Two Year Sentence For 3D Print a Gun.

[IdortMasterRace]

Its the same idea with coding. If you did not know, there are people USA, that think that code should not be taught in schools, as "it gives kids the tools necessary to become hackers." (I kid you not, someone I talked to said that, and she was not alone in her opinion, other also chimed in saying similar things.)

 

Uh, what is wrong with learning to code to learn hacking?

[HalGameGuru]

You have a source? I don't doubt you (the police in any country have EVERY reason to lie and fudge statistics in their favor), but a source is always hard to argue with.

 

Just the big recent one, the articles over the years have been speaking about this going on for a while.

 

"Lord Stevens admits police have been 'fiddling' crime figures for years"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/10557155/Lord-Stevens-admits-police-have-been-fiddling-crime-figures-for-years.html

[Toddwjp]

The US murder rate is four times higher than UK, (yeah turns out that when gun crime happens some one dies, when knife crime happens much higher chance of them living)

The definition of violent crime isn't even the same in both countries,  "violent crime", in both America and Britain does not include homicide. 

the blog you posted assumes correlation is causation and is the demonstration of cherry picking statistics

 

In England and Wales, where guns are far harder to come by, criminals didn't simply go out and equip themselves with other tools and commit just as many murders; there were 32,714 offences involving a knife or other sharp instrument (whether used or just threatened), but they led to only 214 homicides, a rate of 1 homicide per 150 incidents. 

 

That nearly four-times-higher rate of fatality when the criminal uses a gun rather than a knife closely matches the overall difference in homicide rates between America and England.

 

 

 

info taken from this article which lists its sources. read it, if you disagree with it that's fine but the gun/uk violent crime argument is dead.

 

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2013/09/gun-control

[IdortMasterRace]

THIS  argument is completely wrong,  and i wish you pro gun morons would stop using the worst possible arguments there are and instead use the few reasonable sensible ones there are.

 

"Y-YOU'RE WRONG, LET ME INSULT YOU INSTEAD OF MAKING A COUNTER ARGUMENT!"

 

Get out. Come back when you learn to have a debate.

[Imabigmac]

So AMD VS Nvidia or Intel threads get locked shortly after the creation but topics that turn in Gun law debates/moral debates are allowed to carry on endlessly? Changing it up I guess... 

[Toddwjp]

"Y-YOU'RE WRONG, LET ME INSULT YOU INSTEAD OF MAKING A COUNTER ARGUMENT!"

 

Get out. Come back when you learn to have a debate.

 

look above your post

[cae]

Stop HalGameGuru, you're giving me a freedom boner.

[HalGameGuru]

Stop HalGameGuru, you're giving me a freedom boner.

 

That's the best kind. If it last more than 4 hours consult your nearest Eagle.

[Trik'Stari]

 

The US murder rate is four times higher than UK, (yeah turns out that when gun crime happens some one dies, when knife crime happens much higher chance of them living)

The definition of violent crime isn't even the same in both countries,  "violent crime", in both America and Britain does not include homicide. 

the blog you posted assumes correlation is causation and is the demonstration of cherry picking statistics

 

but im done arguing with you guys, your arguments are based on heavily biased statistics. and word play

 

Nevermind the fact that our population is 6 times that of yours. Or the fact that your an Island and thus have MUCH better control over immigration than we do (not to mention your government to my knowledge isn't encouraging illegal immigration in the hopes that those immigrants will vote for their party)

 

Nevermind all that, we're just morons, able to look at facts and figures and see through socialist, statist, propagandist lies.

 

Edit: I bring up immigration because:

a. You can better control the illegal arms trade because you have a MUCH smaller border to patrol

b. We have a problem with gangs and criminals coming here illegally and generally doing illegal shit

[Toddwjp]

Nevermind the fact that our population is 6 times that of yours.

 

this takes that into account, face palm, you argue that the crime for both countries is comparable, then when someone provides information showing that that is difficult and prone to error and may even show the opposite you claim that there incomparable

[HalGameGuru]

Regardless of the UK numbers being suspect the countries are too different for direct comparison. One is far smaller, less racially divided, and has a completely different societal history to build off of.

 

Edit: If you want to make things more fair add the numbers from England's forays into Ireland.

[cae]

Much as I'd love another UK vs. US gun politics debate, we should probably try to keep discussion within Japan as much as possible.

[Scheer]

 

The US murder rate is four times higher than UK, (yeah turns out that when gun crime happens some one dies, when knife crime happens much higher chance of them living)

The definition of violent crime isn't even the same in both countries,  "violent crime", in both America and Britain does not include homicide. 

the blog you posted assumes correlation is causation and is the demonstration of cherry picking statistics

 

In England and Wales, where guns are far harder to come by, criminals didn't simply go out and equip themselves with other tools and commit just as many murders; there were 32,714 offences involving a knife or other sharp instrument (whether used or just threatened), but they led to only 214 homicides, a rate of 1 homicide per 150 incidents. 

 

That nearly four-times-higher rate of fatality when the criminal uses a gun rather than a knife closely matches the overall difference in homicide rates between America and England.

 

but im done arguing with you guys, your arguments are based on heavily biased statistics. and word play

 

info taken from this article which lists its sources. read it, if you disagree with it that's fine but the gun/uk violent crime argument is dead.

 

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2013/09/gun-control

 

 

While you may be correct, it would be really hard to sell to someone its a better system. "Yeah, you are way more likely to be attacked, but its okay because you have a better chance at living."

 

Lets just agree both countries are bad, if you choose to live in one of them, so be it. 

[Toddwjp]

While you may be correct, it would be really hard to sell to someone its a better system. "Yeah, you are way more likely to be attacked, but its okay because you have a better chance at living."

 

Lets just agree both countries are bad, if you choose to live in one of them, so be it. 

 

did i forget to mention that in the definition of violent crime in the UK it includes verbal assault, harressment, all forms of sexual crime (in the us its only rape, in the uk it could be for flashing a stranger)

 

your actually less likely to be attacked in the uk if you take these factors into account,

[Trik'Stari]

this takes that into account, face palm, you argue that the crime for both countries is comparable, then when someone provides information showing that that is difficult and prone to error and may even show the opposite you claim that there incomparable

I never said they were outright incomparable, just that we have HUGE differences between the two of us. I say these things in response to the "well we don't have guns so we have less gun crime" argument that people from the UK always bring up. Which is absolutely fair of me to do. I also forgot that you'd never be able to successfully disarm a population that for the past 200+ years has lived under the belief that gun ownership is one the of most basic human rights. It's too much apart of our culture to disappear.

 

Lets go even further back. Our nation is comprised mostly of people who descended from people of a rebellious nature. The English sent a hell of a lot of Jacobite rebels over here after the Jacobite rebellions in the middle 1700's (who, if you do your reading, were very instrumental and quite ready to help out with out rebellion), not to mention our own later rebellion. A natural distrust of authority is ingrained into our very fabric as people, whereas most of the people in the UK are used to living under the rule of others (not an insult or anything, just an observation). So when your government tells you that it's safer to outlaw guns, do you even question it? For the most part as far as I have seen, no, you did not. You seem to (again, this is only what I see) believe whatever anyone with a badge, crown, or official looking piece of paper will say.

 

While you may be correct, it would be really hard to sell to someone its a better system. "Yeah, you are way more likely to be attacked, but its okay because you have a better chance at living."

 

Lets just agree both countries are bad, if you choose to live in one of them, so be it. 

I highly disagree, I'd rather live here where at the very least I can defend myself. Whereas in the UK your more likely to get sued/prosecuted for committing the apparently heinous act of self defense.

[patrickjp93]

So I guess you want to put people in jail before they commit crimes too?

No, I'm just saying guns are one of those things that make violent crime super easy to commit. It's not an equalizer. It's a stealth distance weapon, and that ease tempts more crime.

Everyone is law-abiding until the trigger is pulled. It's true of gang members as well as paranoid psychopaths.

[Trik'Stari]

No, I'm just saying guns are one of those things that make violent crime super easy to commit. It's not an equalizer. It's a stealth distance weapon, and that ease tempts more crime.

Everyone is law-abiding until the trigger is pulled. It's true of gang members as well as paranoid psychopaths.

That's a very subjective argument. Guns are by no means stealthy, they leave a hell of a lot of evidence, and if you look a the statistics in america, most criminals with a gun, when confronted by a civilian with a gun, will turn tail and run.

 

Not to mention, that over 90% of all massacre's have been committed in "gun free zones"

[HalGameGuru]

did i forget to mention that in the definition of violent crime in the UK it includes verbal assault, harressment, all forms of sexual crime (in the us its only rape, in the uk it could be for flashing a stranger)

 

your actually less likely to be attacked in the uk if you take these factors into account,

 

That depends on who is doing the counting and what definitions they use, some places count rape as a man only crime, others, like Texas, define sexual assault gender neutrally and granularly to include any non-consensual sexual contact. So numbers may not lie but the definitions that lead to the counting can be quite different.

[HalGameGuru]

No, I'm just saying guns are one of those things that make violent crime super easy to commit. It's not an equalizer. It's a stealth distance weapon, and that ease tempts more crime.

Everyone is law-abiding until the trigger is pulled. It's true of gang members as well as paranoid psychopaths.

 

 

A gun is one of those things that in the hands of a good person is no threat to anyone, and any law trying to control it only pulls it from the hands of that good person.

[Toddwjp]

 

 

I highly disagree, I'd rather live here where at the very least I can defend myself. Whereas in the UK your more likely to get sued/prosecuted for committing the apparently heinous act of self defense.

 

 

no you can practice self defence, just your only allowed reasonable force.

[The Dark Fate]

I think it's quite reasonable to have him arrested cause he's in a country where firearms are prohibited, if this happened in US or any countries that allow ownership of firearms, the man should have no trouble.

[Dicehunter]

http://3dprint.com/20019/sentence-imura-3d-printed-gun/

 

No words... 

 

EDIT: I was at work when I posted this and didn't have time to write something about it.

 

If he 3D printed a gun it's a gun but just with other materials, the objective is the same, and if the laws in Japan prohibit having guns it´s ok for the police to arrest him. 

And about the 2 years in prison I don't know, that really depends more on the laws than anything else.

 

The thing is that this can make people think that if you buy a 3D printer the is a big probability that you would print a working gun.

I read this in a news site from Paraguay(where I´m from) and the writer of the news said that 3D printers sales should be regulated because you can print a gun or a knife. 

That's just ridiculous.

 

 

If guns are illegal in a certain country and said person is stupid enough to think they are above the law then they deserve a prison sentence.

 

Plus you have to look at gun homoicide rates in japan, It's in the amazingly low region of 10-20 which is what every country should be hoping for, Not 10-20 thousand just 10-20, Compare that to a country that bases most of it's culture around weapons i.e the USA which has 30,000 gun related deaths per year.

[cae]

It's not apples to apples, though. Consider firearm ownership is heavily regulated and treated as a privilege in Japan, but not heavily regulated (in most states) and treated as a right (in most states) in the US. Japan has a 1 in 1000 gun owner ratio, the US is closer to 1 in 3. That's just the start of the differences.

[IdortMasterRace]

no you can practice self defence, just your only allowed reasonable force.

 

Define 'reasonable'.

 

I'll await your subjective definition.

[Art Vandelay]

People have been able to do this on CNCs for years. I don't see why this is news.

 

 

And the results are showing: 

 

In Japan, annual firearm homicides total 

2008: 11
2002: 47
2001: 56
1997: 34
1996: 36
1995: 42

 

In the United States, annual firearm homicides total 

2012: 8,896
2011: 11,101
2010: 11,078
2009: 11,493
2008: 12,179
2007: 12,632
2006: 12,791
2005: 12,352
2004: 11,624
2003: 11,920
2002: 11,829
2001: 11,348
2000: 10,801
1999: 10,828
1998: 9,257

Of course if you ban firearms, people are going to stop killing eachother with firearms... Doesn't mean that England is the world's safest place.

 

also, can I add that in 2011 there were something like 19,756 firearm suicides in the US (http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr61/nvsr61_06.pdf). Just to put the numbers in perspective.

 

 

Not to mention, that over 90% of all massacre's have been committed in "gun free zones"

but criminals will see the no guns signs and disarm themselves.