Oppo Digital Ceasing development of new products

[NickTheMajin]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarcher/2018/04/02/oppo-shock-popular-av-brand-announces-that-its-time-to-say-goodbye/#577bd3d93acc

 

Quote

Oppo Digital has revealed today that it is going to cease development of new products. In a formal press statement, the US brand responsible for some of the AV world’s most respected high-end DVD, Blu-ray and 4K Blu-ray players declared that ‘as Oppo 4K UHD players reach the pinnacle of their performance, it is time to say goodbye’.

The news will likely be received with shock and dismay by legions of serious AV fans given Oppo’s reputation for pushing performance boundaries with its uncompromising, cutting-edge products. It’s especially surprising given that the brand’s recent UDP-203 (reviewed here) and UDP-205 4K Blu-ray players seemed to have proved impressively popular with discerning AV buyers despite their relatively high price points. 

It seems that Oppo’s announcement isn’t just limited to the development of new products, either. It also looks like Oppo is winding down product production entirely. Certainly the Oppo Digital UK press announcement clearly states that the UK arm of the company with only continue to trade ‘while stocks last’, and ‘expects to close its doors in the summer’.

 

Very sad day. OPPO made the best video players on the market with superb build quality and with fantastic customer support. Guess the market just wasn't there for the higher end product. I love my UDP203 and hate to think that my next player might have to be made of cheap plastic from the likes of Sony or Samsung. 

[leadeater]

Noooooo, I have an Oppo BDP-105D and it's so good for the price. I was really looking forward to any of their Atmos and DTS:X products coming out, damn it.

[leadeater]

59 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

what about their Camera; Phone business? o_o

Sounds like just the AV business

[GoodBytes]

To me it indicates that Blu-Ray aren't really taking off. And those who get one, just get a low priced one.

That, or very few people are building premium home theater setups anymore. More and more people are watching what they are spending.

[dizmo]

@NickTheMajin Why would you have to downgrade to something worse in the future? Just keep using the Oppo. I don't think there's really any chance we'll see a new physical media format come into existence. 

 

2 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

To me it indicates that Blu-Ray aren't really taking off. And those who get one, just get a low priced one.

That, or very few people are building premium home theater setups anymore. More and more people are watching what they are spending.

I think it's just too niche of a market. Most people stream or download. Which, still, is odd, as there are other niche products and companies do quite well. To me it sort of sounds like there's something else going on. 

[silberdrachi]

15 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

To me it indicates that Blu-Ray aren't really taking off. And those who get one, just get a low priced one.

That, or very few people are building premium home theater setups anymore. More and more people are watching what they are spending.

Anecdote Warning: I know one person who buys dvds (not even blue-rays), everyone else i know has netflix or amazon prime or both. I myself only own 4 DVDs and i cant remember the last time i actually watched one. And the only machine in my place with a dvd/blue ray player is my Xbox One.

 

Blue-Rays are great if you have a super high end TV that has 4k HDR (OLED or some real good local dimming system) and you want to get the most out of it. But the average consumer doesnt seem to care about that as much as cost and ease of use. Those TV systems are real expensive and dont really seem like youre quite getting your money worth out of it. And sure netflix can have some horrible artifacting on really dark scenes, but it takes 2 seconds to log in and costs $10 a month to watch whatever you want.

 

Not to mention while we arent in a recession now (supposedly????) a lot of people are keeping a closer watch on their savings/debt ratio than they were in 2007. People are more apt to pay down credit card debt than buy a new TV now, so some of the high end markets are possibly feeling it a little. Though every single time an article comes out saying that, economists go into a tizzy trying to determine if saving/paying off debt is good or bad for the economy, so i cant say too much there.

[IronSoldier]

4k Disc is the physical format we are stuck with for what the next few years at least. Oppo players support all the various formats, technologies and outputs you'd need right now plus have hardware which should handle future options via firmware updates (HDR10+ for example). They don't have issues playing discs for the most part unlike some of the cheaper units so what's the point of burning cash the make new products which are essentially the same as the last. Dyson did the same recently dropping corded vacuums from future releases. It had peaked in size, power and weight and now they want to focus on something else where technology can move forward and they can actually make more money since those products are in demand from consumers to a higher degree. 

[BuckGup]

32 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

To me it indicates that Blu-Ray aren't really taking off. And those who get one, just get a low priced one.

That, or very few people are building premium home theater setups anymore. More and more people are watching what they are spending.

I agree most don't care about quality as online video services like netflix are cheap and have ok quaility. But compared to a UHD Blu-Ray all online video sites are horrendous 

[NickTheMajin]

30 minutes ago, dizmo said:

@NickTheMajin Why would you have to downgrade to something worse in the future? Just keep using the Oppo. I don't think there's really any chance we'll see a new physical media format come into existence. 

 

I think it's just too niche of a market. Most people stream or download. Which, still, is odd, as there are other niche products and companies do quite well. To me it sort of sounds like there's something else going on. 

 

Most people stream but when you have a nice setup you want the best possible quality. I didn’t buy a 4K Oled and Martin Logan electrostatic speakers to watch compressed content. 

 

People like us, the enthusiasts are in the minority though. 

[GoodBytes]

14 minutes ago, silberdrachi said:

Not to mention while we arent in a recession now (supposedly????) a lot of people are keeping a closer watch on their savings/debt ratio than they were in 2007. People are more apt to pay down credit card debt than buy a new TV now, so some of the high end markets are possibly feeling it a little. Though every single time an article comes out saying that, economists go into a tizzy trying to determine if saving/paying off debt is good or bad for the economy, so i cant say too much there.

Agree with everything you said.

Just wanted to say: While technically we are out of a recession, many people:

• Perform miss investments. Doesn't do its research properly, and follows bank advice solely (which are their to make money on you), makes you buy a home that they can barely afford or at all.
• Spends in general more than what should be doing (get a second or third car, or spend to much on a car, by getting fancier models/Trims), while they can't really afford them, or at all.
• Things are more expensive, but wages have not catched up.

So in other words, many people might have the big home, the nice car, but they live pay check by pay check, with no or little savings. So they can't afford the fancy home entertainment system

[GoldenLag]

I might come inn as some lazy person, but im probably just going to pick up ak used console to get the newer features like dolby atmos.

 

My current DVD player is my Xbox 360 and my current Blu-ray player is the Xbox one

 

Wouldnt mind picking up angood Blu-ray player, however my consumption of Blu-ray is strict to Anime and good (older) movies.

[leadeater]

39 minutes ago, NickTheMajin said:

Martin Logan electrostatic speakers to watch compressed content. 

Hey another ML owner 

[NickTheMajin]

11 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Hey another ML owner 

Got Theos speakers in the front and Motion 15s in the back right now. Trying to do impressions at the end of the year and move my Theos to the surround left and right. 

 

See how big my holiday paychecks are haha. 

[leadeater]

14 minutes ago, NickTheMajin said:

Got Theos speakers in the front and Motion 15s in the back right now. Trying to do impressions at the end of the year and move my Theos to the surround left and right. 

 

See how big my holiday paychecks are haha. 

Nice, mine are much older (had them for a really long time), Aeon i. I use Bose 301's as rears/surrounds, one of the best sounding speakers for that role even for how cheap they are. For home cinema I like for everything to be 8" or extremely good 6.5".

 

Also got the ML Grotto sub.

[GoodBytes]

Another reason, I was thinking, is that many sound systems have built-on Blu-ray players, and people are happy with that, despite the cheaper built quality die to price, and the slow responsiveness.

 

[Commodus]

Really not surprised by this. and I don't think Oppo is that sad, either.

 

Blu-ray was already something of a last gasp for physical media, but 4K Blu-ray really did come across as trying to delay the inevitable -- basically, it's 4K for that subset of people who insist on the best possible quality and don't mind that all physical media will likely become obsolete in a few years.  Oppo was going to have an increasingly hard time justifying incremental updates to Blu-ray players when 4K HDR streaming and downloads are already good enough for most people, and will likely get better as HEVC and faster connections allow for improved quality.

 

That and, of course, Oppo is much better known for its phone business these days than its AV equipment.  No sense hanging on to a business that's now much smaller than your cash cow, and which is unlikely to ever bounce back.

[AshleyAshes]

4 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

To me it indicates that Blu-Ray aren't really taking off. And those who get one, just get a low priced one.

That, or very few people are building premium home theater setups anymore. More and more people are watching what they are spending.

UHD BD really has an uphill battle.  First, even with a 65" 4K, honest to god I can NOT tell the difference between 4K and 1080p content from my couch.  I just can't.  In GAMES it's an improvement since it often makes fine 'noisy' details look nicer with less shimmering and stuff but movies don't have that issue at any resolution ANYWAY.

 

Now there is HDR, but you need an HDR TV, a -real- HDR TV.  Most cheaper one's on the market are not HDR but rather can input HDR signals and display them 'correctly' but in more or less SDR range.  So the consumer see's no improvement.  I have one of those 'fake' HDR TVs and yeah, any HDR content on THAT does NOT make me go 'Ooo'.  But I've seen it on expensive OLEDs and it's nice there.  And even for the GOOD HDR TVs that's a HELL of an investment for additional dynamic range.

 

UHD BD over BD just does NOT inspire the same 'Oh... My... God...' feeling that BD over DVD does.

[GoodBytes]

45 minutes ago, AshleyAshes said:

UHD BD really has an uphill battle.  First, even with a 65" 4K, honest to god I can NOT tell the difference between 4K and 1080p content from my couch.  I just can't.  In GAMES it's an improvement since it often makes fine 'noisy' details look nicer with less shimmering and stuff but movies don't have that issue at any resolution ANYWAY.

 

Now there is HDR, but you need an HDR TV, a -real- HDR TV.  Most cheaper one's on the market are not HDR but rather can input HDR signals and display them 'correctly' but in more or less SDR range.  So the consumer see's no improvement.  I have one of those 'fake' HDR TVs and yeah, any HDR content on THAT does NOT make me go 'Ooo'.  But I've seen it on expensive OLEDs and it's nice there.  And even for the GOOD HDR TVs that's a HELL of an investment for additional dynamic range.

 

UHD BD over BD just does NOT inspire the same 'Oh... My... God...' feeling that BD over DVD does.

Most UHD movies are upscaled ones, sadly, and not firmed in 4K (or higher). So, it is like watching a 1080p movie with a good TV upscaler.

So it makes the case for UHD harder. The movies that shine more with 4K are some of the, mostly newer Pixar movies, as they can re-render the movie in higher definition, if it was not already done. So 4K wins more there, especially if the textures on models are in higher definition... basically like games. Games look nicer in 4K because the textures are there, the models are higher polygon counts, viewing distance is higher, and we have the display to shine these finer details that would not be normally visible.

[Mira Yurizaki]

5 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

Most UHD movies are upscaled ones, sadly, and not firmed in 4K (or higher). So, it is like watching a 1080p movie with a good TV upscaler.

So it makes the case for UHD harder. The movies that shine more with 4K are some of the, mostly newer Pixar movies, as they can re-render the movie in higher definition, if it was not already done. So 4K wins more there, especially if the textures on models are in higher definition... basically like games. Games look nicer in 4K because the textures are there, the models are higher polygon counts, viewing distance is higher, and we have the display to shine these finer details that would not be normally visible.

I forgot where I read it, but I heard the reason why this is is because digital special effects are done in 1080p because the studios haven't bothered to upgrade their machines to handle 4K.

 

And well, I'm sure no amount of post-processing is going to make 1080p special effects look good in 4K

[AshleyAshes]

5 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

I forgot where I read it, but I heard the reason why this is is because digital special effects are done in 1080p because the studios haven't bothered to upgrade their machines to handle 4K.

 

And well, I'm sure no amount of post-processing is going to make 1080p special effects look good in 4K

Well, I work in visual effects and let me clarify this for you:  4K costs more money.  It's not just 'Well, we didn't upgrade our machines' it's 'Well, that requires SIGNIFICANTLY more resources.  How much are you willing to pay?'  Everything has a budget and resolution is indeed PART of a budget. Since most theaters are only setup with 2K projectors the increased costs of contracting for 4K VFX is not that attractive.

[Mira Yurizaki]

2 minutes ago, AshleyAshes said:

it's 'Well, that requires SIGNIFICANTLY more resources.  How much are you willing to pay?' 

Alternatively, how much are you willing to lose?

 

It's a classic chicken and egg problem.

[GoodBytes]

1 minute ago, AshleyAshes said:

Well, I work in visual effects and let me clarify this for you:  4K costs more money.  It's not just 'Well, we didn't upgrade our machines' it's 'Well, that requires SIGNIFICANTLY more resources.  How much are you willing to pay?'  Everything has a budget and resolution is indeed PART of a budget. Since most theaters are only setup with 2K projectors the increased costs of contracting for 4K VFX is not that attractive.

Very true, come to think about it.

All needs to be reworked (assuming the film footage was done in 4K in the first place) for, essentially, disk release which is probably not that much sales compared to movie theater, even if you include Netflix and similar services into the mix.

[AshleyAshes]

4 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

Alternatively, how much are you willing to lose?

No, it's not.  this is not a chicken and the egg issue.  It's a business.  You don't spend the money to MASSIVELY invest in resources and then offer usage of those additional resources for FREE.  Asking for 4K does not SUDDENLY become the same cost as 1080p, because it will ALWAYS use more resources.  A render farm who would be spending resources on 4K renders could be doing 4 times as many 1080p jobs in the same amount of time.  So weather a VFX company needs to buy more resources or already has those resources on hand, they are always going to CHARGE for those resources.  This is film and TV, it's not a charity.

[AshleyAshes]

13 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

Very true, come to think about it.

All needs to be reworked (assuming the film footage was done in 4K in the first place) for, essentially, disk release which is probably not that much sales compared to movie theater, even if you include Netflix and similar services into the mix.

Yeah, a lot of people forget that even  your BIGGEST movies have budgets and even individual shots have budges.  The hours and resources to be invested in them are budgeted and overruns are to be avoided, just like any business.  I get that from the outside it so often looks like 'Spend all the dollars, get all the stuff' but nothing is bottomless.  Days on in certain location or spent filming are budged.  The sizes of the sets constructed are budged.  Where the locations even ARE are budgeted.  And yeah, the VFX are budgeted.  And a client may bid for a BUNCH of things and come back later and be like 'We we only have 70% of the money we thought we would for this, we need to reduce scope. :3  Oopsies'.  Only, ya know, the PROBABLY sound more business like.  I dunno, I'm not in those meetings, all I hear is 'The client committed your shot you don't have to do it anymore! :D'

[Guest]

I guess it was bound to happen as services like Netflix etc take over from Blu-Ray / DVD.