AMD caught on lying as well, falsely presenting a working variable refresh rate monitor

[Razzaa]

The reason why it's called 'freesync' is because companies don't need to pay in order to implement it.

So...."Freeforeveryonebuttheconsumersync"? Sounds legit!

[DigitalHermit]

The reason why it's called 'freesync' is because companies don't need to pay in order to implement it.

 

So...."Freeforeveryonebuttheconsumersync"? Sounds legit!

 

It's 'freesync' okay... The monitor costs money to build and you're paying for the monitor...

 

Should you want a firmware update, there's shipping costs and labor costs...

 

nothing is 'free' per se...

 

@Thracks @peter@nixeus

Is there any estimate on how long this tech can reach my country (Philippines)? DVI monitors are still not that readily available nor affordable here...

[Glenwing]

So...."Freeforeveryonebuttheconsumersync"? Sounds legit!

 

FreeSync is free. FreeSync monitors are not free, because the monitor part still costs money. But you don't pay anything for the extra "FreeSync" bit, which makes it free. That's the idea anyway, we'll see how prices stack up when the products actually release.

[Razzaa]

FreeSync is free. Monitors are not free, so FreeSync monitors will still cost money of course. You have to pay for the monitor part. But you don't pay anything for the FreeSync part, which makes it free.

So a monitor with Freesync will cost the same as one without?

[Glenwing]

So a monitor with Freesync will cost the same as one without?

 

It doesn't cost any more to produce, so it should be close at the very least.

[Razzaa]

It doesn't cost any more to produce, so it should be close at the very least.

I highly doubt it. We will see though lol

[airdeano]

It doesn't cost any more to produce, so it should be close at the very least.

 

wouldn't  the extra price for certification to apply the AMD Freesync logo on the

packaging tithe into the profit margin? 'cause that won't be free.

[Hieb]

So a monitor with Freesync will cost the same as one without?

 

Probably not. It's still something marketable and they can still give it a markup. There's a huge gap right now between a normal 144Hz monitor and a 144Hz monitor with G-Sync. The gap is like $400, so there's a lot of breathing room here for the monitor manufacturers.

 

I'm guessing a FreeSync enabled monitor will cost about $70-100 more than a normal monitor. But the key point is that it doesn't cost the manufacturers anything to have freesync. All that's required is the available firmware and the Display Port spec they already have, so there are no proprietary or additional manufacturing costs. Depending on how widespread the feature becomes (since the spec isn't uncommon), it will likely eventually cost the same as an ordinary monitor and just be considered a baseline feature.

[dalekphalm]

The "free" part in free-sync means there isn't some extra module to control the refresh rate of the monitor that costs $100 on top of the monitor's cost itself.

I just wish there was some open-source solution to this instead of it being proprietary tech; that's not good for anybody.

Well, Adaptive-Sync is Open Source. There's literally nothing stopping NVIDIA from using it. They just chose not to (For valid enough reasons: They want to recoup the investment they made on G-Sync - Good for NVIDIA, not necessarily good for consumers).

 

FreeSync is simply AMD's driver side spec. Intel or NVIDIA could release their own "version" of FreeSync that was fully Adaptive-Sync Capable. In fact, I personally suspect that G-Sync (Driver Side) could easily be adapted to work with Adaptive-Sync (Although new GPU's that have DP 1.2a would likely be required).

 

Here's the rounded one;

http://www.pcper.com/news/Graphics-Cards/AMD-Demonstrates-Prototype-FreeSync-Monitor-DisplayPort-Adaptive-Sync-Feature

Its pretty much that monitor, stand is exactly the same, the lights are both blue and same amount of buttons with 4 of them being labeled. 

"pretty much the same" is not "exactly the same".

 

Look, I've clearly stated how it's NOT the same monitor. The one at CES has rounded corners at the top, the one you linked in that picture (Which is not FreeSync capable) has squared off corners. Therefore, they are different monitors. Besides, Monitor Vendors will use as many of the same parts in a monitor as possible, including casing. The overclockers link posted in the thread that I quoted clearly shows that they are different monitors. The Monitor Vendor rep even confirmed the part number of the CES monitor (Go look it up). No idea what you're going on about. Different monitors can have the same number of buttons in the same place. Just look at half the Dell or Acer monitors.

 

Pretty much is not enough for you to make the claim AMD lied. A monoprice 1440p monitor looks the same aesthetically as the 4K monitor. Your claims are not valid until you can give the exact model number used in the demo. 

Exactly this. Not only can different monitors share the same shell casing, but the two @Faa linked don't even look the same. They're clearly different, from a visual perspective.

 

Variable refresh rate isn't impossible without DP 1.2a. NVIDIA were clearly able to do it over DP 1.2, the display controller just needs to be programmed with the correct capabilities and has to communicate properly with the GPU. AMD and the monitor manufacturer worked together to get the proper communication between them to make it work. DP 1.2a is essentially a standardization of this, so that any future GPU and any future display that is compliant with DP 1.2a, with the proper software, will guarantee they all use the same method and format to achieve this. The feature itself is optional, but the spec ensures that if it is implemented, it is done so in a standardized way. But that's not necessary for a one-off demonstration if you have both the GPU and display vendor working together closely on their respective software to make it happen.

 

I suspect some other DP 1.2 monitors could be given a firmware update to enable adaptive-sync behavior, but how well it would work would really depend on the specific design of the monitor, for a real product you'd want a display designed for that capability in mind from the start. The AMD demonstration was just a proof-of-concept to show that a special expensive module isn't necessary for a variable refresh rate, FreeSync was still in development and may not have even operated in the same way as the current finalized FreeSync.

This is a very clear and well thought out analysis of the situation.

 

People are freaking out about this... for what? FreeSync is coming. We knew it would require new monitors (Anyone who didn't know this was being naive). We know that the scaler won't cost the Vendor any additional amount to use in any monitors. I simply cannot understand the argument that "FreeSync isn't free". It's free in the sense that - once released, buying a FreeSync monitor shouldn't cost you much more (or any more) then buying a comparable non-FreeSync monitor.

 

If course, when it all comes down to it, it's up to the Monitor Vendors to price their items, and determine profit margins. Some of them, especially those more concerned with profit over whats right for the consumer, will simply increase the profit margins on a FreeSync monitor, as there's more inherent "Value" in them, despite having an identical BOM (Bill of Materials) cost.

[dalekphalm]

wouldn't  the extra price for certification to apply the AMD Freesync logo on the

packaging tithe into the profit margin? 'cause that won't be free.

Well AMD doesn't charge anything for that certification process, as far as we're aware.

 

Of course, that doesn't stop the Monitor Vendor themselves from simply charging more and pocketing the extra profit. But AMD has zero control over that.

[Guest Kloaked]

Well, Adaptive-Sync is Open Source. There's literally nothing stopping NVIDIA from using it. They just chose not to (For valid enough reasons: They want to recoup the investment they made on G-Sync - Good for NVIDIA, not necessarily good for consumers).

 

FreeSync is simply AMD's driver side spec. Intel or NVIDIA could release their own "version" of FreeSync that was fully Adaptive-Sync Capable. In fact, I personally suspect that G-Sync (Driver Side) could easily be adapted to work with Adaptive-Sync (Although new GPU's that have DP 1.2a would likely be required).

I meant a module like G-Sync that people could make themselves, but now that I think about my idea, it was dumb because not everyone has software to design a PCB and then the tools and supplies to make such a PCB. I think when I posted that I was waiting on someone in the parking lot and I jotted down my thoughts that didn't get processed fully yet, lol.

[YeSH]

If you've figured the monitor out by frame, most korean manufacturers use generic frames for their monitors. So, the monitor they've used could've very well been a prototype of a future monitor just hanging out in that frame because they don't have a new one yet.

[mr moose]

It never ceases to amaze me how gullible people are when it comes to marketing.

[dalekphalm]

If you've figured the monitor out by frame, most korean manufacturers use generic frames for their monitors. So, the monitor they've used could've very well been a prototype of a future monitor just hanging out in that frame because they don't have a new one yet.

Not to mention the one he "matched" it to, doesn't even look the same. Take another look: Rounded corners vs squared corners in the two images he shows. They aren't even the same frame.

[zappian]

It never ceases to amaze me how gullible people are when it comes to marketing.

 

Best thing to do is being cynical and grumpy.

 

Thats what TB does and works well for me too.

[mr moose]

Best thing to do is being cynical and grumpy.

 

Thats what TB does and works well for me too.

I'm always cynical and grumpy, that's why people think I am a fanboy and holier than thou. 

 

So far I have been accused of being a fanboy for:

 

Nvidia, Samsung, Apple, Amd, Intel, Gigabyte. Razor, MS and consoles.

 

Not asus though, they have done anything I have yet to defend in anyway.

[Glenwing]

No need to argue about it, really. We already know which monitor it is:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1534242/amd-amd-brings-the-future-of-computing-to-life-at-2015-international-ces#post_23367750

If you look up the specs, no it does not support DP 1.2a (and it was released before DP 1.2a even existed) but as Thracks already clarified, it supports DP 1.2a and VRR after the custom firmware update that they worked with Nixeus to create. And as was explained earlier this is entirely possible because plenty of scalers (but not all) already in use can operate in VRR mode, but of course they won't do it if they aren't programmed to (hence the firmware update bit).

[zappian]

I'm always cynical and grumpy, that's why people think I am a fanboy and holier than thou. 

 

So far I have been accused of being a fanboy for:

 

Nvidia, Samsung, Apple, Amd, Intel, Gigabyte. Razor, MS and consoles.

 

Not asus though, they have done anything I have yet to defend in anyway.

 

I have been called an AMD fanboy plenty of times.

 

I like their cards because im poor.

[Faa]

Look, I've clearly stated how it's NOT the same monitor. 

Was already confirmed.

 

This is a very clear and well thought out analysis of the situation.

Except that eDP isn't capable of VRR which is what AMD claimed on laptops. 

[peter@nixeus]

I find it coincidental that a AMD rep choses this thread of all AMD attack threads to finally post after being here for this long AND a AMD partner shows up in the same thread. Neither of whom have any affiliate tags that are usually given by the mods so the forum members know that a industry marketing type is amongst them, you know, for the sake of transparency. 

But thats none of my business. 

 

 

One of your senior forum members brought my attention to this thread from twitter - I was perfectly happy lurking and reading for the past few years.  I just came out of the wood works to help clarify some confusion.  It is well known in another forum that I actively contribute and help other members (even though their issues are with another brand) and even play PC games with them.  I am a gamer and PC consumer just like everyone else in this forum and I own both Nvidia and AMD cards.  It is a very exciting time for the PC Monitor industry and I am very greatful that AMD and Nvidia are both resolving an issue that I have experienced since owning Voodoo GPUs back in the late 90s when I was playing Counter-Strike.

[Bloodkil933]

This just seems something an immature fanboy would do.

 

'Let's dig up dirt because I'm upset that Nvidia got made to look bad'

[sgloux3470]

 

Was already confirmed.

 

Except that eDP isn't capable of VRR which is what AMD claimed on laptops. 

 

 

Just give it up man.

[Faa]

Just give it up man.

Such as? The AMD marketing guy clearly stated you need a scaler for VRR, they clearly said they had VRR working on laptops and laptops don't even use a scaler. Hence why that guy couldn't say a damn shit about the laptops. Ask yourself why they havent announced a laptop with Freesync yet.

 

 

This just seems something an immature fanboy would do.

 

'Let's dig up dirt because I'm upset that Nvidia got made to look bad'

Wait, hating a brand's marketing is now immature? Don't tell me you're glad seeing ads everywhere. Hating/criticizing marketing is totally normal. Also as far as I know you were one of those guys lying to people who were asking advice on which CPU to buy. Don't call me a fanboy if you're intentionally lying for your own brand. 

[Bloodkil933]

 

Such as? The AMD marketing guy clearly stated you need a scaler for VRR, they clearly said they had VRR working on laptops and laptops don't even use a scaler. Hence why that guy couldn't say a damn shit about the laptops. Ask yourself why they havent announced a laptop with Freesync yet.

 

 

Wait, hating a brand's marketing is now immature? Don't tell me you're glad seeing ads everywhere. Hating/criticizing marketing is totally normal. Also as far as I know you were one of those guys lying to people who were asking advice on which CPU to buy. Don't call me a fanboy if you're intentionally lying for your own brand. 

 

I gave an opinion, not facts.

 

Also, why the hate? Don't hate what you can't appreciate, and besides, it's good for both sides, competition is what makes for a market. Intel and Nvidia monopoly is something that's bad for everyone, unless you want higher prices on crap CPU's and GPU's?

 

Please stop with this AMD hate vendetta, it's so childish, if you really don't like a brand, then be constructive when you do it, don't just flame and insult people because you don't agree with them.

 

The fact you keep trying to dig up dirt about people just shows everyone how pathetic you're being.

[ComradeHX]

This is just dumb. Xbox demos are being run off of PCs, and nobody cares

The excuse is that it's a "devkit."