Are you for/against the US strikes against IS in Iraq?

[Mooshi]

Not just the US the rest of the world too, because the US has its hand in so many world events its seems like were the country solely obligated to solve all the problems and thats wrong.

Hence my earlier statement of the US should stop playing Super Man and focus on what is right for the citizens. I don't feel any more "free" or "safe" with all this going on.

[AlwaysFSX]

Think about this, what if it was YOURE country thats being opressed/invaded and you couldnt do anything about it. Wouldnt you want the outside help ?

Why wouldn't I be able to do anything about it? Give me a good reason.

[jmaster299]

This is what I am thinking here. Killing people is not a direct goal of itself, but it is used to prove that a given party refuses to happily surrender it's motives so that somebody else has their way. If Israel has a non-genocide end goal, then so does Hamas, Taliban and the likes. If the Palestinians are trying to protect their land, then so are the Israelis. You have to see the other side of the problem, with open eyes, and understand why the "bad guys" do what they do. It is almost always more complex than what the medias would like you to believe. I have lost count of the amount of times where both Fox News and MSNBC have spouted complete and absolute lies about what is going on in the world beyond the States.

 

I have said this before, but I have 0 respect to the people who see the one side as a vile POS because they (very strongly) support the other. Yes, @jmaster299, I am talking about you. You should be very careful when you state your "facts", because I can very easily turn your own logic against you. To classify one side as "radicals" to such a broad degree, you are by yourself a radical, because you reject the merits of the opponent's argument, as misinterpret them as "extremist hate". You really think that Hamas does not see us a "infidel radicals"? When you boil it down, there is little to no difference between how they see us and how we see them, and it essentially becomes a battle of who's opinion is more important. Case in point: The Cold War. 

Hamas are radicals, and so is every person who supports them. The legit government of Palestine does NOT support them, and I stand with that government just like I do Israel.

ISIS are radicals, and so is every person who supports them. People who cut the heads off of children for simply not being radicals too do NOT deserve anything but having a bomb dropped on their head.

The government of Iran, which we sadly had a part in helping come to power, are radicals. So is everyone who supports them. But there is a large portion of the civilian population in Iran that rejects those beliefs, and I stand with them like I do Israel.

The Muslim Brotherhood are radicals, and disgustingly enough the liberals in our government support them, making them radicals too. But the people of Egypt stood up to the Muslim Brotherhood, and I stand with them like I do Israel.

So don't try to spin being a radical as just a difference of opinion or point of view. These groups that are calling for the death of every Jew, Christian and American deserve nothing but to be destroyed. There very demands are an act of war. They have proven over and over again that they will never stop, they will never let the rest of the world live in peace.

[MetalicMassacre]

I am against it purly because we have spent too much time,money, and people there. Its good and all that we are helping them,but we seem to jump in every time there is a conflict

[shiftberry]

What we need in this world is countries to finish wars.  Stop negotiating peace that will never be kept.  Finish enemies off.  I get tired of these bs wars and skirmishes.  Also if certain countries can't act peacefully and behave then why not invade the damn countries and take their resources and kill off the people.  End of story.  

[shiftberry]

So, we should just sit back and continue to let ISIS slaughter people until other countries agree to bomb them with us??????

The ISIS has nothing to do with Hamas, they rise the same Islamic flag doesn't mean they have the very same ideology! Every religion has its own flag or symbol to demonstrate themselves but the ISIS is just beyond from being radical! Anyways, ISIS would have chopped all Hamas members heads off if they were hostages because ISIS doesn't negociate, no matter who you are and were captured by the ISIS as a hostage, you're surely dead...

 

Hamas is fighting for their land and for their people, they want to get their land back and eliminate your oppression and tyranny towards them, so be it and fight them!

 

In Syria, couple months ago, Many Al Nusra-Front members who are known as Jihadists and radicals were killed by the ISIS 

[jmaster299]

The ISIS has nothing to do with Hamas, they rise the same Islamic flag doesn't mean they have the very same ideology! Every religion has its own flag or symbol to demonstrate themselves but the ISIS is just beyond from being radical! Anyways, ISIS would have chopped all Hamas members heads off if they were hostages because ISIS doesn't negociate, no matter who you are and were captured by the ISIS as a hostage, you're surely dead...

 

Hamas is fighting for their land and for their people, they want to get their land back and eliminate your oppression and tyranny towards them, so be it and fight them!

 

In Syria, couple months ago, Many Al Nusra-Front members who are known as Jihadists and radicals were killed by the ISIS 

I never said ISIS was involved or working with Hamas, but both groups are Islamic Radicals. There is no land for Hamas to take back, they have Palestine, that's it. But they are trying to destroy Israel, and have called for the death of every Jew and Christian on earth. Israel does not belong to Palestine, never has, never will. The Jewish claim to Israel dates back 6000 years, the country of Israel occupies the exact same land as they did 6000 years ago. I provided this proof over and over in this thread.

Hamas murders and intentionally causes the death of children too. They don't film themselves cutting their heads off, but as I linked earlier, they use children as human shields for their mortar and rocket sites. They also used children to help dig their tunnels into Israel, killing the children in the process. No one group of Islamic Radicals is better than the other. They all believe in the same thing, that there God commands them to kill every single man, woman and child who does not believe as they do and that they will be rewarded for killing them.

[shiftberry]

I never said ISIS was involved or working with Hamas, but both groups are Islamic Radicals. There is no land for Hamas to take back, they have Palestine, that's it. But they are trying to destroy Israel, and have called for the death of every Jew and Christian on earth. Israel does not belong to Palestine, never has, never will. The Jewish claim to Israel dates back 6000 years, the country of Israel occupies the exact same land as they did 6000 years ago. I provided this proof over and over in this thread.

Hamas murders and intentionally causes the death of children too. They don't film themselves cutting their heads off, but as I linked earlier, they use children as human shields for their mortar and rocket sites. They also used children to help dig their tunnels into Israel, killing the children in the process. No one group of Islamic Radicals is better than the other. They all believe in the same thing, that there God commands them to kill every single man, woman and child who does not believe as they do and that they will be rewarded for killing them.

 

you know what broke my heart the most? it's bombarding randomly civilians, you claim that you have the most modern and sophisticated weaponry and you surely own drones which they don't own because they can't afford a single one or even a tank... why would you strike civilians then? AH! because Hamas members hide their weapons in mosques, in people's houses and at schools that's why you intentionally target everyone like ants.

 

If they were intentional in every move and action they do and use whatsoever they have to strike you back, why wouldn't you accurately avoid killing civilians? That means, your plan is quite consipicuous is genocide. You mustn't blame civilians for supporting in what they believe in, you should blame those who use them as baits so you can guitlessly strike them together and act eventually like Mr. Innocent!

 

People are born free and unshackeled, you train your children hatred and violence as you insert the sense of aggression in them!

[ConfusedDolphin]

I mean US military involvement has always gone so well and never has lasting negative repercussions, how could you not support this?? 

[jmaster299]

you know what broke my heart the most? it's bombarding randomly civilians, you claim that you have the most modern and sophisticated weaponry and you surely own drones which they don't own because they can't afford a single one or even a tank... why would you strike civilians then? AH! because Hamas members hide their weapons in mosques, in people's houses and at schools that's why you intentionally target everyone like ants.

 

If they were intentional in every move and action they do and use whatsoever they have to strike you back, why wouldn't you accurately avoid killing civilians? That means, your plan is quite consipicuous is genocide. You mustn't blame civilians for supporting in what they believe in, you should blame those who use them as baits so you can guitlessly strike them together and act eventually like Mr. Innocent!

 

People are born free and unshackeled, you train your children hatred and violence as you insert the sense of aggression in them!

When did I ever make any claim about having the most modern or sophisticated weapons??? Civilians only die from Israel airstrikes because Hamas fires rockets from populated residential areas ON PURPOSE. The blood of all of those civilians is on Hamas's hands, not Israel. It also sound like you think I'm from Israel or that I'm Jewish. I'm a Christian born and raised in the US. Everything I have stated about the Israel and Hamas conflict is pure fact. Backed up by numerous sources and videos that I have linked throughout this thread.

It's ironic that you talk about training children to be hateful and violent, when its only Islamic Radicals that do that.

Here are two of the videos that I posted earlier. You want to know why civilians get killed in the bombings, this is why. Israel has an absolute right to destroy every missile site, rocket launcher and mortar launcher that is being used against them. 

[shiftberry]

When did I ever make any claim about having the most modern or sophisticated weapons??? Civilians only die from Israel airstrikes because Hamas fires rockets from populated residential areas ON PURPOSE. The blood of all of those civilians is on Hamas's hands, not Israel. It also sound like you think I'm from Israel or that I'm Jewish. I'm a Christian born and raised in the US. Everything I have stated about the Israel and Hamas conflict is pure fact. Backed up by numerous sources and videos that I have linked throughout this thread.

It's ironic that you talk about training children to be hateful and violent, when its only Islamic Radicals that do that.

 

the video i'm quoting now is from Syria, they are protesting against the Syrian Arab Regime of Bashar Al Assad as they are striking the promiscuous regime with that mortar therefore this has nothing to do with Palestine but the use of children is just pathetic and idiotic... you really didn't see what Bashar Al Assad did to his Syrian people, a complete massacre that will make you perhaps weep!

 

i saw some real videos weeks ago in Facebook about Israeli children's and people's aggressive reactions towards Arabs and Muslims aswell!

 

there you go! An American Jewish supports Palestine:

 

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=1451481811769244&set=vb.1375570066027086&type=2&theater

 

some Israeli officers captured a child for no reason:

 

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=599613566824335&set=vb.118863654899331&type=2&theater

[Misanthrope]

"carpet bomb them into oblivion" always nice to see such wonderful human beings on this forums *ignore list updated*

[Th3 Mans1ay3r]

Nope.

 

Iraqis let this happen so they have to just deal with the consequences they sowed.

 

We're also not in the economic position or in the general position to be pulling that kind of crap anymore.  

[Fred Castellum]

Unless someone can provide a legitimate permanent solution to the problem that isn't obscene like bombing them all to ashes then any form of military engagement is pointless. It's a endless cycle of foreign involvement if that's the case.  

[Mooshi]

Unless someone can provide a legitimate permanent solution to the problem that isn't obscene like bombing them all to ashes then any form of military engagement is pointless. It's a endless cycle of foreign involvement if that's the case.  

 

When the core factor is clashing ideology, nothing on this planet will make conflict cease. Thus, there isnt a permanent solution to the problem. The only real option we have is to frivolously waste human lives and billions of dollars or ignore. On a much smaller scale, this is like trying to convince a Pepsi lover that Coca Cola is better. It's not going to happen, both will stubbornly defend their position and get nowhere. The US involvement with the middle east is basically an overblown soda war with casualties. It's pointless. Whenever the US tries to "help", the enemy ends up gettings access to weapons and it creates even more conflict. Like with Israel and the Gaza strip. If no outside funding was going to either side, the conflict would be considerably smaller. (no, I'm not buying the "but they are firing rockets" excuse as I've seen the photos of Israelis smiling on the border with chairs watching Palestinians get attacked and even cheering.) Pointless ideology based fighting at its finest.

[Fred Castellum]

When the core factor is clashing ideology, nothing on this planet will make conflict cease. Thus, there isnt a permanent solution to the problem. The only real option we have is to frivolously waste human lives and billions of dollars or ignore. On a much smaller scale, this is like trying to convince a Pepsi lover that Coca Cola is better. It's not going to happen, both will stubbornly defend their position and get nowhere. The US involvement with the middle east is basically an overblown soda war with casualties. It's pointless.

I'll agree to a extent. 

 

It's basically to save and risk or to ignore and watch. 

[smjpl]

I think opening discussion about serious geopolitical issues on a forum where users have little to no experience with geopolitics is irresponsible

 

How will anyone ever learn though? Yes there will be some bullshit responses but even if a couple of people can be educated, is it not a good thing?

[Fred Castellum]

How will anyone ever learn though? Yes there will be some bullshit responses but even if a couple of people can be educated, is it not a good thing?

Knowledge and viewpoints should be spread, not hidden from view!

[DeViLzzz]

It is called finishing a war.  Simple as that.

[Mooshi]

I'll agree to a extent. 

 

It's basically to save and risk or to ignore and watch. 

 

Added a bit more, but pretty much. It is a gamble either way you put it. If a nation can rise to the top with the massive British empire against it and become a "superpower", well, I believe other nations should fight their own battles and leave their neighbors out of it. Unless it's something on scale with a world war, the USA needs to focus on the USA.

[Fred Castellum]

It is called finishing a war.  Simple as that.

You can't kill ideas, people will pick up those ideas and start the fight all over again. Good luck having the rest of the world sit and watch as millions in the middle east are butchered.... people who connect via their emotions will push for military engagement. 

 

EDIT: do note alot of economical interests would be lost in the process. 

Added a bit more, but pretty much. It is a gamble either way you put it. If a nation can rise to the top with the massive British empire against it and become a "superpower", well, I believe other nations should fight their own battles and leave their neighbors out of it. Unless it's something on scale with a world war, the USA needs to focus on the USA.

Unfortunately some people in the USA don't think the USA should focus on the USA.... their more worried about what they think is morally right without the logical backing and will power to fix the problem on a more longer lasting scale. All of this crap we've been pumping out has been nothing but temporary fixes to the situation, some of them have even made it worse... 

[Mooshi]

You can't kill ideas, people will pick up those ideas and start the fight all over again. Good luck having the rest of the world sit and watch as millions in the middle east are butchered.... people who connect via their emotions will push for military engagement. 

 

Unfortunately some people in the USA don't think the USA should focus on the USA.... their more worried about what they think is morally right without the logical backing and will power to fix the problem on a more longer lasting scale. All of this crap we've been pumping out has been nothing but temporary fixes to the situation, some of them have even made it worse... 

 

Oboy, I think of the facepalming nightmare of Syria where we funded terrorist..it's all a giant sham. If someone wants to badly wage war in the middle east, they should give up their right to citizenship and leave. This nation doesn't need these nuts who are all talk, but are too cowardly to actually fight on the battlefield themselves. We're doing more harm than good and only ruining our reputation with other nations. Even the comical show Top Gear has treated the American military as some joke that can't win its wars and the "friendly fire" commentary on top of that. I love this country, but god damn the people in it sometimes.

[Fred Castellum]

Oboy, I think of the facepalming nightmare of Syria where we funded terrorist..it's all a giant sham. If someone wants to badly wage war in the middle east, they should give up their right to citizenship and leave. This nation doesn't need these nuts who are all talk, but are too cowardly to actually fight on the battlefield themselves. We're doing more harm than good and only ruining our reputation with other nations. Even the comical show Top Gear has treated the American military as some joke that can't win its wars and the "friendly fire" commentary on top of that. I love this country, but god damn the people in it sometimes.

Ha funny because we have no one to blame but ourselves.... 

 

People sometimes fail to understand the world runs on economical and political gain. It's the reality of the world, the fuel in the engine isn't morals(though needed). 

[Misanthrope]

When the core factor is clashing ideology, nothing on this planet will make conflict cease. Thus, there isnt a permanent solution to the problem. The only real option we have is to frivolously waste human lives and billions of dollars or ignore. On a much smaller scale, this is like trying to convince a Pepsi lover that Coca Cola is better. It's not going to happen, both will stubbornly defend their position and get nowhere. The US involvement with the middle east is basically an overblown soda war with casualties. It's pointless. Whenever the US tries to "help", the enemy ends up gettings access to weapons and it creates even more conflict. Like with Israel and the Gaza strip. If no outside funding was going to either side, the conflict would be considerably smaller. (no, I'm not buying the "but they are firing rockets" excuse as I've seen the photos of Israelis smiling on the border with chairs watching Palestinians get attacked and even cheering.) Pointless ideology based fighting at its finest.

 

I'd argue that the core factor isn't actually clashing ideology but a simple territory dispute. The fact is that both sides resort to extremism and ideological clashes to stubbornly refuse to ever concede on said territorial dispute is relevant but not the core factor per se. Let's not bite into what both sides want and call it anything else this is just about territory.

[Mooshi]

Ha funny because we have no one to blame but ourselves.... 

 

People sometimes fail to understand the world runs on economical and political gain. It's the reality of the world, the fuel in the engine isn't morals(though needed). 

 

Sometimes I wish the concept of a world "super power" faded away and the USA's 50 states disbanded into 50 nations instead. Instead of being world police and sticking our noses in everyone else's business, each nation becomes its own state that focuses on its own people. I really wish we were more like the Japanese where we pool together our technical know how for amazing things instead of being some slave to corporate and political interest in exchange for losing face on the political stage.