lethal injection gone wrong

[NInety]

I'm saying the death penalty is wrong because people could be innocent and if I was framed for murder, I wouldn't want the DP.

[Admire]

http://listverse.com/2013/05/22/10-controversial-convictions-based-on-false-confessions/

[Seldszar]

execution is more expensive then life time prison

Sure now it is but like anything, if it becomes the norm, laws and fees could be changed and it would be less expensive.

 

The problems with the justice system are many ... you get people going to jail for stupid things, you have errors at trials because not enough time or bribery or what have you. Its all fcked up. Right now the prisons are overflowing. It needs a serious revamp and the death penalty could be approved or denied completely at that time based on realistic population growth, ratio of criminal per capita and costs and space to keep those prisoners. As usual no one can come to a concensus and we get half assed stuff.

[jezza39]

check this out

oxygen starvation would be a better way than lethal injection

 

 

There is a documentary called "Mayday: Ghost Plane" about Helios Flt 522 where the passengers and crew (except one) died from failure to pressurise the cabin, leading to death by lack of oxygen, the experts say people "feel like they're tired, then fall asleep etc". It would be the most 'humane execution' (however would take an hour or so).

 

I don't totally disagree with the death penalty, on the plus it can be a great card for prosecutors to play to help get guilty pleas and avoid the costs and elements of error in a trial, but killing people for killing others is the most flawed logic I've heard. How do you show people that killing is wrong when the state kills people? Many people kill in prison to receive the death penalty as a life sentence feels like torture.

 

There have been many executed that have been proved innocent after death, a person in prison can be released after 20 years, you can't pull a body out of the ground and revive someone. 

 

Lastly, it's been proven that capital punishment isn't a deterrent, people still run drugs in south east Asia, people still murder in USA. My state (Victoria) abolished executions after a very unpopular hanging in 1967 of Ronald Ryan. Murder rates have not increased. I still think that long prison sentences should be given (20 years to life).

[Admire]

Uh....btw. 1 in 25 in death row are innocent.

 

http://www.abajournal.com/news/article/study_scalia_was_wrong_about_1_in_25_people_sentenced_to_death_are_likely_i/

[Admire]

There is a documentary called "Mayday: Ghost Plane" about Helios Flt 522 where the passengers and crew (except one) died from failure to pressurise the cabin, leading to death by lack of oxygen, the experts say people "feel like they're tired, then fall asleep etc". It would be the most 'humane execution' (however would take an hour or so).

 

I don't totally disagree with the death penalty, on the plus it can be a great card for prosecutors to play to help get guilty pleas and avoid the costs and elements of error in a trial, but killing people for killing others is the most flawed logic I've heard. How do you show people that killing is wrong when the state kills people? Many people kill in prison to receive the death penalty as a life sentence feels like torture.

 

There have been many executed that have been proved innocent after death, a person in prison can be released after 20 years, you can't pull a body out of the ground and revive someone. 

 

Lastly, it's been proven that capital punishment isn't a deterrent, people still run drugs in south east Asia, people still murder in USA. My state (Victoria) abolished executions after a very unpopular hanging in 1967 of Ronald Ryan. Murder rates have not increased. I still think that long prison sentences should be given (20 years to life).

 

That is actually one of my main arguments against the death penalty. I have read so many cases of people being proven innocent and In almost all of them where there are false confessions, its in order to avoid the death penalty. They either start to believe what the cops are saying or they are trying to avoid a death penalty despite not having done the crime.

[FireFox]

'lethal injection gone wrong' He must have lived then lol (at least for a short while)

 

Also I don't like the death penalty, someone kills someone and we (we as in society/government/whatever) give him/her the death penalty I really don't see how we're better than they are.

 

Someone kills someone and you kill them as punishment doesn't make sense in my opinion, the son/daughter of a bitch should rot in prison for the rest of their lives thinking about what they did every single day which works in two ways.

 

One - They feel immense levels of guilt due to taking another life and spend the rest of their lives with that guilt, pretty unbearable sleeping, eating and walking with a pictures of the person they have killed burned into the back of their minds.

 

Two - They wanted to do it and enjoyed doing it (it happens), put them in prison thinking about it for the rest of their lives with the notion that they can't experience that again ever again, pretty unbearable I think wanting to do something again and not being able to.

 

Anyway that is my little 2 cents worth, that is what I think and to be honest it is a complicated and full of variations from case to case so feel free to disagree but that is what I think on those two settings. For true punishment, prisons are the perfect institution for these criminal bastards.

[LAwLz]

I think these two lists should be enough to convince anyone that the death penalty is a horrible horrible idea.
List of Those Freed From Death Row
Wrongful executions
 
I am shocked and it sickens me that 40% of the people who have voted here on LTT have said "Yes, I think it is alright to kill another human being".
Anyone who is OK with the death penalty has obviously not thought it through.
 

 

A few things you have to remember when it comes to the death penalty.
1) The death penalty makes a statement that it is alright to kill another human. That it is morally alright to do such a horrible thing.
 
2) Lots of innocent people have been executed. If you live in a country which has the death penalty, you or someone you love could potentially be executed by the government for no reason. I value the life of an innocent person far too much to let that happen.
There will always be margin of error, and mistakes (and sometimes people are purposely sentenced even though they are innocent). By saying yes to the death penalty, you also have to say yes to the question "do you think it is right to kill some innocent people along with the guilty ones?". It is sadly not uncommon for prosecutors to withhold evidence and/or police investigators forging evidence. Hell, in at least one cases the prosecutors were in fact the real criminals, trying to put the blame on an innocent person called Alan Gell (who was on Death Row for 5 years before being found innocent).
 
3) The executions are often very very inhumane. This whole "lethal injection gone wrong" story is not an isolated case, it's almost the norm. Since 1976 there have been over 1000 executions in the US. Slightly above 800 of those were lethal injections. The rest were electrocution, hanging, gas chamber etc. I am not sure about you, but hanging someone, or electrocuting someone does not sound humane to me. It's two of the most painful deaths I can think of (along with drowning and burning).
Even the lethal injections are often extremely inhumane like I said before. It wasn't invented to be easy on the person being executed, it was made to be easy on the person killing. With things like electricians you create a big mess (the persons face literally melts as the person is being executed, and it gets everywhere, and there is a lot of screaming etc).
 
Wanna know how the lethal injection is carried out? Remember, this is something that could potentially happen to you or someone you love, like your partner, mom, dad, sibling etc for no reason whatsoever.
You lie down on a "bed" (don't remember the correct word for it) and get strapped in so you can't move.
You are injected with sodium thiopental. This is to put you to sleep for a little while.
After that they inject you with pancuronium bromide. This cases your lungs to fail so you can't breath.
The final step is to inject you with potassium chloride. This cases the blood flow in the body to stop. For all intents and purposes, it's like giving you a heart attack.
After a minute or two you die.
 
Doesn't sound that scary, right? You're asleep during the whole time and it doesn't create a mess so it's pretty humane (if you can consider killing a human humane that is).
Well it would be, if it weren't for the fact that a medical journal published by The Lancet showed that out of 49 people that had been executed, 43 had lower levels of sodium thioental that is required for putting someone to sleep in order to perform surgery.
21 of those were found to have so low doses that they had most likely been awake and aware during the execution. The pancuronium bromide will hinder you from moving so it appears that you are asleep, but you can still feel and think.
Does having your lungs paralyzed, while you are having a heart attack, and being unable to move feel humane to anyone? It doesn't feel humane at all to me. Oh and remember that this HAS BEEN DONE TO COMPLETELY INNOCENT PEOPLE!
We are not even allowed to be that brutal towards animals that are being slaughtered.
 
4) The death penalty do not deter criminals. Study after study shows that countries with lower penalties also have lower crime rates. I know that correlation do not equal causation, but if the opposite was true then we wouldn't have these kinds of statistics.
Even if you don't accept that, you still have to think of the 3 reasons why people commit murder.
Passion, profit and compulsion.
The people who do it for profit are completely convinced that they will not be caught. This is why we see hitmen in all counties, not just countries which do not have the death penalty.
People who murder someone out of passion can not be deterred. They do not use logic or reason when they commit their crimes. Risk vs reward is not on the world map for someone who kills out of passion.
Compulsion murders are of course not deterred by the death penalty either because you know... They are caused by compulsion.
 
5) People who support the death penalty are murderers. In 2004, Cameron Willingham was executed for burning up his house and his 3 young children. People who says yes to the death penalty called for him to be executed, and he was.
Not even 1 year after the execution, fire investigator Gerald Hurst looked through the documents and concluded that there was absolutely no evidence that supported the theory that the fire was caused on purpose. It was just a normal fire.
Now, imagine having a fire start in your house, your beloved children dying in the fire, and then be wrongfully executed even though there were no evidence that pointed towards you being guilty. Want something a bit more relatable? Imagine if Austin Evans had lost his parents in the fire, then executed by having his lungs paralyzed and his blood flow stopped, while being conscious. Just because someone thought that he started the fire at his house, even though there were no evidence that supported the theory. Does that sound like justice? It doesn't to me, but in order to say that you are for the death penalty you also have to say yes to that scenario.

 

6) it costs more to sentence someone to the death penalty than it does to sentence them to life-without-parole.

Source 1

Source 2

[jezza39]

That is actually one of my main arguments against the death penalty. I have read so many cases of people being proven innocent and In almost all of them where there are false confessions, its in order to avoid the death penalty. They either start to believe what the cops are saying or they are trying to avoid a death penalty despite not having done the crime.

 

Innocence is of course a major reason to ditch capital punishment, one need only read about Jesse Tafero (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Tafero), plus there are countless others too. Unfortunately we can only ever be 99.9% sure when people don't admit their guilt. Even though I said that, I would never support capital punishment being carried out.

[Theo]

Which happens never! What world do you live in where people are proven "completely guilty?"  So Like when they confess their crimes like the The Central Park Five, the The Norfolk Four, or Earl Washington, Jr.(Who was on death row, waiting to be executed before they figured shit out)

 

There is ALWAYS margin of error.

 

 

 

snip

When i said being 100% sure they commit the crime, like having video, audio that shows that that person did commit that crime

There are a lot better ways to implement the death penalty than what exists now

[Theo]

snipsnip

I do not care if the death penalty was kind and painless for someone who (example) raped/murdered or was a serial killer.

Being for the DP makes you as much of a murderer as much as eating meat makes you a murderer who endangers animal species.

You keep saying innocent people are killed but dont say how many innocents just rot in prison for life and die there any way. Im not for the death penalty the way it is now but with some reforms im all for it 

[Jumper118]

i think its fine. why should i pay to feed and heat a person who has done terrible things. life sentence is very expensive. firing squad is cheaper, they should use that.

[Mooshi]

A box of ammo is considerably cheaper and more cost effective. We need to bring back firing squads and let the victims families have their way with the SOB that murdered their loved one.

 

If someone confesses to murder, rape ect, were proven guilty by DNA evidence or were caught with video/audio evidence, deploy the firing squad. Why should tax payers fund filth for lengthy sentences?

 

As harsh as it sounds, the world is legitimately better off without certain people that cause harm to others. I'm against /innocent/ people having their lives cut short by these sub-humans. The moment someone takes the life of the innocent (both physical death and mental such as rape victims), they aren't human anymore, they are rabid animals that need to be put down. - this goes both ways in my world of justice. If an innocent gets sent to prison, the prison officials are subject to being on the receiving end of a firing squad. Accountability for everyone!

[Admire]

When i said being 100% sure they commit the crime, like having video, audio that shows that that person did commit that crime

There are a lot better ways to implement the death penalty than what exists now

 

 

How many cases like that do you think exists? evidence is always presented like there is no doubt. Read the link I posted earlier, or read this one http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/node/4900#92

 

There is a lot of cases where the evidence from a far seems extremely convincing but when you aren't told the whole story, you cant make the right judgement.

 

Look at the Michael Morton case. His wife gets killed. He sits in jail for 25 years. The prosecutors fought for years to stop DNA testing of a blood soaked bandanna found nearby(later tests showed it was his wifes blood)...The prosecutor let Morton rot for at least six more years while fighting his DNA test which ofcourse showed that another man killed his wife.

They withheld crucial evidence during the entire trial process. Not just this....

Oh, and if the real killer had been found back then, he would have been in jail when he killed another woman two years later.

 

It was so bad that they actually had to really punish the prosecutor. Original prosecutor Ken Anderson got a 10 day sentence(served 5 for good behaviour....Yes...They actually let him out early), 500$ fine, 500 hours of community service in 5 years, had to resign as a judge(But still has his pension...and was close to retirement age anyway), and the prosecutor who fought the DNA testing after Anderson became a judge only lost his reelection.(Didn't stop Rick Perry from supporting him)

 

This is the first time a prosecutor has ever received any actual punishment for concealing evidence. And he gets 10 days.....Pathetic

 

They send a man to jail for 25 years, and let his wifes killer kill again.

 

When your system demands victory from prosecutors and being "TOUGH ON CRIME", this is what you get.....And this is why its so insane that the US has the death penalty.

 

 

 

snip

 

Great post.

[Admire]

A box of ammo is considerably cheaper and more cost effective. We need to bring back firing squads and let the victims families have their way with the SOB that murdered their loved one.

 

If someone confesses to murder, rape ect, were proven guilty by DNA evidence or were caught with video/audio evidence, deploy the firing squad. Why should tax payers fund filth for lengthy sentences?

 

As harsh as it sounds, the world is legitimately better off without certain people that cause harm to others. I'm against /innocent/ people having their lives cut short by these sub-humans. The moment someone takes the life of the innocent (both physical death and mental such as rape victims), they aren't human anymore, they are rabid animals that need to be put down. - this goes both ways in my world of justice. If an innocent gets sent to prison, the prison officials are subject to being on the receiving end of a firing squad. Accountability for everyone!

 

 

So you didn't bother to read all the thousands of cases about false confessions? A majority of the those who have been proven innocent while on death row is a result of false confessions.....

[Mooshi]

So you didn't bother to read all the thousands of cases about false confessions? A majority of the those who have been proven innocent while on death row is a result of false confessions.....

 

You know, this is the one fault of the American "justice" system I loathe the most. While there are legitimate bad guys behind bars, there are those that get pressured by a broken system to confess to something they didn't do to get a get a lighter sentence vs trying to plead their innocence. In those cases, the person doing the false accusations in the first place to even put someone in that situation deserve life imprisonment as punishment for ruining someone else's life.

 

My own family is victim to a member being falsely imprisoned under false accusations and he died. Haven't received one cent in compensation from this shame of a system and because of this, I have zero respect/trust for American law enforcement. Because of this, I'm even more in favor of the truly wicked to  die and for those who lied to get people behind bars have their own freedom stripped away.

[Admire]

You know, this is the one fault of the American "justice" system I loathe the most. While there are legitimate bad guys behind bars, there are those that get pressured by a broken system to confess to something they didn't do to get a get a lighter sentence vs trying to plead their innocence. In those cases, the person doing the false accusations in the first place to even put someone in that situation deserve life imprisonment as punishment for ruining someone else's life.

 

My own family is victim to a member being falsely imprisoned under false accusations and he died. Haven't received one cent in compensation from this shame of a system and because of this, I have zero respect/trust for American law enforcement. Because of this, I'm even more in favor of the truly wicked to  die and for those who lied to get people behind bars have their own freedom stripped away.

 

You have my deepest and most sincere condolences on your loss. That is a disgusting story.

 

But doesn't surprise me. Texas have some of the worst offenders when it comes to this. Texas Prosecutors have started to make waiving the right to future DNA testing as part as plea bargains. They have even destroyed evidence as part of plea bargains. They are also trying to destroy DNA evidence on closed cases.

 

Winning is the only thing that matters. A small kids gets murdered, and you can't find the real killer, you just have to find somebody and make people believe you did it. The answer "We just can't solve this one" isn't accepted by the public, and anybody who is remotely nuanced in his thinking would never be elected in the "Tough on crime" world.

 

Hell, even judges are elected in the US......which really doesn't make any sense.

 

 

I just don't get how you can see have a family member who experienced this and still support the death penalty.

[LAwLz]

I do not care if the death penalty was kind and painless for someone who (example) raped/murdered or was a serial killer.

I do, because I don't think it is alright to torture another human being. Yes they *might* (I say might because a lot of innocent people have been executed or almost been executed) be horrible people, but they are still people.

Making someone feel their blood stop circulating while they slowly choke to death is extremely inhumane. Even if I was for the death penalty I would still not accept such barbaric executions. The problem here is that you do not follow the basic "everyone is equal" and "treat others like you want them to treat you" rules. You try to dehumanize the convicted people and when you do that, you do not feel sorry for them no matter what happens to them. No matter what they have done, they are still people and should be treated as such.

 

Being for the DP makes you as much of a murderer as much as eating meat makes you a murderer who endangers animal species.

Yes it does, because innocent people have been executed because of the death penalty. People have been murderer because people support the death penalty. You are in fact saying that it is alright to kill some innocent people by supporting the death penalty.

You would have a point if there was an infallible way of checking if someone was innocent or not, but there isn't.

Your meat eater analogy doesn't quite work because killing an animal that belongs to an endangered species do not even come close to being as serious as killing an innocent person. Even if they were comparable your analogy still doesn't hold. A more accurate analogy would be saying someone who eats meat from an animal that looks identical to an endangered species and lives in the same area is contributing to extinction of the endangered animal.

 

You keep saying innocent people are killed but dont say how many innocents just rot in prison for life and die there any way. Im not for the death penalty the way it is now but with some reforms im all for it 

It is better to have an innocent person in prison than to execute an innocent person. Did you read the part about Cameron Willingham I wrote? He would have been alive and free without the death penalty.

Because of the death penalty, he was executed less than a year before he was found innocent. Sadly we can't ask him about his opinion, but I am pretty sure he would gladly have taken ~10 more months in prison over being brutally tortured to death.

 

i think its fine. why should i pay to feed and heat a person who has done terrible things. life sentence is very expensive. firing squad is cheaper, they should use that.

If you want to save money then you should be against the death penalty. It costs more to put someone on death row than it does to put them in jail for the rest of their lives, and it's not because the drugs they use to execute people are expensive.

[Admire]

 

Because of this, I'm even more in favor of the truly wicked to  die and for those who lied to get people behind bars have their own freedom stripped away.

 

Until those who lied(Often prosecutors, cops, even judges) are punished, I don't think the death penalty should be there. There is no deterrence for prosecutors because they never, ever get punished.

[Mooshi]

You have my deepest and most sincere condolences on your loss. That is a disgusting story.

 

But doesn't surprise me. Texas have some of the worst offenders when it comes to this. Texas Prosecutors have started to make waiving the right to future DNA testing as part as plea bargains. They have even destroyed evidence as part of plea bargains.

 

Winning is the only thing that matters. A small kids gets murdered, and you can't find the real killer, you just have to find somebody and make people believe you did it. The answer "We just can't solve this one" isn't accepted by the public, and anybody who is remotely nuanced in his thinking would never be elected in the "Tough on crime" world.

 

Hell, even judges are elected in the US......which really doesn't make any sense.

 

 

I just don't get how you can see have a family member who experienced this and still support the death penalty.

 

Mate, this wasn't even in Texas, either. This was when I was living in Georgia, but yeah.

 

The issue is way more complex than everyone behind bars should be put down. We have a crowded system with lengthy sentences, many people having their lives ruined over trivial things like smoking pot. I wish it were as easy as to give every prisoner a lie detector test, but those aren't accurate and can be fooled to give false positives as well as false negatives. For rape and murder cases, a DNA test before sentencing should be the standard, not the exception. It literally makes the difference between life and death for the individual accused.

 

As I've said before, if I had my say in justice, the truly guilty should be subject to a firing squad with the firing squad being made of the  victims family. If prison officials ruined an innocents life with false imprisonment,  they shouldn't be given immunity, they should be bound by the same laws. Not blatant an eye for an eye, but true justice. If anything, people who commit false accusations for the intent to ruin someone else's life, they should get a minimum of 20 years behind bars and this needs to be enforced, no exceptions. Human life is very precious and it makes me angry when we have people trying to take that away from someone. Still in favor of the death penalty, but only when justified.

 

If people only kept their hands to themselves...

 

As for the last bit, the reason he died wasn't the death penalty, but because he got so sick and developed cancer that he withered away behind bars and it was one of the saddest experiences in my life and I still miss him. The person who put him there in the first place, I'd be the firing squad myself. Those people shouldn't be allowed to live on this planet.

[Jumper118]

I do, because I don't think it is alright to torture another human being. Yes they *might* (I say might because a lot of innocent people have been executed or almost been executed) be horrible people, but they are still people.

Making someone feel their blood stop circulating while they slowly choke to death is extremely inhumane. Even if I was for the death penalty I would still not accept such barbaric executions. The problem here is that you do not follow the basic "everyone is equal" and "treat others like you want them to treat you" rules. You try to dehumanize the convicted people and when you do that, you do not feel sorry for them no matter what happens to them. No matter what they have done, they are still people and should be treated as such.

 

Yes it does, because innocent people have been executed because of the death penalty. People have been murderer because people support the death penalty. You are in fact saying that it is alright to kill some innocent people by supporting the death penalty.

You would have a point if there was an infallible way of checking if someone was innocent or not, but there isn't.

Your meat eater analogy doesn't quite work because killing an animal that belongs to an endangered species do not even come close to being as serious as killing an innocent person. Even if they were comparable your analogy still doesn't hold. A more accurate analogy would be saying someone who eats meat from an animal that looks identical to an endangered species and lives in the same area is contributing to extinction of the endangered animal.

 

It is better to have an innocent person in prison than to execute an innocent person. Did you read the part about Cameron Willingham I wrote? He would have been alive and free without the death penalty.

Because of the death penalty, he was executed less than a year before he was found innocent. Sadly we can't ask him about his opinion, but I am pretty sure he would gladly have taken ~10 more months in prison over being brutally tortured to death.

 

If you want to save money then you should be against the death penalty. It costs more to put someone on death row than it does to put them in jail for the rest of their lives, and it's not because the drugs they use to execute people are expensive.

it shouldn't cost more to put them on deaths row. they are just doing it wrong.

[OfficialNapalm]

I'm fine with the death penalty, but death row makes no sense.

 

It costs a lot to keep prisoners in for a life sentence, which is why I don't think death row makes sense. You're spending more to keep them in prison than to just kill them off.

[Admire]

Mate, this wasn't even in Texas, either. This was when I was living in Georgia, but yeah.

 

The issue is way more complex than everyone behind bars should be put down. We have a crowded system with lengthy sentences, many people having their lives ruined over trivial things like smoking pot. I wish it were as easy as to give every prisoner a lie detector test, but those aren't accurate and can be fooled to give false positives as well as false negatives. For rape and murder cases, a DNA test before sentencing should be the standard, not the exception. It literally makes the difference between life and death for the individual accused.

 

As I've said before, if I had my say in justice, the truly guilty should be subject to a firing squad with the firing squad being made of the  victims family. If prison officials ruined an innocents life with false imprisonment,  they shouldn't be given immunity, they should be bound by the same laws. Not blatant an eye for an eye, but true justice. If anything, people who commit false accusations for the intent to ruin someone else's life, they should get a minimum of 20 years behind bars and this needs to be enforced, no exceptions. Human life is very precious and it makes me angry when we have people trying to take that away from someone. Still in favor of the death penalty, but only when justified.

 

If people only kept their hands to themselves...

 

As for the last bit, the reason he died wasn't the death penalty, but because he got so sick and developed cancer that he withered away behind bars and it was one of the saddest experiences in my life and I still miss him. The person who put him there in the first place, I'd be the firing squad myself. Those people shouldn't be allowed to live on this planet.

 

 

But that's the big problem man......Because it can take a looooong time getting the courts to realize that the person is innocent. Look at this link (http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/node/4900#92) and see how many are freed after 10+ years on death row.

 

DNa isn't always available but people are still convicted on witness testimony or really circumstantial evidence.

 

Your solution is a great modern way to do mob justice but its not justice....especially if those family members ends up shooting an innocent person who they believed was guilty. Now you just made them killers

[LAwLz]

it shouldn't cost more to put them on deaths row. they are just doing it wrong.

I completely agree. Putting someone on death row is definitely wrong.

I suspect that's not quite what you meant though. The reason why it's so expensive is because of the EXTREMELY IMPORTANT conviction process.

If you think that's wrong then you are indirectly saying that suspected criminals should not be able to defend themselves, which would lead to a huge number of innocent being executed (we are talking about several hundreds of people here) and even more people being put in prison.

It is completely idiotic to say that the conviction process should be cut down.

[Admire]

it shouldn't cost more to put them on deaths row. they are just doing it wrong.

 

How should they do it different? "On December 21, Seth Penalver was acquitted of all charges and will be freed from Florida's death row, 13 years after being sentenced to death. He was originally charged with a triple murder and armed robbery that occurred in Broward County in 1994. "

 

So, how early in that sentence would you have killed him?