DON’T Throw Away Your Broken Controllers

[jakkuh_t]

 

[Levent]

I have been buying original but broken X360 controllers every time I see one for sale. Finding decent quality analog sticks for them are impossible. You can replace them with replicas but those dont feel great and usually are made for PS2 controllers.

 

Just an FYI for people trying to do the same thing, finding original X360 controllers is very hard especially if you are buying from online sites. Their stickers also differ according to region they are made for so there really is not a great way to find out if they are original without disassembling them and checking the motherboard (This is a relatively good resource for basic identification). Finding original wireless receivers for them are also impossible nowadays.

 

Overall, they are fun to repair, I would recommend it.

[kumicota]

It's funny Linus pushing to repairability, environmental and more while a few weeks ago he was pushing to highly integrated systems(The episode he shilled to SOC's computers) which one of its biggest drawbacks is that you can't repair or upgrade it easily or for cheap.

[ToboRobot]

Fixing tech is great, even it is console controllers.  

[tkitch]

7 minutes ago, Levent said:

I have been buying original but broken X360 controllers every time I see one for sale. Finding decent quality analog sticks for them are impossible. You can replace them with replicas but those dont feel great and usually are made for PS2 controllers.

 

Just an FYI for people trying to do the same thing, finding original X360 controllers is very hard especially if you are buying from online sites. Their stickers also differ according to region they are made for so there really is not a great way to find out if they are original without disassembling them and checking the motherboard (This is a relatively good resource for basic identification). Finding original wireless receivers for them are also impossible nowadays.

 

Overall, they are fun to repair, I would recommend it.

I collected more than a few during the pandemic for shockingly cheap (Including 2 USB PC Receivers)
Apparently I got lucky! 

[reptarded]

I hate when my nipples get cracked or dirty... it's the worst!

[_Froyo]

I've been playing smash bros with my friends since high school, and being the cheapskate I am, I've always been taking apart and putting together gamecube controllers to avoid buying new ones. At first my friends thought I was some kind of tech wizard to get them working, but it was never that hard for me to do. That being said, I never had to replace the stick mechanisms like in the video, so I never had to worry about soldering.

[Ultraforce]

40 minutes ago, kumicota said:

It's funny Linus pushing to repairability, environmental and more while a few weeks ago he was pushing to highly integrated systems(The episode he shilled to SOC's computers) which one of its biggest drawbacks is that you can't repair or upgrade it easily or for cheap.

I might be remembering the video incorrectly but if it's the one talking about how x86 will die it's not one where I would call it shilling and rather just a warning that hey this will likely happen.

[sub68]

I guess its time to desolder and resolder some PS4 controllers

 

[Dooner94]

Hi, recently got a free series s controller off a friend and tried replacing the analog sticks but ask the ones I tried weren’t quite as good (they’d register 100% before reaching the edge of the stick if that makes sense) 

does anyone know a god course for quality replacements?

 I’m in the uk btw 

[Ultraforce]

One thing that I think I know why it didn't get mentioned but is a problem which will likely leave me to leave a gen 1 xbox one elite controller in storage is that the inner grip peeled off. I was able to replace the outer grip fairly easily, but couldn't find any kits for the inner grip.

[MLConian]

7 hours ago, Dooner94 said:

Hi, recently got a free series s controller off a friend and tried replacing the analog sticks but ask the ones I tried weren’t quite as good (they’d register 100% before reaching the edge of the stick if that makes sense) 

does anyone know a god course for quality replacements?

 I’m in the uk btw 

Try https://www.zedlabz.com/ - they're a UK based company, great prices and absolutely love their service. I've been ordering from them for quite some time, all products so far have been to very good standards.

 

I've been fixing my controllers for ages - even took apart new generation devices simply because they're not up to scratch anymore. Starting with the Wii U, manufacturers have switched to smaller stickboxes. That's where the trouble with stick drift really started. They should simply go back to the larger variety. Now I constantly find myself disassembling controllers, cleaning the stickbox, putting a few small pieces of tape on the thumbstick mount to make it sit tighter - rinse and repeat every 4 to 6 months, whereas I never had to service my Xbox 360 controller in the 6 years it was my main console for. I actually replaced my 360 before I replaced the controller.

 

On a related sidenote though, I've been looking up those Gulikit hall sensor sticks for Steam Deck - those boards seem awfully similar to the stick boards on the Wii U controller. Does anyone know if they'd be compatible with the Wii U Gamepad?

[Quackers101]

man, its great to hear that they also agree with controllers getting stupidly expensive with maybe worse quality or less repairability.

xbox 360 controller survived 10+ years, xbox any newer version? died after a few months or a year, one was just acid leak or corrosion from battery being plugged into it when not using.

[Kisai]

19 hours ago, Levent said:

Just an FYI for people trying to do the same thing, finding original X360 controllers is very hard especially if you are buying from online sites. Their stickers also differ according to region they are made for so there really is not a great way to find out if they are original without disassembling them and checking the motherboard (This is a relatively good resource for basic identification). Finding original wireless receivers for them are also impossible nowadays.

 

Overall, they are fun to repair, I would recommend it.

I still have the wireless controllers for my Xbox 360 I never used. I used a wired controller so I could use it on the PC and Xbox 360.  Guess which controller finally died? Yep the wired xbox 360 controller.

 

The rubber on the joysticks are worn off, but I think the malfunction is actually the USB cable. Good luck ever finding another one though.

 

Here's a thought to any enterprising controller designer.

 

Make all controllers have detachable USB-C cables, that also double as the "charging cable" when using a Lithium battery. Use an off-the-shelf AA battery design shape, and then add a separate USB-C PD port inside the battery compartment to allow for small USB-C PD batteries to attach. Thus the user can use either types of batteries, or even decide they still want a cabled USB-C battery, but would rather have a 6' cable end on their living room table than stretch all the way across the living room.

 

The next most complain-able aspect of current generations of controllers is how utterly horrible the analog controller feels now. In particular, the Switch controllers have these high-wearing analog controls. I know some minor analog drift is expected, but that should be like well past 5 years of use, not within 90 days of use. It makes buying the "Switch Lite"'s a potential time bomb. Don't get me started on the buttons either. I played one game, straight through with the Switch's Joycon's and my hands ached for an entire day. The buttons are not great, I'd prefer the feel of the SNES/PSX buttons.

 

I half agree with Linus about the Xbox controllers using AA batteries. I think Microsoft had the right idea, but an incomplete solution.  They should have used USB-C in the battery compartment to allow a USB-C PD attachment. So if people wanted a lightweight battery, they could get one. If they wanted a heavy LR6 battery, they still had that option. The playstation's PS3/PS4/PS5 only real downside is that the batteries can't be replaced like a (2000's) cell phone battery. All this fear of aftermarket batteries is foolish and resulting in more e-waste. 

[kenblu24]

 

11 hours ago, James Evens said:

11 hours ago, Kisai said:

The playstation's PS3/PS4/PS5 only real downside is that the batteries can't be replaced like a (2000's) cell phone battery.

Yes and no.

Sony might be anti repair by not providing manuals and replacement parts. At the same time there products are one of, if not, the best in class regarding reparability.

to replace the PS4 controller battery all you need is a flat head screw driver and PH00. With PS5 controller it takes longer but they made it even simpler and less chance to leave visible marks in the plastic shell.

Yes but there's another benefit to AA batteries: You can keep spares and change them out quickly. Can't do that without a battery door.

 

11 hours ago, Kisai said:

I half agree with Linus about the Xbox controllers using AA batteries. I think Microsoft had the right idea, but an incomplete solution.  They should have used USB-C in the battery compartment to allow a USB-C PD attachment. So if people wanted a lightweight battery, they could get one. If they wanted a heavy LR6 battery, they still had that option.

I'm not a controller designer, but GOD NO. USB-C is not a general purpose connector, and PD is meant for charging, not intra-device power connections. I'm not the most familiar with the PD standard, so maybe you could play hacky wacky with PD and get it to behave, but it'd be a waste of technology. We already have rechargeable aftermarket lithium packs for Xbox controllers. Hell, we even have first party battery packs. https://www.xbox.com/en-US/accessories/batteries-chargers/play-and-charge-kit There's no need to use PD as an intermediary when you can just get a lithium battery already. As for your weird use case of extending a battery connection with a USB-C cable, you can power/charge your controller with a USB battery bank. It's kinda silly and would use power while idle, but it's an option.

[tkitch]

On 7/26/2022 at 2:45 PM, Levent said:

I have been buying original but broken X360 controllers every time I see one for sale. Finding decent quality analog sticks for them are impossible. You can replace them with replicas but those dont feel great and usually are made for PS2 controllers.

 

Just an FYI for people trying to do the same thing, finding original X360 controllers is very hard especially if you are buying from online sites. Their stickers also differ according to region they are made for so there really is not a great way to find out if they are original without disassembling them and checking the motherboard (This is a relatively good resource for basic identification). Finding original wireless receivers for them are also impossible nowadays.

 

Overall, they are fun to repair, I would recommend it.

 So on the topic of XBox controllers:

I'd love to swap the microUSB header with a USB C.  Even at USB2 connections, it'll still do data transfer.  Have you seen a swappable USB C header that can go into a controller?

[Kisai]

2 hours ago, kenblu24 said:

 

I'm not a controller designer, but GOD NO. USB-C is not a general purpose connector, and PD is meant for charging, not intra-device power connections. I'm not the most familiar with the PD standard, so maybe you could play hacky wacky with PD and get it to behave, but it'd be a waste of technology. We already have rechargeable aftermarket lithium packs for Xbox controllers. Hell, we even have first party battery packs. https://www.xbox.com/en-US/accessories/batteries-chargers/play-and-charge-kit There's no need to use PD as an intermediary when you can just get a lithium battery already. As for your weird use case of extending a battery connection with a USB-C cable, you can power/charge your controller with a USB battery bank. It's kinda silly and would use power while idle, but it's an option.

The idea is that there would be a standard "two AA battery" size, standard Lithium battery that fits in the space and attach to a connector that would have all the necessary power/charging safety features that do not exist with AA's. There was a time when NiMH and NiCad batteries were a common way to avoid wasting money on AA batteries, but these batteries were more expensive, and barely lasted long enough to justify the investment in them. No standard, then all battery packs end up proprietary and not interchangeable with other devices. The idea is that there would be the standard AA spring connectors on one side, but a separate contact for USB-PD so that voltage can be negotiated and charge state can be given to the controller.

 

[kenblu24]

Also, there's some #lienus action going on with the middle three controller repairs in the B-roll hehe

[kenblu24]

8 hours ago, Kisai said:

The idea is that there would be a standard "two AA battery" size, standard Lithium battery that fits in the space and attach to a connector that would have all the necessary power/charging safety features that do not exist with AA's. There was a time when NiMH and NiCad batteries were a common way to avoid wasting money on AA batteries, but these batteries were more expensive, and barely lasted long enough to justify the investment in them. No standard, then all battery packs end up proprietary and not interchangeable with other devices. The idea is that there would be the standard AA spring connectors on one side, but a separate contact for USB-PD so that voltage can be negotiated and charge state can be given to the controller.

 

AAs are standard, relatively cheap, and widely available, and best of all, hot-swappable. And you can gauge the charge level by measuring the voltage of the AA battery. Also, all the Lithium battery packs for Xbox have extra pins for communicating with the battery management system inside the pack, which provides a charge level. There's no need to negotiate voltage in this way, and doing so would be terrible engineering anyways since that would imply voltage conversion, which is inefficient and unnecessary for this use case. Microsoft does many things wrong, but they really did try (and succeed imo) with giving you as much choice as possible with the Xbox controller battery system. Slapping PD on a controller would be expensive and inefficient, because every use case you seem to want is already covered by the current system; as an engineer this makes me very confused why you're not happy with it.

[Kisai]

51 minutes ago, kenblu24 said:

AAs are standard, relatively cheap, and widely available, and best of all, hot-swappable. And you can gauge the charge level by measuring the voltage of the AA battery. Also, all the Lithium battery packs for Xbox have extra pins for communicating with the battery management system inside the pack, which provides a charge level. There's no need to negotiate voltage in this way, and doing so would be terrible engineering anyways since that would imply voltage conversion, which is inefficient and unnecessary for this use case. Microsoft does many things wrong, but they really did try (and succeed imo) with giving you as much choice as possible with the Xbox controller battery system. Slapping PD on a controller would be expensive and inefficient, because every use case you seem to want is already covered by the current system; as an engineer this makes me very confused why you're not happy with it.

You seem to be thinking I'm talking about the current Xbox X|S controller and not the Xbox 360 controller and third party controllers that cut corners in the context of the PS3/PS4/PS5 non-removable batteries.

 

The reason I bought the wireless Xbox 360 wired controller in the first place was to avoid having any batteries, because the controller is stupidly heavy with AA batteries, where as the PS3 controller was not. But the launch model PS3 controllers (SIXAXIS) also didn't have the dual shock motors.

 

Let me repeat it again... The feature I'm asking for is a STANDARDIZED "FITS IN THE SPACE OF 2 AA BATTERIES" Lithium battery pack. You know which Lithium batteries are "standard" ? None of them. They are emulating LR6 batteries to some level, but rechargeable batteries (NiCd and NiMH) historically have been poor at doing this because their cells were 1.2V. Lithium batteries are 3.6V. So hooking two in series, the shape of an AA is going to kill your device. Especially if you put them in wrong.

 

I have a version of one of these:

https://www.amazon.ca/Neewer-Dimmable-Panasonic-Samsung-Olympus/dp/B06XDFGDCX/

You know what battery packs are used with these? Either 6 AA batteries, or 1 Sony camera battery. There are also many devices out there that use old Nokia phone batteries.

 

Why is there not a standard sized battery pack? Because we decided that USB-C PD to solve this problem for devices big enough to have buttons. So you end up with solutions like this:

https://www.amazon.ca/POWER-FORCE-PLUS-Rechargeable-Batteries/dp/B09T34X162/

Which is hilariously steered in the wrong direction.

 

The Xbox 360 battery compartment is roughly the same size as those Sony camera batteries. So why didn't Sony just leverage their existing expertise in batteries and use those same smaller capacity infolithium M batteries on their PS controllers with the option to use standard AA's? Cause those lithium batteries were often priced at $30. They'd still be lighter than AA's and you would have forward and backward compatibility with existing battery packs.

 

But hindsight. What is desired is a standard battery pack that can be replaced, which is not accomplished by having proprietary designs.

 

 

[drob182]

Anyone have a good source for replacement snes controller cords? Most places seem to be sold out and for whatever reason the few that I have found so far don't include the male connector to make swapping it out easy 

[Xenronn]

I love that feeling of seeing new content and thinking "Hey I already do that!!"  Nice to know I'm not an anomaly in our post-modern consumerist tech world.

 

I highly recommend fixing controllers rather than buying new for nearly everyone; not only will you save some money in the long run, but it's a great entry point for those who don't usually tinker, and the stakes are (usually) pretty low- after all, you can't break a broken thing MORE.

[Sarra]

I actually think I might buy some Hall Effect sticks for my XBox and PS5 controllers. The XBox controller died literally 91 days after I bought it, the warranty is for 90 days. Right stick freaks out, goes 100% in one direction until you poke it, then after a second, does the same thing. It's not just one axis, either, it's like 'look down and slowly to the left' when it does it.

[JogerJ]

I absolutely hate that PS5 controllers are not compatible with the PS4 and now PS4 controllers regularly sell at similar if not higher price than a PS5 controller.

 

I had a mushy button on my controller and had to replace it with third-party parts. Bought a 5€ kit shipped from China with miscellaneous parts and replaced the membrane. It really does not feel the same, but at least it's better than the older faulty ones. Also be wary of how fragile the plastic clips are if you decide on opening up your controller.

[kenblu24]

On 7/28/2022 at 12:21 PM, Kisai said:

Let me repeat it again... The feature I'm asking for is a STANDARDIZED "FITS IN THE SPACE OF 2 AA BATTERIES" Lithium battery pack. You know which Lithium batteries are "standard" ? None of them. They are emulating LR6 batteries to some level, but rechargeable batteries (NiCd and NiMH) historically have been poor at doing this because their cells were 1.2V. Lithium batteries are 3.6V. So hooking two in series, the shape of an AA is going to kill your device. Especially if you put them in wrong.

...

But hindsight. What is desired is a standard battery pack that can be replaced, which is not accomplished by having proprietary designs.

 

 

Ah. I think I see what you're getting at. I thought this was just about XBone/360 controllers, for which lithium battery packs exist, as opposed to a universal standard for that form factor. Yeah, I gotta agree with you on this; I would love if there were standards for replaceable lithium battery packs. Like, it's especially bad in the power tools department, where each brand has their own battery system. But I think this might be a case of https://xkcd.com/927/, with some extra commercial incentives for proprietary-ness.

 

That said, standard single-cell lithium cells do exist, like 18650, RCR123, etc. But practically nothing uses these except some flashlights. I have a dental curing light that uses RCR123s which is neat though.

 

On 7/28/2022 at 12:21 PM, Kisai said:

Why is there not a standard sized battery pack? Because we decided that USB-C PD to solve this problem for devices big enough to have buttons. So you end up with solutions like this:

https://www.amazon.ca/POWER-FORCE-PLUS-Rechargeable-Batteries/dp/B09T34X162/

Which is hilariously steered in the wrong direction.

Yeah, those things SUCK. Just yesterday I was working on these https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2662828, for which we bought twenty rechargeable 9v batteries. Well, guess what? They couldn't handle the load of the motors starting up, which caused the microcontroller to brownout, causing the whole system to constantly reset. I don't think a standard 2s LiPo battery would have done that...

 

That said, batteries aren't as simple as we'd like them to be. I'm sure there are at least some engineering considerations that help explain why there's no standard for this on top of all the proprietary ecosystem stuff.