Corridor Calls Out LTT on RED Video

[DIT]

So I finally decided to sign up to the LTT forums as the second I saw Sam and Niko's video I knew there would be some serious discussions going down. 

 

First things first I work in the film and tv industry as Digital Imaging Technician, my job on-set is to essentially handle and process all the data on set, technician support for the camera, become a bridge between the camera and editorial. But along with that handle the colour and look of the production either through live grading (manipulating the colours in real time and distributing this out to all the on-set monitors) or near set grading, where I get full mags and grade them away from set and these are then delivered as Dailies to Editorial and then back to the director. 

 

With a bit of my background and experience explained - I am very much with the Sam and Niko on this one. Although it's kind of very hard to pinpoint one underlying point. 

I understand Linus making a video to get views but it does say a lot about his understanding of the subject, as yes the prices are very high but you need to look at it from the perspective of films costing millions and millions of dollars. 

 

When I'm on set working on a film with 250 million dollars behind it you don't want some shitty ass cable pissing off the director. "Oh sorry Mr.Bay we are having to find a new cable as this $5 cable just shorted out and this means we have to delay your shot", time is money on this film sets. Lemo cables are firstly not only used by RED they are an industry standard cable, Arri use them, Sony use them, Canon use them even the Sound dept use Lemo connections for certain tasks. It's a robust cable, it has a good locking mechanism, good shielding, good water resistance,  good build quality and the list goes on. 

 

For some one like Linus who does not work in the field of major major productions - yes compared to and SSD or HDMI cable of course $2,000 is going to seem like a lot. Lenses for example can cost upwards for $100,000 EACH not for a set each. But in my industry we need the best cables, we need reliable safe media that can run in extreme heat and extreme cold and be battered around like no mans business. 

 

You also have to look at development costs on smaller scales - the R&D on these types of things is huge and when you maybe sell a few thousand camera's a year. You need to get that return on investment, this cost gets paid for by the consumer of these products and if productions and rental houses are willing to pay for them it's going to keep on happening. 

 

I love LTT, nothing against them but when I did see his video I just cringed....

 

If anyone has any questions feel free to ask away

 

[Treiskaideka]

Those points about it improving the worth and value of LMG as a Media Group are pretty good.

I enjoyed the recent high quality short videos a lot ( I wish they would do those more often  ) 

But yeah, I rewatched the original Holy $hit video and had pretty much the same feeling about it as I did when it just came out:
While i found it mostly highly amusing, the rant was just too much. I didn't know too much about RED cameras beforehand, other than that they are for professional, Cinema grade type of use. 
So the part of buying every single item separetly to fit your specific work case doesn't really surprise me, nor would I have expected it otherwise. I mean, good DSLRs also don't come with lenses, and it depends on your use case for what lens you need. 
Even back then  I thought the video really would have needed a part at the end that balances it out. Maybe explaining that it's basically overkill (a common occurrence on LTT) and why they thought to invest in it. There are other rant-y or otherwise played up showcases or non-serious reviews that have this. 
Because if you only watch that video, it would also imply Linus as dumb for spending so much money. 

So, I knew that they play it up because that's fun. But I'm a regular viewer of the channel who knows about the product already.  

[Misanthrope]

5 minutes ago, DIT said:

So I finally decided to sign up to the LTT forums as the second I saw Sam and Niko's video I knew there would be some serious discussions going down. 

 

First things first I work in the film and tv industry as Digital Imaging Technician, my job on-set is to essentially handle and process all the data on set, technician support for the camera, become a bridge between the camera and editorial. But along with that handle the colour and look of the production either through live grading (manipulating the colours in real time and distributing this out to all the on-set monitors) or near set grading, where I get full mags and grade them away from set and these are then delivered as Dailies to Editorial and then back to the director. 

 

With a bit of my background and experience explained - I am very much with the Sam and Niko on this one. Although it's kind of very hard to pinpoint one underlying point. 

I understand Linus making a video to get views but it does say a lot about his understanding of the subject, as yes the prices are very high but you need to look at it from the perspective of films costing millions and millions of dollars. 

 

When I'm on set working on a film with 250 million dollars behind it you don't want some shitty ass cable pissing off the director. "Oh sorry Mr.Bay we are having to find a new cable as this $5 cable just shorted out and this means we have to delay your shot", time is money on this film sets. Lemo cables are firstly not only used by RED they are an industry standard cable, Arri use them, Sony use them, Canon use them even the Sound dept use Lemo connections for certain tasks. It's a robust cable, it has a good locking mechanism, good shielding, good water resistance,  good build quality and the list goes on. 

 

For some one like Linus who does not work in the field of major major productions - yes compared to and SSD or HDMI cable of course $2,000 is going to seem like a lot. Lenses for example can cost upwards for $100,000 EACH not for a set each. But in my industry we need the best cables, we need reliable safe media that can run in extreme heat and extreme cold and be battered around like no mans business. 

 

You also have to look at development costs on smaller scales - the R&D on these types of things is huge and when you maybe sell a few thousand camera's a year. You need to get that return on investment, this cost gets paid for by the consumer of these products and if productions and rental houses are willing to pay for them it's going to keep on happening. 

 

I love LTT, nothing against them but when I did see his video I just cringed....

 

If anyone has any questions feel free to ask away

 

Please read my replies: Linus Media Group is a professional production company, not just "youtube videos" and that's likely why he bought the equipment. I understand your point but it doesn't justifies Red at all: if they wanted they could easily build in the R&D costs and margins they want on the sensor unit itself, not the stupid cables and LCD screen.

 

Just because they could sell the accessories at a reasonable price doesn't means that they'd need to get rid of the proprietary nature of them if the aim is to ensure users are only on their ecosystem that just doesn't has an inherit markup price this high. Nothing does in fact and red could just decide to charge 100 or 150 thousand for a sensor unit instead of just 50k and make up for it with expensive accessories: that's just deceiving and dishonest.

[DaftBehemoth]

5 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

I could have done without the mask stuff stitched in but really good video overall. It can basically be summarized as "You're making YouTube videos and you bought a camera meant for video shoots that costs millions upon millions of dollars. You're not the intended audience".

Side note: I am looking at their $50 Camera vs $50,000 Camera video and it is like a breath of fresh air to see actual informative content on YouTube. Thanks for showing me this channel.

 

 

Anyway, I think this brings up an issue I have been worried about ever since Linus started saying he cared more about making money than to make things he is proud of (not his exact words obviously). If he thinks (and might be correct) that he will get more views by posting these rant-type videos, even if he needs to pretend to be ignorant about the product then I could see him doing it. That's just being dishonest and feeding his viewers with false assumptions and information. It really puts his credibility into question.

 

Please keep in mind that I have not watched the original video (or any videos outside of the WANk show for a long time) so I am basing that on a fairly limited exposure to his recent videos, and his behavior in the past. Things might be different though. Maybe he made it clear that he was just being sarcastic, or pretending to be ignorant.

Corridor's vlog/behind the Scenes channel follows a format of splitting between two stories throughout the video, which is why the mask stuff was there. It was a follow up to a previous video. But yeah, they make some good stuff. Great shorts on the main Corridor channel, and generally very interesting content on the Sam and Niko channel.

 

And my own biased opinion is that while Linus has made it clear how they handle videos, I don't think they've strayed far from their usual values. Linus is okay with having some meh filler videos (the "SLI" Nvidia thumb drives, for example) in between more interesting content (like the Deadmau5 studio tour). I'm fine with that as well. At the end of the day, LMG is a company and they have employees to pay. Daily videos with clickbait thumbnails will do that. You can't exactly check out a quantum computer every day, so things need padding to work. Rant videos do happen, but they're few and far between, and from my own perspective, he's generally been pretty on point (for example, calling out Intel's BS with the i9 release). In the case of the actual RED video, I do think he was genuinely ignorant (I don't mean that in a mean way) on some of the things that were bought for the camera. Professional video production equipment has never been his forte, so I don't think it's too strange to think that he wouldn't know everything about it... Things could change in the future, but I think Linus is a pretty stand up guy and has been pretty blunt with how the channel has been handled. I don't think there's much to worry about. 

At the end of the day, I think Linus made a silly video ranting about production equipment that's completely overkill for his application... But overkill is what Linus does, so it's not like I'm judging them for it, hell my computer is comparatively even more stupid... But with that, I think it's fair to take judgement from people that REALLY know their shit when it comes to cinema equipment.

[Treiskaideka]

Btw, did LTT ever do a resume or review about RED? 
I'd really love to hear Brandon's opinion about all this 

[DaftBehemoth]

1 minute ago, Treiskaideka said:

Btw, did LTT ever do a resume or review about RED? 
I'd really love to hear Brandon's opinion about all this 

No, not yet. Would also be interested to hear Brandon's thoughts on it. Sam and Niko's comparison of the RED vs a $50 camera was really good though. (crap, now it seems like I'm straight up advertising for them...)

[LAwLz]

2 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

Please read my replies: Linus Media Group is a professional production company, not just "youtube videos" and that's likely why he bought the equipment. I understand your point but it doesn't justifies Red at all: if they wanted they could easily build in the R&D costs and margins they want on the sensor unit itself, not the stupid cables and LCD screen.

 

Just because they could sell the accessories at a reasonable price doesn't means that they'd need to get rid of the proprietary nature of them if the aim is to ensure users are only on their ecosystem that just doesn't has an inherit markup price this high. Nothing does in fact and red could just decide to charge 100 or 150 thousand for a sensor unit instead of just 50k and make up for it with expensive accessories: that's just deceiving and dishonest.

You know, a lot of the things Linus bought have third party alternatives.

It's like buying Apple branded RAM for a Macbook back when you could throw in any RAM you wanted.

 

Does that cable cost 250 dollars to make? No, not even close.

Did Linus have to buy that expensive cable? No, because you can find a bunch of them on for example eBay if you want. They won't be Red branded, and they will probably be a lot more cheaply made, but they will cost like 1/5 of the price. I mean, correct me if I am wrong but isn't the cable used for the Red camera just a 5 pin to 4 pin Lemo cable? Here is one for 45 dollars on Amazon (haven't looked into it much so it might be the wrong cable).

[Princess Luna]

Something must be very wrong with me taking into consideration what a couple of people is saying because I feel YouTube videos on 1080p are of good enough quality already.

[DIT]

22 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

Please read my replies: Linus Media Group is a professional production company, not just "youtube videos" and that's likely why he bought the equipment. I understand your point but it doesn't justifies Red at all: if they wanted they could easily build in the R&D costs and margins they want on the sensor unit itself, not the stupid cables and LCD screen.

 

Just because they could sell the accessories at a reasonable price doesn't means that they'd need to get rid of the proprietary nature of them if the aim is to ensure users are only on their ecosystem that just doesn't has an inherit markup price this high. Nothing does in fact and red could just decide to charge 100 or 150 thousand for a sensor unit instead of just 50k and make up for it with expensive accessories: that's just deceiving and dishonest.

Here is something you need to understand before RED came along the industry was hugely inflated. Sony charging £150,000 for a camera - RED is the "innovator" in this sector they actually drove down prices and made it more competitive. They made 4K widely available to shooters, I've owned a RED Epic and a RED Dragon. I didn't have close to the money Linus has but I didn't moan about the prices. 

 

Back to the point about cables - RED don't make the connectors themselves if you want to buy a Lemo connector by itself no wire no nothing you would be looking at $50-$60, times that by two you've got $120, you then need to pay for the wire, the shielding, the neck and then pay someone to solder it all up. If you want to get into the "Professional" world you need to pay the professional prices - nobody else cries about it. The same can be said for any industry cars, planes, books, phones. You pay for the quality of product, customer care and support the on niche of the product. 

 

There is going to be so many comments just like yours flying around from people who don't know the industry or how it works or why these things cost so much. I understand from your perspective $240 is stupid in the context of our industry nobody bats and eye lid.  You are paying for the security to know this cable will work under and conditions you put it into and how do you know the R&D costs were not millions and millions of dollars anyway ? 

 

If Linus is worried about the price of a $240 cable he shouldn't be buying that camera enough said. 

 

 

EDIT - I would also like to point out Linus did not need to but that cable. The RED LCD monitors have metal pins on the bottom that attach right to the camera so don't need a cable between the monitor and the camera. So he chose to purchase that cable knowing full well he could have used the "no cable" option. 

[DIT]

5 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

You know, a lot of the things Linus bought have third party alternatives.

It's like buying Apple branded RAM for a Macbook back when you could throw in any RAM you wanted.

 

Does that cable cost 250 dollars to make? No, not even close.

Did Linus have to buy that expensive cable? No, because you can find a bunch of them on for example eBay if you want. They won't be Red branded, and they will probably be a lot more cheaply made, but they will cost like 1/5 of the price. I mean, correct me if I am wrong but isn't the cable used for the Red camera just a 5 pin to 4 pin Lemo cable? Here is one for 45 dollars on Amazon (haven't looked into it much so it might be the wrong cable).

The cable you linked is designed for making sure the Sound and Camera are both recording the same timecode so that in post you can easily sync up video to audio. 

 

For example if the camera shows it's timecode at 00:01:04:53 and the sound is showing at 00:02:08:54 you will not be able to match the audio file to the video clips but if both Audio and Video have the timecode at the exact same time you can simply click "Auto-sync via timecode" in you editing system and it will match the clips up exactly no need to manually move clips around to sync. 

 

You would plug one end into the camera and one end into a Lock-it box like this (http://ambient.de/en/product/lockit-sync-box/). This box would then be plugged into the sound recordists, recorder and then you are "jammed" and synced across all platforms. This lockit box would cost around $1,000. 

[Misanthrope]

12 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

You know, a lot of the things Linus bought have third party alternatives.

It's like buying Apple branded RAM for a Macbook back when you could throw in any RAM you wanted.

 

Does that cable cost 250 dollars to make? No, not even close.

Did Linus have to buy that expensive cable? No, because you can find a bunch of them on for example eBay if you want. They won't be Red branded, and they will probably be a lot more cheaply made, but they will cost like 1/5 of the price. I mean, correct me if I am wrong but isn't the cable used for the Red camera just a 5 pin to 4 pin Lemo cable? Here is one for 45 dollars on Amazon (haven't looked into it much so it might be the wrong cable).

There was one of them featured in the video in fact. But I have little doubt that with that much of a mark up they intend to also profit from secondary sales, heavily. It's not hard to imagine that a good salesman talking to some production department from a professional studio will make a ton of secondary sales. Just because it's common place on the professional level doesn't makes it any less of a rip off: just build in more cost into the core product itself.

[AshleyAshes]

34 minutes ago, DIT said:

So I finally decided to sign up to the LTT forums as the second I saw Sam and Niko's video I knew there would be some serious discussions going down. 

 

First things first I work in the film and tv industry as Digital Imaging Technician, my job on-set is to essentially handle and process all the data on set, technician support for the camera, become a bridge between the camera and editorial. But along with that handle the colour and look of the production either through live grading (manipulating the colours in real time and distributing this out to all the on-set monitors) or near set grading, where I get full mags and grade them away from set and these are then delivered as Dailies to Editorial and then back to the director. 

 

With a bit of my background and experience explained - I am very much with the Sam and Niko on this one. Although it's kind of very hard to pinpoint one underlying point. 

I understand Linus making a video to get views but it does say a lot about his understanding of the subject, as yes the prices are very high but you need to look at it from the perspective of films costing millions and millions of dollars. 

 

When I'm on set working on a film with 250 million dollars behind it you don't want some shitty ass cable pissing off the director. "Oh sorry Mr.Bay we are having to find a new cable as this $5 cable just shorted out and this means we have to delay your shot", time is money on this film sets. Lemo cables are firstly not only used by RED they are an industry standard cable, Arri use them, Sony use them, Canon use them even the Sound dept use Lemo connections for certain tasks. It's a robust cable, it has a good locking mechanism, good shielding, good water resistance,  good build quality and the list goes on. 

 

For some one like Linus who does not work in the field of major major productions - yes compared to and SSD or HDMI cable of course $2,000 is going to seem like a lot. Lenses for example can cost upwards for $100,000 EACH not for a set each. But in my industry we need the best cables, we need reliable safe media that can run in extreme heat and extreme cold and be battered around like no mans business. 

 

You also have to look at development costs on smaller scales - the R&D on these types of things is huge and when you maybe sell a few thousand camera's a year. You need to get that return on investment, this cost gets paid for by the consumer of these products and if productions and rental houses are willing to pay for them it's going to keep on happening. 

 

I love LTT, nothing against them but when I did see his video I just cringed....

 

If anyone has any questions feel free to ask away

 

I have to back this and I also work in the film industry.  I get why many people would support Linus in ranting about the costs of film production gear, because they are consumers and they have no idea what kind of engineering and the short runs seen in the film industry are like.  It's kinda like kinda complaining about the costs of parts and tools for Indy car racing when your only experience with automotive servicing is your home sedan.  It's an entirely different realm of reality and until you've been in that reality, you really can't 'get it'.

[Misanthrope]

20 minutes ago, DIT said:

Here is something you need to understand before RED came along the industry was hugely inflated. Sony charging £150,000 for a camera - RED is the "innovator" in this sector they actually drove down prices and made it more competitive. They made 4K widely available to shooters, I've owned a RED Epic and a RED Dragon. I didn't have close to the money Linus has but I didn't moan about the prices. 

 

Back to the point about cables - RED don't make the connectors themselves if you want to buy a Lemo connector by itself no wire no nothing you would be looking at $50-$60, times that by two you've got $120, you then need to pay for the wire, the shielding, the neck and then pay someone to solder it all up. If you want to get into the "Professional" world you need to pay the professional prices - nobody else cries about it. The same can be said for any industry cars, planes, books, phones. You pay for the quality of product, customer care and support the on niche of the product. 

 

There is going to be so many comments just like yours flying around from people who don't know the industry or how it works or why these things cost so much. I understand from your perspective $240 is stupid in the context of our industry nobody bats and eye lid.  You are paying for the security to know this cable will work under and conditions you put it into and how do you know the R&D costs were not millions and millions of dollars anyway ? 

 

If Linus is worried about the price of a $240 cable he shouldn't be buying that camera enough said. 

 

 

EDIT - I would also like to point out Linus did not need to but that cable. The RED LCD monitors have metal pins on the bottom that attach right to the camera so don't need a cable between the monitor and the camera. So he chose to purchase that cable knowing full well he could have used the "no cable" option. 

No.

 

You're misrepresenting the point quite a bit in fact: I said specifically that I understand that they need to recover their R&D costs and get to a certain profit margin. Yes there's cost involved in the accessories. Cost higher than other parts simply because they are proprietary and specific use case. That doesn't means than you have to charge 900 bucks for a cable: The costs of accessories are not inherently separated from the cost of the sensor unit even if you intend to make it very modular. As I pointed out if Linus spend say 150 thousand total on one camera + accesories I'd expect Red to get as much money from him without charging 900 for a cable: Just make the camera 100k, price the accessories reasonably (If you notice I am kind enough to call 50k of accessories reasonable) and call it a day.

 

Even 300 or 400 bucks for a cable would be far more reasonable if you already paid for that cost partly with the purchase of the camera since it would need the accessories regardless just maybe not all of them, hence modularity it's still a feature and major selling point, 100k it's still also less than 200k or 300k from competitors, etc.

[Misanthrope]

4 minutes ago, AshleyAshes said:

I have to back this and I also work in the film industry.  I get why many people would support Linus in ranting about the costs of film production gear, because they are consumers and they have no idea what kind of engineering and the short runs seen in the film industry are like.  It's kinda like kinda complaining about the costs of parts and tools for Indy car racing when your only experience with automotive servicing is your home sedan.  It's an entirely different realm of reality and until you've been in that reality, you really can't 'get it'.

Read above: you're greatly misrepresenting the points here. We aren't suggesting that Red makes any less money at all than what they're making already. Just charge more for the sensor unit itself and if more accessories are needed or have to be replaced, you still could purchase them at reasonable prices. Saying "we deal with millions of dollars" isn't at argument at all: It should cost more than is reasonable just because you can pay for it? Doesn't really adds to the functionality that much vs the camera itself.

[AshleyAshes]

3 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

As I pointed out if Linus spend say 150 thousand total on one camera + accesories I'd expect Red to get as much money from him without charging 900 for a cable: Just make the camera 100k, price the accessories reasonably (If you notice I am kind enough to call 50k of accessories reasonable) and call it a day.

http://nofilmschool.com/2011/08/chinese-kineraw-s35-camera-knockoff-red-arri-alexa

 

And yet you don't see major parties, including LTT, opting for something like the KineRAW S35 or any of the other Chinese made competition.  ...I wooooooonder whyyyyyy?

[DIT]

3 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

No.

 

You're misrepresenting the point quite a bit in fact: I said specifically that I understand that they need to recover their R&D costs and get to a certain profit margin. Yes there's cost involved in the accessories. Cost higher than other parts simply because they are proprietary and specific use case. That doesn't means than you have to charge 900 bucks for a cable: The costs of accessories are not inherently separated from the cost of the sensor unit even if you intend to make it very modular. As I pointed out if Linus spend say 150 thousand total on one camera + accesories I'd expect Red to get as much money from him without charging 900 for a cable: Just make the camera 100k, price the accessories reasonably (If you notice I am kind enough to call 50k of accessories reasonable) and call it a day.

 

Even 300 or 400 bucks for a cable would be far more reasonable if you already paid for that cost partly with the purchase of the camera since it would need the accessories regardless just maybe not all of them, hence modularity it's still a feature and major selling point, 100k it's still also less than 200k or 300k from competitors, etc.

 

Reasonable to you is because you are a consumer. You are used to mass produced HDMI cables that you can pick-up for a couple of bucks.

How do you know that RED isn't already passing on saving to the owners of these cameras ? Maybe they could charge $500 for the cable but they have already off-set some of the cost into the adapter of to connect it to the camera already ? 

 

[Mira Yurizaki]

11 minutes ago, AshleyAshes said:

I have to back this and I also work in the film industry.  I get why many people would support Linus in ranting about the costs of film production gear, because they are consumers and they have no idea what kind of engineering and the short runs seen in the film industry are like.  It's kinda like kinda complaining about the costs of parts and tools for Indy car racing when your only experience with automotive servicing is your home sedan.  It's an entirely different realm of reality and until you've been in that reality, you really can't 'get it'.

I recently found out servos in a plane we work on cost $30K each. And they're not that big either.

 

I'm sure a lot of people will balk at why said plane needs $30K servos until they try to replace them with something cheaper and find the servo can't withstand aerospace conditions.

 

EDIT: On that note, there was someone on Ars Technica who told their account of after spending a bunch on Quadros, they thought they could save money by buying consumer cards of similar performance. They regretted it later when the Quadros were still running fine and the consumer cards were dropping like flies.

[AshleyAshes]

3 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

I recently found out servos in a plane we work on cost $30K each. And they're not that big either.

 

I'm sure a lot of people will balk at why said plane needs $30K servos until they try to replace them with something cheaper and find the servo can't withstand aerospace conditions.

I have literally been on set and replacing batteries on everything every two hours.  Was something not used?  Replace the batteries anyway.  Know why?  Because the money lost because something died when you NEEDED it is so much more than the price of fresh batteries.  And this was just FILM SCHOOL.  I sit at a desk in post production now.  In post production, sometimes we feel that 30gbps internet connections and in some cases dedicated private dark fiber networks don't move data fast enough... So we put hard drives on airplanes.

 

And yeah, your Aerospace example is a good one.  Obviously this is more 'don't waste time' (And time is money.  On set, time is a LOT of money.  It's so much freakin' money.) instead of 'Don't crash the plane and kill people' but with how much money is on the line, thinks are overengineered to a redonk level.

 

...Also I bagged all of the AA's from film school and keep them in a basket and I still haven't used them all in three years of TV remotes, wireless mice, and Xbox 360 controllers.

[Misanthrope]

6 minutes ago, DIT said:

 

Reasonable to you is because you are a consumer. You are used to mass produced HDMI cables that you can pick-up for a couple of bucks.

How do you know that RED isn't already passing on saving to the owners of these cameras ? Maybe they could charge $500 for the cable but they have already off-set some of the cost into the adapter of to connect it to the camera already ? 

 

They can offset the cost by charging more for the camera sensor unit: the R&D had to be done already so why not charge more for the platform itself instead of the accessories?

 

I am not being unreasonable here I am still talking about 1/3rd of the total price of just the accessories. Red doing it the other way around, charging twice for the accessories than the camera itself, is far more unreasonable. It doesn't serves any purpose other than to push secondary sales and pretending the product is far cheaper than the competition. It still is cheaper afaik, but just not a bargain. There's no reason to build in a "gotcha!" with the accessories even if the cost of them is higher than normal, a lot higher than normal, I guarantee you that it's not 450 times higher than normal. And if t was I understand that they're selling a platform so charge more for the platform itself instead of hoping your customers have accidents or misplace accessories and come back to make a killing on secondary sales cover that upfront honestly.

[Mira Yurizaki]

1 minute ago, AshleyAshes said:

I have literally been on set and replacing batteries on everything every two hours.  Was something not used?  Replace the batteries anyway.  Know why?  Because the money lost because something died when you NEEDED it is so much more than the price of fresh batteries.  And this was just FILM SCHOOL.  I sit at a desk in post production now.

 

And yeah, your Aerospace example is a good one.  Obviously this is more 'don't waste time' (And time is money.  On set, time is a LOT of money.  It's so much freakin' money.) instead of 'Don't crash the plane and kill people' but with how much money is on the line, thinks are overengineered to a redonk level.

 

...Also I bagged all of the AA's from film school and keep them in a basket and I still haven't used them all in three years of TV remotes, wireless mice, and Xbox 360 controllers.

I added another example of something less life threatening and more in line with "saving time and money" But for the record:

 

Quote

EDIT: On that note, there was someone on Ars Technica who told their account of after spending a bunch on Quadros, they thought they could save money by buying consumer cards of similar performance. They regretted it later when the Quadros were still running fine and the consumer cards were dropping like flies.

 

[TetraSky]

So... "linus is wrong and we're smarter than him because we bought third party components instead, also it's made in america so obviously it's totally worth the price."
Is essentially what I got from that video.

And what's with the random 3D printing mask in this... Completely takes you away from the main focus of the video, which is to say that Linus is a dum dum that overpaid for something he didn't truly need for the content they produce on youtube...

Except they got one thing wrong, Linus doesn't only produce videos for Youtube, thus why they need higher quality and lower compression settings. You're not exactly going to shoot a commercial for some big brand on a budget camera after all, if you want to be taken seriously. (Though they may not be doing that anymore? Also floatplane club quality is better than Youtube)

[Misanthrope]

Just now, M.Yurizaki said:

I added another example of something less life threatening and more in line with "saving time and money" But for the record:

 

 

Again this point is disingenuous: I am not suggesting a 20 bucks consumer grade display port here. I am ok with 200, 300 even 400 bucks for the specialized cable. Just not 900 that's double what it needs to be by any estimation, it's just hiding the actual cost of the unit.

[Mira Yurizaki]

3 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

Again this point is disingenuous: I am not suggesting a 20 bucks consumer grade display port here. I am ok with 200, 300 even 400 bucks for the specialized cable. Just not 900 that's double what it needs to be by any estimation, it's just hiding the actual cost of the unit.

I wasn't aware we were arguing the economics of selling a device and its accessories.

[MageTank]

3 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

Again this point is disingenuous: I am not suggesting a 20 bucks consumer grade display port here. I am ok with 200, 300 even 400 bucks for the specialized cable. Just not 900 that's double what it needs to be by any estimation, it's just hiding the actual cost of the unit.

No, it's charging exactly what people are willing to pay for the product. That's business 101. If people were not paying the price for it, it wouldn't be that high. Does it NEED to be that high? Nope. Can it be? Certainly. 

[The Ran]

4 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

They can offset the cost by charging more for the camera sensor unit: the R&D had to be done already so why not charge more for the platform itself instead of the accessories?

Then why not go all the way and just charge the full cost for the body and chuck the accessories in for free? Because not everyone will want them so it's an unneeded cost and a waste of hardware. By doing things the way they are they're actually saving people money that don't need certain accessories (as has been mentioned the cable isn't necessary), when the end cost for the people that do need them is the same what's the problem?