Gamers Nexus alleges LMG has insufficient ethics and integrity

[Cooldoe]

7 minutes ago, Godiwa said:

still if you do it on your work twitter profile it doesn't matter how much you claim it does not represent your work... it 100% does...

and trust me (bro) if you post on twitter with your private account that "I'm a racist and all "race" are inferior" you WILL be fired... no company with any dignity want anything to do with that

True but most people will recognized that is was done by employee and not the employer.

Here is a mistake by an employee and they employer took notice on that and apologize to the community that the employee have offend.

Suddenly people saying it was done by Linus and he did that maliciously

The leap of some people is just astounding.

 

The fact is Tim misspoke and Linus have chastised him for the mistake and apologized to the people Tim might offended.

As far as I know Linus never attack other channel

[Loopers]

10 minutes ago, Godiwa said:

still if you do it on your work twitter profile it doesn't matter how much you claim it does not represent your work... it 100% does...

and trust me (bro) if you post on twitter with your private account that "I'm a racist and all "race" are inferior" you WILL be fired... no company with any dignity want anything to do with that

Sorry, bud, you lost me when you try comparing passion and opinion with hate. You're reaching for the stars here.

[Godiwa]

1 minute ago, Loopers said:

Sorry, bud, you lost me when you try comparing passion and opinion with hate. You're reaching for the stars here.

what "passion" and "opinion" do I compare with hate? Hmm?

I didn't say he should be fired for his blunder...
I did say that it hurts the company because he is AT WORK, IN A WORK SITUATION and makes a massive F-up... Had  he done it on a company twitter account, mail account etc. then it would matter too... Heck if some youtuber had interviewed him in his spare time and he said the same it would still reflect poorly on LMG with his statement because he compared THEM with someone else and came with false accusations...

Still don't think he should be fired, but it still affects the company and yes it will reflect on THEM since he works for them...

[RevGAM]

Here's my unrequested $.02. LMG screwed up. They should retract the Billet Labs Cooler video and pay damages to BL.

 

I used to rely on LTT for reviews but, after noticing bias and inaccuracies, I have been steering away from their videos. I've also noticed that, for quite some time now, their videos are so focused on entertainment that the quality has, often, suffered. Sure, they make us laugh but when you do a product review and assign two people who are not experienced to help do it, you're just doing the product an injustice, and doing injurious damage to the manufacturer, especially a new company like BL, and some of the others that LMG called bad, because their word has a lot of influence with consumers, even knowledgeable ones.

 

That Linus has NOT removed the video speaks volumes about the actual amount of integrity vs ego at play here, and that he was whining on the WAN show about not wanting to shell out the money to do the review properly just shows that he is not interested in doing the right thing - despite what he claims - if it will slightly inconvenience him. Personally, I'm glad he's not the CEO anymore, and I hope Terren changes the production schedule so that it's not ridiculous; after all, several employees voiced concerns about the timetable and quality, including Linus!

 

I won't be responding to this. I'm genuinely disappointed by the lack of ethicality and maturity displayed by Linus and whoever is allowing that fiasco to continue.

[jkirkcaldy]

33 minutes ago, AHPanda said:

And now they falsely advertised about FP too. The cookie jar is empty and all the moldy crusts are exposed.

I can't reply to this on reddit as the subreddit is in community only mode. 

 

The testing here seems extremely suspect.  I suspect that the person downloading these files is encoding as they download. My test gives drastically different results to their results. 

 

 

[adb push]

tonights WAN show wont be the juicy show we're all hoping. I bet over the last 3 days Linus and the whole managment crew have been scripting how the narative is going to go tonight... the last thing anybody at LMG wants right now is more fuel on this dumpster fire. He will choose his words very carefully and I'm sure Luke will kick him under the table if he starts to stray from the approved narratives. 

 

this drama is fun and all, we love to watch ultra wealthy people get their ass handed to them and all but lets also admit that were all on LTT forums (mostly) because we were fans (at least a few weeks ago) and none of us are perfect. I'm glad shit hit the fan, but let them clean it up and hopefully learn some major lessons from all this. 

 

But they do need to learn how to take a pulse better, the "apology" video they put out was pretty messed up with the jokes and fake sponsor throws.. kinda gross actually. I get that they think they're "wacky" or wtv and thats the brand but it wasn't called for, and the monitization of the video at first.. wtf. 

 

At least we have Luke on the exec team. He seems to be the only one who still has any common sense. 

[WallacEngineering]

3 hours ago, hmfaysal said:

Why would they be friends? Steve has a much much smaller channel with even smaller viewership.

They are not even in the same league. 

Dude, Steve has literally been a guest on LTT like 4 or 5 times over the years. They had fun, they might not be life BFFs but they were pretty cool with eachother for quite some time.

 

IDK why people aren't aware of this.

[Blademaster91]

59 minutes ago, Loopers said:

Tim is an engineer, not in public relations. I 100% agree with you it's immature, but back when I worked at 3com, my making a statement shouldn't reflect poorly on 3com for my opinions even if it's in bad taste. I was managing some Fortune 500 companies back then will enormous infrastructure. I talked smack and I was stupid for it.

I believe the people giving tours volunteered and a lesson probably learned for sure that if there were future tours after that, they would need PR training or no tours at all. 

Just my opinion as I don't know Tim personally. It's just a passionate employee who said something he shouldn't have and it sucked. 

Tim still represents LMG as a company, what he said was at the company, even though it wasn't as PR or in public I think it shouldn't have been said in a tour.

2 hours ago, Cooldoe said:

1. Steve specifically mention he did not want to contact Linus. Your wording if you defense on him. Not his actual wording in the video. And he started the video talking about ethic and proceed to shove it all away. He is the one bringing the conversation about his ethic not me.

2. Again you are jumping off point. I am only demanding Steve to do what he accuses LMG on. If he is not going to do what he is preaching about why bother? My point is based on his own video he should disclose that and he 'forgot' to do. Based on his own suggestion he should create an apology video to 'forgot' such an important fact. Again I am using Steve logic here

3. You are deflecting here. The issue again Steve DID NOT DISCLOSE that it is an industry standard practice to make text correction on mistake instead of reshoot. In fact it is very uncommon for creator to reshoot such a small mistake.

4. Again you are deflection. The issue is Steve does not disclose that LMG already disclose multiple time about framework and there is no evidence of bias provided at all. Only Steve insinuating bias without a spec of proof. As Steve want to be harbinger of ethics, in this instance LMG have done their ethical obligation while Steve clearly left ethics as just an excuse.

5. Again you are deflecting on this. Base on Steve own standard he should disclose his dispute with ASUS and his feeling on LMG due to ASUS issue. In which he did not.

 

It is funny that a valid critic to GN considered as an attack. All the point I made is factual and using Steve own standard in the video. All I ask is the disclosure that Steve clearly did not do. Based on the standard he propose he should be criticized 

1.  Steve explained why he didn't contact Linus in the video and decided when the "trust me bro" controversy happened, Steve said he would treat LMG like any other company, he doesn't contact a company every time he makes a review, those that watched the GN videos on this, and GN's reviews show he is objective.

2.  How is Steve to blame for any of this? He didn't have to contact Linus and if he did Linus would've forced him to only talk about certain points, and I doubt the Billet labs thing would have came out at all. I'm glad it did as Billet labs got paid for the value of the product and Jayztwocents has mentioned on twitter/X he wants to review a Billet labs block.

3. It would've been nice if Steve had asked first, but why should other youtubers have to ask Linus for permission to point out mistakes they've been making for a long time now? Linus shifting the blame and complaining about ethics when they need to seriously work on their own ethics in reviews show their arrogance towards others on getting criticism.

4. LMG disclosing Framework about doesn't mean anything other than Linus essentially saying he's giving other laptops a fair review and the audience can only base that on trusting Linus. Steve is well known for providing good data driven benchmark reviews, again anyone that watches his videos knows that.

5. Steve has done videos on Asus and their issues with motherboards killing CPU's, IMO that doesn't show there is any negative bias against Asus. Reporting problems with a product isn't having a negative dispute with a company.

LMG/LTT has a clear bias towards Asus, which is against their policy of blacklisting companies that have done anti-consumer things.

 

It is because people aren't objectively criticizing GN, they're taking things out of context to throw the blame at GN, when all GN did was report on the issues that need addressing.

[Thepyrodex]

Just now, WallacEngineering said:

Dude, Steve has literally been a guest on LTT like 4 or 5 times over the years. They had fun, they might not be life BFFs but they were pretty cool with eachother for quite some time.

 

IDK why people aren't aware of this.

It is probably because back then Steve treated LTT as “Linus and friends” and now he treats it like “Linus Inc”? 
 

no saying right wrong good bad.  That’s my understanding.

[FullStackEditor]

It's pretty simple. If GN would reach out first nothing major would happen. This way Linus was forced to have a deep think and start making (more) changes (faster).
Some of the fanbase was lost as Linus lacks introspection (most rich people do) and could have make the necessary transitions sooner.

It was a good push for LTT in the long run. All these 300 pages pro et contra will be meaningless to LTT in a year.

[Loopers]

20 minutes ago, Godiwa said:

what "passion" and "opinion" do I compare with hate? Hmm?

I didn't say he should be fired for his blunder...
I did say that it hurts the company because he is AT WORK, IN A WORK SITUATION and makes a massive F-up... Had  he done it on a company twitter account, mail account etc. then it would matter too... Heck if some youtuber had interviewed him in his spare time and he said the same it would still reflect poorly on LMG with his statement because he compared THEM with someone else and came with false accusations...

Still don't think he should be fired, but it still affects the company and yes it will reflect on THEM since he works for them...

 

24 minutes ago, Loopers said:

private account that "I'm a racist and all "race" are inferior"

This is reaching the moon to validate my dude.

One with any sort of critical thinking skills would be able to discern and differentiate two different things spoken by an employee. One was pride, the other was hate. You used hate as your example and that's as disingenuous as it gets. The mistake was allowing tours from staff untrained in PR. He's an engineer, not in public relations.

 

It has been demonstrated time and time again considering your statement, his audience is rather obtuse, so it was a lose-lose situation with bad optics. Anyone expecting him to be fired is a moron and part of the cancel culture I despise so much today. If I recall correctly, Tim has only been there 6 months and it was, IMO, a lapse of judgment on LMG to have anyone not well-seasoned to do the tours.

[Slizzo]

3 hours ago, hmfaysal said:

But GN, on their high horse, didn't sit well. Just want to know who is going to sponsor them after 6 months. Companies that work with vindictive high horse riders are dangerous.

MSI still works with GN on occasion. He still gets seeded product for review by them I believe. That's just a quick example off the top of my head. Also NVIDIA engineers showing up on his channel even though he's been harsh and critical of them in the past as well.

[WallacEngineering]

For those of you still thinking GN just did this for the money - more evidence that you couldn't be more wrong.

 

Steve could have continued with the drama and digging into LTT with more "public beatdown" videos but look at that, that didn't happen now did it?

 

What is today's video? About new technology coming to aid testing and ensure greater accuracy than ever before.

 

Steve literally doesn't give two f***s about the drama, its actually pretty hilarious that he just casually ignores all the BS and continues straight on with the next topic:

 

 

[hmfaysal]

Just now, WallacEngineering said:

For those of you still thinking GN just did this for the money - more evidence that you couldn't be more wrong.

 

Steve could have continued with the drama and digging into LTT with more "public beatdown" videos but look at that, that didn't happen now did it?

 

What is today's video? About new technology coming to aid testing and ensure greater accuracy than ever before.

 

Steve literally doesn't give two f***s about the drama, its actually pretty hilarious that he just casually ignores all the BS and continues straight on with the next topic:

 

 

Good for him, that’s what he should be doing anyways. Also great plug

[WallacEngineering]

11 minutes ago, Thepyrodex said:

It is probably because back then Steve treated LTT as “Linus and friends” and now he treats it like “Linus Inc”? 
 

no saying right wrong good bad.  That’s my understanding.

 

There could be some truth to that, I mean who can say when said "friendship" ended.

[WallacEngineering]

1 minute ago, hmfaysal said:

Good for him, that’s what he should be doing anyways. Also great plug

 

Well that wasn't the point but I guess ur right, it would be a great plug huh?

[Thepyrodex]

Just now, WallacEngineering said:

 

There could be some truth to that, I mean who can say when said "friendship" ended.

Certainly not me, 100% a guess and repeating information I hear 2nd to 5th hand.

 

but it’s fun reading all the armchair legal/corporate experts and the internet mob going nuts soooo I throw in my 2 cents. 

[Blademaster91]

25 minutes ago, Cooldoe said:

If there is actual bias in regard to framework the show the proof.

There is none as far I know.

They are doing very limited review on framework and always clearly disclose their potential bias.

It is actually higher standard compared to news agency that usually disclose the potential bias in fine print or running text.

 

I agree with you in the billet issue they make a mistake and should be called for. Same with the pwaned mouse.

 

WAN show always reposted in LTT channel with certain part focus only on the issue highlighted.

The issue here is Steve clearly know about Linus aware of the mistake issue and want to address it. It is directly related to pnawed mouse issue that he refer to so he cannot say he is unaware.

But he choose to not mention this on the video.

 

As for correction in the video, they do correction in the video but Steve take issue with that. His opinion it should be taken down and then reupload as new with the correction.

 

For your Anker comment, Linus specifically said he don't think Anker is a bad product, he loved the product but due to eufy issue he is takkng his foot down and cut ties with Anker even though it hurt him financially.

 

As for your comment that Linus should be harder on ASUS, Intel and NViDIA Linus have address that multiple time that he choose to work with the brand to make some changes and help to be the voice of consumer to the brand. Linus also have been pretty strong in his critic on NVIDIA.

As for Intel, I guess you did not notice that the tech upgrade sponsor. Is now AMD instead of Intel?

 

There may not be any actual bias, it is the fact that Linus has a interest in Framework. It would be like a reviewer that is a shareholder for Intel or Nvidia for example doing product reviews, IMO they aren't going to be the most trustworthy source.

 

I agree the Billet labs block and the Pwnage mouse need to be fixed, and I think videos for those should be taken down, or a proper review for the Pwnage mouse.

 

In my opinion putting a note in the WAN show isn't a very good correction for things like messing up on the Billet labs or Pwnage mouse review.

 

I think they should re-shoot the corrections instead of just putting an asterisk with text in the video, or slow down with the content and get it right before uploading the video, as by the time corrections are made with how LMG is rushing their pace, most people already watched the video with an error in it.

 

As for Anker, Linus said they were dropping Anker and made a huge drama out of it, the fans took that and were saying Anker as a brand is bad, and I have to wonder how bad that hurt LMG with all the sponsors they have, it probably hurt Anker more by people refusing to buy Anker products.

 

Regarding working with brands, I think they could've dropped the Asus sponsorship, and bought their own Asus hardware for review, at the least it would show they aren't being biased towards Asus. Also continuing to work with brands means they still endorse the product, viewers will see he still uses Asus and buy stuff from Asus.

And for Intel, they've done sponsorships more with Intel, it seems like he's willing to do sponsor spots with who is willing to pay more.

[Owsleygarcia95]

2 minutes ago, WallacEngineering said:

For those of you still thinking GN just did this for the money - more evidence that you couldn't be more wrong.

 

Steve could have continued with the drama and digging into LTT with more "public beatdown" videos but look at that, that didn't happen now did it?

 

What is today's video? About new technology coming to aid testing and ensure greater accuracy than ever before.

 

Steve literally doesn't give two f***s about the drama, its actually pretty hilarious that he just casually ignores all the BS and continues straight on with the next topic:

 

 

If you honestly beleive that he's not profiting off of this financially and from more people finding out who he is, you're highly naive. He probably planned this with Madison. No way that timing is coincidental. He doesn't need to keep talking about it for it to be highly effective in damaging the reputation of one of his biggest competitors.

[mikaelus]

1 minute ago, Owsleygarcia95 said:

If you honestly beleive that he's not profiting off of this financially and from more people finding out who he is, you're highly naive. He probably planned this with Madison. No way that timing is coincidental. He doesn't need to keep talking about it for it to be highly effective in damaging the reputation of one of his biggest competitors.

She used it to her advantage.

[harls]

20 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

Tim still represents LMG as a company, what he said was at the company, even though it wasn't as PR or in public I think it shouldn't have been said in a tour.

1.  Steve explained why he didn't contact Linus in the video and decided when the "trust me bro" controversy happened, Steve said he would treat LMG like any other company, he doesn't contact a company every time he makes a review, those that watched the GN videos on this, and GN's reviews know that.

2.  How is Steve to blame for any of this? He didn't have to contact Linus and if he did Linus would've forced him to only talk about certain points, and I doubt the Billet labs thing would have came out at all. I'm glad it did as Billet labs got paid for the value of the product and Jayztwocents has mentioned on twitter/X he wants to review a Billet labs block.

3. It would've been nice if Steve had asked first, but why should other youtubers have to ask Linus for permission to point out mistakes they've been making for a long time now? Linus shifting the blame and complaining about ethics when they need to seriously work on their own ethics in reviews show their arrogance towards others on getting criticism.

4. LMG disclosing Framework about doesn't mean anything other than Linus essentially saying he's giving other laptops a fair review and the audience can only base that on trusting Linus. Steve is well known for providing good data driven benchmark reviews, again anyone that watches his videos knows that.

5. Steve has done videos on Asus and their issues with motherboards killing CPU's, IMO that doesn't show there is any negative bias against Asus. Reporting problems with a product isn't having a negative dispute with a company.

LMG/LTT has a clear bias towards Asus, which is against their policy of blacklisting companies that have done anti-consumer things.

 

It is because people aren't objectively criticizing GN, they're taking things out of context to throw the blame at GN, when all GN did was report on the issues that need addressing.

Yes,  It would have been nice if Steve reached out first.  Then he could have had a more factual video.  He would have had the evidence to show that the Billet labs ordeal was not a malicious attempt to destroy a company.  He would have seen that this was not a one of a kind prototype that was going to destroy a company by not getting back.  He would have seen that LMG was trying to make it right.  Instead,  he chose to not do what he did when dealing with ASUS or Newegg,  he ran a story putting the spin on it that would benefit him. 

 

[AHPanda]

2 minutes ago, mikaelus said:

She used it to her advantage.

Since when is being bullied, belittled and (possibly) SA'd at work an advantage?

[Loopers]

11 minutes ago, WallacEngineering said:

Steve literally doesn't give two f***s about the drama

lol 

[atxcyclist]

7 hours ago, mikaelus said:

And what does that have to do with anything? I've been watching LTT for a few years now but never felt the need to join the forum, until there was a topic big enough to voice my opinion on it. There are millions of viewers of LTT who don't care about the forum very much but they are still entitled to having an opinion on the allegations against a creator they follow. What's wrong about that exactly?

They didn’t care about engaging with the community on here until there’s drama?  This forum doesn’t have a barrier to entry, if these people were all watching LMG content then they knew it was here, but they still didn’t show up until there was some big incident?

Considering how inflammatory and non-constructive the rants coming from many of these people are, and some basically spamming the same messages over and over, I’m sticking-with my expectation that they are for the most part, drama-seeking trolls.

[Owsleygarcia95]

1 minute ago, mikaelus said:

She used it to her advantage.

That's definitely possible. But given that the allegation was quietly being talked about before all of this, it seems highly likely that multiple journalists probably attempted reaching out to her before all of this. It's not insane to think that one of her competitors would work with her, and keep it private.