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nicklmg

Let's hope we don't screw this up... - RED Camera Reassembly Highlights

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It's like LEGO.......

 

 

 

 

 

But for Linus Specifically. 


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@DrMacintosh Everything is LEGO at some point. 

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35 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

It's like LEGO.......

 

 

 

 

 

But for Linus Specifically. 

Just like lego.... i mean its like 40 grand but mehh..... minor details


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1 minute ago, driftz240 said:

Just like lego.... i mean its like 40 grand but mehh..... minor details

Hey, LEGO is pretty expensive. 


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Just now, DrMacintosh said:

Hey, LEGO is pretty expensive. 

Actually, for real, it is. I still have thousands of dollars worth of unopened legos downstairs lol. They'll be worth selling one day... maybe... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


 

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I wonder if at the end of all of this, they'll get a real improvement in low light. Because actually a lot of the noise comes from sensor heat, so maybe the first RED with little to no noise past 6400ISO

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In terms of benchmark tests for a camera, I would go for a few low light.
Since a CCD sensor's noise is fairly directly proportional to its temperature. (And also to the size of the sensor, but shouldn't change, unless Linus has magic...)

So a few easily reproducible light levels within a room. And see if the future water cooled camera has less noise in the image should portray the real advantages of a cooler sensor.

 

Audio wise, getting rid of fan noise is also a positive, but not one that would effect image quality all that much.

Also, there is so called Cooled CCD cameras, using peltier coolers to get down to far bellow sub ambient, giving practically noise free images. The youtube channel 

mikeselectricstuff has a pair of videos on the topic, though more electronics oriented as they tear it down to poke about inside it. (And they practically take fairly noise free images in a non lit room... So cooling a CCD sensor can make for some radical improvements.)

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46 minutes ago, Nystemy said:

In terms of benchmark tests for a camera, I would go for a few low light.
Since a CCD sensor's noise is fairly directly proportional to its temperature. (And also to the size of the sensor, but shouldn't change, unless Linus has magic...)

So a few easily reproducible light levels within a room. And see if the future water cooled camera has less noise in the image should portray the real advantages of a cooler sensor.

 

Audio wise, getting rid of fan noise is also a positive, but not one that would effect image quality all that much.

Also, there is so called Cooled CCD cameras, using peltier coolers to get down to far bellow sub ambient, giving practically noise free images. The youtube channel 

mikeselectricstuff has a pair of videos on the topic, though more electronics oriented as they tear it down to poke about inside it. (And they practically take fairly noise free images in a non lit room... So cooling a CCD sensor can make for some radical improvements.)

Yea, but... They have a CMOS camera

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6 minutes ago, Matteo Pignoli said:

Yea, but... They have a CMOS camera

A CCD is a charge-coupled device.
A traditional CCD sensor is an array of charged-coupled devices, who's content get switched onto an analog buss matrix, then amplified with an external chip, send it off to an analog to digital converter chip, before we finally get the data in a digital form.

A CMOS sensor uses a CCD array as well, has the same analog buss matrix, uses an amplifier that is internal to the chip, and has an internal analog to digital converter, + some glue logic to run the show. Ie a CMOS sensor is a CCD sensor with everything else included on the same chip.

So the same cooled CCD advantages applies, though limited by the noise floor of the internal amp/ADC that might not have been designed to have a low enough noise floor for this type of application.

But yes, the RED might be using a CMOS sensor, I haven't taken one apart and checked.

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I think you guys have gotten too far into yourselves because of your success. It is easy to do. Really if you went off and thoughtabout it for awhile do you really need a $40,000 camera. I can see a film studio using one. But obviously your camera has been down for some time and nobody missed it. $10,000 can buy a heck of a camera. The other $30,000 could maybe go to employee bonuses or benefits. Hubris can get away from you.

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9 hours ago, poochyena said:

What happened to the full video?

Was wondering this as well, iirc (forgive me if I'm wrong) they mentioned on the WAN show that was the same day as the original stream that the VOD wasn't uploaded like normal for the stream, and so they would make a highlights of it. Linus I believe mentioned that they would post the full VOD unlisted or similarly but wasn't concrete about it. Would love to be able to see the full thing.

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Was it ever explained why they were able to leave such an expensive camera disassembled for all this time? Seems like a heck of a thing to buy if you don't need it.


If you want good hardware recommendations, please tell us how you intend to use the hardware. There's rarely a single correct answer.

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13 hours ago, uott2 said:

I think you guys have gotten too far into yourselves because of your success. It is easy to do. Really if you went off and thoughtabout it for awhile do you really need a $40,000 camera. I can see a film studio using one. But obviously your camera has been down for some time and nobody missed it. $10,000 can buy a heck of a camera. The other $30,000 could maybe go to employee bonuses or benefits. Hubris can get away from you.

 

38 minutes ago, Cyanara said:

Was it ever explained why they were able to leave such an expensive camera disassembled for all this time? Seems like a heck of a thing to buy if you don't need it.

Last time I checked, they had at least 2 of these cameras, so picking one apart for half a year isn't that bad.

And in the larger scheme of things, the 40 grand camera body is not all that expensive, after all, the rest of the stuff fitted to it can easily outweigh the cost of the camera. (objectives, sound recorders, screen, handles, batteries, memory cards, etc) Not to mention the cost of the other production equipment and studio space, in the end, a 40 grand camera isn't all that expensive.

Secondly, there is a whole LTT video in regards to why they bought these cameras, and yes Brandon does state that they are surely overkill for their needs, but also fulfill their needs very neatly.


Then they also have other non RED cameras that are good in their own regard, and if push comes to shove, Linus would have just put it together earlier, or bought one more. After all, it is a business expense and I wouldn't be surprised if they spend 4 grand a year for toilet paper alone, not to mention other trivial expenses that comes with running a media production company with 25+ employees while staring up a video streaming service on the side.

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14 hours ago, uott2 said:

I think you guys have gotten too far into yourselves because of your success. It is easy to do. Really if you went off and thoughtabout it for awhile do you really need a $40,000 camera. I can see a film studio using one. But obviously your camera has been down for some time and nobody missed it. $10,000 can buy a heck of a camera. The other $30,000 could maybe go to employee bonuses or benefits. Hubris can get away from you.

As @Nystemy said. Having an 8k camera is infinitely useful for them because they only export in 4k, that allows a lot of room for them to make mistakes in shooting and not have to re-shoot. Now, given that LMG content sometimes requires several thousand dollars worth of equipment rentals, not to mention man hour for the hosts and Linus himself a 40k camera quickly begins to make a bit more sense. Lets do some quick math:

 

LTT does not post their wages on the hiring page, and it would be in CAD so it would be meaningless to me anyways. For the sake of doing maths, lets say $20/Hr (this makes 0 sense as they are almost certainly paid a static wage, but this makes my math easier). Now, lets assume a shoot is 3 hours from beginning to end, which I don't deem unreasonable given the jank nature of many LTT videos. That is $60 out of Linus' pocket for a writer to go shoot something in this scenario, and another $60 for the camera man to actually record, not to mention 3 hours of those people not writing, researching a project, or literally doing anything else related to their job.

 

Thats fine, $120 worth of LMG time and 3 man hours isn't much, but now say they did that on a 4k camera, and "Oh s*** nobody white balanced the camera". Those numbers just doubled and it's now substantial. Then multiply that by 25 editors and I think you see where I'm going with this. I haven't been in cinematography for a while, but even at my best I occasionally made a stupid mistake like that. Pardon my shitty napkin math, but the point should be somewhat clear.

 

Could they have gotten a cheaper 8K camera? Probably. But downtime is wasted money and nobody wants that, its the same reason why companies buy thinkpads for their employees. They are not cheap, at all, but they are built with reliability first and everything else second.🤷‍♂️


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Besides the other reasons given, the RED cameras open other options for them. Beyond just youtube videos. Which up the levels of job satisfaction for someone like Brandon, so he can stretch his wings, while staying with LMG. That IS investing in the employees.


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