Gamers Nexus alleges LMG has insufficient ethics and integrity

[hmfaysal]

Okay, nice, 305 pages

[Majestic12]

6 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

Claiming Steve only made the video as a "hit piece" or that he "acts as if the'yre anointed by god" is complete nonsense.

The reasons are very obvious why Steve didn't want to have to make the video but it is well justified as he reported on things out in the open in videos, when someone can point out mistakes being made for a long time then the call out needs to be done.

If you don't like the style in how Steve does videos thats fine but attacking GN in order to defend Linus and LMG is wrong in my opinion.

All of the companies that Steve has called out for anti-consumer things were right of them to do, these companies are selling things to the consumer that are a fire hazard, or can ruin a CPU then deny warranty or even admit they did anything wrong.

I'd like to see more tech youtubers call out companies for bullshit, but many of them don't want to risk upsetting sponsors, or care more about the money as LMG clearly does, and more about the money than getting basic testing in a review right.

 

The thing with the PCI-e riser is that the pain could be easily scratched off by installing and  removing it just a few times, and the company admitted it was an issue and tried to fix it, before anyone buying it risked ruining their PC or worse setting their house on fire.

 

As for the PSU, those were also dangerous and should've been fully recalled by Newegg, Newegg as a company has also been going downhill with terrible support and allowing marketplace sellers to sell junk so buyers have to be careful when buying that an item comes from a reputable seller or directly from Newegg.

And as for the Asus motherboard issue, Asus chose to put that disclaimer in a BIOS when the BIOS was causing the motherboard to break the CPU, no other manufacturer was denying warranty even if others had the same problem.

Also for the whole Billet labs issue, that is on LMG, they sold it, then claimed it was fine because "at least it wasn't sitting on a shelf" then Linus said it wasn't sold it was auctioned, it being for charity also makes it worse as the charity is involved in the probelm.

 

And no the whole issue is on LMG to improve, GN only brought up the mistakes LMG has been for years now, GN tried to contact them with the "trust me bro" issue but Linus ignored them and took it personally instead something they need to resolve as a company. Steve decided to treat LMG like every other company he's done a video on after that and I think that is justified when Linus takes everything personally instead of admitting they made a mistake.

You're missing the point - I outright said that while GN raises valid concerns but it's the WAY they do it that I take issue with. They misrepresented more than one fact to drum up drama and on purpose made certain things seem worse than they were. Linus has shown Steve was wrong on some accounts while admitting work needs to be done on others and Steve then went after Linus saying "See, he's deflecting!". You can NOT ever win this way!

 

And Linus admitted the Billet Labs thing was a mistake from the start - he only took offense at the fact Steve insinuated he was being malicious by selling it on purpose. He neglected to mention Billet Labs had told LMG could keep it at first AND neglected to mention it was auctioned off for charity and not sold for profit. This alone shows where Steve's interests lie and it's NOT, as you and GN pretend, to wake LMG up. Why would they do it in such a malicious way if that were true?

[andreimj]

That's a lot of pages :)))

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

Claiming Steve only made the video as a "hit piece" or that he "acts as if the'yre anointed by god" is complete nonsense.

The facts show the following:

1. GN had access to LMG that few had before them.

2. GN host Steve knew how to press Linus's buttons to get an emotional response.

 

3. GN knew LMG was restructuring. GN knew that LMG knew they had problems and had to exploit that knowledge before LMG had the opportunity to restructure.

 

4. GN manipulated the narrative and weaponized cancel culture.

5. GN admit to this in their own videos. Go watch it again. They said they know how LTT/LMG is going to respond.

6. GN kept control over the narrative knowing there will be a video after the letter and preemptively said they will not respond.

 

GN knew exactly what they were doing. They are not innocent. Let us recognize these facts.

[WallacEngineering]

4 hours ago, Silvy said:

To be frank, most people didn't give a crap about the inaccuracies

 

Actually no, inaccurate testing and misrepresenting products have been complained about in comments of LMG videos for some time now.

 

Of course the whole Billet Labs thing SOUNDS worse when you use words like THEFT or STEAL but there was definitely some misunderstanding involved.

 

As for Steve not knowing all the facts - Ya you are right he didn't, but its also not his fault:

 

A.) LMG would have ignored Steve or said its none of his business as they have been every other time he has reached over the past 2 years and so as a result...

 

B.) He never would have gotten the full story to begin with. Both Billet and Linus Omitted details - so how the hell is Steve supposed to be 100% accurate when he can't gain access to 100% of the information?

 

The video's public release is what got the truth to finally come out so it still would have been the exact same situation had GN reached out anyways unless he specifically used a thread - "Im gonna go public if LMG boes not tell me the truth" - Which hell no, Steve would NEVER be that guy.

 

Steve would still have only gotten some information from Billet Labs themselves and we now know that they lied about it to attack LMG for some reason so basically there was only one way for this situation to go down.

 

Steve makes mistakes like anyone else like how he kinda fumbled around a bit in the second video regarding Linus's 5-Year-Old response because he was in such shock and awe he couldn't keep it together.

 

However, despite that human error - Going Public was still the best move. Nothing would have changed otherwise because LMG would have continued to ignore criticism and would have continued to slowly destroy their own reputation.

 

Unfortunately you are correct about the Madison situation - it simply adds to the Chaos and despite the fact the entire thing is BS and LMG technically doing nothing wrong in this situation, people are absolute Hyenas these days with drama and scavenge every little bit they can.

 

This kind of crap is why I hate drama and hate the human race in general these days. What has happened to us? Everyone these days seems to be a complete ass hole, nobody shows respect or care for their fellow man anymore, and every single little thing is all about money anymore - even family matters.

 

Well, predictions from environmental scientists are starting to emerge that we are going to kill Planet Earth and ourselves before we can escape to Mars and well if it happens - I guess thats just Karma now isn't it?

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, andreimj said:

That's a lot of pages :)))

Yea I am done.

 

Right now I am just repeating myself. I will not do that anymore.

[ImpliedSilence]

6 minutes ago, 3m3m said:

 Let us recognize these opinions and suppositions.

Fixed it for you.

[Vexenar]

Just now, Majestic12 said:

Linus has shown Steve was wrong on some accounts while admitting work needs to be done on others and Steve then went after Linus saying "See, he's deflecting!". You can NOT ever win this way!

If you are talking about the screenshots of the e-mails which were supposed to be sent to Billit Labs but weren't. 
Those e-mails appear to be missing dates where Colton is offering to reimburse them, so looking at it from a realistic perspective this could just be damage control and a smokescreen to shift blame. 

The initial e-mail Colton sent with "at least it's not collecting dust on a shelf " paints a very different perspective where they just didn't seem to care about Billit Labs and their product. 
 

6 minutes ago, Majestic12 said:

And Linus admitted the Billet Labs thing was a mistake from the start - he only took offense at the fact Steve insinuated he was being malicious by selling it on purpose. He neglected to mention Billet Labs had told LMG could keep it at first AND neglected to mention it was auctioned off for charity and not sold for profit. This alone shows where Steve's interests lie and it's NOT, as you and GN pretend, to wake LMG up. Why would they do it in such a malicious way if that were true?

In the WAN show on Friday (before the GN video went live) he said that he did not feel the need to apologize for how he tested the piece and how they handled it, he also said that properly testing it was not worth 500$ of someone's time even though realistically speaking the performance would have most likely been better, because it would have actually been tested on a product it was intended for. 

LMG is also writing a narrative but looking at the facts they are calling out GN for not properly going through the correct channels and asking for their side of the story while they did not even bother reaching out to Billit Labs to test a product they in good faith gave to LMG to test and do a review piece on. And that's not even accounting for the fact that Billit sent them documentation and the actual card it was intended to be tested with, none of which were used, to make a hit video where Linus is goofing around while throwing the startup under the bus. 

How anyone here can willfully ignore that fact is beyond me. For a 15-min video Linus goofed around, improperly tested a product and then told his entire youtube outlet not to buy it. You do not do that when you are a self-respected tech reviewer and boast about wanting to do the right thing and test things properly. 

I'm all for calling GN out, but there is even more to call LMG and Linus specifically out for in this situation. 

[kewtz]

10 hours ago, Biomancer81 said:

You can honestly say that releasing a video that harms a competitor, which has proven now to have funneled subs and viewers to his channel, which will increase his financial standing is not a "gain"?

In business, all publicity is good publicity.

The lack of quality information and potential misleading to consumers due to lack of quality should be called out. 
 

LMG runs circles around GN in terms of subs, views, sponsors. Sure, GN may pick up crumbs from his de-monetized hit piece on LTT. I didn’t say he won’t gain. 
 

GN brought (documented) errors to light and challenged LTT to do better - which is pretty consistent / on brand for GN.

 

You can fan-boy LTT all you want, defend them all you want (which is weird), they have some business issues to address, correct and overcome. 

 

 

[Mouhfighter]

For me, the discussion is not so much about Linus' response... anybody who watches LTT for any amount of time has noticed the content and Linus change, anybody who denies that should go back to the old videos...

 

The Madison Drama is a whole other story and shouldnt have happened in the first place.

The Billet Drama is a typical "shouldnt have happened, but happened" story, there is little they can do to change that, but that's what it is...

 

For me one of the breaking points was actually one of the last "pool cooling" videos, nothing is fitting, nothing really works, all just janking around.... that was never the case beforehand. At least something worked, at least something was there as a "take home " message...

 

Now you have more of the feeling of watching somebody with, what feels like a bottomless budget, purposefully fucking up.... and for me, that is too much...

 

Does anybody recall the "million-dollar PC" where they got the absurdly strong server? How many videos were those? 1 , 2, maybe 3 short videos?

 

Does anybody recall this crazy mega-fan? man there was SOO much you could have been doing with in.... no they put on a wig and stand in its exhaust....

 

 

Now, lastly, the conflicts of interests GN mentioned... 

When Linus made a huge fuss about his investment in Framework, he pretended to be super carefull bla bla bla, but GN is right, there are some sponsors that are shield VERY much from harsh criticism, especially during WAN when there is less scripting you see Linus coming up with statements that are "questionable" at least and for ME , personally, that has shown me what kind of person he seems to have become.

 

Spoiler

 

[Mouhfighter]

36 minutes ago, 3m3m said:

Yes, Linus got played in the worst possible way. He got played by someone that knew him intimately, and that have spend a lot of time with them publicly as GN. This changed the way I view GN. GN like LMG have good people working for the channel. No one wants to see them get hurt. I just wish Steve saw LMG in the same light. Good people are working hard to do the very best they can do.

 

But weaponizing a friendship in this way, manipulating a person in this way. That is beyond terrifying. If I was friends with Steve from GN I would reevaluate that friendship carefully. Analyze every conversation and be very selective of what I share in future. Thankfully I am not but those who are should be careful. The old saying "with friends like this, who needs enemies" rings true here. 

 

Dude, the "friendship" between them has been denied on several occasions, at least from what I recall..

Steve didn't use any "friendship insider material" for his video, he voiced something that multiple people, influencers and YouTubers have seen and voiced already...

[hmfaysal]

1 minute ago, Mouhfighter said:

 

Dude, the "friendship" between them has been denied on several occasions, at least from what I recall..

Steve didn't use any "friendship insider material" for his video, he voiced something that multiple people, influencers and YouTubers have seen and voiced already...

Why would they be friends? Steve has a much much smaller channel with even smaller viewership.

They are not even in the same league. 

[Vexenar]

Just now, hmfaysal said:

Why would they be friends? Steve has a much much smaller channel with even smaller viewership.

They are not even in the same league. 

They are not in the same league when we are talking about raw numbers. 
When it comes to tech journalism and properly testing things, GN is miles ahead of LMG. 

And that is exactly why it's important to hold LMG to higher standards, because of their size and reach. 

[Mouhfighter]

Just now, hmfaysal said:

Why would they be friends? Steve has a much much smaller channel with even smaller viewership.

They are not even in the same league. 

as you can see, i replied to 3m3m which was pretending that Steve and Linus are friends and Steve used his "friendship" to backstab linus....

 

Also you can be a friend with somebody who earns less money then you....

[hmfaysal]

Just now, Vexenar said:

They are not in the same league when we are talking about raw numbers. 
When it comes to tech journalism and properly testing things, GN is miles ahead of LMG. 

And that is exactly why it's important to hold LMG to higher standards, because of their size and reach. 

Again, you described two different leagues, regardless of who is on top. 

Weight class matters, punching within your own weight class matters more.

If GN is on top, as you said miles ahead, why are they beating on the little guys? How absurdly elitist of them?

[hmfaysal]

1 minute ago, Mouhfighter said:

as you can see, i replied to 3m3m which was pretending that Steve and Linus are friends and Steve used his "friendship" to backstab linus....

 

Also you can be a friend with somebody who earns less money then you....

No not really, there are slabs, called income brackets, you can be friends with a lower income individual within your bracket, not outside your bracket. It never ends well.

History of mankind

[Godiwa]

3 minutes ago, hmfaysal said:

Why would they be friends? Steve has a much much smaller channel with even smaller viewership.

They are not even in the same league. 

so they can't be friends because of that? so people can't be friends with an NBA player because they only coach the local neighborhood kids for fun? that makes ZERO sense

[ScoggsUK]

1 minute ago, hmfaysal said:

No not really, there are slabs, called income brackets, you can be friends with a lower income individual within your bracket, not outside your bracket. It never ends well.

History of mankind

What utter nonsense.

[Godiwa]

4 minutes ago, Mouhfighter said:

as you can see, i replied to 3m3m which was pretending that Steve and Linus are friends and Steve used his "friendship" to backstab linus....

 

Also you can be a friend with somebody who earns less money then you....

they were friends (if they still are I can't say) but they were and that is publicly known

[hmfaysal]

1 minute ago, Godiwa said:

so they can't be friends because of that? so people can't be friends with an NBA player because they only coach the local neighborhood kids for fun? that makes ZERO sense

Yeah, bullseye. So many stories just like that when someone gets to NBA, they leave their old neighborhood and people behind. 

I guess there are even movies about this particular phenomenon. 

[hmfaysal]

1 minute ago, Godiwa said:

they were friends (if they still are I can't say) but they were and that is publicly known

Feel good stuff

[Mouhfighter]

1 minute ago, hmfaysal said:

No not really, there are slabs, called income brackets, you can be friends with a lower income individual within your bracket, not outside your bracket. It never ends well.

History of mankind

jesus, one post earlier you call somebody "elitist", now you use the most outdated trope when it comes to human interactions...

for a lack of words... that is embarassing

[hmfaysal]

Just now, Mouhfighter said:

jesus, one post earlier you call somebody "elitist", now you use the most outdated trope when it comes to human interactions...

for a lack of words... that is embarassing

Yeah, that was making a point. We shouldnt pretend class system doesn't exist, at every verticals, in life, at home, at work, in business. 

[hmfaysal]

1 minute ago, Mouhfighter said:

jesus, one post earlier you call somebody "elitist", now you use the most outdated trope when it comes to human interactions...

for a lack of words... that is embarassing

Of course, its embarrassing, It breaks my heart to even type in these words. But it is what it is. 306 pages, my fellow human beings cannot utter these words in fear of getting cancelled. Thats also embarrassing 

[Vexenar]

2 minutes ago, hmfaysal said:

Again, you described two different leagues, regardless of who is on top. 

Weight class matters, punching within your own weight class matters more.

If GN is on top, as you said miles ahead, why are they beating on the little guys? How absurdly elitist of them?

Using your own logic, why are you creating a negative narrative for both Madison and GN, if they are little guys compared to LTT?
Why are 99% of your posts in on the forums supporting LMG and Linus without admitting they also made mistakes, when they clearly did? 

We can debate semantics and personal intentions, but I would rather put my energy in looking at the facts. 

The issue is (for as far as you were unaware of it) that people who worked in the LTT labs claimed they had better data and were using better processes than Hardware Unboxed and Gamers Nexus, who are being seen in the industry as two sources of very viable and corract data when it comes to testing computer hardware. 

As we've seen by numerous videos, the GN video and LTT charts their data is highly inaccurate but due to their broad reach they can potentially give consumers wrong data that leads to wrong purchases, and effectively wasting consumers their money when it is not something they have/had to spend. 

I believe LMG due to their broad outreach has a responsibility in making sure they create proper information for consumers that's accurate to industry standards when they also go out of their way to recommend products like that.