[Forbes] Why 'Watch Dogs' Is Bad News For AMD Users -- And Potentially The Entire PC Gaming Ecosystem

[Camul]

I don't know about crippling the whole industry, but I don't like the fact that they do handicap AMD's performance in the game.  That is bullshit and shouldn't be allowed

It might piss you off a lot less when you realise it runs like shit on Nvidia cards too.

[tharvey]

It might piss you off a lot less when you realise it runs like shit on Nvidia cards too.

LOL.. I don't know if it pisses me off less or if it just makes me kinda sad.  

[Camul]

LOL.. I don't know if it pisses me off less or if it just makes me kinda sad.  

I get that. On one had I'm annoyed more about the fact Nvidia screwed over AMD users and still fucked up optimizing it (Don't know if Nvdia or Ubisoft is to blame tbh though). On the other hand I find it hilarious.

[Foxxer]

Soon, both companies would be suing each others life.

[Lynx]

Bad News for AMD users?, well i don't thinks so http://hardocp.com/article/2014/05/27/watch_dogs_amd_nvidia_gpu_performance_preview/3

and thanks to the extra VRAM, AMD run much better on "Ultra Textures"

[alicskysareblue]

this is nividia they are  closed and propriatory in nature  in general, but really this reaks

[Notional]

Bad News for AMD users?, well i don't thinks so http://hardocp.com/article/2014/05/27/watch_dogs_amd_nvidia_gpu_performance_preview/3

and thanks to the extra VRAM, AMD run much better on "Ultra Textures"

Just another proof that nvidias stingy use of vram is hurting them now. 2gb on 770 vs 3gb on 280x, 4gb on 290 series compared to 3gb on 780 series. Get your act together nvidia.

[Natanael]

So Nvidia has a program where developers put some extra time into making the game look good and run well only on Nvidia hardware? Yeah, AMD would NEVER do anything like that. I mean, say, inventing a whole new API that's only compatible with AMD GPUs but boosts performance significantly for games that use it... totally not something AMD would do.

 

AMD has stated that in time Mantle will be an open source. 

[LAwLz]

AMD has stated that in time Mantle will be an open source. 

I would like a source on that, especially since it relies on DirectX components.

I've seen a lot of forum members say it will be open sourced in the future (why not do it now if that's the case?) but never seen an official statement from AMD.

[Audacius]

The discussion aside...

The game is so bad, i think that devs pooped on their keyboards for 2 years, and it somehow compiled to this game.

 

It's really sad where exactly the game industry is going, especially since this is the next in a series of bad Ubisoft games.

Although its cooked in the GameWorks kitchen, any rig, independent of branding, will experience fps drops, stuttering, long loading screens and more...

The worst thing? IGN and GameStop gave it a 8+ rating, while on Steam there is an ARMY of enraged players wishing to get their money back!

[DeViLzzz]

The bad part of Watch Dogs is the E3 footage showing a totally way better looking game for pc.  People pre-ordered it off of seeing that for sure.  I really wish some people would take Ubisoft to court and demand they get what they were shown as being the product.

[Sammael]

This is really bad news. How is AMD supposed to compete when the game is rigged ? literally. Unreal 4 is just one engine that we know of who knows how many others are going to be rigged.

 

 

I wonder if that is why unreal 4 changed the license terms to make it cheaper for developers.  Maybe being more locked into nvidia for better performance was a turn off for some game devs.

 

http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/178831-balkanized-gaming-nvidia-gameworks-now-a-core-part-of-ue4-amd-counters-with-mantle-integration-in-cryengine

 

 

cryengine seems like it's more neutral on directx 11, though the mantle support on some games will help amd.

 

 

The strategies remind me of two types of classes from the original chrono trigger.  One class buffed allies (amd mantle buffing the performance of their own cards with certain games), while another class debuffed/cursed enemies (nvidia looks to be forcing games/engines with gameworks to perform WORSE with amd hardware, this is not just a buff to their own products, it is actively seeking to lower the performance of amd hardware by preventing amd from optimizing their hardware to the same extent as nvidia with gameworks games)

 

amd good/noble

nvidia bad/evil

 

I'm an amd fanboy, but this kind of makes my case for me.

[matin94]

Yarrrr,

There be a lot of crying people in these here thread.

Is this a bad thing. Yeah.

Is he saying it because he's AMD and is it less worse then he is saying. Probably

Would AMD do this or are they doing this 2. Yup.

Its called competition, it might be a bad thing for us gamers.

But both will do this to some if not a full extend.

These kind of things are no reason not to buy Nvidia, or AMD for that matter.

Not allowing AMD to compete doesn't make it competition

[CoffeeBlack]

Does AMD not do something similar with games that display their badge like "Tomb Raider"?

[nokturrduk84]

AMD deserves it! Good job Nvidia. I always liked their tactics

[Timmyfox]

AMD deserves it! Good job Nvidia. I always liked their tactics

Have fun when a the future equivalent of a 750TI costs as much as a 780 does now.

[Balian]

I don`t get it why the Nvidia users are happy about this ? Competition drives performance up and prices down, this is not competition. Unless you want to pay 600$ for a GTX750 in the future think again. I have been an Nvidia users since TNT2 till GTX760, now because of this i`ll never buy an Nvidia card ever again. Using Vapor-X 290 OC and happy about it. I hope i won`t get screwed by developers payed by Nvidia though.

[LAwLz]

I don`t get it why the Nvidia users are happy about this ? Competition drives performance up and prices down, this is not competition. Unless you want to pay 600$ for a GTX750 in the future think again. I have been an Nvidia users since TNT2 till GTX760, now because of this i`ll never buy an Nvidia card ever again. Using Vapor-X 290 OC and happy about it. I hope i won`t get screwed by developers payed by Nvidia though.

While I agree that it's stupid for Nvidia users to be happy about this, I think it's extremely short sighted to say that you will "never buy an Nvidia card ever again".

AMD and Intel are also paying developers to make things run better on their products, just like Nvidia. This is sadly fairly standard business practice and I don't see it stopping any time soon.

[1funnygame]

I'd quite like to see both AMD Mantle and this nVidia shit go away. They are both equally bad for the PC games industry. Instead we should be working on a 100% fixed implementation of both DirectX and OpenGL on AMD, nVidia and Intel hardware in order to leave it down to the individual manufacturers to build the best graphics hardware they can rather than gaining unfair advantages by having technologies that benefit them and potentially putting the other vendors at a disadvantage within modern gaming titles.

AMD Mantle was not bad at all it forced microsoft to improve directX and AMD knew they would do this they said it many times because microsoft is one of those companies that only improves a product if theres viable competition

Also Mantle is open source so nvidia could easily do whatever optimisations they wanted to do easily unlike with the physX crap

[Fetzie]

While I agree that it's stupid for Nvidia users to be happy about this, I think it's extremely short sighted to say that you will "never buy an Nvidia card ever again".

AMD and Intel are also paying developers to make things run better on their products, just like Nvidia. This is sadly fairly standard business practice and I don't see it stopping any time soon.

 

I have no problem with paying developer teams to make a game or program run better on specific hardware. More money invested in the final product usually means a better product in the end.

 

I am on the fence about paying the developer to not release the software to competing hardware manufacturers until the release date, but at least the competition is allowed the chance to optimize the software (even if it is after the release of the software).

 

What I have a problem with, is a hardware manufacturer removing the ability of anybody else to make the game work equivalently well on their hardware. nVidia, with their GameWorks package, doesn't even let the game developers see the code - let alone AMD.

[Analog]

So Nvidia has a program where developers put some extra time into making the game look good and run well only on Nvidia hardware? Yeah, AMD would NEVER do anything like that. I mean, say, inventing a whole new API that's only compatible with AMD GPUs but boosts performance significantly for games that use it... totally not something AMD would do.

 

Yeah, but Mantle sucks anyway and is obviously a hassle to deal with since there are only a handful of games using it. Regarding nVidia's program, well, it's just business. Every company looks to undercut their competitors. Just look at the prices of books on Amazon, they are significantly lower than those in conventional book stores.  

[LAwLz]

What I have a problem with, is a hardware manufacturer removing the ability of anybody else to make the game work equivalently well on their hardware. nVidia, with their GameWorks package, doesn't even let the game developers see the code - let alone AMD.

The same can be said about DirectX and Mantle. The APIs are basically black boxes as well so the hardware manufacturers and game developers are not allowed to see the code.

[Balian]

While I agree that it's stupid for Nvidia users to be happy about this, I think it's extremely short sighted to say that you will "never buy an Nvidia card ever again".

AMD and Intel are also paying developers to make things run better on their products, just like Nvidia. This is sadly fairly standard business practice and I don't see it stopping any time soon.

There`s a difference between making a code work great on some hardware, and blocking the developer to optimize code for competition... that`s unfair. Something similar happened with Intel in the past vs AMD .. Intel lost in court but the damage was already done.

 

I don`t know why some say Mantle is crap, i`m using it and i love it. Not to count it woke MS from their sleep to further improve DX. AMD even offered Mantle to Nvidia... but they declined. Games like this should simply not be bought. I don`t hate Intel rigs or w/e but for our sake, the consumer sake, keep the competition fair. For this .. now i hate Nvidia.

[LAwLz]

There`s a difference between making a code work great on some hardware, and blocking the developer to optimize code for competition... that`s unfair. Something similar happened with Intel in the past vs AMD .. Intel lost in court but the damage was already done.

Yep, and by making Mantle closed source AMD are blocking developers from optimizing the code. Same with Direct X. I wouldn't be surprised if it's the same deal with TrueAudio.

 

 

I don`t know why some say Mantle is crap, i`m using it and i love it. Not to count it woke MS from their sleep to further improve DX. AMD even offered Mantle to Nvidia... but they declined. Games like this should simply not be bought. I don`t hate Intel rigs or w/e but for our sake, the consumer sake, keep the competition fair. For this .. now i hate Nvidia.

I'm not saying that Mantle is bad, but keeping it proprietary is bad. AMD fanboys seem to just ignore all the bad things AMD does and instead points fingers towards Nvidia. Both companies are pretty bad. Hate Nvidia all you want, but you're pretty hypocritical if you hate Nvidia for doing this, and then cheer AMD on when they do almost the same thing.

[xAcid9]

Does AMD not do something similar with games that display their badge like "Tomb Raider"?

 

No they did not.