AMD fTPM causing random stuttering.

[TomaThePolliwog]

Not sure if this has already been said but there is now an AGESA update (1.2.0.6b) to B550-E boards released just on March 7th.

 

https://rog.asus.com/motherboards/rog-strix/rog-strix-b550-e-gaming-model/

 

I doubt it fixes fTPM, but it may fix other issues.

[whatdoink]

Just to hopefully mitigate "I just saw an update I wonder if this will fix the issue"-posts, read the the AMD statement properly.

AMD expects that flashable customer sBIOS files to be available starting in early May, 2022. Exact BIOS availability timing for a specific motherboard depends on the testing and integration schedule of your manufacturer. Flashable updates for motherboards will be based on AMD AGESA 1207 (or newer).

 

[djmakk]

8 hours ago, whatdoink said:

Just to hopefully mitigate "I just saw an update I wonder if this will fix the issue"-posts, read the the AMD statement properly.

AMD expects that flashable customer sBIOS files to be available starting in early May, 2022. Exact BIOS availability timing for a specific motherboard depends on the testing and integration schedule of your manufacturer. Flashable updates for motherboards will be based on AMD AGESA 1207 (or newer).

 

aligns with the last email I received too:

 

Quote

 

Our engineers have identified that intermittent system stutters may be experienced with fTPM Enabled on Windows 10 and 11 based select Ryzen system configurations.

Currently our engineers are currently working on a fix which will be implemented through an AGESA 1207 or newer BIOS update for your motherboard.

AMD expects that flashable customer BIOS files to be available starting in early May, 2022. Exact BIOS availability timing for a specific motherboard depends on the testing and integration schedule of your manufacturer. 

For more details, please refer the KB article, PA-410.

 

 

[caramelgeoff]

Intermittent System Stutter Experienced with fTPM Enabled on Windows® 10 and 11 | AMD

The funny thing is AMD is claiming a dedicated TPM will fix the issue, whoever that was in this thread saying it doesnt fix and swore up and down: 

[gymleader]

Can anyone see if this windows update fixes your event id 86 errors: https://www.windowslatest.com/2022/03/09/windows-10-kb5011487-21h2-21h1-released-heres-whats-improved/

 

"Fixed an issue where certificate enrollment fails"

 

Before I used to get 2 errors at the same time in event viewer on system startup. One scep error for local system and one for workgroup. I'm now only getting 1 error for workgroup and no longer local system. I don't know how to get rid of workgroup one or why it exists.

[DiceGG]

10 hours ago, gymleader said:

Can anyone see if this windows update fixes your event id 86 errors: https://www.windowslatest.com/2022/03/09/windows-10-kb5011487-21h2-21h1-released-heres-whats-improved/

 

"Fixed an issue where certificate enrollment fails"

 

Before I used to get 2 errors at the same time in event viewer on system startup. One scep error for local system and one for workgroup. I'm now only getting 1 error for workgroup and no longer local system. I don't know how to get rid of workgroup one or why it exists.

Just my two cents:

While it is absolutely possible that it fixes the error messages, I don't know if it fixes the stutters. Would be great if it did though! 
But I think we just have to wait till May for AGESA 1207 to come out, since AMD statet it was something happening on the board/chip, not in the OS. 

[Kirut]

So AMD will fix this in early May?

[Yoge]

2 hours ago, Kirut said:

So AMD will fix this in early May?

My understanding of it is that starting early May, AMD will make a fix available to board partners, meaning manufacturers of motherboards will then have to issue BIOS updates. Not all motherboards will get the fix at the same time and it may take days (unlikely), weeks or more as nothing is confirmed. But since it's an important issue I'd like to think that updates won't delay excessively.

 

So starting early or mid May, you will have to keep an eye on the BIOS update page of your specific motherboard until a BIOS with AGESA 1207 or newer is available for download.

[Cheki]

Is this issue across all AMD boards, or is it only for specific brands, I'm building a system for a friend and I'm seeing if there is a way around it since I have it on my system currently, it's not a problem if its on all boards, but If there is a way to avoid it, I'd love to know

[Mojo-Jojo]

25 minutes ago, Cheki said:

Is this issue across all AMD boards, or is it only for specific brands, I'm building a system for a friend and I'm seeing if there is a way around it since I have it on my system currently, it's not a problem if its on all boards, but If there is a way to avoid it, I'd love to know

It's already been posted on here a few times that AMD has acknowledged the issue and is working on a fix. It's a problem with the fTPM itself, so the CPU. Not any specific board.

[Frizz]

29 minutes ago, Cheki said:

Is this issue across all AMD boards, or is it only for specific brands, I'm building a system for a friend and I'm seeing if there is a way around it since I have it on my system currently, it's not a problem if its on all boards, but If there is a way to avoid it, I'd love to know

Just to clear up any confusion some may have. fTPM is built into the CPU (but has some negotiation within the UEFI firmware). 
However the fix will have to occur across all motherboards since CPUs cannot be directly updated. Their microcode is applied essentially from the firmware on startup. 
More nuanced then that but you get the point. Hope this helps!

[gymleader]

The first AGESA 1.2.0.7 has been deployed by Asus to fix the issue.

 

https://www.overclock.net/threads/asus-rog-x570-crosshair-viii-overclocking-discussion-thread.1728796/page-559#post-28980910

 

MSI is not far behind. I'll report back soon.

 

Edit: Whelp I don't want to be the bearer of bad news but I'm still getting event id 86 errors for workgroup. Before you used to get 2 errors. One for the local system and one for workgroup but local system seemed to be fixed via Windows update for me even before 1.2.0.7 came out.

 

 

Accompanying aida to show it's on 4201

[DiceGG]

Can't find the BIOS on the official Asus website. The link you posted leads towards some google drive files.
I will wait until the stable release on the official sites.

[gymleader]

1 hour ago, DiceGG said:

Can't find the BIOS on the official Asus website. The link you posted leads towards some google drive files.
I will wait until the stable release on the official sites.

https://rog.asus.com/us/motherboards/rog-crosshair/rog-crosshair-viii-dark-hero-model/helpdesk_bios

[DiceGG]

2 hours ago, gymleader said:

https://rog.asus.com/us/motherboards/rog-crosshair/rog-crosshair-viii-dark-hero-model/helpdesk_bios

It only shows the Version 4006 with AGESA V2 PI 1.2.0.6b. At least for me.

[Zips]

On 4/28/2022 at 12:57 AM, gymleader said:

Edit: Whelp I don't want to be the bearer of bad news but I'm still getting event id 86 errors for workgroup. Before you used to get 2 errors. One for the local system and one for workgroup but local system seemed to be fixed via Windows update for me even before 1.2.0.7 came out.

Seeing errors show up is one thing, but how is the actual performance issue?

 

Have you noticed any of the stutter we've all come to know and "love" since trying out 1.2.0.7? I couldn't care less if there are errors being logged if the performance hiccups are fixed.

 

I'm still waiting on Gigabyte to get a new BIOS out but given that they're still on a beta driver for 1.2.0.6 B, I think I'm going to be waiting a while.

[DiceGG]

I finally found the original Asrock SPI module on sale for 10€ a few days ago.
Just LEGO-ed it onto the MB and turned on "route to SPI" in the BIOS.
Maybe it's useless, maybe not, 10 bucks is not the world, I'll give it a try, I thought.
Now the integrety check says I'm ready, the module works fine and I'm good to go for Win11. Windows Update however disagrees, it seems.
( EDIT I just ran this command prompt and now Win Update agrees that my PC is ready: https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/windows-insider-program/windows-11-update-still-says-pc-does-not-meet-requirements-after/m-p/3217149/highlight/true#M14911 )

I still have my fingers crossed for everyone that AMD and the board partners will fix the issue completely and asap.

[gymleader]

@DiceGG You might need to clear your cache or something to see it.

 

 

@Zips Hard to say. I will state that event 86 makes me think they didn't actually figure out what the real reason is and since it's so rare to see anyway, it's almost impossible to say if it's fixed or not. Think we need another 2-3 weeks for all manufacturers to roll out BIOS so there's a much bigger testing size. Usually from people that got it 2-3 times a day. In the day I've briefly used it no noticeable issues so far.

 

I will say when I play Street Fighter online I usually have no complaints from opponents about lag. Today I had 3 people complain that my connection is bad and the only difference in setup was the BIOS change. I ran cmd ping test to known server as I usually do and all was fine so unless these guys were just making excuses as to why they were losing, this AGESA might somehow be introducing some weird network delay. Probably the former (haha) but something for others to look out for.

 

 

[Yoge]

Just as a warning remember to be careful when updating your BIOS, let it complete as many reboots as it needs without interruption even if you see a black screen for a couple of min, and know your options if something goes wrong (check mobo manual). Remember in most cases they are going to be BETA BIOS releases for now, meaning they could fix the stuttering and cause a different problem, and feel free to wait for a stable release if you prefer, you have waited months you can wait a few more weeks.  Before updating BIOS take note of any current settings you want to keep after updating as it will all be reset to default settings, have a backup ready, check if your board supports bios flashback and how to use it, etc. Godspeed!

[AkikoKumagara]

2 hours ago, gymleader said:

Hard to say. I will state that event 86 makes me think they didn't actually figure out what the real reason is and since it's so rare to see anyway, it's almost impossible to say if it's fixed or not. Think we need another 2-3 weeks for all manufacturers to roll out BIOS so there's a much bigger testing size. Usually from people that got it 2-3 times a day. In the day I've briefly used it no noticeable issues so far.

Why are we assuming that error has anything to do with the issue? I haven't seen anything compelling to back this up.

[gymleader]

18 hours ago, AkikoKumagara said:

Why are we assuming that error has anything to do with the issue? I haven't seen anything compelling to back this up.

People with 86 error have stutter. People without 86 error don't. It's fair to make that link.

[AkikoKumagara]

4 hours ago, gymleader said:

People with 86 error have stutter. People without 86 error don't. It's fair to make that link.

Correlation ≠ Causation

 

AMD's explanation of the issue makes a lot of sense and this error at most is a side effect if it is even related, but is almost definitely not the cause. If you've still got the error after several more days but no more stuttering, perhaps it's worth reporting this issue itself.

 

I see no reason to believe that still encountering this error implies your system is still stuttering, that's my point.

[Zips]

On 4/30/2022 at 5:01 PM, gymleader said:

@Zips Hard to say. I will state that event 86 makes me think they didn't actually figure out what the real reason is and since it's so rare to see anyway, it's almost impossible to say if it's fixed or not. Think we need another 2-3 weeks for all manufacturers to roll out BIOS so there's a much bigger testing size. Usually from people that got it 2-3 times a day. In the day I've briefly used it no noticeable issues so far.

 

I will say when I play Street Fighter online I usually have no complaints from opponents about lag. Today I had 3 people complain that my connection is bad and the only difference in setup was the BIOS change. I ran cmd ping test to known server as I usually do and all was fine so unless these guys were just making excuses as to why they were losing, this AGESA might somehow be introducing some weird network delay. Probably the former (haha) but something for others to look out for.

Noted.

 

Be sure to keep us updated on how things are going with this. So far, just the fact that you made it through an entire day or so without any stutter sounds like a promising start. Hopefully the supposed lag is just coincidental (or your opponents were making excuses for losing).

[VelocityXCI]

Any word on a bios update for the X570S Aorus Pro AX? PC is stuttering multiple times a day, it's driving me crazy. Just played Halo Infinite and the FPS crashed down to 4fps for 5-6 seconds. 

[DiceGG]

On 5/3/2022 at 9:56 PM, VelocityXCI said:

Any word on a bios update for the X570S Aorus Pro AX? PC is stuttering multiple times a day, it's driving me crazy. Just played Halo Infinite and the FPS crashed down to 4fps for 5-6 seconds. 

You can check your motherboards support website: https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/X570S-AORUS-PRO-AX-rev-11/support#support-dl-bios