Smoking Barrels - LTT's Unnofficial Gun Club!

[IkeaGnome]

 

Not directly relevant to topic, but relevant to topic in the unofficial Discord. Didn't want to post there to ruffle any feathers.

[Agall]

LPVO, red dot (magnifier), holo (magnifier), or prism (magnifier); What do you use on your go-to rifle and why?

 

-I use a 1x prism with a 6x magnifier because red dots look like comets with a changing point of impact (astigmatism), depending on which eye I'm using. I also don't think the complexity and battery life of a holographic sight is worth it, since I'm not using NV/IR. I also prioritize 1x > 6x and weight saving, so I wouldn't want an LPVO.

 

-My other rifles have fixed magnified prisms, excluding my 300wm bolt gun with a FFP BDC 4-14x. Somethings still use red dots, but are generally 50yrd and in where having an effective 10MOA dot isn't a huge problem.

 

 

Yes the astigmatism is fixed with glasses, although I don't need them for regular vision all the time and therefore don't always wear them.

[Crunchy Dragon]

1 hour ago, Agall said:

LPVO, red dot (magnifier), holo (magnifier), or prism (magnifier); What do you use on your go-to rifle and why?

 

-I use a 1x prism with a 6x magnifier because red dots look like comets with a changing point of impact (astigmatism), depending on which eye I'm using. I also don't think the complexity and battery life of a holographic sight is worth it, since I'm not using NV/IR. I also prioritize 1x > 6x and weight saving, so I wouldn't want an LPVO.

 

-My other rifles have fixed magnified prisms, excluding my 300wm bolt gun with a FFP BDC 4-14x. Somethings still use red dots, but are generally 50yrd and in where having an effective 10MOA dot isn't a huge problem.

 

 

Yes the astigmatism is fixed with glasses, although I don't need them for regular vision all the time and therefore don't always wear them.

I use a red dot, no magnifier. I don't need magnification inside my home.

Astigmatism on my RDS is fine(Bushnell TRS-25), but it is still there if I don't have my glasses on, so I've considered switching to a prism for that reason. My astigmatism isn't bad enough so I can still shoot well without my glasses(it also helps that I'm farsighted and don't struggle to see things up close), but if having a prism and no astigmatism would reduce the amount of effort my brain puts into putting shots on target, I think that's a very worthwhile investment.

 

For the mythical "combat" or "SHTF" rifle, I really think it would depend on what I'm doing with the gun and what the gun's job is. Magnification would become a requirement, but I'm not sure if I would take an LPVO, 1x with a magnifier, or just a normal magnified optic like an Acog or equivalent. I'm not gonna rock a 4-14x scope on a rifle that I'm running around the streets with, but if I was farther out in the wilderness and needed to see farther or positively ID friendlies/threats, I'd take the high zoom scope all day.

 

LPVO probably makes the most sense for an urban "combat" rifle where you're going indoors, outdoors, clearing buildings, and everything else you do in your prepper SHTF fantasies, just because it allows you to see things closer and farther and you don't necessarily have to be stuck with magnification when you'd rather not have it. I don't have any experience with LPVOs though, but I have used red dots with magnifiers and liked the experience. The one issue I have with that is it's a little difficult to fit ironsights on a rail if you also have a flashlight, RDS or holo, and magnifier.

[Real_PhillBert]

2 hours ago, Agall said:

LPVO, red dot (magnifier), holo (magnifier), or prism (magnifier); What do you use on your go-to rifle and why?

 

-I use a 1x prism with a 6x magnifier because red dots look like comets with a changing point of impact (astigmatism), depending on which eye I'm using. I also don't think the complexity and battery life of a holographic sight is worth it, since I'm not using NV/IR. I also prioritize 1x > 6x and weight saving, so I wouldn't want an LPVO.

 

-My other rifles have fixed magnified prisms, excluding my 300wm bolt gun with a FFP BDC 4-14x. Somethings still use red dots, but are generally 50yrd and in where having an effective 10MOA dot isn't a huge problem.

 

 

Yes the astigmatism is fixed with glasses, although I don't need them for regular vision all the time and therefore don't always wear them.

 

Tough one. 

 

I used to be pretty hard set in the red dot camp, but I recently got into a few two gun matches, one of which I used my "SHTF" SBR with a dot (pictured with an MRO, but now sports an Aimpoint T2) and although you certainly can get hits at distance (our two gun matches only go out to 200y) with a dot, I'm personally quite a bit faster with a bit of magnification. Conversely I have also used my "back up SHTF" rifle, which is a 16" with a 1-10 on it, and that's a better solution for competition, but a bit of a heavy rifle. 

 

Now I'm really thinking hard about adding a magnifier behind my T2. 

 

 

The LVPO gets a bit heavy and no matter how great the eye-box is, it's not the same as a red dot. 

[Agall]

15 minutes ago, Real_PhillBert said:

 

Tough one. 

 

I used to be pretty hard set in the red dot camp, but I recently got into a few two gun matches, one of which I used my "SHTF" SBR with a dot (pictured with an MRO, but now sports an Aimpoint T2) and although you certainly can get hits at distance (our two gun matches only go out to 200y) with a dot, I'm personally quite a bit faster with a bit of magnification. Conversely I have also used my "back up SHTF" rifle, which is a 16" with a 1-10 on it, and that's a better solution for competition, but a bit of a heavy rifle. 

 

Now I'm really thinking hard about adding a magnifier behind my T2. 

 

 

The LVPO gets a bit heavy and no matter how great the eye-box is, it's not the same as a red dot. 

 

I've got a couple of MROs and the parallax makes anything past 100yrds somewhat difficult and isn't friendly to astigmatism. One of them is on my M1014 clone which works really nicely, the other of which is collecting dust right now.

 

I have an InrangeTV WWSD clone which comes in at about 5lbs barebones and unloaded, adding about 2.5lbs between accessories/optics/standard capacity magazine. I don't have a close current picture with my recently upgraded light configuration (I was playing around with some for a bit) but the last part comes in Friday.

 

This one at least shows the functional parts, however the bipod was only used to zero the rifle easier from my truckbed. The whole front end is different now, but the rest is the same.

 

[Agall]

1 hour ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

I use a red dot, no magnifier. I don't need magnification inside my home.

Astigmatism on my RDS is fine(Bushnell TRS-25), but it is still there if I don't have my glasses on, so I've considered switching to a prism for that reason. My astigmatism isn't bad enough so I can still shoot well without my glasses(it also helps that I'm farsighted and don't struggle to see things up close), but if having a prism and no astigmatism would reduce the amount of effort my brain puts into putting shots on target, I think that's a very worthwhile investment.

 

For the mythical "combat" or "SHTF" rifle, I really think it would depend on what I'm doing with the gun and what the gun's job is. Magnification would become a requirement, but I'm not sure if I would take an LPVO, 1x with a magnifier, or just a normal magnified optic like an Acog or equivalent. I'm not gonna rock a 4-14x scope on a rifle that I'm running around the streets with, but if I was farther out in the wilderness and needed to see farther or positively ID friendlies/threats, I'd take the high zoom scope all day.

 

LPVO probably makes the most sense for an urban "combat" rifle where you're going indoors, outdoors, clearing buildings, and everything else you do in your prepper SHTF fantasies, just because it allows you to see things closer and farther and you don't necessarily have to be stuck with magnification when you'd rather not have it. I don't have any experience with LPVOs though, but I have used red dots with magnifiers and liked the experience. The one issue I have with that is it's a little difficult to fit ironsights on a rail if you also have a flashlight, RDS or holo, and magnifier.

I run the SLx 1x micro prism and its really nice. It was originally on my AK-105 but swapped it with the SLx 3x so I could use this magnifier setup. If you're running something like a prism 1x, there's really no need for irons in my opinion. If you're running into a scenario where you're having to revert to magpul mbus iron sights, you've probably got bigger problems than being unable to use your primary sighting system.

 

A micro prism with a QD magnifier is probably the best option for you, or the 3x or 5x if you're using your dominant eye. Even if you're cross eyed, you might be fine. The SLx 3x on my AK-105 doesn't give me the issues it did with it on my AR-15, somehow. The positioning difference with a (rewelded) triangle folder and zenitco kit on that AK-105 makes it a perfect position compared to on my AR-15.

 

The 4-14x involves deer hunting at ranges in excess of 500yrds, so the extra magnification for those longer shots really helps  

 

[Real_PhillBert]

3 hours ago, Agall said:

I've got a couple of MROs and the parallax makes anything past 100yrds somewhat difficult and isn't friendly to astigmatism. One of them is on my M1014 clone which works really nicely, the other of which is collecting dust right now.

My experience with the MRO is similar. I replaced it with an Aimpoint T2 about a year ago, the MRO has been chilling in the safe ever since. I'm sure eventually it'll end up on a range toy or something that I'm not expecting to make any shots at any real distance. 

 

I generally made it work with the MRO, but the parallax issues made it more difficult than it needed to be. 

[Agall]

16 minutes ago, Real_PhillBert said:

My experience with the MRO is similar. I replaced it with an Aimpoint T2 about a year ago, the MRO has been chilling in the safe ever since. I'm sure eventually it'll end up on a range toy or something that I'm not expecting to make any shots at any real distance. 

 

I generally made it work with the MRO, but the parallax issues made it more difficult than it needed to be. 

Its not terrible with astigmatism, but it could be better. I've used handgun optics with better parallax and with less blooming than the MRO, even as an owner of two of them  Bought the second one before realizing how crisp red dots should be.

 

I'd hold off and throw it on an AK on a dogleg mount or on a shotgun personally. Its a great fit there. My M1014 at the 2nd stock position using that MRO on a QD mount is the perfect height, since how collapsed that stock is varies the height. You basically can't use the irons without having the stock fully extended, as an example.

 

If you don't have a competition style 22lr handgun, that's also a great host for it  Either one with a full top rail or an optics mount that you can adapt to 1913.

[Crunchy Dragon]

3 hours ago, Agall said:

I run the SLx 1x micro prism and its really nice. It was originally on my AK-105 but swapped it with the SLx 3x so I could use this magnifier setup. If you're running something like a prism 1x, there's really no need for irons in my opinion. If you're running into a scenario where you're having to revert to magpul mbus iron sights, you've probably got bigger problems than being unable to use your primary sighting system.

 

A micro prism with a QD magnifier is probably the best option for you, or the 3x or 5x if you're using your dominant eye. Even if you're cross eyed, you might be fine. The SLx 3x on my AK-105 doesn't give me the issues it did with it on my AR-15, somehow. The positioning difference with a (rewelded) triangle folder and zenitco kit on that AK-105 makes it a perfect position compared to on my AR-15.

 

The 4-14x involves deer hunting at ranges in excess of 500yrds, so the extra magnification for those longer shots really helps  

 

Good to know. I've been hearing a lot of very good things about Primary Arms optics. That's a fair point about irons, I just like redundancies #JustInCase. I'm a weirdo though

 

I am cross eye dominant a little bit, with my left having a bit of an edge over my right. I've been told shooting longbows is driven more by your dominant eye, and I cannot shoot longbows right handed. I do firearms right handed though because while I am ambidextrous, my right hand does have an edge over my left, so I also shoot favoring my right eye as a result. I've only ever shot with both eyes open though, so it's not as huge of an issue being cross eyed or the mild astigmatism.

 

I'll have to check out Primary Arms some more. Do they make their own magnifiers or do I have to find one from another company and hope it works with the optic?

[Agall]

20 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Good to know. I've been hearing a lot of very good things about Primary Arms optics. That's a fair point about irons, I just like redundancies #JustInCase. I'm a weirdo though

 

I am cross eye dominant a little bit, with my left having a bit of an edge over my right. I've been told shooting longbows is driven more by your dominant eye, and I cannot shoot longbows right handed. I do firearms right handed though because while I am ambidextrous, my right hand does have an edge over my left, so I also shoot favoring my right eye as a result. I've only ever shot with both eyes open though, so it's not as huge of an issue being cross eyed or the mild astigmatism.

 

I'll have to check out Primary Arms some more. Do they make their own magnifiers or do I have to find one from another company and hope it works with the optic?

I'm actually in the same boat, genuinely. I'm left eye dominant yet I'm like a 40/60 split left/right, where plenty of one handed tasks I prefer my left but ever so slightly use my right majority of the time. Two handed activities I'm generally left handed, I can write and throw with both hands, and I'm usually more confused on which hand to use for something than not (although its rarely a problem since I'm quite athletic). Sometimes it changes by mood even, usually if I'm a bit more neurotic and right brain dominant that day, I'll end up using my left hand far more often. It's a strange configuration that's been interesting to figure out.

 

Regarding eyes, I also shoot both eyes open, since I shoot right handed and therefore long guns with my right eye, but handguns I shift to use my left eye. I don't have bad parallax issues that I know some of my friends have when shooting cross eyed, where my left eye isn't 'as dominant' as others might find theirs to be. Firearms just work better shooting right handed and early on I stuck to that as my dominant hand.

 

Primary Arms makes their own magnifiers that do work with the SLx 1x microprism. If you see my photo above of my KP-15 AR-15, that's using the SLx 1x and PA's 6x magnifier. The thing to keep in mind with that configuration is that you're working with two diopter settings, which took some time to get right to be good with both eyes and with/without the magnifier. The only downside to their magnifiers is that they don't come with a QD mount, and I don't see a 1st party option for one, however, this rifle is so light already, I just keep it permenantly installed and I just modified the trap door on my KP-15 lower to socket a torx wrench that works with both the SLx and magnifier.

 

 

If I need to remove it, here's the tool, always with the firearm

[Crunchy Dragon]

22 minutes ago, Agall said:

Primary Arms makes their own magnifiers that do work with the SLx 1x microprism. If you see my photo above of my KP-15 AR-15, that's using the SLx 1x and PA's 6x magnifier. The thing to keep in mind with that configuration is that you're working with two diopter settings, which took some time to get right to be good with both eyes and with/without the magnifier. The only downside to their magnifiers is that they don't come with a QD mount, and I don't see a 1st party option for one, however, this rifle is so light already, I just keep it permenantly installed and I just modified the trap door on my KP-15 lower to socket a torx wrench that works with both the SLx and magnifier.

 

 

If I need to remove it, here's the tool, always with the firearm

That's really good to know. My grip has the snack compartment(Magpul CTR stock on mine) so I could probably hide a tool in there...

[Agall]

@Real_PhillBert

 

Would you think a Streamlight Powertac 2 mounted ~1.5" away but in line with the muzzle device and end of the barrel of a 

16 inch 5.56 Barrel with Flash Hider | AR 15 Barrels (faxonfirearms.com) would be of concern? I'm seeing mixed information on whether that'll be likely to kill the light, it'll obviously cover it in carbon.

 

It doesn't seem to be as big of an issue with flash hiders compared to having your flashlight basically sucking a muzzle break, this barrel's flash hider being similar volume to an A2 since its longer but skinnier. 

 

Basically the bell of the light sticks out almost past the barrel with how I have it mounted. If I pull it any farther back, it prevents me from using the setup left handed properly. Its at the 2 o'clock position. Hard to show without a bunch of pictures, but here's at least one.

 

 

Its actually mounted at the last m-lok slot now from when I took this photo, so its even farther out now and almost at the end of the barrel.

[Real_PhillBert]

8 minutes ago, Agall said:

@Real_PhillBert

 

Would you think a Streamlight Powertac 2 mounted ~1.5" away but in line with the muzzle device and end of the barrel of a 

16 inch 5.56 Barrel with Flash Hider | AR 15 Barrels (faxonfirearms.com) would be of concern? I'm seeing mixed information on whether that'll be likely to kill the light, it'll obviously cover it in carbon.

 

It doesn't seem to be as big of an issue with flash hiders compared to having your flashlight basically sucking a muzzle break, this barrel's flash hider being similar volume to an A2 since its longer but skinnier. 

 

Basically the bell of the light sticks out almost past the barrel with how I have it mounted. If I pull it any farther back, it prevents me from using the setup left handed properly. Its at the 2 o'clock position. Hard to show without a bunch of pictures, but here's at least one.

 

*SNIP*

You shouldnt have any problems with that setup.

 

Before I got on the "Suppress all rifles all the time" bandwagon, I used a very similar setup but with comps. With a flash hider you should have no problems at all.

 

Here's my pre-suppressor setup:

 

[Agall]

6 minutes ago, Real_PhillBert said:

You shouldnt have any problems with that setup.

 

Before I got on the "Suppress all rifles all the time" bandwagon, I used a very similar setup but with comps. With a flash hider you should have no problems at all.

 

Here's my pre-suppressor setup:

 

That's sort of what I was hoping you had experience with, since I noticed the bell of your weaponlights are at the muzzle device because of suppressors.

 

I had to get the streamlight m-lok mount with a spacer and shaffer machining m-lok pressure switch to complete this setup, but its still cheaper than a surefire setup with a dual input tailcap from what I've seen. I can always reach over and constant on the light with the tailcap button in this setup.

 

Without the m-lok spacer, the octagonal design of this Faxon carbon fiber handguard is too wide, but the spacer works perfectly fine and you still can't see the flashlight body in my 1x optic whatsoever.

 

I'll be testing it today since it's in a configuration that I'll likely keep it (not shown in the photo), doing some live fire drills after work. So I'll let you know if there's any problems but I doubt it.

[Real_PhillBert]

15 minutes ago, Agall said:

That's sort of what I was hoping you had experience with, since I noticed the bell of your weaponlights are at the muzzle device because of suppressors.

 

I had to get the streamlight m-lok mount with a spacer and shaffer machining m-lok pressure switch to complete this setup, but its still cheaper than a surefire setup with a dual input tailcap from what I've seen. I can always reach over and constant on the light with the tailcap button in this setup.

 

I'll be testing it today since it's in a configuration that I'll likely keep it (not shown in the photo), doing some live fire drills after work. So I'll let you know if there's any problems but I doubt it.

I've gone through a few iterations of light switch setups over the years. I started with the Modlite with a Surefire DS00 tailcap, and the Surefire SR07 pressure pad pictured above, but was never wild about the SR07 mounting. Then I started hearing and seeing people modifying the SR07 to fit into a Cloud Defensive mount for the Streamlight switches, so I went that route for a few years.

 

 

This was solid, but the Surefire pressure pads were known to reduce the output of the modlites. I was willing to take that small hit for the pressure pad, until Unity came out with the modbutton and mod button lite, then I picked up a couple of the modbutton lites and havent looked back since. 

 

 

Not the cheapest light setup, but it's been rock solid on both my rifles.

 

At some point I would love to try out one of the Cloud Defensive REIN 3.0s, but I havent bitten that bullet just yet.

[Agall]

1 minute ago, Real_PhillBert said:

I've gone through a few iterations of light switch setups over the years. I started with the Modlite with a Surefire DS00 tailcap, and the Surefire SR07 pressure pad pictured above, but was never wild about the SR07 mounting. Then I started hearing and seeing people modify the SR07 to fit into a Cloud Defensive mount for the Streamlight switches, so I went that rout for a few years.

 

 

This was solid, but the Surefire pressure pads were known to reduce the output of the modlites. I was willing to take that small hit for the pressure pad, until Unity came out with the modbutton and mod button lite, then I picked up a couple of the modbutton lites and havent looked back since. 

 

 

Not the cheapest light setup, but it's been rock solid on both my rifles.

 

At some point I would love to try out one of the Cloud Defensive REIN 3.0s, but I havent bitten that bullet just yet.

 

The setup I have shown is my first full dive into pressure pad setups, which total has been <$300. The big hole I found in most of them is there's no external battery level indicator for any of these lights, so I might wait for someone to design such, maybe a special tailcap that can add that feature.

 

The limitation I run into is in my photo, the end of the pressure pad and that 1 slot m-lok cover is where the gas block is, where the bolt for that m-lok cover is shaved down several millimeters to prevent it from impacting the gas tube. The handguard is wonderful, but has its limitations obviously, since its symmetrically octagonal. Overall I think the material choice outweighs the downsides since outside of the gas block specifically, the handguard is never hot to the touch, even after several hundred rounds. It just creates certain limitations regarding light placement.

 

I also have to be careful how heavy I make the light, since it can drastically throw off the balance. The 6x magnifier I have on the firearm helps compensate for it though since it's at the proper location to balance out the light.

 

Not sure how keen I am on Streamlight's battery design, which uses a type-c port attached to the battery. So to charge the light, you remove the battery and plug in the type-c, and it uses red/green LEDs to indicate charge.

 

[Crunchy Dragon]

1 hour ago, Real_PhillBert said:

At some point I would love to try out one of the Cloud Defensive REIN 3.0s, but I havent bitten that bullet just yet.

I'm looking to snag one of those myself. Currently have a REIN 1.0 and it is very solid. Lumens and candela are both high enough that I have a very direct and focused beam that can blind people but it still throws enough light to fully illuminate any room in my home.

 

Mine is mounted below the bore with an Arisaka Scout offset mount. It's nice because the A2 flash hider directs all the gas and debris up away from the light, so it stays nice and clean

[Agall]

6 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

I'm looking to snag one of those myself. Currently have a REIN 1.0 and it is very solid. Lumens and candela are both high enough that I have a very direct and focused beam that can blind people but it still throws enough light to fully illuminate any room in my home.

 

Mine is mounted below the bore with an Arisaka Scout offset mount. It's nice because the A2 flash hider directs all the gas and debris up away from the light, so it stays nice and clean

I've considered that setup, the problem being my rail is 13" long and my ideal hand position is quite far out towards the end, so the light has to be mounted in an area not occupied by my QD mount, or pressure pad+VFG/AFG. Currently using the BCM KAG.

 

I will say running a pistol style light in such a position and using the back of your index/middle finger to actuate it is quite nice, a setup I ran for some time. Does require a VFG to operate effectively.

[Crunchy Dragon]

35 minutes ago, Agall said:

I've considered that setup, the problem being my rail is 13" long and my ideal hand position is quite far out towards the end, so the light has to be mounted in an area not occupied by my QD mount, or pressure pad+VFG/AFG. Currently using the BCM KAG.

 

I will say running a pistol style light in such a position and using the back of your index/middle finger to actuate it is quite nice, a setup I ran for some time. Does require a VFG to operate effectively.

Yeah, I have an AFG because my rail is weird. For some reason the top isn't M-LOK and it's a lightweight rail so it's not picatinny either, so the only way I can mount my remote switch is on the side. But then the only way I can keep enough of my hand on the gun while actuating the switch is to slap an AFG on the bottom rail, so that's what I did.

 

In nearly any other case, I'd prefer to have the switch on the top of the rail and have a VFG or handstop so I can C clamp more effectively with the light on.

 

EDIT: if we're measuring rail lengths, I think mine is 13.5" on a 16" barrel.

[Agall]

10 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Yeah, I have an AFG because my rail is weird. For some reason the top isn't M-LOK and it's a lightweight rail so it's not picatinny either, so the only way I can mount my remote switch is on the side. But then the only way I can keep enough of my hand on the gun while actuating the switch is to slap an AFG on the bottom rail, so that's what I did.

 

In nearly any other case, I'd prefer to have the switch on the top of the rail and have a VFG or handstop so I can C clamp more effectively with the light on.

 

EDIT: if we're measuring rail lengths, I think mine is 13.5" on a 16" barrel.

I had to go with the 13" when I built this upper since its a 14.5" integral barrel, so the next step up at 15" would get too close to the muzzle device for comfort.

 

When InrangeTV did their factory WWSD 2020 rifles with Brownell's, they used a different full m-lok carbon fiber handguard than the Faxon one, which they covered most of the top m-lok slots. Because of how tight it is to the gas tube, the whole top section is practically useless, where there's only a 1.5 slot section at the end that's open then another 1 slot between the gas block and before the gas tube curves upwards that are usable. Obviously this area needs to be covered for comfort, but there's m-lok slots going all the way back to the barrel nut minus the first most slot, all of which are practically worthless. I'd say its at least ventilation for the gas tube, compared to what InrangeTV did by filling them in.

 

The BCM KAG I swapped on and played with the other day, previously using a slateblackindustries VFG. the BCM KAG puts just the proper angle to get everything farther out without requiring my elbow to be locked to reach it properly. Its also more slimline than a VFG which is always nice.

[Agall]

Question for mostly people in the US:

 

If the NFA/Hughe's amendment was appealed/removed and NFA items entirely were fair game, what would be the first thing y'all would buy/do?

 

I'd personally take my side-by-side and make it a nice US v Miller special because why not  

 

First purchase would likely be some sort of select fire 9mm SMG as a plinker, like a fully configured MP9, MP5, MPX, etc.

[Crunchy Dragon]

15 minutes ago, Agall said:

Question for mostly people in the US:

 

If the NFA/Hughe's amendment was appealed/removed and NFA items entirely were fair game, what would be the first thing y'all would buy/do?

I'd reach my home defense endgame a lot faster, that's for sure: SBR suppressed .300 BLK.

 

I'm not sure what else I would do right off the bat, I'd have to give that some more thought. Select fire obviously comes to mind pretty quickly, I wouldn't mind having a burst-capable lower for SHTF and a full auto for the range.

[Crunchy Dragon]

This talk of full auto got me thinking about the time Jerry Miculek did this video:

 

The thumbnail kinda says it all. Gun shot so slowly that he turned to look at the camera while firing.

[Agall]

3 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

This talk of full auto got me thinking about the time Jerry Miculek did this video:

 

The thumbnail kinda says it all. Gun shot so slowly that he turned to look at the camera while firing.

Imagine how prolific tube guns would be even if the Hughe's amendment was repealed. Even with the $200 tax, they'd probably only cost $500 or less a piece.

 

7 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

I'd reach my home defense endgame a lot faster, that's for sure: SBR suppressed .300 BLK.

 

I'm not sure what else I would do right off the bat, I'd have to give that some more thought. Select fire obviously comes to mind pretty quickly, I wouldn't mind having a burst-capable lower for SHTF and a full auto for the range.

A suppressed 300BLK PDW is too obvious of an answer though  Same with an MP7 which we might see if H&K had free will to import them as machine guns in this scenario.

[Crunchy Dragon]

1 minute ago, Agall said:

A suppressed 300BLK PDW is too obvious of an answer though  Same with an MP7 which we might see if H&K had free will to import them as machine guns in this scenario.

Darn you HK for refusing to give us a semi auto MP7. They could totally do it, they just won't.

 

I don't care how "obvious" a .300BLK PDW is, that's what I think about the most as a regular guy who thinks about defending his family lol. I'd knock that one out first and then turn my attention to other fun toys.