What's a tech trend you disagree with?

[Retro_R]

idk is this fits in but the popularity of corsair RGB gets me railed up every time i think about it.

 

Most, if not all, is over priced, proprietary, and works worse than competitors for more money (which is what some of the same ppl complain abt Apple for doing cough). Not to mention their bloated software which can slow computers down (slightly). It's just a mess and just get normal fans that can hook into your ARGB/RGB header instead of having to buy a $75 hub to manage all your fans n strips to take up an extra USB header.

 

I really don't understand the hype around them, like i get they look nice, but you can find plenty of other fans that look just as good if not better for way cheaper and that will work with your on board mobo rgb.

[Galaxy2007]

Laptops where the RAM/SSD are soldered to the board and/or difficult to repair. I'm still using a 10 year old laptop where the drive and RAM bays are easily accessible and located just under plastic panels with only 1-2 screws. Also a ton of ports on it with a total of 4 USBs. Although still not exactly simple to work on because well, its still a laptop, it was still much easier to repair then any modern laptop I've worked with. Also noticeably built to last, a lot of new ones are thin and cheap feeling, this one is thick and genuinely feels quality.

[Galaxy2007]

On 12/25/2022 at 7:47 AM, HanZie82 said:

The biggest tech hurdle for me is, people saying its good enough.
Thus hindering evolution and research.
Its ok to not spend you money but dont call it bad just cus you too ignorant to see the benefits.

 

Im talking bigger screens, faster hardware, more pixels, more speakers etc.
"Just shut up and dont buy", dont call it bad because you dont know what the benefits are as you've never used anything like it...

Dont feel offended this is in general and not meant towards anyone in particular.

 

 

I know its not really a tech thing, but very tech related.
And im fine with ppl thinking its superfluous, but for the development its needed.
I mean no one now even thinks twice of 3D TVs but they sure helped increasing the frame rate on bigger panels. (as that was what was needed for some 3D TV with the switching glasses).

I'd have to disagree with this lol. Not everyone has money to just go out and buy new stuff every year. My old tech stuff, much of which is 10+ years old works just fine and I'm not replacing it when I only make minimum wage and need to afford other things

[Neroon]

9 hours ago, vertigo220 said:

Definitely. Trying to hit just the right spot on a touchscreen in a car that's bouncing around, especially bad on dirt roads, is a nightmare and absolutely dangerous, compared to just grabbing a physical dial and turning it or pushing a physical button. And in my car, I have to adjust both the driver and passenger side temperature, since there's no way to just lock them together. And I don't use the auto button, because it always turns the fans up to full-blast, so I turn it on by pressing the fan up/down buttons. Also, every time I do use the auto button, it turns the AC on even if it's below freezing out. They tried to make it smart and just made it completely idiotic and frustrating to use.

While I don't like auto systems for that either, having the AC on is pretty normal. The misconception is that you should only use the AC in warm weather, but it is beneficial during the winter as well. Instead of writing it down, I found this from an article:

Quote

Some car owners hesitate when it comes to running their car’s air conditioning during the winter months. Not many think it is a good idea to run the a/c when temperatures outside are near freezing and the ground is covered by snow. However, running the a/c in the winter months does not cause any harm to the car’s heating and cooling system. In fact, there are many benefits to running the car’s air conditioning in the winter.

Air Conditioning Compressor

The car’s compressor does more than just cool the air before it passed through the car. You can use the a/c compressor while controlling the heat setting of the car to control the climate within. Doing so will help dehumidify the air, reducing fogged up windows. Running the air conditioner will also help clear up window condensation.

Air Conditioning System

Running the air conditioner during the winter will help prevent the car’s cooling system components from wasting away. This helps reduce the loss of refrigerant which occurs when the air conditioning unit is not used for extended periods of time. It also helps keep up the service life of the vehicle, reducing the need for to take the car to a local Longmont auto repair shop for expensive cooling system repairs. Those who opt not to run their air conditioning system during the winter months should make sure they at least run it for 30 minutes once a week. This will help keep the system active and fluids flowing through the a/c compressor.

Air Conditioning Problems

Though the cooling aspect of the air conditioning system will not be used during the winter months, car owners will still be able to catch any major issues. If the air conditioner is not run during the winter, a problem with the system may not be noticed until the summer. Which means the car owners could be driving around without air conditioning when the hotter months come around.

Running the air conditioner in a car during the winter months has many different benefits. Those who do so will be able to more efficiently control the temperature and moisture in the car. Plus, they can also protect the cooling system and possibly avoid high repair costs.

Personally I leave my AC on, even if your filters are good, you are still getting water/moist in. The AC definitely helps with that. My experience has been that all climate control cars use AC in auto mode.

[HanZie82]

10 hours ago, iPdo said:

I'd have to disagree with this lol. Not everyone has money to just go out and buy new stuff every year. My old tech stuff, much of which is 10+ years old works just fine and I'm not replacing it when I only make minimum wage and need to afford other things

Then you have misunderstood what i tried to write down.

Its when people that are ignorant to future tech hold up development saying its bad. And saying its useless just because they are not willing to pay for it.
And making it even harder for the ones whom ARE willing to pay for it to find such technology.

That completely different then not willing to spend the money.

[E-waste]

14 hours ago, vertigo220 said:

This is one reason why Android and iOS need to be replaced by Linux, so at least the software side would be handled by the community and not have to be shouldered by the manufacturers. But even then, they couldn't stay in business selling a phone for barely any profit once every several years.

I dig that.  But how are computers sold?  Microsoft is not a PC manufacturer, and all the pre-built computers are still being sold.  So there's a separation here between who is selling the hardware, and who is developing the software.

 

If phones had an "independent" operating system like Android, or Linux, that's not requiring the resellers (I don't think the different brands manufacture anything, they just sell hardware) to support the software, maybe this has a chance to be solved.

 

But now with Google selling hardware, there's not a chance in hell that they'll offer long-term support for their resold hardware, that they purchased and had designed.  They want as much money as humanly possibly from hardware sales AND to collect all your data at every time you turn on wi-fi or cell internet.

[vertigo220]

6 hours ago, Neroon said:

While I don't like auto systems for that either, having the AC on is pretty normal. The misconception is that you should only use the AC in warm weather, but it is beneficial during the winter as well. Instead of writing it down, I found this from an article:

Personally I leave my AC on, even if your filters are good, you are still getting water/moist in. The AC definitely helps with that. My experience has been that all climate control cars use AC in auto mode.

I'm aware of all that, and I'm usually the one telling people they need to run it occasionally during the winter, but the air is already pretty dry in the winter, and while running the AC does help dry it out, it also makes it colder, which is the last thing I want when it's 20 out. Having to turn it off manually every time because it turns on automatically is really annoying. Unless it's somehow running the compressor but not actually cooling the air, which I'm not even sure is possible, but in that case it shouldn't even show that the AC is on. Also, running the compressor decreases gas mileage.

 

51 minutes ago, Timpster said:

I dig that.  But how are computers sold?  Microsoft is not a PC manufacturer, and all the pre-built computers are still being sold.  So there's a separation here between who is selling the hardware, and who is developing the software.

 

If phones had an "independent" operating system like Android, or Linux, that's not requiring the resellers (I don't think the different brands manufacture anything, they just sell hardware) to support the software, maybe this has a chance to be solved.

 

But now with Google selling hardware, there's not a chance in hell that they'll offer long-term support for their resold hardware, that they purchased and had designed.  They want as much money as humanly possibly from hardware sales AND to collect all your data at every time you turn on wi-fi or cell internet.

Microsoft actually is a PC manufacturer: Surface, Surface Pro, Surface Book, Surface Laptop. Many computer parts on their own cost what an average entire phone costs. And manufacturers don't have to do anything at all related to software. Most of them choose to preinstall Windows, since most people wouldn't know what to do with a computer without an OS, and they charge you for that, but there is zero involved for them in maintaining the software.

 

Resellers typically don't support anything, anyways.

 

Well, Google has been selling hardware for six years, and has in that time widened their reach to things like Google Home, Nest thermostat, and possibly others I'm unaware of. The one good thing about Google is that they support their phones longer than others, and that's a big reason other manufacturers have been extending how long they support their phones, because they need to in order to compete with Google. I won't buy a Pixel myself, but they're the best option if you want the longest-lasting phone. Either that or buy a phone that can be unlocked so you can install a custom rom on it, as the more popular phones are supported that way for years. That's close to if they were to run Linux (and, to be clear, Android is Linux, but when I say Linux, I mean non-Android, to be completely free of Google, like with Pine) and provides feature and security updates while removing much, if not all, of Google's crap, depending on the OS. Problem is, Samsung is the most popular manufacturer and most of their phones are locked, and many other manufacturers have some models that are and some that aren't.

[E-waste]

Oh, don't get me started on Microsoft, they don't give a rats ass about ANY of their customers.  Case in point, the Surface Pro 3.  They don't even list it on their website anymore, I looked.  They just move on.  They provide NO support, and they have no plans of changing that.  Go read their own forums, it's just rude.  Microsoft has ENTIRELY, completely, lost my respect for a software / hardware company, they are terrible.

 

So, the flash memory had an issue, O.K. deal with it!  Offer the people who paid money for the device, that allows Microsoft to sell and design MORE of them, support, or a repair service to replace the flash memory.  But I guess that's too much to ask when you can just "buy a new one" like everybody does because "that's cheaper" or "more convenient".  I've already made clear my feelings on e-waste in this forum, it's just unbelievable.  So now there are 9 surface devices or 18 if you count "pro" and such.  And if any of them has an issue, you are NOT getting support from Microsoft.  I just don't respect that.  It's a punch in the face to all of their customers.

[vertigo220]

10 minutes ago, Timpster said:

Oh, don't get me started on Microsoft, they don't give a rats ass about ANY of their customers.  Case in point, the Surface Pro 3.  They don't even list it on their website anymore, I looked.  They just move on.  They provide NO support, and they have no plans of changing that.  Go read their own forums, it's just rude.  Microsoft has ENTIRELY, completely, lost my respect for a software / hardware company, they are terrible.

 

So, the flash memory had an issue, O.K. deal with it!  Offer the people who paid money for the device, that allows Microsoft to sell and design MORE of them, support, or a repair service to replace the flash memory.  But I guess that's too much to ask when you can just "buy a new one" like everybody does because "that's cheaper" or "more convenient".  I've already made clear my feelings on e-waste in this forum, it's just unbelievable.  So now there are 9 surface devices or 18 if you count "pro" and such.  And if any of them has an issue, you are NOT getting support from Microsoft.  I just don't respect that.  It's a punch in the face to all of their customers.

I had a SP3. It was garbage, and between the product itself and Microsoft's complete lack of support for and obvious lack of caring about it, that's what made me vow to never again buy any MS product. I've already hated their products and them as a company for years, but that was the final straw. I use alternatives for just about every MS software product I can and I won't go near their hardware. At the rate Linux has been improving, I'm hopeful it will be at a point it will be a suitable replacement for me within the next 2-3 years. It's not quite there yet, but it's getting close.

[sub68]

2 hours ago, HanZie82 said:

Its when people that are ignorant to future tech hold up development saying its bad. And saying its useless just because they are not willing to pay for it.

I see alot of the same things in car development to future tech.

 

Remember every new tech gets to the enthusiasts first than starts to trickel down to consumer.

 

You as a enthusiast don't mind when things break you know/how to fix it. Enthusiasts provided feedback to the manufacturer that leads them to make it better.

There is a difference between cant afford and afford but not want too.

 

I can afford new computer parts but dont care enough and spend it on camera gear.

I work enough in IT to just go it doesnt matter and rather have a reliable system than be a enthusiast but thats just my take.

[TH3M4DR4TT3R]

The selling of fake hard drives on Amazon and eBay really annoys me especially when both sites do nothing to stop it.

[Godlygamer23]

18 hours ago, vertigo220 said:

I don't really care one way or the other or really see much point in a smart oven or especially microwave, but smart lights are very useful. If you can't think of useful things to do with them, then you don't have a use for them, but that doesn't mean they're dumb. I personally love them and use them all the time, whether to provide low-level, orange light so I can see without it being overwhelming while watching TV or just to see after dark, to using a red light in the bathroom at night, to using them as a sunrise alarm, to having them flash when receiving an important text, to being able to turn the lights on when getting home (or when away from home) both as a safety measure (security in the case of being away from home) and to avoid having to fumble with the light switches in the dark or with full hands.

 

Not as near as you'd think. I brought up this concern to my brother when he was talking about his new BMW and its ability to start without taking the fob out of his pocket. He said the same thing you did, so I suggested he try it. We were in a restaurant and the car was probably at least 10m away and it started right up. Somebody could have easily driven it off (after breaking in, of course) due to that. Whether it would shut itself off after getting out of range, I don't know. Hopefully, otherwise I could see someone leaving the house and forgetting the fob, only to find they couldn't start their car once they got where they were going.

 

BTW, years before this I was riding with the same brother in another car and we were talking about the automatic seat belts (yeah, remember those things?) and I brought up how they seemed unsafe because they could loosen up if the door were to open up during an accident. He said they probably wouldn't do so when the car is in motion, so I suggested testing it. He opened his door a bit while driving down the road and, sure enough, the seat belt started moving forward. Hopefully there was some sort of mechanism to prevent that in the case of an accident, but I don't see how it could be done reliably.

Do you connect directly to smart bulbs? Or do they work through a hub? 

 

In regards to the fob discussion, that is a problem with the implementation from BMW then. The start/stop button isn't an issue in of itself because of that. The technology itself doesn't allow someone to just randomly drive off in someone's vehicle if they break into it. Many years ago, I knew a couple that had a Nissan that had a start/stop button, and if the driver got out with the car running and was maybe 10 ft away, the car would lock itself, and the shifter would lock. I don't know what would happen if someone drove off in the car, and got out of range of the fob. I assume it would stall out, but I have no idea. It's still a problem with the implementation though, and the technology doesn't inherently allow someone to just start someone's car and drive off. 

[vertigo220]

2 minutes ago, Godlygamer23 said:

Do you connect directly to smart bulbs? Or do they work through a hub? 

 

In regards to the fob discussion, that is a problem with the implementation from BMW then. The start/stop button isn't an issue in of itself because of that. The technology itself doesn't allow someone to just randomly drive off in someone's vehicle if they break into it. Many years ago, I knew a couple that had a Nissan that had a start/stop button, and if the driver got out with the car running and was maybe 10 ft away, the car would lock itself, and the shifter would lock. I don't know what would happen if someone drove off in the car, and got out of range of the fob. I assume it would stall out, but I have no idea. It's still a problem with the implementation though, and the technology doesn't inherently allow someone to just start someone's car and drive off. 

Hub, which is better for security.

 

Yeah, I realize it's an implementation issue, which can be said for any technology issue, really. I'm not against it; I think it's a cool idea and useful. I'm just saying caution is required, both in the design/implementation and for the consumer to make sure there's nothing stupid like that they need to worry about. And yeah, my understanding is that Nissan does a good job with that, including that it's apparently impossible to lock the fob in the car, which doesn't really make sense, because how would you lock the doors when driving, so maybe that's only with the engine off. But even fobs in general can be poorly implemented and can causes issues, like the Civics that for some unfathomable reason don't use code-hopping, which is a very old technology, allowing criminals to record the signal from the fob and play it back, or the possibility for criminals to jam the signal entirely so when you try to lock your car while walking into a store, it doesn't actually lock (always make sure it honks and/or the lights flash).

[Mihle]

16 hours ago, iPdo said:

Laptops where the RAM/SSD are soldered to the board and/or difficult to repair. I'm still using a 10 year old laptop where the drive and RAM bays are easily accessible and located just under plastic panels with only 1-2 screws. Also a ton of ports on it with a total of 4 USBs. Although still not exactly simple to work on because well, its still a laptop, it was still much easier to repair then any modern laptop I've worked with. Also noticeably built to last, a lot of new ones are thin and cheap feeling, this one is thick and genuinely feels quality.

To be fair, I don't think many laptops die because of the memory, with that specifically I think a better and good argument is you cant upgrade it later if the needs change. 

My current laptop sadly have 16 GB soldered ram, I would like it not to be but everything else fit what I wanted better than other options, so I still went for it. storage is not soldered tho. (Lenovo Yoga Slim 7 Pro)
It feels much better quality than the shitty MSI gaming laptop I had that was big. But that is only two laptops.

[Godlygamer23]

2 hours ago, vertigo220 said:

Hub, which is better for security.

One of my concerns here is that to have your hub connected to your network(which based on my understanding is what happens), that would potentially allow it to have access to your other devices if it were to get hacked. I don't know the likeliness of this, but as these devices become more common, which is inevitable, hackers will find ways to get access to people's devices, and use the hub as the proxy. That means companies would have to constantly chase security vulnerabilities, and zero-day threats become even more of an issue. And this goes for more than just these smart bulbs. This would include any device that connects to the network, and is also accessible over the internet. Smart ovens, microwaves, washers, dryers, etc. I don't see how these specifically add any benefit to our lives that wouldn't otherwise require your physical presence anyway to make use of, but then they add security concerns to the mix constantly, and other concerns, like the manufacturer being able to control how you use the device, especially with automatic firmware/software updates. 

[vertigo220]

1 minute ago, Godlygamer23 said:

One of my concerns here is that to have your hub connected to your network(which based on my understanding is what happens), that would potentially allow it to have access to your other devices if it were to get hacked. I don't know the likeliness of this, but as these devices become more common, which is inevitable, hackers will find ways to get access to people's devices, and use the hub as the proxy. That means companies would have to constantly chase security vulnerabilities, and zero-day threats become even more of an issue. And this goes for more than just these smart bulbs. This would include any device that connects to the network, and is also accessible over the internet. Smart ovens, microwaves, washers, dryers, etc. I don't see how these specifically add any benefit to our lives that wouldn't otherwise require your physical presence anyway to make use of, but then they add security concerns to the mix constantly, and other concerns, like the manufacturer being able to control how you use the device, especially with automatic firmware/software updates. 

Correct, and I brought this up just a few posts back. Well, my posts, but it's on the last page. Any device on the network can be hacked to gain entry into the network and is a security risk in that sense, which is the biggest problem with IOT, and why the S in IOT stands for security. But I'm aware of the risks and weigh them against the benefits, and do what I can to mitigate them. Most people, unfortunately, are not and do not. As I said, hubs are generally more secure, and I trust Philips, which is what most of my lights are, to make their hub secure a lot more than I trust all the no-name crap out there. They cost more, but they're better quality bulbs and probably more secure. But yeah, it's always a risk. And it's important to use a good router with a good firewall. You can also sandbox them by putting them on a separate network.

 

The bottom line is network and internet security are very complicated, and most of these devices have little to no security at all. I'm far from an expert in the area, but I do what I can, which is more than most, and at the very least I'm not likely as easy a target as many others, so just like you don't have to make your house ultra secure, just more secure than others around you, it's also about making it more difficult than it's worth. And the more devices you have, the more of an attack surface you have. Another thing, and I could be entirely wrong here because, again, not even close to an expert, but I think it's much easier to access and control the devices than to use them as a foothold to gain access to the rest of the network. So an attacker may be able to control my lights, but may not be able to do anything beyond that. And even if they do gain additional access, there's not that much they're likely to be able to do. Whereas if they can control my oven, thermostat, water heater, etc, they can cause some actual harm.

 

I can certainly see benefits to basically every device being "smart" except maybe the microwave. The fridge can let you know when you're running low on something and even order more. The stove/oven can be turned off remotely if you forgot when you left the house or you can turn it up or down as needed as something cooks. The washer and dryer can alert you on your phone that they're done. But all of those are very minor, are mainly just things that allow you to be extremely lazy, and I had to reach for them, so yeah, there's benefit, but barely, and not worth the risk or potential issues to me. Thermostat would definitely have benefits, and I originally wanted to get one, and still do, but I'd need to see some real progress in security before taking that leap. Lights are very useful and, as far as I'm aware, have very little risk with quality ones.

[vertigo220]

2 minutes ago, Caroline said:

Lol imagine houses becoming discos when impatient bosses who harass their employers and don't know the difference between life and a job send them texts at 3AM

 

We live in a comically absurd corporate dystopia

I mean, yeah, if you went crazy with it. I did it because I'd accidentally left my phone at work and was on call, so I asked my coworker/friend, who they would call when not hearing back from me, to email me if I was needed, then used IFTTT to flash the light in the room I was in if I got an email from him. Not an ideal situation, but it was the best I could do aside from driving all the way back to work late at night, especially since we didn't get calls very often.

[Rex Hite]

-Cookie-cutter websites

-Tech enabled 'gig' work

-DAC units with vacuum tubes.

-Vacuum tubes

-DAC units

-The shiit that passes for audiophile

-the lack of a smartphone as some weird indicator of moral superiority. Come to think of it, what would become of smug bastards if there were no smartphones?...it's how we know who they are...and how will they know who they are?

-Smartphones

-opinions. Not itself tech, but when everyone has a telecommunicatory devicelment with global reach in their pocket it makes a mockery of samizdat. (Is Musk Stalin now?)

-China

-pretending right to repair is going to change things in consumer tech toy-dom

 

I'll be yelling at clouds soon. There should be an app for that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-

 

 

 

[SimplyChunk]

2 hours ago, Rex Hite said:

I'll be yelling at clouds soon. There should be an app for that.

It's called Twitter..

[Galaxy2007]

6 hours ago, Mihle said:

To be fair, I don't think many laptops die because of the memory, with that specifically I think a better and good argument is you cant upgrade it later if the needs change. 

My current laptop sadly have 16 GB soldered ram, I would like it not to be but everything else fit what I wanted better than other options, so I still went for it. storage is not soldered tho. (Lenovo Yoga Slim 7 Pro)
It feels much better quality than the shitty MSI gaming laptop I had that was big. But that is only two laptops.

Yeah I meant that it should be upgradeable, although mine isn't soldered, the max amount on my laptop is 8gb which I feel was a poor choice by Toshiba although its probably because most models using my specific motherboard had less RAM. Being able to upgrade is quite nice and has made a lot of my laptops faster

[Godlygamer23]

On 12/29/2022 at 6:24 PM, vertigo220 said:

Correct, and I brought this up just a few posts back. Well, my posts, but it's on the last page. Any device on the network can be hacked to gain entry into the network and is a security risk in that sense, which is the biggest problem with IOT, and why the S in IOT stands for security. But I'm aware of the risks and weigh them against the benefits, and do what I can to mitigate them. Most people, unfortunately, are not and do not. As I said, hubs are generally more secure, and I trust Philips, which is what most of my lights are, to make their hub secure a lot more than I trust all the no-name crap out there. They cost more, but they're better quality bulbs and probably more secure. But yeah, it's always a risk. And it's important to use a good router with a good firewall. You can also sandbox them by putting them on a separate network.

 

The bottom line is network and internet security are very complicated, and most of these devices have little to no security at all. I'm far from an expert in the area, but I do what I can, which is more than most, and at the very least I'm not likely as easy a target as many others, so just like you don't have to make your house ultra secure, just more secure than others around you, it's also about making it more difficult than it's worth. And the more devices you have, the more of an attack surface you have. Another thing, and I could be entirely wrong here because, again, not even close to an expert, but I think it's much easier to access and control the devices than to use them as a foothold to gain access to the rest of the network. So an attacker may be able to control my lights, but may not be able to do anything beyond that. And even if they do gain additional access, there's not that much they're likely to be able to do. Whereas if they can control my oven, thermostat, water heater, etc, they can cause some actual harm.

 

I can certainly see benefits to basically every device being "smart" except maybe the microwave. The fridge can let you know when you're running low on something and even order more. The stove/oven can be turned off remotely if you forgot when you left the house or you can turn it up or down as needed as something cooks. The washer and dryer can alert you on your phone that they're done. But all of those are very minor, are mainly just things that allow you to be extremely lazy, and I had to reach for them, so yeah, there's benefit, but barely, and not worth the risk or potential issues to me. Thermostat would definitely have benefits, and I originally wanted to get one, and still do, but I'd need to see some real progress in security before taking that leap. Lights are very useful and, as far as I'm aware, have very little risk with quality ones.

I don't think I trust any manufacturer of smart devices at this point. I don't think security is taken as seriously as it should with these devices, because they're being rushed to market. But I do hope Philips is taking it seriously.

 

They might only have access to your lights, but I think that's an assumption, and a hacker might be able to figure out a way to use the lights/hub to get into the router, like if the password is not securely stored on the hub. Might be less of an issue with Philips, but for all the other manufacturers out there, particularly no-name brands, it might be particularly easy. But just because it's a name brand doesn't mean anything either. Anker is currently under fire with Eufy, because you can access the cameras using VLC if you wanted to, and at least for a time, the cameras were uploading footage to the cloud. If we ever have smart water heaters, or have way to control them remotely, that's just ridiculous. Microwaves are already bad enough, but now a smart WATER HEATER?? 

 

I don't think I understand why a fridge would need to know why I'm low on something - all of that just screams privacy concerns to me anyway. I can also literally look in the fridge and figure out what I need or not need, or maybe I don't want it to order something automatically. For the stove/oven, I think local settings could be adjusted without getting too wild with the interface or need for internet. Same goes for being able to adjust the temperature on the fly - there's nothing special about that functionality. No need to overly complicate it. Just let me adjust it while I'm cooking, which I think my 15 year old oven already allows me to do anyway. For washers/dryers, I can just set timers as needed. I think I would agree regarding thermostats, but personally, still no need to connect to the internet or my network. I can just set profiles locally on the device itself. 

 

Smart devices in my opinion are overly complicating already established basic devices, and when it comes to security, they're basically a black box. No regular consumer is going to try to figure out how secure they're smart appliances are, nor should they have to. They should already be secure out-of-the-box. But there's something else that is becoming an issue. The more stuff they integrate into these appliances, the higher the cost. If they're trying to fit their products into a particular price bracket, they either have crappy smart integration, and make the device unusable because of it, or they use crappy internal parts. No way around it. And that also means to have both, you would have to spend a stupid amount of money on what used to be a basic appliance, all for a little bit of extra convenience, when in my opinion, most of these devices require physical presence to use in the first place, especially when it comes to cooking, in the event of a fire. 

[vertigo220]

1 hour ago, Godlygamer23 said:

I don't think I trust any manufacturer of smart devices at this point. I don't think security is taken as seriously as it should with these devices, because they're being rushed to market. But I do hope Philips is taking it seriously.

 

They might only have access to your lights, but I think that's an assumption, and a hacker might be able to figure out a way to use the lights/hub to get into the router, like if the password is not securely stored on the hub. Might be less of an issue with Philips, but for all the other manufacturers out there, particularly no-name brands, it might be particularly easy. But just because it's a name brand doesn't mean anything either. Anker is currently under fire with Eufy, because you can access the cameras using VLC if you wanted to, and at least for a time, the cameras were uploading footage to the cloud. If we ever have smart water heaters, or have way to control them remotely, that's just ridiculous. Microwaves are already bad enough, but now a smart WATER HEATER??

Correct. I don't know, I can only assume/hope. The fact Philips has been making their bulbs/hubs for years longer than Eufy cameras have been a thing (to my knowledge) and yet I haven't seen anything major about them, whereas Eufy and others have "already" had their issues discovered does suggest Philips probably does a better job with it. But I agree, I don't trust any manufacturer, either. I consider the reputation of a manufacturer, both their corporate reputation and the quality of past products, I consider how risky it might be, and I consider how useful it would be. It's a risk-benefit analysis, which we do al the time, just usually on such a small scale we don't even realize we're doing it. And I try to mitigate things as much as I can. I recently bought a security IP cam from some no-name Chinese company, which I then returned because it was a piece of junk, but I wasn't worried about network security or the camera sending my data to China, because I simply created a separate network for it that had access to the LAN, so I could send the video to my computer, but not the WAN, so it couldn't call home or be attacked.

 

1 hour ago, Godlygamer23 said:

I don't think I understand why a fridge would need to know why I'm low on something - all of that just screams privacy concerns to me anyway. I can also literally look in the fridge and figure out what I need or not need, or maybe I don't want it to order something automatically. For the stove/oven, I think local settings could be adjusted without getting too wild with the interface or need for internet. Same goes for being able to adjust the temperature on the fly - there's nothing special about that functionality. No need to overly complicate it. Just let me adjust it while I'm cooking, which I think my 15 year old oven already allows me to do anyway. For washers/dryers, I can just set timers as needed. I think I would agree regarding thermostats, but personally, still no need to connect to the internet or my network. I can just set profiles locally on the device itself. 

 

Smart devices in my opinion are overly complicating already established basic devices, and when it comes to security, they're basically a black box. No regular consumer is going to try to figure out how secure they're smart appliances are, nor should they have to. They should already be secure out-of-the-box. But there's something else that is becoming an issue. The more stuff they integrate into these appliances, the higher the cost. If they're trying to fit their products into a particular price bracket, they either have crappy smart integration, and make the device unusable because of it, or they use crappy internal parts. No way around it. And that also means to have both, you would have to spend a stupid amount of money on what used to be a basic appliance, all for a little bit of extra convenience, when in my opinion, most of these devices require physical presence to use in the first place, especially when it comes to cooking, in the event of a fire. 

You would be able to customize it, so milk would always be ordered but occasional purchases wouldn't. I'm sure you could also set it to ask before ordering, and of course to not order but to simply remind you, perhaps in the form of a text when your phone detects you've left work. I agree, this is all potentially bad for privacy but, like anything, it can be done in a way that's safe for it, with open-source software and E2EE. I'm also not saying I would do it, but most people don't care about their privacy at all, using Google, Facebook, etc without a care, and only care about convenience, which this would offer. And it could also all be controlled by the user, by putting the smart devices on their own network without internet access, so everything is local only. I admitted I was stretching on those examples, and that I agree for most appliances there's very little added utility, certainly not enough to make up for the increased cost and risk and likely reduced reliability. I was simply saying there are benefits, however small, and if somebody wants to spend the money and take on the risk, to each their own.

 

I do agree it becomes an issue if you can't get a dumb device anymore, or if your options for them are severely limited. I also agree smart devices shouldn't rely on customers to protect themselves, and the security should be vastly improved by the manufacturers, who should be responsible and liable for that security, at least to a point. But that has nothing to do with technology, it has to do with regulation, and unfortunately lawmakers generally don't really care about protecting consumers but about protecting the manufacturers whose bribers "lobbyists" pay them to do so. We didn't need to outlaw donuts, we just needed to finally pass laws that prohibit trans fats (yet, somehow, I'm still seeing them in foods all the time, go figure, but then, I also see labels without the added sugars all the time). We similarly don't need to resist smart technology, we need to regulate it so manufacturers aren't selling people that don't know any better products that are potentially harmful.

[discarded]

On 12/3/2022 at 8:21 PM, 7412 said:

For me, it's how smartphone companies have completely given up on pop-up selfie cameras, despite them having suffered no catastrophic failures when they were a thing.

They held up well, and the OnePlus 7 Pro remains to this day the best looking smartphone screen you can get in 2022 despite despite being a 3 year old device.

 

But they went back to notches. All brands did, even Xiaomi (Poco) and Asus (ZenFone).

* over-emphasis on RGB

* black mainboards and cables versus excellent and easy-to-assemble colour-coded models of the past

* desktop cases with no optical drive bays

* over-popularity of black cases and black optical drives and keyboards (bring back beige)

* over-popularity of piano black gloss finishes that were popular for too long

* designed-for-disposal phones and laptops without easily replaceable batteries

* phones with fixed storage and no MicroSD slots

* designed-for-disposal laptops not designed to be upgraded nor have their storage and batteries and RAM easily swapped / replaced / upgraded

* 'normie' phones and tablets filled with spyware from Google and Apple that cannot run custom firmware (such as LineageOS) to put a stop to 24/7 permissionless location tracking going to Google and Apple and countless others, regardless of your wifi, bluetooth and location settings (these settings are just for third-party apps). Rob Braxman Tech has a good discussion of this.