Gamers Nexus alleges LMG has insufficient ethics and integrity

[TheSilverSpade]

Just now, Master Link said:

*be, *you're

(Sorry, you fell into that one.)

i hate you. *crying inside* Noooooo!

*shrivels into a singularity*

[mikaelus]

2 minutes ago, LinusAuctionTips said:

First you said it is an absolutely false statement (incorrect), then said it is up to the the court's discretion (correct). Which is it?

Your assertion that any opinion is immune from defamation claims.

[Drazil100]

2 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

Tbh, I feel it would be prudent for Linus to buy back the block, and return it anyway. It may be too late to alter public opinion here, it would guarantee protection of the IP. 

If the person who has it wants to give it back then sure, but given that Billet doesn't want it back it would be really shitty if the current owner felt pressured into returning it. Billet has already stated that they want the new owner to keep it and I agree with this. They shouldn't be wrapped up in all of this. They aren't some company that is going to steal Billet's IP so there is no harm in them keeping it.

[LinusAuctionTips]

1 minute ago, mikaelus said:

Your assertion that any opinion is immune from defamation claims.

I never asserted that. I asserted that it could be raised as a defense. The only absolute defense to defamation is truth. Stop being disingenuous and twisting peoples arguments to fit your narrative.

Edited August 16, 2023 by LinusAuctionTips
double post herp derp

[plume]

12 minutes ago, TheSilverSpade said:

I am genuinely shocked at just how many people are holding Linus accountable 

 

Considering he mentions how much he says it's great he is held accountable by the community on almost every wan show, I expected a lot more outrage. 220 pages is rookie number for a community this size. If he was a Minecraft creator this size/influence, we would be in the thousands of pages and lmg employees would have good reasons to be scared for their safety (Minecraft stans a scary motherfuckers). 

 

One thing that surprises me is how many well written comments there is.  In other youtube communities, it would be 95% one liners, jokes, insults, etc. The average age here seems to be much higher and that also means that he can't weasel his way out of it as easily.  

[LinusAuctionTips]

Just now, LinusAuctionTips said:

I never asserted that. I asserted that it could be raised as a defense. The only absolute defense to defamation is truth. Stop being disingenuous and twisting peoples arguments to fit your narrative.

 

[Jaegan]

3 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

Tbh, I feel it would be prudent for Linus to buy back the block, and return it anyway. While it may be too late to alter public opinion here (and really isn’t the point), it would guarantee protection of the IP, which would be foremost on my mind. 

Buy it back, make a video testing it on the correct video card, and then return it, in addition to compensating Billet in the meantime.

[JoshuaScholar]

If Steve wants to help the consumer get the truths, then he calls out an outlet that doesn't really care what the truth is, you know like one that trashes a couple kids then says that being honest would have cost money on a video they were monetizing anyway!

 

If Steve wants to help Linus Group's suffering employees, then he calls them out for forcing them to make videos so quickly that they can't be proud of their work.

 

If Steve wants to help Linus Group stay in business, then he gets them to change course before they trash their reputation over, you know, a few years of content that would discredit them.

 

If Steve wants to help Linus Group stay in business, he makes problems clear right when new management is coming in and has an opportunity to fix Linus's bad decisions.

 

I think Steve IS helping.

[Drazil100]

2 minutes ago, Jaegan said:

Buy it back, make a video testing it on the correct video card, and then return it, in addition to compensating Billet in the meantime.

The person who bought the cooler had no fault in any of this. They shouldn't be dragged into it. Billet has expressed publicly that they don't want the person who has the card to be dragged into this.

[IkeaGnome]

Sooooo LTT messed up. 220+ pages later we’re still doing backwards math to try to defend?

2 minutes ago, Drazil100 said:

If the person who has it wants to give it back then sure, but given that Billet doesn't want it back it would be really shitty if the current owner felt pressured into returning it. Billet has already stated that they want the new owner to keep it and I agree with this. They shouldn't be wrapped up in all of this. They aren't some company that is going to steal Billet's IP so there is no harm in them keeping it.

At least reach out to Billet. See if they’d want it to continue prototyping but then would be willing to give it back after. At the end of the day who ever has it bought what is technically now stolen property..

[Zodiark1593]

5 minutes ago, Drazil100 said:

If the person who has it wants to give it back then sure, but given that Billet doesn't want it back it would be really shitty if the current owner felt pressured into returning it. Billet has already stated that they want the new owner to keep it and I agree with this. They shouldn't be wrapped up in all of this. They aren't some company that is going to steal Billet's IP so there is no harm in them keeping it.

If this is genuinely the case (and Billet has explicitly said so themselves), then, for what it’s worth, I’ve no objection myself. 
 

Otherwise, this would still remain Billet’s property, and the buyer would have to pursue LTT for the costs, should Billet choose to take it back. 

[TheSilverSpade]

Just now, plume said:

 

Considering he mentions how much he says it's great he is held accountable by the community on almost every wan show, I expected a lot more outrage. 220 pages is rookie number for a community this size. If he was a Minecraft creator this size/influence, we would be in the thousands of pages and lmg employees would have good reasons to be scared for their safety (Minecraft stans a scary motherfuckers). 

 

One thing that surprises me is how many well written comments there is.  In other youtube communities, it would be 95% one liners, jokes, insults, etc. The average age here seems to be much higher and that also means that he can't weasel his way out of it as easily.  

Yeah I suppose that is true. But I was more shocked at the ratio of “For Linus” vs “Against Linus”

(I use quotes as I don’t have a proper word for “against Linus” I’m not against him I’m against his response)

[SirCadvan]

1 minute ago, plume said:

 

Considering he mentions how much he says it's great he is held accountable by the community on almost every wan show, I expected a lot more outrage. 220 pages is rookie number for a community this size. If he was a Minecraft creator this size/influence, we would be in the thousands of pages and lmg employees would have good reasons to be scared for their safety (Minecraft stans a scary motherfuckers). 

 

One thing that surprises me is how many well written comments there is.  In other youtube communities, it would be 95% one liners, jokes, insults, etc. The average age here seems to be much higher and that also means that he can't weasel his way out of it as easily.  

For every mistake, there is an opportunity to learn and grow. One can never be too old, too rich, or too powerful for this truth to remain valid today and in the days to come.

[mikaelus]

5 minutes ago, TheSilverSpade said:

I can’t sued because I think your an idiot.

Tell me I’m wrong.

*you're

 

You can freely say someone is an idiot, at least in the US, because that is a subjective statement of opinion that can't be factually evaluated (what defines an idiot?).

But you can run into trouble when you say - or even impute - that someone is giving special treatment to a 3rd party because they have taken their sponsorship money. It's a downright allegation of corruption, even if it's thinly veiled as an "opinion".

[Drazil100]

2 minutes ago, IkeaGnome said:

Sooooo LTT messed up. 220+ pages later we’re still doing backwards math to try to defend?

At least reach out to Billet. See if they’d want it to continue prototyping but then would be willing to give it back after. At the end of the day who ever has it bought what is technically now stolen property..

Please read this. 

[plume]

2 minutes ago, TheSilverSpade said:

Yeah I suppose that is true. But I was more shocked at the ratio of “For Linus” vs “Against Linus”

(I use quotes as I don’t have a proper word for “against Linus” I’m not against him I’m against his response)

 

I was also shocked by by that ratio. 

[dynastes]

1 minute ago, TheSilverSpade said:

Yeah I suppose that is true. But I was more shocked at the ratio of “For Linus” vs “Against Linus”

(I use quotes as I don’t have a proper word for “against Linus” I’m not against him I’m against his response)

In how far did it shock you? Did you expect more people to defend him or the other way around? Just curious

 

Because if it is the former, I think it comes back to what @plume said. The fact that the average age and maturity is a bit higher here also might mean that people will not let him get away with it easily and are not willing to just accept such behaviour.

[Emzijs]

I've been watching Linus since 2015, and I have invested many hours into their content. But at this point, I am not sure how some fans of LTT still defend LTT after numerous controversies in past 12-24 months:

 

* Backpack saga, which was handled poorly (trust me bro hehe, that's aint gonna fly)
* That reddit thread which was previously posted. If, and I say IF, what the OP claims was true and LTT was involved in nuking that kids channel, then it's a bad look and I am telling it lightly
* Linus's opinion on Unionization. I'm sorry, but unions in NA are must have and if he thinks they serve no purpose then it shows more about Linus than unions as a whole. Someone already summarized my thoughts about this so I am not gon repeat that.
* Treatment of ASUS on Secret Shopper thing. Like, it's a bad look when you let ASUS go lightly and at the same time they are your main LTX sponsor.

* And now GN video about Billet situation and whole QC thing.

 

I am sorry but half assed apology that was posted many pages ago won't do justice. I am not even sure what can be done at this point, especially after the "Apology" written in forum instead of social media. I'll probably watch the videos that interest me, but sponsorblock and ublock plugins will be enabled from now on and probably will skip majority of videos. It's been evident that in past 12 months all the videos have been half-arsed and actual production value has been lower than it used to be. Therefore I can't really trust your judgment on products.

Hopefully this gets resolved, but damage has been done.

[kamaji-xl]

I've been a fan of LTT for a long time. I haven't kept up with the videos for with the exception of some of the tech upgrade videos, just because they don't hit like they used too. That being said I still typically keep up on the WAN show as I've always thought of LTT as genuinely good guys and I really like the WAN show. I have even bought some merch like the tech sack just because I like Linus and Luke and wanted to support the company. I feel like Linus typically handles mistakes well and appears to care about making things right. I understand that mistakes happen and that LTT has been experiencing some exponential growth lately so mistakes are more likely to happen. However I feel like on some of the WAN episodes in the past couple of years Linus has had some increasingly bad takes, and has demonstrated some pretty crazy mental gymnastics to justify things. Ultimately I'm really disappointed in the way he's handled the Billet situation, and I'll probably stop watching WAN.

 

Feels bad man. 

[JoshuaScholar]

Just now, plume said:

 

I was also shocked by by that ratio. 

So many posts felt like "HOW DARE STEVE HURT MY FRIEND LINUS!"  He's a bad man.  Bad bad bad!

[TheSilverSpade]

1 minute ago, dynastes said:

In how far did it shock you? Did you expect more people to defend him or the other way around? Just curious

 

Because if it is the former, I think it comes back to what @plume said. The fact that the average age and maturity is a bit higher here also might mean that people will not let him get away with it easily and are not willing to just accept such behaviour.

I had figured more people would be defending him in an r/youngpeopleyoutube sorta way.

[wanderingfool2]

1 minute ago, mikaelus said:

But you can run into trouble when you say - or even impute - that someone is giving special treatment to a 3rd party because they have taken their sponsorship money. It's a downright allegation of corruption, even if it's thinly veiled as an "opinion".

The trick is though if there is some public evidence that things might be biased, then the statement of whether it can be trust would greatly be considered opinion by the courts. (Like statements of saying a product brand is always reliable or similar things...even when they are going through a PR nightmare at that time)

 

1 minute ago, dynastes said:

Because if it is the former, I think it comes back to what @plume said. The fact that the average age and maturity is a bit higher here also might mean that people will not let him get away with it easily and are not willing to just accept such behaviour.

Personally I'm surprised by the later, that there are so many people who are just defending Linus; and especially the ones who defend by trusting Linus' word in his post here (and somehow thinking everything is resolved)

[Amaninacity]

32 minutes ago, LinusAuctionTips said:

except he provided evidence. Best defense for defamation is the truth. I don't think you realize how high of a bar it is to successfully bring a suit for slander (or libel), especially against a public figure.

You don’t have to be factually incorrect in all regards to be found to have libeled a public figure. But you do have to have at least some, and an apparent disregard for whether the information is false. Tell me your gut, “training as a lawyer” doesn’t tell you that if Steve was your client he has a very high chance of getting FUCKED in discovery.

[brownninja97]

Gonna be very annoyed if this ends up destroying LTT, very poor reaction by Linus. Expected better in all honesty. He clearly saw red and didnt think about the implications of his answer.

[Zodiark1593]

5 minutes ago, Drazil100 said:

Please read this. 

I don’t feel this email mitigates that what LMG has done was, both ethically, and legally, wrong. (And among the issues raised, I feel this to be the most serious one.) Rather, Billet probably sought to close out ties as cleanly as possible. 
 

Assuming the email is legitimate, and the buyer was contacted in writing as well, the buyer is likely free and clear to keep the prototype.