance output (the XBONE being nearly 30% weaker then the PS4 in raw GPU and CPU horsepower) does make it hard to devs to make a good game in the first place.

Would it be fair to sell XBONE games as 30FPS only and PC/PS4 as 60FPS???

That would infuriate MS, as their sales would dive faster then a WWII Kamikaze pilot.

[Dabombinable]

to some degree, yes X86/X86-64 is holding PCs back, but one thing that is holding powerPC back is intercompatibility with PC.

Which is why we have gotten shitty ports in the first place.

And another issue was the point you brought up "custom Nvidia GPU". Which means, it is not a semi custom, tweaked GPU. It is its own SoC GPU that has its own proprietary drivers used with a custom API that is tailored to the consoles hardware. PC is ALOT more "open", so trying to recode from one API that is locked tighter then a straight mans rear end into something that is free for all is bound to go wrong at some point.

As for the APU currently used in the consoles... given its power usage, it is far from holding stuff back... Sure, IPC wise it could be better (slighly improved, low clocked Phenom II), but performance per watt wise, it is pretty nippy.

the iGPU is pretty solid too, and once devs learn how to use the DX12 esque API that consoles use (yes, it is still a custom version API, but this one is closer to PC APIs then before) then we should see a huge benefit from porting, rather then it being shit.

Unfortunatly, due to the consoles having WASTLY different performance output (the XBONE being nearly 30% weaker then the PS4 in raw GPU and CPU horsepower) does make it hard to devs to make a good game in the first place.

Would it be fair to sell XBONE games as 30FPS only and PC/PS4 as 60FPS???

That would infuriate MS, as their sales would dive faster then a WWII Kamikaze pilot.

Look, it was custom in the sense that Nvidia designed it to be cheap while having decent performance. It still uses the DirectX API. And as for performance, a Phenom II would actually be better inside a console as they have a far higher IPC, a low TDP for 45nm mobile CPU. And the iGPU is still lacking in performance when compared to PC of the same price-which you never saw with previous Xbox and Playstations. And the Xbone is in 1 word, shit.

[Firet2000]

But if AMD can't sell enough products to cover the cost of research and Development (which is A LOT). They will eventually go Down with the ship.

What happens then?

In this case, Intel will prep up their game hahhhh.

[Prysin]

Look, it was custom in the sense that Nvidia designed it to be cheap while having decent performance. It still uses the DirectX API. And as for performance, a Phenom II would actually be better inside a console as they have a far higher IPC, a low TDP for 45nm mobile CPU. And the iGPU is still lacking in performance when compared to PC of the same price-which you never saw with previous Xbox and Playstations. And the Xbone is in 1 word, shit.

i know the fagbox is shit, they've always been a bit shit compared to PS, which is a "hardware orgy" every time a new one comes out.

As for performance. Due to porting, the early PS4 titles didnt use the mantle/DX12 esque API of today, so i bet the iGPU performance of the PS4 was simply suffering from DX11 like CPU overhead...

As for the CPU inside the PS4/fagbox, it is essentially 2x Athlon 5150 at stock speed for the PS4, and with a 150MHz frequency bump for the fagbox...

you can read more about that APU here

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaguar_(microarchitecture)

Anyway... if the PS4 had had a better cooler, they could have ramped it up a bit. Honestly, i feel like we got slightly screwd with this generations console improvements over the previous one. If sony had opted for a better cooler (something like the corsair bulldogs proprietary cooler?) we may hae seen a 60FPS 1080p machine come true. That being said, at this point it is up to game devs to optimize the hardware... we can with certainty say that the slightly cut down 270/270X (essentially, the PS4s APU has marginally stronger iGPU then the 750Ti, in theory) can power 1080p at 60FPS.... However, i feel like there is soemthign else going on when it comes to consoles and FPS.....

[jackm1120]

Are you judging the GPU based off the reference? Because in the mid to mid/high price point AMD owns it. Low end depends on the model and region. High end is all Nvidia

I was just saying my honest opinion of their high end card.  But I really think Nvidia has been getting a better grasp on the mid range market. The 970 @ 320$ is really quite the bargain for a mid range card. I really believe in esthetics and customization.  I do not like AMDs approach with the FuryX, Nor do I appreciate the fact that they have been rebranding their mid range cards for a while now.  I think its stuck in peoples heads that their getting a "better deal" with mid range cards and their CPUs, but it just seems like its a shorter lifespan of a system when buying from the big guys for a little extra money yields a much more sustainable, and longer term solution.

[Dabombinable]

i know the fagbox is shit, they've always been a bit shit compared to PS, which is a "hardware orgy" every time a new one comes out.

As for performance. Due to porting, the early PS4 titles didnt use the mantle/DX12 esque API of today, so i bet the iGPU performance of the PS4 was simply suffering from DX11 like CPU overhead...

As for the CPU inside the PS4/fagbox, it is essentially 2x Athlon 5150 at stock speed for the PS4, and with a 150MHz frequency bump for the fagbox...

you can read more about that APU here

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaguar_(microarchitecture)

Anyway... if the PS4 had had a better cooler, they could have ramped it up a bit. Honestly, i feel like we got slightly screwd with this generations console improvements over the previous one. If sony had opted for a better cooler (something like the corsair bulldogs proprietary cooler?) we may hae seen a 60FPS 1080p machine come true. That being said, at this point it is up to game devs to optimize the hardware... we can with certainty say that the slightly cut down 270/270X (essentially, the PS4s APU has marginally stronger iGPU then the 750Ti, in theory) can power 1080p at 60FPS.... However, i feel like there is soemthign else going on when it comes to consoles and FPS.....

Low end, cheap and old APU are at their limits due to limited resources-the dGPU are already struggling enough as it is so some load being taken off the CPU will only make a small difference, if any at all.

[jackm1120]

Low end, cheap and old APU are at their limits due to limited resources-the dGPU are already struggling enough as it is so some load being taken off the CPU will only make a small difference, if any at all.

You know, dispite AMDs low hardware in the machines,  They lose money on every console that goes off the shelves.  It was an effort to get their brand more exposure....because people using a high end DVD player for gaming really pay attention to their hardware.

 

Look here

http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/150892-nvidia-gave-amd-ps4-because-console-margins-are-terrible

[Prysin]

You know, dispite AMDs low hardware in the machines,  They lose money on every console that goes off the shelves.  It was an effort to get their brand more exposure....because people using a high end DVD player for gaming really pay attention to their hardware.

AMD doesny lose money, SONY/Microsoft does...

AMD makes a nice PROFIT, on consoles, it is actually one of the few things that are NOT producing red numbers atm...

[jackm1120]

AMD doesny lose money, SONY/Microsoft does...

AMD makes a nice PROFIT, on consoles, it is actually one of the few things that are NOT producing red numbers atm...

No, the way with consoles is the hardware goes to the lowest bidder, in this case it was AMD. Think about it, it was a desperate play for AMD in their time on ongoing crisis.