illegal to copy what you've bought.... again..... in the uk

[Trik'Stari]

Did no one bother to point out "this will be impossible to enforce in every single way imaginable"?

 

Old farts who don't understand how the digital world works.

They try to apply obsolete rules to a different beast that is the Internet and digital goods.

 

They understand it, they just don't like it because it means their little house of cards will eventually come toppling down. This isn't incompetence, this is malice.

 

What the fuck are you talking about dude. This makes literally no sense, utter gibberish.

 

He's talking about the fact that your government can do whatever the hell it wants, and your people can do nothing to stop them. They have no fear of you, they don't have any reason to. The people of the UK gave up that power in the name of "safety" and being provided for by government, which in the end is always an abusive parent.

[Swndlr]

They have no intention of enforcing it. It was illegal previously and nobody gave a fuck. It's actually pretty funny, "Basca, the Musicians' Union, and industry representatives UK Music" were trying to get a kickback from the fact copying physical media was made legal, but instead of that happening, it's just been made illegal again. No kickback for them, and literally nothing changes with regards to people's behaviour.

UK making the most logical legal choice of 2k15

lol

[Arty]

You can Not Stop The Internet.!

[othertomperson]

And to that, I say this:

 

I own a couple of Emerson, Lake and Palmer albums that have DVDs with the FLAC files on the disc. It was clear that Sony Music intended for someone to use those FLAC files, like putting them onto a portable music player, since they're not accessible through the DVD menus.

And as much as I love bands like Yes, ELP, Mike Oldfield......if I already bought their album once and still have it in some way, I will extend their life as far as I can stretch them. The only times it's been different are when I bought them on another physical format like vinyl, or if I wanted a digital version because it was cheap anyway.

 

Oh, and it's none of the High Court's business, nor is it of UK Music, what I do with my music if I'm listening to it for personal use.

I bought The Wall on CD for £20 already, and on vinyl for £22 because what vinyl collection is complete without it (which, incidentally, came with a code to an official website where I can download the MP3s), so as far as I'm concerned, it's the music industry that needs to adapt and not the consumers.

 

This is what happens, ladies and gentlemen, when you have idiot politicians who put their own gain in front of agenda so as to screw anyone who does not conform. The UK sucks......and if Scotland separates, I'm moving to them. Because they're actually vaguely competent. And it's a nice place.

 

Now if you'll excuse me, I'll go and listen to what is now mandated as an illegal copy of Close to the Edge...

 

The politicians in this case were actually the sensible ones -- they legalised this explicitly. It's the courts who are being idiots in this instance.

[Murdoch]

Yes it does. When your own society doesn't value and defend personal liberty, liberties are stripped away all too easily by agents and crafters of your laws. The U.S. is falling into the same trap.

 

Again, you're talking absolute bollocks mate. This is a law that was passed to make copying CDs for personal use legal, it was irrelevant legislation for two reasons, nobody paid attention when it was illegal and copied CDs anyway, and secondly it was passed after people stopped using CDs. Not to mention it was a judge that overturned government legislation, so if you are trying to make a point about Government attacks on personal liberties... You are choosing the wrong example. In fact you couldn't pick a worse example.

[patrickjp93]

Again, you're talking absolute bollocks mate. This is a law that was passed to make copying CDs for personal use legal, it was irrelevant legislation for two reasons, nobody paid attention when it was illegal and copied CDs anyway, and secondly it was passed after people stopped using CDs. Not to mention it was a judge that overturned government legislation, so if you are trying to make a point about Government attacks on personal liberties... You are choosing the wrong example. In fact you couldn't pick a worse example.

No, the premise is still there. The action to contradict the lunacy wouldn't be necessary without the lunacy in the first place. Is causality really so difficult?

[Murdoch]

No, the premise is still there. The action to contradict the lunacy wouldn't be necessary without the lunacy in the first place. Is causality really so difficult?

 

The premise isn't there at all. That was more a case of omission than anything else, I'm sorry but the concept of the iPod wasn't available to legislators back in 1988. Is that really so difficult to understand?

[patrickjp93]

The premise isn't there at all. That was more a case of omission than anything else, I'm sorry but the concept of the iPod wasn't available to legislators back in 1988. Is that really so difficult to understand?

That's not the point. The point is governments love control and money, and that idiotic law arose because the Brits let them have it all too easily.

[79 Potatoes]

Just gonna say, I don't get all those anti piracy BS things, it doesn't work, at least here it increases it. I see a lot more people buying (YES, BUYING) pirated CD/DVDs because no region lock and DRMs  :mellow:

[Raytsou]

So basically they are just killing off what little stores remain that sell blank media. Th won't actually affect anyone, since its been years since I bought a CD/DVD.

Also, does this mean that it's okay for ppl in UK to, say, go to another country or even a foreign embassy, rip the CD unto a USB, and come out with it? Or does it make all existing copies of ripped media illegal, as I'll get detained as soon as I enter the UK?

[Murdoch]

That's not the point. The point is governments love control and money, and that idiotic law arose because the Brits let them have it all too easily.

 

No, it is completely the point, the first time a law in the UK was passed with regards to making personal digital copies was in 2014. This was overthrown by a high court judge due to a challenge by lobbying groups for the music industry. Your example of "idiot laws" were the same copyright laws half the world followed, which worked fine before the internet became a thing. I mean if I wanted to be a dick about it, I'd say you should be more concerned about the US for spreading DMCA internationally, and ramming DRM down our throats.

 

The narrative you are trying to spin here is stupid, it doesn't work with this as an example. And it especially isn't linked to fucking "socialism". It's the same as anything else, entities trying to protect their own interests via lobbying. Using whatever channels they have available to them.

[patrickjp93]

No, it is completely the point, the first time a law in the UK was passed with regards to making personal digital copies was in 2014. This was overthrown by a high court judge due to a challenge by lobbying groups for the music industry. Your example of "idiot laws" were the same copyright laws half the world followed, which worked fine before the internet became a thing. I mean if I wanted to be a dick about it, I'd say you should be more concerned about the US for spreading DMCA internationally, and ramming DRM down our throats.

 

The narrative you are trying to spin here is stupid, it doesn't work with this as an example. And it especially isn't linked to fucking "socialism". It's the same as anything else, entities trying to protect their own interests via lobbying. Using whatever channels they have available to them.

If millions of people commit suicide together, does that make it a good idea? Which half of the world?

 

DMCA is perfectly fair and sets up just protections to media providers. You pay a license to watch TV. You don't get to distribute content for free or for profit. Software companies should be free to be able to protect themselves from having trade secrets stolen. It's perfectly fair. It might be annoying for pirates, but pirates are in the wrong in the first place.

 

And no, it's the thinking which gives rise to socialism, that individual liberty doesn't trump all but the most dire of circumstances. You trade liberty for security and you end up with neither. You give an inch to a corrupt government, it takes ten miles.

[Murdoch]

If millions of people commit suicide together, does that make it a good idea? Which half of the world?

 

DMCA is perfectly fair and sets up just protections to media providers. You pay a license to watch TV. You don't get to distribute content for free or for profit. Software companies should be free to be able to protect themselves from having trade secrets stolen. It's perfectly fair. It might be annoying for pirates, but pirates are in the wrong in the first place.

 

And no, it's the thinking which gives rise to socialism, that individual liberty doesn't trump all but the most dire of circumstances. You trade liberty for security and you end up with neither. You give an inch to a corrupt government, it takes ten miles.

 

So you support DMCA, wich makes it illegal for anybody to tamper with DRM protections on personal media such as DVDs, in essence making them illegal to copy. But you think the UK is trading it's "individual liberties" because our law that was passed that made non DRM protected media legal to "format shift" was overturned by the high court.

 

Fucking hell man, Your ideologies are skewed right here. Seems like you suffer from the same thing as every other right-winger does, you have no clue when your personal liberties are being attacked, and just ya know try to blame the socialists.

[michaelk12]

If you copied it for your personal use, yes that's illegal, but I can pretty much guarantee they won't bother to prosecute you for it unless you're distributing it to others. Besides, how will they catch you if it's only going to stay in your house/car?

[Sintezza]

i hope they have enough jails in GB, cause wenn they get law going.

They can arrest allmost whole GB?

[patrickjp93]

So you support DMCA, wich makes it illegal for anybody to tamper with DRM protections on personal media such as DVDs, in essence making them illegal to copy. But you think the UK is trading it's "individual liberties" because our law that was passed that made non DRM protected media legal to "format shift" was overturned by the high court.

 

Fucking hell man, Your ideologies are skewed right here. Seems like you suffer from the same thing as every other right-winger does, you have no clue when your personal liberties are being attacked, and just ya know try to blame the socialists.

DMCA DRM doesn't actually make it impossible to copy media. It limits the number of copies you can make. The kind which actually prevents you from making a copy only exists on rentable media. Now, even if it did do what you propose, I would oppose it, because I never signed a licensing contract, and I bought a physical item. That would be an infringement upon my freedom to do as I wish with my property, though, do riddle me this: if you break your wrench (say it rusts out and cracks at the head), are you able to simply get another for free? No. If you break or scratch up your CD, are you really entitled to a free one? In a way, DMCA only enforces that digital and physical are treated the same way. Even with that said, I've never found DRM that actually keeps me from making a copy. I've only found DRM that limits the number of copies I can make, and frankly that's fair.

 

And I'm neither right wing nor clueless. You've confused the facts. You've already lost.

[Murdoch]

DMCA DRM doesn't actually make it impossible to copy. It limits the number of copies you can make. The kind which actually prevents you from making a copy only exists on rentable media.

 

And I'm neither right wing nor clueless. You've confused the facts. You've already lost.

 

Did you read what I wrote? I said the DMCA legislation makes it an offence to tamper with (or circumvent) DRM. Your point about the "number of copies" really makes no sense with regards to my example (I'm not sure if you understand, but there are many different types of DRM), so I'll spell out what I'm saying. It is not possible to make a digital copy of a (commercially available) Blu-Ray or DVD without circumventing copy protection, which is an offence under DMCA legislation.   

 

Also, if I presumed you were a "right winger" it was meant as a "you sound like a soundbite from Fox news". You hear the words "UK" and "Law" and automatically blame "socialism". In truth the UK has elected the most right wing Government in decades, it follows an almost entirely Neoliberal agenda, and any legislation that is passed has literally nothing, I mean nothing to do with "socialism".

[patrickjp93]

Did you read what I wrote? I said the DMCA legislation makes it an offence to tamper with (or circumvent) DRM. Your point about the "number of copies" really makes no sense with regards to my example (I'm not sure if you understand, but there are many different types of DRM), so I'll spell out what I'm saying. It is not possible to make a digital copy of a (commercially available) Blu-Ray or DVD without circumventing copy protection, which is an offence under DMCA legislation.   

 

Also, if I presumed you were a "right winger" it was meant as a "you sound like a soundbite from Fox news". You hear the words "UK" and "Law" and automatically blame "socialism". In truth the UK has elected the most right wing Government in decades, it follows an almost entirely Neoliberal agenda, and any legislation that is passed has literally nothing, I mean nothing to do with "socialism".

Um, no it's not. I have digital rips of lots of Blu-Rays, and I didn't do anything special to get them. Just an off-the-shelf media suite I can't install on my linux system. I'm limited to making 5 copies however.

 

The UK right wing is left of 95% of the U.S. Democrats. It's hardly right wing. And the UK is already under a system of socialism, regardless of what the current party is doing. Until such a system is dismantled, I maintain that position.

[Murdoch]

Um, no it's not. I have digital rips of lots of Blu-Rays, and I didn't do anything special to get them. Just an off-the-shelf media suite I can't install on my linux system. I'm limited to making 5 copies however.

 

The UK right wing is left of 95% of the U.S. Democrats. It's hardly right wing. And the UK is already under a system of socialism, regardless of what the current party is doing. Until such a system is dismantled, I maintain that position.

 

Yeah you did do something special, you used software that was breaking the law. Or there's some sort of licensing deal going on with regards to circumventing the DRM, either way, you are paying twice for your legally owned physical media, or you're breaking the law. These Neoliberals, coming after our money, via our civil liberties.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-circumvention

 

Edit: I'm a little disappointed you haven't replied with regards to the DRM circumvention issue, sure it's easily done, but the legality of it is an entirely different matter.

 

Also, with regards to your UK is already "socialist", how exactly do you think that relates to our lost "civil liberties"? Do you honestly think that socialism plays any part in that? The biggest UK civil liberties issue in recent years, widespread surveillance done behind the backs of the general population in the name of "national security", in cahoots with the US.

[TheMcSame]

The decision does not include joke or parody versions of hit songs.

 

Don't worry guys, we can still rip Weird Al's songs! 

[Murdoch]

He's talking about the fact that your government can do whatever the hell it wants, and your people can do nothing to stop them. They have no fear of you, they don't have any reason to. The people of the UK gave up that power in the name of "safety" and being provided for by government, which in the end is always an abusive parent.

 

I think I've made it pretty clear how this ruling, and indeed the former legislation has nothing to do with a "socialist agenda", only somebody from the US could look at the Conservative Government and think "socialism". In fact, their most recent plan is to diminish the power of the Unions, both in terms of their ability to strike and partake in direct action, and their ability to fund the Labour Party (their only realistic opposition). I don't really understand the line of thinking that suggests a socialist legacy which has retained free healthcare & free education, but has embraced Neoliberalism in most other respects somehow now works to diminish civil liberties. The cause of our weakened civil liberties is not socialism, in fact it is the polar opposite.

 

But I largely agree with the general point of how apathetic, and easily manipulated the UK population is, neither of the main two parties over the last two decades have stood up for civil liberties, and most people turn a blind eye to revelations like "mass surveillance". I just completely disagree about where the real threat comes from.

[rentaspoon]

FFS UK why do they do this to us?

Because Cameron?

[jaggysnake57]

do you know how difficult this will be to police?  seriously, is it a slow news day because there are much bigger issues out there....snoopers charter anyone

[Trik'Stari]

I think I've made it pretty clear how this ruling, and indeed the former legislation has nothing to do with a "socialist agenda", only somebody from the US could look at the Conservative Government and think "socialism". In fact, their most recent plan is to diminish the power of the Unions, both in terms of their ability to strike and partake in direct action, and their ability to fund the Labour Party (their only realistic opposition). I don't really understand the line of thinking that suggests a socialist legacy which has retained free healthcare & free education, but has embraced Neoliberalism in most other respects somehow now works to diminish civil liberties. The cause of our weakened civil liberties is not socialism, in fact it is the polar opposite.

 

But I largely agree with the general point of how apathetic, and easily manipulated the UK population is, neither of the main two parties over the last two decades have stood up for civil liberties, and most people turn a blind eye to revelations like "mass surveillance". I just completely disagree about where the real threat comes from.

In the case of conservatives it's fascism, not like it makes a difference because they both end up in the exact same place. A totalitarian regime that does whatever the hell it wants, the difference is their "justification". Both eventually result in a loss of civil liberties.

[deviant88]

Like anyone actually give a flying fuck about any antipiracy?