You don’t need a new PC

[Birblover12]

I'm really, genuinely trying to wrap my head around how LTT would in good faith recommend an OS like this with these problems specifically:

 

 

Recommending removing anti virus programs, and meltdown mitigations (among other things) just so your file manager opens 0.2 seconds faster is NOT a trade anyone should be willing to make. Worst part I can see happening is some new tech enthusiast is going to watch the video, think "gosh, I can get so much more speed out of my (and potentially other's) PC!", proceed to download it without downloading 3rd party antiviruses and then get malware installed on their PC in a matter of days. A better disclaimer would have been needed here, glossing over these facts as "only a few downsides" will get a lot of people in serious doo doo very quickly.

 

Microsoft doesn't pay their security engineers hundreds of millions of dollars to patch new viruses and update Windows Defender for no reason, there's a reason they make it very difficult to "fully disable" it, so perhaps you should heed their advise lol. Security updates aren't "bloatware", they're literally the only thing keeping you from having no working PC at all 

 

Worst part about the whole thing is when Linus was interacting with stock windows, it didn't even look that slow. Certainly faster than an HDD for sure, would have liked to see multiple people try it and see if it's "unresponsive and sluggish" as claimed.

 

[squabbled]

AtlasOS is actually horrible. Disabling mitigations, antivirus, system restore and backup, and resetting this PC for... a few extra frames? way to get pwned.

[Collin24]

These are my specs:

RX 480(trying to fix drivers and bios)

Xeon E3-1225 v3

24gb ddr3 1600MHz ram

samsung 850 evo ssd

some random 7200rpm 1tb hard drive

[BondiBlue]

38 minutes ago, Collin24 said:

These are my specs:

RX 480(trying to fix drivers and bios)

Xeon E3-1225 v3

24gb ddr3 1600MHz ram

samsung 850 evo ssd

some random 7200rpm 1tb hard drive

Why do you need to run a modified version of Windows on this kind of hardware?

[Collin24]

40 minutes ago, BondiBlue said:

Why do you need to run a modified version of Windows on this kind of hardware?

I really do not see why. It seems so much of a hassle for such little performance increase.

[CALANGO]

On 4/24/2023 at 12:14 PM, WhistlerBlade said:

no idea if i can run windows 11
asus z170 Mark 1
sabertooth
wow google says i can enable it
gonna give it a try
nope no option to enable not there

 

Yes, you can run Winders 11 on almost anything IF you  know how to get around the TPM check; and THERE ARE WAYS.  I've even put it on a Core 2 Duo system running DDR2.

[OhYou_]

On 4/24/2023 at 12:38 PM, Vishera said:

That's because Firefox just let's anyone with access to your PC to see the passwords in it's password manager...

Same goes for Chrome.

 

But Safari protects your passwords - with a password:

cool so does chrome and firefox

[CALANGO]

Just for fun, I decided to pull out an old system and try installing the AtlasOS and I followed all the inrections and distructions on the Atlas site and it did boot from the USB and start the OS installation process, but when it got to the "install to what drive" section, even though I deleted all existing partitions, I got an error message that it couldn't create a boot partition on the drive (or something like that).  I tried partitioning the entire unpartitioned space as one partition, and that didn't work either.  Any ideas...?

 

Edit:  Nevermind, I figured it out.  The "Ventoy" interface that comes up when you boot from the USB, gives you two options.  If you click on boot or install (I don't remember exactly what it says), normally, all you get on the screen is a flashing cursor.  That's when you just have to be patient and let it take how ever long it takes and 20 or 30 min. later it will actually open the Winder' install screen and it will work.

Edited April 26, 2023 by CALANGO
I figured out the answer I was lookin for.

[OhYou_]

2 hours ago, Birblover12 said:

I'm really, genuinely trying to wrap my head around how LTT would in good faith recommend an OS like this with these problems specifically:

 

 

Recommending removing anti virus programs, and meltdown mitigations (among other things) just so your file manager opens 0.2 seconds faster is NOT a trade anyone should be willing to make. Worst part I can see happening is some new tech enthusiast is going to watch the video, think "gosh, I can get so much more speed out of my (and potentially other's) PC!", proceed to download it without downloading 3rd party antiviruses and then get malware installed on their PC in a matter of days. A better disclaimer would have been needed here, glossing over these facts as "only a few downsides" will get a lot of people in serious doo doo very quickly.

 

Microsoft doesn't pay their security engineers hundreds of millions of dollars to patch new viruses and update Windows Defender for no reason, there's a reason they make it very difficult to "fully disable" it, so perhaps you should heed their advise lol. Security updates aren't "bloatware", they're literally the only thing keeping you from having no working PC at all 

 

Worst part about the whole thing is when Linus was interacting with stock windows, it didn't even look that slow. Certainly faster than an HDD for sure, would have liked to see multiple people try it and see if it's "unresponsive and sluggish" as claimed.

 

installing gnu/linux puts you in the same boat unless you install some normie distro, but for the sake of a bloat topic, people will wouldn't be using those then now would they?

 

[Crunchy Dragon]

11 hours ago, Spotty said:

I didn't think I needed a new PC until Linus described 7th gen as obsolete ewaste.

Agreed, I feel like I need a new PC even more now - also on Skylake(albeit X, but still Skylake).

 

I think overall this video could have been done a lot better, especially if they chose an actual obsolete platform. It might be a bigger deal when DDR3 is in the equation; I have a really hard time considering anything using DDR4 as "obsolete".

 

It would be a more impressive video in my mind if they had noticeable performance gains using something like an i7-2700 instead of just essentially saying "4 cores, 4 threads, 3.5Ghz = garbage" despite still being a modern platform with a modern CPU.

[OhYou_]

3 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Agreed, I feel like I need a new PC even more now - also on Skylake(albeit X, but still Skylake).

 

I think overall this video could have been done a lot better, especially if they chose an actual obsolete platform. It might be a bigger deal when DDR3 is in the equation; I have a really hard time considering anything using DDR4 as "obsolete".

 

It would be a more impressive video in my mind if they had noticeable performance gains using something like an i7-2700 instead of just essentially saying "4 cores, 4 threads, 3.5Ghz = garbage" despite still being a modern platform with a modern CPU.

why, the 2500k is the baseline cpu for good desktop performance. it would have to be a 920 system. 
but at the end of the day, the 6-8th gen is whats hitting the dumpsters right now, anything older is low volume. 
even if 0.001% of viewers took this advice and went out and bought a old pos, it would dry up all the cheap machines on that gen be it 5th, 4th, even 2nd gen intel. 

there is a bit of thought in this bit because i think it will really make the best case for trying to get people to reuse. 

[Crunchy Dragon]

12 minutes ago, OhYou_ said:

why, the 2500k is the baseline cpu for good desktop performance. it would have to be a 920 system. 
but at the end of the day, the 6-8th gen is whats hitting the dumpsters right now, anything older is low volume. 
even if 0.001% of viewers took this advice and went out and bought a old pos, it would dry up all the cheap machines on that gen be it 5th, 4th, even 2nd gen intel. 

there is a bit of thought in this bit because i think it will really make the best case for trying to get people to reuse. 

I would have been fine with something older, but I still think it would have been a better and more interesting video had it been done with an older platform.

[Greengecko27]

Decided to try out Atlas on my old media server and holy crap does that thing move fast now.

[thewelshbrummie]

56 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Agreed, I feel like I need a new PC even more now - also on Skylake(albeit X, but still Skylake).

 

I think overall this video could have been done a lot better, especially if they chose an actual obsolete platform. It might be a bigger deal when DDR3 is in the equation; I have a really hard time considering anything using DDR4 as "obsolete".

 

It would be a more impressive video in my mind if they had noticeable performance gains using something like an i7-2700 instead of just essentially saying "4 cores, 4 threads, 3.5Ghz = garbage" despite still being a modern platform with a modern CPU.

I'm inclined to to agree though I understand why they went with 7th gen. As an owner of a 4th gen system, I'd say that it's not worth upgrading massively from where it is now unless you're weirdly inclined. I do intend on keeping my build so have a RAM upgrade ready to go, and at some point it will eventually get the 3060 in my current system, simply because it currently doesn't have a GPU and I'd like to keep the computer around for some older games and the massive number of HDD bays I have to play with for server based use.

48 minutes ago, OhYou_ said:

why, the 2500k is the baseline cpu for good desktop performance. it would have to be a 920 system. 
but at the end of the day, the 6-8th gen is whats hitting the dumpsters right now, anything older is low volume. 
even if 0.001% of viewers took this advice and went out and bought a old pos, it would dry up all the cheap machines on that gen be it 5th, 4th, even 2nd gen intel. 

there is a bit of thought in this bit because i think it will really make the best case for trying to get people to reuse. 

2nd gen Intel was viable until a couple of years ago, probably when Zen 2/10th gen Intel launched. The 920 was really a HEDT platform, before I remember seeing the acronym used.

On 4/24/2023 at 7:10 PM, LapsedMemory said:

I could be mistaken, but I think the basis behind calling a 7th gen intel 'obsolete' is that Win10 is the last Windows version 7th gen and earlier will be able to run without hacks.  Once Windows 10 stops getting updates, that's it.  MS does not allow you to install Win11 on 7th gen processors, so while it technically has plenty of life still in it

...which I assume is why they went with 7th gen. When Win 10 launched I updated all of our work PCs to Win 10 without issue except a 2003 era Pentium3 based PC that was running Win 7 perfectly fine. The CPU lacked SSE2 which blocked a Win 10 install. We left it as is due to it still being supported (apparently SSE2 was required for Win7 from May 2018 but OS support outlasted my employer's business). What mattered is that it worked properly with an ancient (1990ish) program we ran for part of the business that could only print to a 1990-era dot matrix printer. All of which worked fine with the printer we had.

 

The point is that a 2003 era PC had 15 years of OS support. That's far longer than I'd expect but it's in the ballpark and I'd certainly expect a computer to have 10+ years of OS security support.

Quote

Microsoft will be EoL'ing it in a year and a half when they cut off Win10 updates.

14th October 2025. 2.5 years away.

Quote

The good news is that Linux runs like an absolute champ on these older processors, and will be fully supported long after MS gives them up to the scrap heap.  Come October 15, 2025, Linux will be the only secure upgrade path for millions of perfectly good, older PCs.

True but I seriously doubt that the majority of those computers will ever be upgraded. Mainstream Linux remains extremely unlikely. Though that doesn't give Microsoft a free pass of obsoleting computers that are 7-8 years old with a seemingly arbitrary TPM 2.0 requirement (had they wanted to force that, going with TPM1.1 should have been the limit for Win 11, then raise it to TPM 2 for Win 12).

 

--

 

The takeaway for me is that they could have gone with older parts but you end up with the same problem - all of them will lose OS support in 2025. I see the argument for going with the best parts that won't be supported beyond that - in particular you can go from a Kaby Lake build right through to 13th gen Intel or Ryzen 5000 and reuse the RAM, which wouldn't be possible on 5th gen Intel or earlier (Kaby Lake being the last platform with DDR3 support on the right motherboard). At the same time, I don't remember any mention of 8th gen+ in the video or any mention of Win 11 support. Can't say I'm happy with producing a video about how to modify an older pre-build without the obvious disclaimer of it not supporting Win 11.

[ogel2]

On 4/25/2023 at 2:09 AM, Ashley MLP Fangirl said:

meanwhile me still running a 4670K. on windows 11 too, doesn't even run that bad...

I was on the same route. And I've been suprised when upgraded to 6500, then 8400.

I felt nothing improved until 10400 last year....  

[Omni-Owl]

On 4/24/2023 at 8:54 PM, Sakuriru said:

Ah yes, just remove spectre and meltdown fixes, definitely bloat.

 

If you remove all security from Windows it will run blazing fast until it gets compromised and infected.

I mean...use money you saved on not buying a new PC to get anti-virus?

[Omni-Owl]

On 4/24/2023 at 10:48 PM, Uttamattamakin said:

People don't use linux to extend the shelf life of an old PC.  That hasn't been a reason to use Linux for at least 15 years.  The reason people switch to Linux is usually frustration with the radical changes done to Windows, concerns with security and privacy.   Then there are the people who change to Linux without thinking about it.  

People who use their phone as their sole personal computing device and using Linux or in the case of iOS UNIX. 

People who switch to a Chromebook or mac are using Linux or OSX/ UNIX.

 

The rest don't really know or care what OS their computer has.  

I have seen it used to extend the shelf life of an old PC for *many* years. Including in the last 15. Even if you don't use it that way, know that it is very common.

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

The only place for a FX-6300 is 

[Vishera]

8 minutes ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

The only place for a FX-6300 is 

~snip~

For web browsing these CPUs are fine, though for gaming they are hot garbage.

[iHardware Shelden]

I really wanted to give this a try, what stopped me was the security risks it seemed to add. My newest system is X99 based and I have a few even older systems that work perfectly well for my uses, I tend to run Windows on everything honestly just cause I am familiar with it. Stuff like AtlasOS and Tiny11/10 etc I have always found cool but never felt comfortable running on my regular use systems.

 

Once Windows 10 reaches EOL I might just need to look into running more Linux based operating systems. It is crazy to think that none of my computers officially support Windows 11 but maybe that's just me not wanting to admit my computers are older than they feel...

[Amaranth]

I'm really surprised, and disappointed, to see LTT recommend something like AtlasOS given the massive security concerns.

[PcBeExpensive]

On 4/25/2023 at 5:00 AM, samcool55 said:

I was stupid enough to do that once!
Thing got infected in 2 days by a RAT, how i figured that out? Because my computer suddenly decided to open the firefox password vault, which was luckily empty.

Literally pulled the plug and nuked it, I'm thankful they didn't go for my lastpass vault. Never again will I run without an antivirus. It's not worth the performance bump.

I feel you, have never done that, (yet) but I was once tired and stupid enough to let myself click 'allow notifications' on google. That was an easy fix though.

[Spindel]

I look at steams RAM usage in this video and then I look at steam on a mac (freshly launched) >_>

 

[OhYou_]

really wtf do you people do on your pc that you get all these viruses. 

I mean okay maybe you have a 0.0001% hance of running across a no click browser vuln with privilege escalation, but other than that.

like zero people here are not behind a router with a firewall and nat.

so what is it, is everyone here a bloody pirate downloading shit and then crying aaaaa save me AV im dumb? 

I've ran the latest version of Common Sense AV since 2010 and had zero problems. 

[ToboRobot]

18 minutes ago, OhYou_ said:

really wtf do you people do on your pc that you get all these viruses. 

I mean okay maybe you have a 0.0001% hance of running across a no click browser vuln with privilege escalation, but other than that.

like zero people here are not behind a router with a firewall and nat.

so what is it, is everyone here a bloody pirate downloading shit and then crying aaaaa save me AV im dumb? 

I've ran the latest version of Common Sense AV since 2010 and had zero problems. 

pornography

piracy

malicious ad networks

installing plugins or software that are compromised

my mom borked her Mac trying to install Flash because a website popup told her to!