Need help about dirtex12 and rx480cossfire

[DAnewguy]

So is it someone who knows much about dirtex12 and crossfire that could help me with choosing a gpu when benchmarks comes out for rx480

 

Thx if someone wants to help   

 

If yes we can like get a messenger just for that or something else for communication 

[DAnewguy]

50 views and 0 response my hope is gone ??

[alphaproject]

No one answered because no one knows exactly what the 480 can do yet.

[DAnewguy]

3 minutes ago, alphaproject said:

No one answered because no one knows exactly what the 480 can do yet.

Yeah I said when they will come out

 

[alphaproject]

What do you need help with if you can just look at the benchmarks when they come out? We all see the same benchmarks? Just decide if it's good enough for what you need.

[App4that]

It's not the best solution to use crossfire, or SLI. One stronger card is always the best solution. So what is your budget?

[DAnewguy]

15 hours ago, App4that said:

It's not the best solution to use crossfire, or SLI. One stronger card is always the best solution. So what is your budget?

No im thinking of 2 rx480 cuz they "will" be more powerfull in dirtex 12 games or we don't rly know yet

*Edit* and dirtex 12 will do so both of the cards will be used 100% but what do you think?

[DAnewguy]

15 hours ago, App4that said:

It's not the best solution to use crossfire, or SLI. One stronger card is always the best solution. So what is your budget?

I got enough for 1070 btw

[msvelev]

Direct X 12 won't magically make everything work at 100%. Most dev studios won't adopt it for years and they probably won't use the multi gpu optimisation since multi gpu setups aren't very common and aren't worth investing in. If you have the money for a 1070, get it and be happy.

[Simon771]

Just to point out the fact: 2x RX 480 won't be able to compare with single GTX 1080. Like ever! It just won't.

 

But might compare with GTX 1070. Now you have to factor some additional facts. It's always better to use single more powerfull card vs crossfire/SLI. 2 cards would generate more heat and draw more power. More noise from 2 cards.

DX12 games might benefit a bit more from those 2 cards, but still not to the point where it can compare with GTX 1080 lol.

Sure it might get same results like GTX 1070 in some games, but keep in mind that single GTX 1070 costs around 400$, while 2x RX 480 8GB versions will cost 250$ each so 500$ total.

I'm not fanboy of anyone, but I don't have any remotly hope for RX 480 to blow the market.

 

Benchmarks will be avaliable at the end of the month.

[A/C]

Just get the RX 490 or whatever it's called. - I know it's a stupid reply but it's basically the best advice I can give you based on your question and the fact that none of us users know anything relevant about the RX 480.

 

Since you're aiming DX12, which won't be truly and fully impelented for some time, you could, theoretically, wait for Vega to be released and get one powerful card insted of two lesser cards, thus eliminating any problems asociated with crossfire.

 

In my mind questions about unreleased and untested chips like this are pointless, yet people keep asking them regularly eventhough they themselves probbably know it.

[Delicieuxz]

2 hours ago, Simon771 said:

Just to point out the fact: 2x RX 480 won't be able to compare with single GTX 1080. Like ever! It just won't.

 

But might compare with GTX 1070.

The AotS 2x 480 demo was running more FPS than the stock GTX 1080, and while AotS is an async-heavy game, there are two things to note about the 2x480 system AMD ran their demo with:

 

- It was running at 51% utilization, which is very low for a crossfire setup, and AMD pointed it out (The GTX system was running at 97% utilization)

- The RX 480s in the 2x480 setup were not overclocked

 

So, while we don't know what normal 2x480 performance will be, we know that in heavy async games, it beats a GTX 1080... and that whatever 2x480 performance is normally, that it is greater than what was demonstrated in AMD's 2x480 demo. If the RX 480 overclock rumours are legit, then when overclocked, it may be that 2x480 beats a stock GTX 1080 all over.

 

It may also be that a heavily OCed RX 480 trades blows with a stock GTX 1070. We'll have to wait for confirmation, but some people claim this.

[msvelev]

42 minutes ago, Delicieuxz said:

The AotS 2x 480 demo was running more FPS than the stock GTX 1080, and while AotS is an async-heavy game, there are two things to note about the 2x480 system AMD ran their demo with:

 

- It was running at 51% utilization, which is very low for a crossfire setup, and AMD pointed it out (The GTX system was running at 97% utilization)

- The RX 480s in the 2x480 setup were not overclocked

 

So, while we don't know what normal 2x480 performance will be, we know that in heavy async games, it beats a GTX 1080... and that whatever 2x480 performance is normally, that it is greater than what was demonstrated in AMD's 2x480 demo. If the RX 480 overclock rumours are legit, then when overclocked, it may be that 2x480 beats a stock GTX 1080 all over.

 

It may also be that a heavily OCed RX 480 trades blows with a stock GTX 1070. We'll have to wait for confirmation, but some people claim this.

Nah man, in the cherry picked AotS demo, the visual settings were clearly different. The GTX 1080 demo looked a lot better. It was a marketing scam pretty much. Let's all wait for the real benchmarks. In a real game on the same settings things will be a lot different IMO, but let's all wait.

[Tythus]

10 minutes ago, msvelev said:

Nah man, in the cherry picked AotS demo, the visual settings were clearly different. The GTX 1080 demo looked a lot better. It was a marketing scam pretty much. Let's all wait for the real benchmarks. In a real game on the same settings things will be a lot different IMO, but let's all wait.

Also Aots has always ran better on AMD everyone complains when Games X runs better on NVidia but no-one bats an eyes when the shoe is on the other foot

[Delicieuxz]

22 minutes ago, msvelev said:

Nah man, in the cherry picked AotS demo, the visual settings were clearly different. The GTX 1080 demo looked a lot better. It was a marketing scam pretty much. Let's all wait for the real benchmarks. In a real game on the same settings things will be a lot different IMO, but let's all wait.

The AotS demo graphical discrepancies were addressed by AMD:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/4m692q/concerning_the_aots_image_quality_controversy/

 

And I think a Stardock developer commented on the difference on twitter, saying that it wouldn't impact performance noticeably.

 

But yeah, post-release benchmarks will tell all.

[msvelev]

28 minutes ago, Delicieuxz said:

The AotS demo graphical discrepancies were addressed by AMD:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/4m692q/concerning_the_aots_image_quality_controversy/

 

And I think a Stardock developer commented on the difference on twitter, saying that it wouldn't impact performance noticeably.

 

But yeah, post-release benchmarks will tell all.

Wasn't aware of that post, thanks!
A bit below they also explain the "51%". It's another marketing wording.. It was a CPU bottle neck at that point. 
Let's hope that when the 3d party benchmarks come out, the 480 will prove to be an awesome budget gpu as it seems.

[Misunderstood Wookie]

480x seems nice but if the 490x is in a $500 price point I will just get two of those, it will probably just like the R9 290x was a little while back when it smashed the mid end cards from Nvidia. Lets face it 1070 and 1080 are just entry level current gen cards as will be the 480x its just a mid card.

 

Everyone is jumping over board with these cards when I can see is there is better stuff coming before the year ends in the $670 price point for single GPU hardware. 

 

I am just going to get a second R9 290x and be happy with that until I see benchmarks for a 490X or a 1080ti\ 1090

[minibois]

- the card is not out yet

- there are barely any games out that (fully) utilize DX12

- we don't even know what DX12 can do fully

[App4that]

Too many people don't understand what an API is. DX12 isn't a magic bullet, and AotS isn't DX12 nor is ASYC. 

 

There are games still getting DX11 updates like DayZ. And even within DX12 only one developer has use the multi GPU feature of DX12.

 

If you want to run crossfire, go for it. Ignore those who have already and see what happens. I'm sure fate will reward you by someone asking for advice returning the favor.

[Nena Trinity]

Well there is not many DX12 games yet most are DX11 or DX11+ and then we got games running OpenGL and Vulkan which I believe will defeat DX12 in the long run probably?

[DAnewguy]

On Monday, June 20, 2016 at 9:25 AM, msvelev said:

Direct X 12 won't magically make everything work at 100%. Most dev studios won't adopt it for years and they probably won't use the multi gpu optimisation since multi gpu setups aren't very common and aren't worth investing in. If you have the money for a 1070, get it and be happy.

 

On Monday, June 20, 2016 at 9:36 AM, Simon771 said:

Just to point out the fact: 2x RX 480 won't be able to compare with single GTX 1080. Like ever! It just won't.

 

But might compare with GTX 1070. Now you have to factor some additional facts. It's always better to use single more powerfull card vs crossfire/SLI. 2 cards would generate more heat and draw more power. More noise from 2 cards.

DX12 games might benefit a bit more from those 2 cards, but still not to the point where it can compare with GTX 1080 lol.

Sure it might get same results like GTX 1070 in some games, but keep in mind that single GTX 1070 costs around 400$, while 2x RX 480 8GB versions will cost 250$ each so 500$ total.

I'm not fanboy of anyone, but I don't have any remotly hope for RX 480 to blow the market.

 

Benchmarks will be avaliable at the end of the month.

 

On Monday, June 20, 2016 at 11:50 AM, Delicieuxz said:

The AotS 2x 480 demo was running more FPS than the stock GTX 1080, and while AotS is an async-heavy game, there are two things to note about the 2x480 system AMD ran their demo with:

 

- It was running at 51% utilization, which is very low for a crossfire setup, and AMD pointed it out (The GTX system was running at 97% utilization)

- The RX 480s in the 2x480 setup were not overclocked

 

So, while we don't know what normal 2x480 performance will be, we know that in heavy async games, it beats a GTX 1080... and that whatever 2x480 performance is normally, that it is greater than what was demonstrated in AMD's 2x480 demo. If the RX 480 overclock rumours are legit, then when overclocked, it may be that 2x480 beats a stock GTX 1080 all over.

 

It may also be that a heavily OCed RX 480 trades blows with a stock GTX 1070. We'll have to wait for confirmation, but some people claim this.

 

On Monday, June 20, 2016 at 0:43 PM, Tythus said:

Also Aots has always ran better on AMD everyone complains when Games X runs better on NVidia but no-one bats an eyes when the shoe is on the other foot

 

23 hours ago, Minibois said:

- the card is not out yet

- there are barely any games out that (fully) utilize DX12

- we don't even know what DX12 can do fully

23 hours ago, Misunderstood Wookie said:

480x seems nice but if the 490x is in a $500 price point I will just get two of those, it will probably just like the R9 290x was a little while back when it smashed the mid end cards from Nvidia. Lets face it 1070 and 1080 are just entry level current gen cards as will be the 480x its just a mid card.

 

Everyone is jumping over board with these cards when I can see is there is better stuff coming before the year ends in the $670 price point for single GPU hardware. 

 

I am just going to get a second R9 290x and be happy with that until I see benchmarks for a 490X or a 1080ti\ 1090

Let's just wait for 480  come out and look at the benchmarks.

So you guys are saying that full version of dx12 is not used and will not in like a year?cuz i tought that most games that have dx12 uses the full version but thx guys will wait and see

[minibois]

6 minutes ago, DAnewguy said:

Let's just wait for 480  come out and look at the benchmarks.

So you guys are saying that full version of dx12 is not used and will not in like a year?cuz i tought that most games that have dx12 uses the full version but thx guys will wait and see

Well name all the games that at the moment use DX12? And I'm talking full games out now.

I can only think of, if I remember correctly, Just Cause 3 which only used a little bit of DX12.

 

Gaming companies have to rework their engines to make it compatible with DX12, so it will just take more time.

[DAnewguy]

3 minutes ago, Minibois said:

Well name all the games that at the moment use DX12? And I'm talking full games out now.

I can only think of, if I remember correctly, Just Cause 3 which only used a little bit of DX12.

 

Gaming companies have to rework their engines to make it compatible with DX12, so it will just take more time.

Thx for info man and yes not that many games but still I tought games like witcher3 uses dx12  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_games_with_DirectX_12_support

[Misunderstood Wookie]

18 hours ago, DAnewguy said:

 

 

 

 

Let's just wait for 480  come out and look at the benchmarks.

So you guys are saying that full version of dx12 is not used and will not in like a year?cuz i tought that most games that have dx12 uses the full version but thx guys will wait and see

Na, DX 12 is fully support by all DX 11 AMD GCN architecture cards and most recent Nvidia like the 900 series. 

 

Win 10 fully supports DX 12 aswell. It's the programs which don't fully make use of DX12's features. The latest engines atm use DX12 Shader improvements but not the main feature of DX12 which Microsoft developed to directly compete with AMD Mantel by offering finer grained control over direct hardware communication at low levels.

 

(if Microsoft didn't retaliate to Mantle Microsoft would have lost the very thing keeping users on Windows as a platform) 

 

It's this which ultimately will greatly the effect performance of the hardware. Not graphical improvements. These features aren't used because it adds a lot of development costs and time as the changes are only beneficial if developers are willing to manually optimize the communication between the hardware and software. 

 

The reason it's a big deal is because this communication used to be solely on the drivers ability to communicate with the hardware without fine grained control, but to make use of it, it does require a good deal of extra care and development time.

 

The results are similar too what we saw with the few games that used AMDs Mantel (.e.g. Battlefield 4) which offered two very different low level backbones for hardware communication. If using Battlefield 4 as an example which was the first game to support something other than DirectX (Mantle) improvements of up too 40 percent could be extracted from any existing GPU which supported Mantle and you enabled the Mantle engine in game. 

 

In real life this was a gain of up too about 15-25 maybe more FPS with the same in game settings and hardware. 

 

Why is it so good you may be asking, well that's because until DX12 DirectX was plagued with extra processing checks which added small but rather meaningful delays and overhead between an operation being requested and the operation being completed.

 

Too simplify what the checks were, they existed to help workaround lazy software optimisation and maintain a level of compatibility between hardware configurations, developers had no way around these extra overheads between the software and hardware, until Mantel was released and more recently DX12 both offer the option to remove those overheads in favour of optimisation control.

 

But none of these things will make a difference in current or future performance if the software does not make use of the extra control offered as the software must be specifically created and coded to make use of both Mantle and DX12's hardware communication enhancements to be of any performance benefit.

 

So too repeat myself, is exactly what is going on right now. 

 

I hope this helps your understanding of Direct X and what it means for gaming performance. 

 

I simplified this a lot but if you are interested in how or why it works you can google Mantle and why it was a breakthrough over DirectX 11.

 

Edited June 22, 2016 by Misunderstood Wookie
A lite bit of text formatting and information added

[BrightCandle]

Game developers have had the ability to use 2 GPUs to render one screen since at least DirectX 9. Even ignoring split screen rendering and compute and just supporting SLI/Crossfire with AFR has been absolutely possible for all the games for a decade. But how many did so themselves? Almost none.

 

So when people start telling me DX12 is going to be different due to the brand new API giving developers the ability to use multiple cards I laugh my arse off because its genuinely funny. It is not going to happen because its never happened. Most developers are console first and as a result do absolutely nothing to support dual cards. Infact most of the work for Xfire/SLI comes from Nvidia and AMD, as its in their best interests. Game developers as a collective do very little to enable dual cards and are increasing choosing techniques that limit the ability of AFR to scale. If anything DX12 is going to make the situation worse, because handing the keys of support to them will mean it never gets used. AotS is the only DX12 game to support it and it scales pretty badly. Its mostly a technical demo as its not actually a very good game so on the grand scheme of things it doesn't really matter. All the other DX12 games do not support SLI/Xfire and unfortunately there is nothing that Nvidia/AMD can do about it because of the new API. DX12 is the death of dual cards not its saviour, because they gave the burden of support to the one group in all this that cares the least about using it.

 

Don't count on SLI or crossfire to make up the performance deficit, we are now at the stage where about a third of games released don't scale at all, most are in the 50% range and only a handful get close to 90%+. The heydays of the 680 and 970 SLI are behind us as games have changed.

 

I have used dual cards for 8 years, starting with a 4870X2. All the AMD cards (5970 and 2x 7970) had microstutter and major support/performance problems I can't recommend it. The Nvidia solution (2x680 and 2x970) was better but lately its not been worth the money. With the gap widening for the 1070 to 1080 its just less likely to pay off as a better solution. So if what you want is a 390X like performance GPU then the RX 480 is going to make that cheaper, but not buy the hype dual cards aren't going to make it a 1080 killer you are just going to get frustrated with how shit crossfire is generally (from game support and microstutter issues). I went a single 1080 this time around, my 970s ought to be similar performance but in practice its a big step up because SLI isn't what it was.