Usb 3.2 announced

[Mira Yurizaki]

10 minutes ago, TheKDub said:

Might as well just drop ethernet and start using USB-C for wired internet at this rate

Got you covered: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0174U0X7I/ref=asc_df_B0174U0X7I5093686/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=394997&creativeASIN=B0174U0X7I&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167140037427&hvpos=1o2&hvnetw=g&hvrand=13929304449840030731&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031309&hvtargid=pla-307313703976

 

But in all seriousness, let's not.

[Jito463]

55 minutes ago, TheKDub said:

Might as well just drop ethernet and start using USB-C for wired internet at this rate

That may work for short distances (a few feet), but eventually you'd need to use Cat5e/6 for longer runs.

[DragonTamer1]

I really wish that they would just call it USB 4 and 5 to help keep it simple. Why does it need a decimal in it? Just making shit complicated for the sake of being complicated.

[DocSwag]

13 hours ago, Wikiforce said:

Why is it called usb 3.1/3.2 and not usb 4.0 and 5.0 respectively? Just curious 

I would assume because the jump isn't large would to warrant it. 1.0 to 2.0 I believe was a 40 fold bandwidth increase, 2.0 to 3.0 was around a 10 fold one. These are "only" 2 fold.

[Stefan1024]

Haha I love it how doubeling the data rate is only worth a 0.1 increase in the version number.

 

Other companies make a new generation for a 10% improvement.

[The Benjamins]

8 hours ago, DocSwag said:

I would assume because the jump isn't large would to warrant it. 1.0 to 2.0 I believe was a 40 fold bandwidth increase, 2.0 to 3.0 was around a 10 fold one. These are "only" 2 fold.

 

4 minutes ago, Stefan1024 said:

Haha I love it how doubeling the data rate is only worth a 0.1 increase in the version number.

 

Other companies make a new generation for a 10% improvement.

Also they have not increased data rate per pin, they just made it so USB C connectors/cables can use all 4 lanes versus the 2 lanes USB A/B use.

 

USB 3.2 basically only pertains to USB C when USB 3.0, 3.1 gen 1/2 are for all connectors/cables

[The Benjamins]

4 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

If USB speeds kept up the 40 fold thing from 1 to 3, the difference of 1 to "4" would be 40^3= 64000 fold. (compared to 40x10x2= 800 fold)

I kinda wouldn't blame them if they called USB-C USB 4 instead??

USB C is a physical connector design just like USB A and B. their is no speeds tied to it.

 

USB 3.1 gen2 works on USB A,B,C

USB 3.2 works on USB C due to is having 4 lanes vs 2.

[Sniperfox47]

17 hours ago, M.Yurizaki said:

However, that's the least of USB's worries. Type-C's alternate modes make people think every Type-C is capable of Thunderbolt, DP, and HDMI.

I don't really get where this comes from...

 

If it has a DisplayPort logo next to it, it supports DisplayPort.

 

If it has a thunderbolt logo next to it, it supports thunderbolt 3, and thus DisplayPort.

 

No real consumer devices support the HDMI or Ethernet alt-modes.

 

If your device came with a USB-C power adapter it probably supports Power Delivery. If not, it probably doesn't.

 

If you have a phone or tablet, the chances of it supporting video output are slim, but it'll likely charge off the port.

 

If you have a Mac, it's complicated AF and get wrekd 'cause Apple can't be bothered to degrade the beautiful finish of their devices with the standardized logos.

 

Like sure these are heuristics and not always 100% accurate, but in the vast majority of cases they're right and even when they're wrong they're just overly conservative.

 

Worst case is you plug something in and it doesn't work. Oh no.

 

 

[Jito463]

1 minute ago, Sniperfox47 said:

I don't really get where this comes from...

 

If it has a DisplayPort logo next to it, it supports DisplayPort.

 

If it has a thunderbolt logo next to it, it supports thunderbolt 3, and thus DisplayPort.

You put too much faith into the intelligence awareness of end users.

[Mira Yurizaki]

5 minutes ago, Sniperfox47 said:

I don't really get where this comes from...

 

If it has a DisplayPort logo next to it, it supports DisplayPort.

 

If it has a thunderbolt logo next to it, it supports thunderbolt 3, and thus DisplayPort.

 

No real consumer devices support the HDMI or Ethernet alt-modes.

 

If your device came with a USB-C power adapter it probably supports Power Delivery. If not, it probably doesn't.

 

If you have a phone or tablet, the chances of it supporting video output are slim, but it'll likely charge off the port.

 

If you have a Mac, it's complicated AF and get wrekd 'cause Apple can't be bothered to degrade the beautiful finish of their devices with the standardized logos.

 

Like sure these are heuristics and not always 100% accurate, but in the vast majority of cases they're right and even when they're wrong they're just overly conservative.

 

Worst case is you plug something in and it doesn't work. Oh no.

 

 

It's easy for you to understand this, but a majority of people who use electronics don't know what to look for. If it looks like a thing, surely it must be the thing with all the bells and whistles.

 

Still get people asking why their USB 3.0 thumb drive sucks. Because you know, if it says USB 3.0 and the plug itself looks like USB 3.0, surely it must need USB 3.0. Because otherwise they would've stuck with USB 2.0, right?

[The Benjamins]

9 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

It's easy for you to understand this, but a majority of people who use electronics don't know what to look for. If it looks like a thing, surely it must be the thing with all the bells and whistles.

 

Still get people asking why their USB 3.0 thumb drive sucks. Because you know, if it says USB 3.0 and the plug itself looks like USB 3.0, surely it must need USB 3.0. Because otherwise they would've stuck with USB 2.0, right?

valid point but most new laptops and desktops mostly have USB3 and many don't have USB2 anymore.

[Mira Yurizaki]

Just now, The Benjamins said:

valid point but most new laptops and desktops mostly have USB3 and many don't have USB2 anymore.

So what you're saying is they see the thumb drive as USB 2.0 and go "BUT I ONLY HAVE 3.0 PORTS, THIS PRODUCT WON'T WORK"

[Sniperfox47]

3 minutes ago, Jito463 said:

You put too much faith into the intelligence awareness of end users.

That issue is not specific to usb-c though.

 

People buying a DisplayPort alt-mode adapter for a port that doesn't support DisplayPort because they don't realize it's not supported, is literally no different than the people who buy a DVI cable because they don't realize it's different than a VGA cable.

 

People are dumb. People are going to be dumb whether two different things use the same port or not. What needs to happen is people need to stop explaining it as "USB-C does DisplayPort so you can connect to a monitor", and start explaining it as "USB-C is the new USB port. DisplayPort is this cool thing that lets you connect to a monitor, and certain USB ports may also be a DisplayPort". It's a marketing issue moreso than a technical issue...

 

3 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

It's easy for you to understand this, but a majority of people who use electronics don't know what to look for. If it looks like a thing, surely it must be the thing with all the bells and whistles.

Which is part of why we need to stop training people on ports, and start training people on icons. Because this is nothing new or specific to USB. What about incompatibility in different HDMI and HDCP specs? Or issues with DVI-I vs DVI-D vs DVI dual channel?

 

The icons are standardized and tell you exactly what you need to know about the port.

6 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

Still get people asking why their USB 3.0 thumb drive sucks. Because you know, if it says USB 3.0 and the plug itself looks like USB 3.0, surely it must need USB 3.0. Because otherwise they would've stuck with USB 2.0, right?

Yeah, and the problem's compounded when you have machines like Asus gaming laptops where they just go, "Hurr durr, some of these USB ports are 2.0 and some are 3.0, but let's just make all of them red!"

 

I get that customers are still going to make mistakes and be confused, but there's no magic bullet to making a perfect system.

 

The alternative to different USB versions? Make a new port for every revision that's not backwards compatible. This was a thing in the past before USB. It was bad. It causes issues, but nowhere near as much as having everything over different ports.

 

The whole one-port thing is going to be the same, especially at first and especially for Joe consumer until they're trained on the new paradigm, but in the long run it's for the best it'll help save space in devices, especially smaller form factor devices, will reduce cable clutter, and just generally lead to a better tech state.

[The Benjamins]

2 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

So what you're saying is they see the thumb drive as USB 2.0 and go "BUT I ONLY HAVE 3.0 PORTS, THIS PRODUCT WON'T WORK"

No, I mean the part were people don't know why their drive is running slow, due to know know that it is not a USB 3 port.

[Mira Yurizaki]

14 minutes ago, Sniperfox47 said:

Which is part of why we need to stop training people on ports, and start training people on icons. Because this is nothing new or specific to USB. What about incompatibility in different HDMI and HDCP specs? Or issues with DVI-I vs DVI-D vs DVI dual channel?

 

The icons are standardized and tell you exactly what you need to know about the port.

I've yet to see an HDMI logo on a device that clearly tells me what features it can or can't do (not to mention it is possible to upgrade the HDMI version, as the PS3 did).  The Thunderbolt logo doesn't tell me if it's 1, 2 or 3. Some devices don't even have icons: 

Spoiler

DVI though is more easier to tell since the plug itself is visibly different depending on the type. However, the fact that there are dicks who make "passive" DVI-D to VGA doesn't help.

 

The thing is, people are going to associate with plugs and connectors more than icons. These are things you physically interact with, what you see most often. That's going to have more meaning than an icon that may or may not even be on the device.

 

Quote

The alternative to different USB versions? Make a new port for every revision that's not backwards compatible. This was a thing in the past before USB. It was bad. It causes issues, but nowhere near as much as having everything over different ports.

The problem I'm finding is that USB is trying to do other things than USB. USB being backwards compatible with USB itself is fine. USB physically being compatible with other protocols is not. If they can't find a way to make those protocols work over USB itself, then they shouldn't have bothered.

[Jito463]

51 minutes ago, Sniperfox47 said:

That issue is not specific to usb-c though.

Oh, I agree completely.  I can't tell how many times I've had customers come in looking for a video adapter, and half the time they don't even know which port they're adapting from, much less what they're adapting to.

[Doobeedoo]

Very nice. Though to minimize confusion they should've called Type-C with higher speeds USB 4 but oh well. Hopefully Type-C gets implemented everywhere and finally replaces old connector. Hence actually live up to it's name being new modern universal connector. 

[Syntaxvgm]

USB 3.x is like firefox when they went from version 4.0 to version 8 billion in like a week

[JoostinOnline]

3 minutes ago, Syntaxvgm said:

USB 3.x is like firefox when they went from version 4.0 to version 8 billion in like a week

I was just thinking about that recently.  It was Firefox 3 for years. 

[Sauron]

On 7/26/2017 at 4:02 PM, iBeast_M0de said:

Finally some real preformance, USB GPU docks maybe?

 

Nevermind I thought Thunderbolt 3 was 20Gb/s but its 40 Gb/s

It's not just a matter of bandwidth, a USB controller could never replace a pcie slot. Thunderbolt on the other hand is a much more direct connection to the cpu.

[Syntaxvgm]

50 minutes ago, JoostinOnline said:

I was just thinking about that recently.  It was Firefox 3 for years. 

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