How come we only have 3 CPU/GPU brands?

[iiNNeX]

Have you ever wondered how come nobody else has come up with a CPU or a GPU other than Nvidia, intel and AMD? (rip ATI)

 

Do you think they are too far ahead for anyone to catch up? Or perhaps something else limiting Startups? Potentially might be too expensive to get into...

 

Let's see your thoughts.

[NMS]

Why even bother when these 2 companies would simply destroy any newcomer to the market.

[sazrocks]

It’s mainly who actually gets to use the x86 architecture (which, AFAIK is Intel, AMD, and VIA). Other people can’t legally build an x86 cpu as Intel holds the copyright for it and isn’t likely to license it out to any more people.

[Master Disaster]

Short answer: making chips is hard AF.

[Wauthar]

CPU wise, there are more than just Intel and AMD. Qualcom and Samsung come to mind, but they're more focussed on the mobile markets.

Back in the day, there used to be loads for both products, but they either went under or got bought by bigger companies.

[NinJake]

4 minutes ago, iiNNeX said:

Potentially might be too expensive to get into...

This plus the risk of dumping all the money with a potential for 0 return if it flops. Nobody wants to lose money. If someone has the startup cash for something like this, they are probably better off investing that money in a different market.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, sazrocks said:

It’s mainly who actually gets to use the c86 architecture (which, AFAIK is Intel, AMD, and VIA). Other people can’t legally build an x86 cpu as Intel holds the copyright for it and isn’t likely to license it out to any more people.

Actually amd has the copyright for it. If you look even in your intel 64 bit computer there is a folder called AMD64, not Intel64.

[iiNNeX]

2 minutes ago, NinJake said:

This plus the risk of dumping all the money with a potential for 0 return if it flops. Nobody wants to lose money. If someone has the startup cash for something like this, they are probably better off investing that money in a different market.

That is true but so many years without competition for those 3 is just... crazy to me. Look at the phone market, went from like 40 brands to more like 10 now, but even then they are competitive af and new brands do pop up here and there.

[Apepa]

4 minutes ago, Almostbauws said:

Actually amd has the copyright for it. If you look even in your intel 64 bit computer there is a folder called AMD64, not Intel64.

They both do, amd64 is an extension of the architecture Intel first developed in the 1970s and later licenced to AMD.

[DocSwag]

7 minutes ago, iiNNeX said:

That is true but so many years without competition for those 3 is just... crazy to me. Look at the phone market, went from like 40 brands to more like 10 now, but even then they are competitive af and new brands do pop up here and there.

Doesn't mean they're all profitable. IIRC only Samsung and apple are profitable and Samsung is just barely so.

[BluJay614]

12 minutes ago, Wauthar said:

CPU wise, there are more than just Intel and AMD. Qualcom and Samsung come to mind, but they're more focussed on the mobile markets.

Back in the day, there used to be loads for both products, but they either went under or got bought by bigger companies.

Well, there is also Apple and ARM.

[Thermosman]

14 minutes ago, sazrocks said:

It’s mainly who actually gets to use the c86 architecture (which, AFAIK is Intel, AMD, and VIA). Other people can’t legally build an x86 cpu as Intel holds the copyright for it and isn’t likely to license it out to any more people.

Yay monopolies.

Maybe Via will actually start making chips and we can get more competition

[DocSwag]

2 minutes ago, BluJay614 said:

Well, there is also Apple and ARM.

I'm guessing they mean consumer desktop. Since on mobile there's a fair number of competitors and in server there's IBM and now Qualcomm

[BluJay614]

Just now, DocSwag said:

I'm guessing they mean consumer desktop. Since on mobile there's a fair number of competitors and in server there's IBM and now Qualcomm

Qualcomm has also been getting into the laptop space.

[DocSwag]

Just now, Thermosman said:

Yay monopolies.

Maybe Via will actually start making chips and we can get more competition

They made a partnership with a Chinese company to make chips IIRC. I think it was Zhaoxing. The chips so far are pretty crap though: TSMC 28nm based, at max 8c 8t at 2 ghz with bulldozer level ipc.

[DocSwag]

Just now, BluJay614 said:

Qualcomm has also been getting into the laptop space.

Consumer desktop not consumer laptop . Though that is true, I did kind of forget about them.

 

At the same time though, their performance isn't quite at amd/intel level yet.

[orbitalbuzzsaw]

I'm waiting for Qualcomm ARM desktop chips - they've already got Windows working so it's only a matter of time.

[Thermosman]

Just now, DocSwag said:

They made a partnership with a Chinese company to make chips IIRC. I think it was Zhaoxing. The chips so far are pretty crap though: TSMC 28nm based, at max 8c 8t at 2 ghz with bulldozer level ipc.

Dont think they have released yet

https://www.viatech.com/en/silicon/processors/

[iiNNeX]

2 minutes ago, DocSwag said:

They made a partnership with a Chinese company to make chips IIRC. I think it was Zhaoxing. The chips so far are pretty crap though: TSMC 28nm based, at max 8c 8t at 2 ghz with bulldozer level ipc.

Well that is a start at least, competition is healthy for us consumers.

[DocSwag]

6 minutes ago, Thermosman said:

Dont think they have released yet

https://www.viatech.com/en/silicon/processors/

http://en.zhaoxin.com/solution.aspx?id=3

6 minutes ago, iiNNeX said:

Well that is a start at least, competition is healthy for us consumers.

They still aren't that close though. They also have affiliations with the Chinese government iirc. So I'm not sure how happy the US government would be about it.

[SpaceGhostC2C]

1. Patent hoarding
2. Large entry costs, fixed costs
3. I guess I could have said just "huge barriers to entry" and call it a day, but who'd want a 1-item list?

[Apepa]

Basically, it costs a lot of money to do the research and development, and even then you have to contend with patents, especially if you want it to be compatible with existing software.

 

Intel and AMD have a lot of cross-licensing agreements in place so that both companies can use each other's innovations to ensure compatibility. The same sort of situation exists in the mobile market, with most chip designers like Apple and Qualcomm licensing ARM's architecture and  modifying it.

 

[Crunchy Dragon]

2 minutes ago, Apepa said:

patents

Read this as "parents".....

 

Don't mine me, just passing through....

[iiNNeX]

21 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Read this as "parents".....

 

Don't mine me, just passing through....

Yeah that parent hoarding is real

[sazrocks]

4 hours ago, Almostbauws said:

Actually amd has the copyright for it. If you look even in your intel 64 bit computer there is a folder called AMD64, not Intel64.

1. I didn’t say anything about x86-64 or amd64.

2. x86-64/amd64 is an extension to x86, which intel owns. Therefore intel has the copyright for x86 and amd has the copyright for the extension of x86, amd64.

4 hours ago, Thermosman said:

Yay monopolies.

Maybe Via will actually start making chips and we can get more competition

Not really sure how three competing companies in an industry is a monopoly.

 

Via does make chips.