Are you for/against the US strikes against IS in Iraq?

[AlwaysFSX]

I have provided all the proof that says you are mistaken. You simply don't know your history, or are sticking to bad sources for your information. Judaism was created by the Jewish people. Jews as a people, as an ethnicity, existed long before they established their religion. You can be of Jewish ethnicity without following the religion. It's not like being Muslim or Christian where it's strictly defined by the religious beliefs. That's why the establishment city of Jerusalem, named after the ethnic Jewish people, predates Judaism, and is why no one else has any claim to that land.

Israel is fighting because Hamas is constantly firing rockets at them, and launching terrorist attacks against them, and using tunnels to sneak into their country to kidnap and murder people. It was the rocket attacks that forced Israel to bomb the missile sites and they only launched a ground operation to destroy the tunnels. The day Hamas lays down it's arms, Israel will stop defending themselves against Hamas. Learn your history, that land belongs to the Jewish people and has belong to them for thousands of years.

You can't be Jewish without following Judaism.

 

eth·nic·i·ty

eTHˈnisitē/

noun

the fact or state of belonging to a social group that has a common national or cultural tradition.

"the interrelationship between gender, ethnicity, and class"

 

 

Also, you know who has claim to that land? The people that conquered it. Simple fact of how the world runs. If I conquer land, and you show up, it's still my land.

 

I do not care for why Israel is fighting because they are still not helping the situation. Sure, they're protecting themselves. But if they're openly denying peace talks then they are narrow-minded simpletons that refuse to play nice. So they do not deserve help in my book. Until you openly reach out with a hand to try and make peace, I do not care what happens.

[shiftberry]

Also, you know who has claim to that land? The people that conquered it. Simple fact of how the world runs. If I conquer land, and you show up, it's still my land.

 

I do not care for why Israel is fighting because they are still not helping the situation. Sure, they're protecting themselves. But if they're openly denying peace talks then they are narrow-minded simpletons that refuse to play nice. So they do not deserve help in my book. Until you openly reach out with a hand to try and make peace, I do not care what happens.

but what if Hamas happen to conquer the whole map, then you would have already proven your point, they applied the same as what Hitler did to Europe so be it 

 

you said it yourself, this is how the world works!

[AlwaysFSX]

but what if Hamas happen to conquer the whole map, then you would have already proven your point, they applied the same as what Hitler did to Europe so be it 

 

you said it yourself, this is how the world works!

Tough shit for Israel? They can fight back, they're just not going outside their own borders. I think they have forgotten that to end a problem like this you either make peace or conquer the area. That's how it used to be done. They're not asking for peace so let them fight. The US can easily end problems like these quickly, by bombing the ever living hell out of the place, but there's still no reason to. Does not pertain to us, does not require intervention.

[Fred Castellum]

Let's give everyone against Hamas and ISIS more weapons! We won't directly help but we can supply.

 

Wait...

 

I think this has been done before... <.<

Ughhh so problematic.... 

 

if you vote against... you need to think hard about your life. there are 50 000 people on a mountain about to die and people are commenting "We dont have enough money"

Don't be so sensationalist, there are various atrocities happening around the world all the time. If we don't have the resources to help we can't help, if you can't help yourself how are you to help others? Sure the US has tons of military power that it can use but at what cost? Money helps the world go round and that's the cold hard truth, I'm not against providing humanitarian aid for those suffering but everything needs to be done within logical reason.

 

For example some country on the other side of the world is having a raging civil war, why should we send jets over there and bomb one of the factions when the conflict has no direct relation to us? 

 

Not everyone thinks the same, its like there was a murder case in England and the US hears about it. Oh it was a horrid murder case we should send out detectives over to England to help out! 

 

EDIT: A example would be the massive earthquake in china recently.

[AlwaysFSX]

Ughhh so problematic.... 

 

Don't be so sensationalist, there are various atrocities happening around the world all the time. If we don't have the resources to help we can't help, if you can't help yourself how are you to help others? Sure the US has tons of military power that it can use but at what cost? Money helps the world go round and that's the cold hard truth, I'm not against providing humanitarian aid for those suffering but everything needs to be done within logical reason.

 

For example some country on the other side of the world is having a raging civil war, why should we send jets over there and bomb one of the factions when the conflict has no direct relation to us? 

 

Not everyone thinks the same, its like there was a murder case in England and the US hears about it. Oh it was a horrid murder case we should send out detectives over to England to help out! 

Because it's a large group of people in need! Frankly I think we should put those resources towards the Ebola problems in Africa because that's a problem in which people are dying but nobody caused any fighting. That's just nature being nature. Two groups attacking each other because of their beliefs? Eh, let them duke it out for a while.

 

I only want the historical sites preserved for the rest of humanity, those seem more important to me because they give seeds for thinking..hopefully rationally.

[Fred Castellum]

Because it's a large group of people in need! Frankly I think we should put those resources towards the Ebola problems in Africa because that's a problem in which people are dying but nobody caused any fighting. That's just nature being nature. Two groups attacking each other because of their beliefs? Eh, let them duke it out for a while.

 

I only want the historical sites preserved for the rest of humanity, those seem more important to me because they give seeds for thinking..hopefully rationally.

Agreed on the notion we should provide aid to the Ebola victims. Though the chances of economical gain is lower by doing so at least were not sending people to their possible deaths. 

[x7ASSASSIN7x]

Ughhh so problematic.... 

 

Don't be so sensationalist, there are various atrocities happening around the world all the time. If we don't have the resources to help we can't help, if you can't help yourself how are you to help others? Sure the US has tons of military power that it can use but at what cost? Money helps the world go round and that's the cold hard truth, I'm not against providing humanitarian aid for those suffering but everything needs to be done within logical reason.

 

For example some country on the other side of the world is having a raging civil war, why should we send jets over there and bomb one of the factions when the conflict has no direct relation to us? 

 

Not everyone thinks the same, its like there was a murder case in England and the US hears about it. Oh it was a horrid murder case we should send out detectives over to England to help out! 

Think thoroughly... We are talking about IS (Islamic State). If we don't stop them now they will expand into Turkey and Jordan (They said so themselves) eventually tearing through the middle east. So would you really want WW3 to be the IS group against UN. Don't let an early decision ruin the future of A LOT of people other than North America. 

They also sent jets to help Iraq because the head of counsel thought this through or else they would not have sent their Navy to Iraq. As Obama said, he takes his military very seriously. I think he's doing the right thing now! 

Also please don't compare a murder case in England to a mass genocide in Iraq... don't be one of those people

[AlwaysFSX]

Agreed on the notion we should provide aid to the Ebola victims. Though the chances of economical gain is lower by doing so at least were not sending people to their possible deaths. 

Making money off of war isn't my cup of tea, I'd prefer through transactions dealing with the improvement on technologies.

 

Think thoroughly... We are talking about IS (Islamic State). If we don't stop them now they will expand into Turkey and Jordan (They said so themselves) eventually tearing through the middle east. So would you really want WW3 to be the IS group against UN. Don't let an early decision ruin the future of A LOT of people other than North America. 

They also sent jets to help Iraq because the head of counsel thought this through or else they would not have sent their Navy to Iraq. As Obama said, he takes his military very seriously. I think he's doing the right thing now! 

Wat. You think Turkey will stand to let itself get invaded? There's a reason they've been there forever. This is a problem that's been contained to those few countries for thousands of years, it's not likely it'll change with one group that has an attitude problem.

[cae]

if you vote against... you need to think hard about your life. there are 50 000 people on a mountain about to die and people are commenting "We dont have enough money"

 

They're about to die because of our "support" in the past, disbanding the Iraqi army and supplying Syrian rebels. Both options leave us with bloodied hands.

[x7ASSASSIN7x]

Making money off of war isn't my cup of tea, I'd prefer through transactions dealing with the improvement on technologies.

 

Wat. You think Turkey will stand to let itself get invaded? There's a reason they've been there forever. This is a problem that's been contained to those few countries for thousands of years, it's not likely it'll change with one group that has an attitude problem.

People like you said the same in WW2 against Germany.... Don't get ahead of yourself. The Iraqi army fled because of the fear from IS. The IS group behead and kill people in their way, this is not taken lightly by people. Also, I bet if we went back to 3 years ago and I told you that an group named IS would take over Syria and Iraq in about 2 years, you'd laugh; what can we say now?

[x7ASSASSIN7x]

They're about to die because of our "support" in the past, disbanding the Iraqi army and supplying Syrian rebels. Both options leave us with bloodied hands.

I agree with that statement fully but the support you gave earlier was more money than action if you know what I mean

[Fred Castellum]

Think thoroughly... We are talking about IS (Islamic State). If we don't stop them now they will expand into Turkey and Jordan (They said so themselves) eventually tearing through the middle east. So would you really want WW3 to be the IS group against UN. Don't let an early decision ruin the future of A LOT of people other than North America. 

They also sent jets to help Iraq because the head of counsel thought this through or else they would not have sent their Navy to Iraq. As Obama said, he takes his military very seriously. I think he's doing the right thing now! 

Also please don't compare a murder case in England to a mass genocide in Iraq... don't be one of those people

Do you really think Israel will bend over and let them have their way? Israel's military isn't weak... they will resist and fight back if they have to. What happens when you corner a country? They fight back with more force and moral reason!

 

The UN should be a group effort in helping with the conflict if they are going to help at all. Fuck the idea of the US being the only nation to provide heavy military support.

 

Whether you like it or not mass genocide being done over there was not caused by the US people so we have no obligation to fix it, though we can provide humanitarian aid to help those suffering. 

 

Do you want to arm up and head over there to fight the ones you view as wrongdoers with your life on the line even though none of it was caused by your doing?

[Fred Castellum]

Making money off of war isn't my cup of tea, I'd prefer through transactions dealing with the improvement on technologies.

 

Wat. You think Turkey will stand to let itself get invaded? There's a reason they've been there forever. This is a problem that's been contained to those few countries for thousands of years, it's not likely it'll change with one group that has an attitude problem.

Naturally I agree but its undeniable the US saw potential financial benefit from the war in Iraq. 

 

Not to mention Turkey's military power isn't some flak either. 

 

I agree with that statement fully but the support you gave earlier was more money than action if you know what I mean

Do you want to spend lives or money? Its not like the conflict will end altogether if we spend lives.

[x7ASSASSIN7x]

Do you really think Israel will bend over and let them have their way? Israel's military isn't weak... they will resist and fight back if they have to. What happens when you corner a country? They fight back with more force and moral reason!

 

The UN should be a group effort in helping with the conflict if they are going to help at all. Fuck the idea of the US being the only nation to provide heavy military support.

 

Whether you like it or not mass genocide being done over there was not caused by the US people so we have no obligation to fix it, though we can provide humanitarian aid to help those suffering. 

 

Do you want to arm up and head over there to fight the ones you view as wrongdoers with your life on the line even though none of it was caused by your doing?

That's why people join the army, because they know they will end up going to a place and fight for something they didn't start. I agree with you though on one point, I don't think USA should be the only country to help, the UN should get involved also. UK sent a plane yesterday to help.

 

Naturally I agree but its undeniable the US saw potential financial benefit from the war in Iraq. 

 

 

Do you want to spend lives or money? Its not like the conflict will end altogether if we spend lives.

I never said to send either. Money is what started this whole thing as the rebels in Syria started because of the "US" trying to help fight of Assad. Now they have expanded, so money obviously isn't the solution. Although, Obama is not sending troops into Iraq only fighter jets, so you also cannot say more american lives will be killed compared to the Iraqi civilians.

[AlwaysFSX]

People like you said the same in WW2 against Germany.... Don't get ahead of yourself. The Iraqi army fled because of the fear from IS. The IS group behead and kill people in their way, this is not taken lightly by people. Also, I bet if we went back to 3 years ago and I told you that an group named IS would take over Syria and Iraq in about 2 years, you'd laugh; what can we say now?

You must not know history because damn near everyone knew Germany was taking land by force. Everyone just turned a blind eye or agreed to their terms while Hitler turned around and stole more land. Even reading a newspaper you'd know Germany was expanding. Doesn't take a genius to read a headline. ISIS (or whatever they're called at this point, I don't care) on the other hand, does not have the resources or military that Germany had back then. The only reason they're able to take over areas is because the other people, as always, do not want to stand up for themselves, grab a gun and tell them to GTFO.

 

Do you really think Israel will bend over and let them have their way? Israel's military isn't weak... they will resist and fight back if they have to. What happens when you corner a country? They fight back with more force and moral reason!

 

The UN should be a group effort in helping with the conflict if they are going to help at all. Fuck the idea of the US being the only nation to provide heavy military support.

 

Whether you like it or not mass genocide being done over there was not caused by the US people so we have no obligation to fix it, though we can provide humanitarian aid to help those suffering. 

 

Do you want to arm up and head over there to fight the ones you view as wrongdoers with your life on the line even though none of it was caused by your doing?

Sure! Why not! 

[AlwaysFSX]

That's why people join the army, because they know they will end up going to a place and fight for something they didn't start. I agree with you though on one point, I don't think USA should be the only country to help, the UN should get involved also. UK sent a plane yesterday to help.

 

I never said to send either. Money is what started this whole thing as the rebels in Syria started because of the "US" trying to help fight of Assad. Now they have expanded, so money obviously isn't the solution. Although, Obama is not sending troops into Iraq only fighter jets, so you also cannot say more american lives will be killed compared to the Iraqi civilians.

People join the Army to protect our country. Not theirs. Also, a plane? Just one? Hurray for all the support. This did not start with Syria, Syria was a result of the US not being able to keep al qaeda where they were. This is a problem that has been on going in these countries for hundreds of years.

[x7ASSASSIN7x]

You must not know history because damn near everyone knew Germany was taking land by force. Everyone just turned a blind eye or agreed to their terms while Hitler turned around and stole more land. Even reading a newspaper you'd know Germany was expanding. Doesn't take a genius to read a headline. ISIS (or whatever they're called at this point, I don't care) on the other hand, does not have the resources or military that Germany had back then. The only reason they're able to take over areas is because the other people, as always, do not want to stand up for themselves, grab a gun and tell them to GTFO.

 

Sure! Why not! 

Then why didn't the US get into WW2 until 1941? It took them 2 years to read their newspapers to finally decide who to fight against? If you think that IS is that easily beatable, then I ask you to please read on your history as well. People in the middle east don't have the courage to fight against them when their own generals leave their posts. People are scared to tell them to GTFO because they will be targeted and killed. Unfortunately, we don't live in a world where its that simple

[x7ASSASSIN7x]

People join the Army to protect our country. Not theirs. Also, a plane? Just one? Hurray for all the support. This did not start with Syria, Syria was a result of the US not being able to keep al qaeda where they were. This is a problem that has been on going in these countries for hundreds of years.

Al Queda helped IS with money but US were the leading factor. Remember when they gassed all those people and the US blamed Assad? Until they found out who it actually was. I blame the US for starting the war back in 2003 in Iraq as they left it with minimum support.

[cae]

That's why people join the army, because they know they will end up going to a place and fight for something they didn't start. I agree with you though on one point, I don't think USA should be the only country to help, the UN should get involved also. UK sent a plane yesterday to help.

 

I never said to send either. Money is what started this whole thing as the rebels in Syria started because of the "US" trying to help fight of Assad. Now they have expanded, so money obviously isn't the solution. Although, Obama is not sending troops into Iraq only fighter jets, so you also cannot say more american lives will be killed compared to the Iraqi civilians.

 

Say we stop the bloodshed presently. Then what? We've taken steps to destabilize the region in the past. That's how ISIS is able to steamroll the way they are. What prevents it from happening again? And what stops air strikes in Syria at ISIS from turning into air strikes at Assad like Obama wanted in the first place?

[AlwaysFSX]

Then why didn't the US get into WW2 until 1941? It took them 2 years to read their newspapers to finally decide who to fight against? If you think that IS is that easily beatable, then I ask you to please read on your history as well. People in the middle east don't have the courage to fight against them when their own generals leave their posts. People are scared to tell them to GTFO because they will be targeted and killed. Unfortunately, we don't live in a world where its that simple

The US didn't enter WW2 because it didn't have a reason to until Japan attacked. US declares war on Japan, Germany and Italy declare war in the US. Not hard to follow. IS is easily beatable, believe it or not. If the blast doesn't kill you, the radiation certainly will. People are scared because they're afraid to die, but don't want their land taken. It's one or the other really. Fight or be conquered.

[x7ASSASSIN7x]

The US didn't enter WW2 because it didn't have a reason to until Japan attacked. US declares war on Japan, Germany and Italy declare war in the US. Not hard to follow. IS is easily beatable, believe it or not. If the blast doesn't kill you, the radiation certainly will. People are scared because they're afraid to die, but don't want their land taken. It's one or the other really. Fight or be conquered.

Regardless, your last statement should have been said different about the newspapers lol, but the last point you made we can both agree on. Now I do not want to keep debating on a post on LTT that should have not been made anyways lol

 

Say we stop the bloodshed presently. Then what? We've taken steps to destabilize the region in the past. That's how ISIS is able to steamroll the way they are. What prevents it from happening again? And what stops air strikes in Syria at ISIS from turning into air strikes at Assad like Obama wanted in the first place?

No one can bet on any of those to stop happening, but we have to make sure the infectious disease of IS does not grow especially when thousands are dying

[AlwaysFSX]

No one can bet on any of those to stop happening, but we have to make sure the infectious disease of IS does not grow especially when thousands are dying

Hey, maybe if people stopped fearing death and started fighting for their stuff, there wouldn't be this problem.

[cae]

No one can bet on any of those to stop happening, but we have to make sure the infectious disease of IS does not grow especially when thousands are dying

 

Religious extremists hell-bent on genocide, thousands dying at their hands. How do we violently oppose it from ISIS and fervently support it from Israel, a few hundred miles from each other, simultaneously?

[Fred Castellum]

 

That's why people join the army, because they know they will end up going to a place and fight for something they didn't start. I agree with you though on one point, I don't think USA should be the only country to help, the UN should get involved also. UK sent a plane yesterday to help.

I've met quite a few military personnel spanning from air force, marines to army while playing GW2 and I can assure you none of the ones I've met joined the army for the sake of fighting at a place that has nothing to do with defending their home country. 

 

They don't like the idea of putting their lives on the line for something they don't believe in, yet they do it anyway because that's their obligation to the military. 

 

The UK sent a single plane.... I guess that's a start? A laughable one? 

 

The world ain't that simple of a place. 

 

EDIT: Somewhat humorous, as a friend of mine has said before. It's not funny when you step to the side to do your business then suddenly hear gunfire... can't even shit in peace over there. 

[x7ASSASSIN7x]

Hey, maybe if people stopped fearing death and started fighting for their stuff, there wouldn't be this problem.

Its not that simple, I can say that because I've personally experienced it. People would rather run then protect their stuff

 

Religious extremists hell-bent on genocide, thousands dying at their hands. How do we violently oppose it from ISIS and fervently support it from Israel, a few hundred miles from each other, simultaneously?

 

Israel isn't IS though. I know they are killing people that are being used as shields but that has nothing to do with this post about Iraq. I think that in itself is America's problem, that it why I think they contradict themselves, but the Iraq problem is a place US has to come into place nonetheless.

 

 

I've met quite a few military personnel spanning from air force, marines to army while playing GW2 and I can assure you none of the ones I've met joined the army for the sake of fighting at a place that has nothing to do with defending their home country. 

 

They don't like the idea of putting their lives on the line for something they don't believe in, yet they do it anyway because that's their obligation to the military. 

 

The UK sent a single plane.... I guess that's a start? A laughable one? 

 

The world ain't that simple of a place. 

 

EDIT: Somewhat humorous, as a friend of mine has said before. It's not funny when you step to the side to do your business then suddenly hear gunfire... can't even shit in peace over there. 

 

When I pinpointed the UK plane I was trying to allow you to know that they are stepping in. The people on that mountain would not be laughing with you on this one I'd have to say. I guess the point of me posting here is, when the US spends money elsewhere no one bats an eye, but when they send help for innocent people who have shed many more tears than you could imagine, everyone loses an their minds. One of the reason Obama stepped in was because of the one woman crying the Iraq office. The video went viral (dunno if you saw it).

 

What your friend said is quite true. Like I said above, I have experienced these atrocities first hand where I was born, and let me tell you, its horrifying.