5800x3d Can these parts handle the 5800X3D?

[FluorescentGreen5]

I'm planning on upgrading to the 5800X3D at the end of the year, and am worried about whether the other parts I have or am getting will be able to handle it.

 

I'm planning on buying a new cooler since I doubt my Wraith Prism can handle it. I'm after a decent price, adequate cooling performance for the 5800X3D and a fan with blue lights to match the rest of my system. Here are the 4 I'm trying to decide between:

• https://au.pcpartpicker.com/product/r2H7YJ/arctic-freezer-a35-rgb-cpu-cooler-acfre00114a
• https://au.pcpartpicker.com/product/fNLwrH/deepcool-gammaxx-gte-v2-645-cfm-cpu-cooler-dp-mch4-gmx-gtev2
• https://au.pcpartpicker.com/product/LBVBD3/antec-c40-380-cfm-cpu-cooler-c40
• https://au.pcpartpicker.com/product/NF2rxr/antec-a40pro-36-cfm-cpu-cooler-a40pro
• https://au.pcpartpicker.com/product/VTqBD3/id-cooling-se-224-xt-basic-7616-cfm-cpu-cooler-se-224-xt-basic (with a blue LED fan replacement).

I'm mostly interested in the Arctic Freezer A35, since I heard it can handle a 3900X and 5950X, and should be able to keep a 5800X3D below 90C at full load.

 

I'm going to be sticking with my current case and motherboard:

• In Win 303
  • Will there be enough clearance for the cooler?
  • There are 3 Cooler Master SickleFlow X fans installed: 2 sucking air in from the vent on the right and the other as an exhaust at the back.
• MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX: Will the VRMs be enough for the 5800X3D?

Edited November 3, 2022 by FluorescentGreen5
Added A40PRO to List and Case Fan Details

[An0maly_76]

I think you should consider a more open-faced case. These processors run hot and you really need more airflow. That looks to be a side intake with a bare minimum of intake volume. You don't need a tornado, but to illustrate, my peak temps gaming went down 15C going from a Corsair 4000X to a Fractal Pop Air XL.

 

I'd upgrade to a B550 board, personally. I'm not saying it won't work, I just don't think I would trust a 5800 / X / 3D, 5900X, or 5950X and B450 setup. I run the Asus Tuf B550-PLUS, my only regret thus far is not going for the PRO, which has a 3.2 header the PLUS does not.

 

As for the cooler, I think four air tubes might be cutting it a bit thin. I run a Scythe Mugen 5 (six tubes to the four on the ones mentioned) and it does quite well. A four-tube might not cool as efficiently, or as well. The 5 S is nearly identical, with some improvements.

Edited November 3, 2022 by An0maly_76
Revised, more info

[mariushm]

That chip consumes less than 5800x and a bit more than 5700g  ... up to around 110 watts.

Any 125w TDP cooler would work. I'm not familiar with what you chose there, but it seems you targeted rgb coolers.

 

My Scythe FUMA 2 that  cools my 5800x would have no problem cooling 5800x3d

 

The Wraith Prism should handle it, but it will probably stay at 80-85c under load and the fan will be noisy... I went with Fuma 2 because 5800x didn't come with stock cooler and FUMA 2 is quite silent.

 

The tomohawk boards had some of the higher quality vrms on b450 chipset motherboards. It will handle the 5800x3d without any problems.

[DoctorNick]

2 hours ago, An0maly_76 said:

I think you should consider a more open-faced case. These processors run hot and you really need more airflow. That looks to be a side intake with a bare minimum of intake volume. You don't need a tornado, but to illustrate, my peak temps gaming went down 15C going from a Corsair 4000X to a Fractal Pop Air XL.

 

I'd upgrade to a B550 board, personally. I'm not saying it won't work, I just don't think I would trust a 5800 / X / 3D, 5900X, or 5950X and B450 setup. I run the Asus Tuf B550-PLUS, my only regret thus far is not going for the PRO, which has a 3.2 header the PLUS does not.

 

As for the cooler, I think four air tubes might be cutting it a bit thin. I run a Scythe Mugen 5 (six tubes to the four on the ones mentioned) and it does quite well. A four-tube might not cool as efficiently, or as well. The 5 S is nearly identical, with some improvements.

@FluorescentGreen5I agree with An0maly that the case might not be the best for aircooling. It's optimized for watercooling. I would get something like a arctic liquid freezer II, but thats a different price. Would work much better and its still cheaper than getting a new cooler + case.

[An0maly_76]

20 minutes ago, DoctorNick said:

@FluorescentGreen5I agree with An0maly that the case might not be the best for aircooling. It's optimized for watercooling. I would get something like a arctic liquid freezer II, but thats a different price. Would work much better and its still cheaper than getting a new cooler + case.

Even liquid cooled, your radiators would have to be top and bottom, that front is blowing nothing.

[TrigrH]

2 hours ago, mariushm said:

That chip consumes less than 5800x and a bit more than 5700g  ... up to around 110 watts.

Any 125w TDP cooler would work. 

No, the 5800x3d needs a good cooler!

 

A 125w TDP cooler will have the CPU running too hot and it will drop clocks.

 

Doesn't matter if its not pulling much power, the vcache makes it run hot.

 

AK620 or 280mm aio or better imo.

[DoctorNick]

20 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

Even liquid cooled, your radiators would have to be top and bottom, that front is blowing nothing.

The case is not made for front intake. You can install fans in the bottom for intake, take a look at:

 

[An0maly_76]

9 minutes ago, DoctorNick said:

The case is not made for front intake. You can install fans in the bottom for intake,

I figured it had to be something like that. But most solid-faced cases I've seen had side-draft intakes, some one-sided, ala the NZXT H510 (another aquarium).

[DoctorNick]

7 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

I figured it had to be something like that. But most solid-faced cases I've seen had side-draft intakes, some one-sided, ala the NZXT H510 (another aquarium).

This better than the H510 though, but what isn't  

[freeagent]

4 hours ago, mariushm said:

... up to around 110 watts.

People who don’t own a chip shouldn’t comment on power usage. One guy said 5600X can use 90w max because he had a bunch of review links, then I put up a screen shot showing over 130w PPT. X3D can do 143w ppt, with that much cache, 143w is a lot. I’m not saying those numbers are what it will do all the time, just saying that’s what it is capable of.

[FluorescentGreen5]

1 hour ago, An0maly_76 said:

I figured it had to be something like that. But most solid-faced cases I've seen had side-draft intakes, some one-sided, ala the NZXT H510 (another aquarium).

Yep, this case lets you mount 3 120mm fans at the bottom (unless you're using an ATX mobo which is too long) and 2 for side intake.

 

2 hours ago, DoctorNick said:

@FluorescentGreen5I agree with An0maly that the case might not be the best for aircooling. It's optimized for watercooling. I would get something like a arctic liquid freezer II, but thats a different price. Would work much better and its still cheaper than getting a new cooler + case.

Hmm, would upgrading to higher CFM case fans be a good option as well? I have the 95 CFM Cooler Master JetFlos (upgrade from my 69 CFM non-PWM SickleFlow Xs) in mind. It'll still work out to be cheaper to buy the A35 + 3 JetFlos than buying this 240mm AIO for 139 AUD, and there's a possibility I won't have to buy the new case fans either (I'll only buy them if thermal testing shows it throttling without them).

[FluorescentGreen5]

9 minutes ago, freeagent said:

People who don’t own a chip shouldn’t comment on power usage. One guy said 5600X can use 90w max because he had a bunch of review links, then I put up a screen shot showing over 130w PPT. X3D can do 143w ppt, with that much cache, 143w is a lot. I’m not saying those numbers are what it will do all the time, just saying that’s what it is capable of.

Good point, although I'm wondering if the rated TDPs can at least be used for comparing within the Ryzen lineup (the 3900X, 5950X and 5800X3D are all rated for 105W and are under the same lineup, so a cooler that can handle the first 2 should be able to handle the 3rd one in theory).

[freeagent]

9 minutes ago, FluorescentGreen5 said:

Good point, although I'm wondering if the rated TDPs can at least be used for comparing within the Ryzen lineup (the 3900X, 5950X and 5800X3D are all rated for 105W and are under the same lineup, so a cooler that can handle the first 2 should be able to handle the 3rd one in theory).

Yup. I am using a little PA120 on my X3D, probably as small as I’m willing to go. Iirc that is a 260w cooler? Something like that. Might not put out a lot of power, but it is a thermally dense package. 7nm can be a bear at the top end.

[FluorescentGreen5]

1 minute ago, freeagent said:

Yup. I am using a little PA120 on my X3D, probably as small as I’m willing to go. Iirc that is a 260w cooler? Something like that. Might not put out a lot of power, but it is a thermally dense package. 7nm can be a bear at the top end.

Nice, what kind of temps do you get with it running at full load?

 

Also, I should've asked this question sooner, but where can I find a TDP rating for coolers? A lot of coolers I find don't seem to specify it. The best I can find is a CFM rating on PCPartPicker.

[mariushm]

39 minutes ago, freeagent said:

People who don’t own a chip shouldn’t comment on power usage. One guy said 5600X can use 90w max because he had a bunch of review links, then I put up a screen shot showing over 130w PPT. X3D can do 143w ppt, with that much cache, 143w is a lot. I’m not saying those numbers are what it will do all the time, just saying that’s what it is capable of.

It was me who posted several reviews where it was shown the peak power consumption for 5600x was around 90 watts. 

edit: and I own a 5800x as can be seen in the profile.

 

You're the exception that got the chip to run at 130 watts by disabling hyperthreading and changing settings in BIOS to basically overclock your CPU. 

Not everyone's gonna do that, and don't assume everyone's gonna overclock and squeeze the absolute maximum performance. 

 

Yes, the 5800x3D does have the extra 64 MB of cache, but at the same time it's also binned better and you can't overclock it, or you can't overclock it as much, so the power consumption of the extra 64 megs of ram is not that big. 

 

Here's a bunch of reviews :

 

power measured at cpu cable : 

115-118w for 5800x3d vs 139w for 5800x : handbrake doing software encoding  

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-ryzen-7-5800x3d-review/4

 

118w for 5800x3d vs 142w for 5800x

https://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/luke-hill/amd-ryzen-7-5800x3d-review-worth-the-cache/13/

 

GamersNexus : 108w at the 12v power connector, vs 127w for the 5800x ( jump to 8:30)

 

whole system values  :   

5800x vs 5800x3d   :  69/76 idle,  107/109 single thread, 219/211w multithread  (yeah, consumes more at idle because those 64 MB have to be powered, but LESS than 5800x at multithreaded tasks)

  https://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/amd-ryzen-7-5800x3d-review,6.html

 

168w for 5800x3d system load vs 176w for 5800x stress test techpowerup 

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/amd-ryzen-7-5800x3d/20.html

 

Use the values measured at the 12v connector, because system values are tricky.

With whole system values you have to be aware that the values are measured at the wall, so the higher the power consumption the higher the losses. 

For example, Guru3D tested with a 1200w AX1200i power supply, which is around 91-92% efficient  at such low loads of 200-300 watts (not even 50% of the maximum capability of the psu).

So at idle, 76w at the wall, means 76 x 92/100 = 70w were actually going to components, and at 211w that means 211w x 0.92 = 194w was the actual power consumed by components. 

So if you substract around 50w from the 194w number, you'd get the power consumption of cpu of let's say 140w. But you'd still have to substract the RAM power consumption, because at idle the ram basically consumes less... 

 

 

[An0maly_76]

26 minutes ago, FluorescentGreen5 said:

Also, I should've asked this question sooner, but where can I find a TDP rating for coolers? A lot of coolers I find don't seem to specify it. The best I can find is a CFM rating on PCPartPicker.

Some you can directly Google this per mfr / model #. Worked for the I70 I'm using on some LGA1155 builds.

[freeagent]

41 minutes ago, mariushm said:

You're the exception that got the chip to run at 130 watts by disabling hyperthreading and changing settings in BIOS to basically overclock your CPU. 

I am not the exception.. and I did not disable ht, just enabled PBO, +200, my power limits, and my curve. If I went to a static 4700 I could get it to do 155w PPT. I don’t have a 5800X, but I have a 5900X, and with PBO etc I can squeeze 235w PPT from it. Ever since I started giving out my power limits I see a lot of people repeating them. Just food for thought.

[mariushm]

17 minutes ago, freeagent said:

I am not the exception.. and I did not disable ht, just enabled PBO, +200, my power limits, and my curve. If I went to a static 4700 I could get it to do 155w PPT. I don’t have a 5800X, but I have a 5900X, and with PBO etc I can squeeze 235w PPT from it. Ever since I started giving out my power limits I see a lot of people repeating them. Just food for thought.

Exactly ... and when you buy the processor is this stuff printed on the box, or in a manual inside? 

if I put the cpu on a A520 chipset motherboard would I even have these options anywhere?

 

We're talking STOCK behavior, just plug the cpu in and put a cooler on top. That's the default power consumption, not some numbers from your own personal experience, after various tweaks.

Don't contradict and say I'm lying or that I don't know what I'm talking about.  Of course you can play in bios or with various tools to make the CPU consume more power, for debatable performance increase.

 

 

 

[freeagent]

38 minutes ago, mariushm said:

We're talking STOCK behavior

I never deal with stock numbers because I don't run stock, ever. I am just here to let you know what is possible with air cooling

 

38 minutes ago, mariushm said:

for debatable performance increase

The gains are definitely there, much faster than stock. Which is why people like me do what they do..

[Mark Kaine]

7 hours ago, mariushm said:

up to around 110 watts.

Any 125w TDP cooler would work.

work yes, but probably cutting it real close... my 3D is already up to 125w / 85C and ive been only running cb 23 for like 10 minutes... add heat output from a gpu and this wouldn't look so rosey anymore,  i suppose. 

unless my nh u12s is better than i think it is... unfortunately cant find any reliable wattage rating for noctua coolers tho...

 

ps: seeing the debate above, my 3D is completely stock as it comes

 

 

[An0maly_76]

4 hours ago, Mark Kaine said:

work yes, but probably cutting it real close... my 3D is already up to 125w / 85C and ive been only running cb 23 for like 10 minutes... add heat output from a gpu and this wouldn't look so rosey anymore

 Hence the reason I detailed my cooling setup, I think OP will something similar whether they OC / PBO or not.

[Mark Kaine]

6 hours ago, freeagent said:

I never deal with stock numbers because I don't run stock, ever. I am just here to let you know what is possible with air cooling

 

i mean i did my homeworks before buying... every review / guide I've seen suggested 150w and yeah, am already at 125w with default BIOS and settings... its easy to imagine with some PBO trickery it goes 150w easily... and they all said you need a "beefy" cooler also suggested water cooling, but ima not put water in my pc, no, no, no ;D

 

1 hour ago, An0maly_76 said:

Hence the reason I detailed my cooling setup, I think OP will something similar whether they OC / PBO or not.

i put a metric ton of mx4, that's my "cooling setup"  

[An0maly_76]

1 minute ago, Mark Kaine said:

i mean i did my homeworks before buying... every review / guide I've seen suggested 150w and yeah, am already at 125w with default BIOS and settings... its easy to imagine with some PBO trickery it goes 150w easily... and they all said you need a "beefy" cooler also suggested water cooling, but ima not put water in my pc, no, no, no ;D

 

i put a metric ton of mx4, that's my "cooling setup"  

Too much can be as bad as not enough. Some of this stuff is conductive and you don't want it on your board or anywhere else.

[Mark Kaine]

Just now, An0maly_76 said:

Too much can be as bad as not enough. Some of this stuff is conductive and you don't want it on your board or anywhere else.

oh, yeah, but no, i watched enough "Thanks, Steve" videos to know how much paste is  "enough" : p

 

And actually its better to put too much than too little, also mx4 is not conductive as you probably know = )

 

 

[freeagent]

With some pastes, such as AS5 for example, will act as an insulator if you go on too thick. Nice and thin, but not translucent is what you want