Han Solo Vs. James T. Kirk

[DrMacintosh]

Kirk fought a Gorn. Han Solo can get lost!

 

[Mister Woof]

In tough situations, Kirk has offered his own life in exchange for the safety of his crew repeatedly.

 

He also literally gave up eternal happiness in order to help a captain and a population of aliens he didn't even know.

 

What about Solo?

[Mutoh]

1 minute ago, Plutosaurus said:

In tough situations, Kirk has offered his own life in exchange for the safety of his crew repeatedly.

 

What about Solo?

Hell get you next time, kid. LOL

[MarbleHornets]

Just now, Mutoh said:

Admiral and General are more or less similar ranks. Kirk was also Chief of Starfleet Ops which is a very high ranking position. Solo was field promoted for Endor and didnt do anything worthwhile for thr resistance after he ran away from his kid problems to smuggle again for how many decades?

 

 

 

 

I know who I would trust my life with and it isnt the womanizing smuggler with commitment problems and an aging DL-44 

I do agree there, pretty much equivalent just different branches, but he was actually promoted before Endor and he did continue to work the alliance after the fall of the empire, helping many diplomatic missions and recruitment, including helping free the wookies from their imprisonment with his wife and after became a legitimate owner of his own shipping business and it was only after his son turned to the dark side did he go back to his old smuggling habits. 

 

4 minutes ago, Plutosaurus said:

In tough situations, Kirk has offered his own life in exchange for the safety of his crew repeatedly.

 

He also literally gave up eternal happiness in order to help a captain and a population of aliens he didn't even know.

 

What about Solo?

And Solo sacrificed his Imperial academy career to defy orders and save his fellow pilots, preformed many covert and open rescue missions to save rebellion troops during and after the Galactic war, and after the war he raised his family since his wife was a senator and kept his piloting skills up by competing in races and donating the winnings to charities, and created quite the legacy for himself after the war being able to turn his life around.

[Mister Woof]

11 minutes ago, MarbleHornets said:

I do agree there, pretty much equivalent just different branches, but he was actually promoted before Endor and he did continue to work the alliance after the fall of the empire, helping many diplomatic missions and recruitment, including helping free the wookies from their imprisonment with his wife and after became a legitimate owner of his own shipping business and it was only after his son turned to the dark side did he go back to his old smuggling habits. 

 

And Solo sacrificed his Imperial academy career to defy orders and save his fellow pilots, preformed many covert and open rescue missions to save rebellion troops during and after the Galactic war, and after the war he raised his family since his wife was a senator and kept his piloting skills up by competing in races and donating the winnings to charities, and created quite the legacy for himself after the war being able to turn his life around.

None of that stuff is canon tho

[MarbleHornets]

Just now, Plutosaurus said:

None of that stuff is canon tho

Actually, it is. Its not part of Star Wars Legends and is completely cannon. If we wen't by Legend's standards, it'd be much longer list than just this.

[Mutoh]

14 minutes ago, MarbleHornets said:

I do agree there, pretty much equivalent just different branches, but he was actually promoted before Endor and he did continue to work the alliance after the fall of the empire, helping many diplomatic missions and recruitment, including helping free the wookies from their imprisonment with his wife and after became a legitimate owner of his own shipping business and it was only after his son turned to the dark side did he go back to his old smuggling habits. 

 

And Solo sacrificed his Imperial academy career to defy orders and save his fellow pilots, preformed many covert and open rescue missions to save rebellion troops during and after the Galactic war, and after the war he raised his family since his wife was a senator and kept his piloting skills up by competing in races and donating the winnings to charities, and created quite the legacy for himself after the war being able to turn his life around.

Unfortunately Disney says that didnt happen.

 

 

If we drew from trek EU we could dig further too but I figured that was cheating a bit.

[MarbleHornets]

Just now, Mutoh said:

Unfortunately Disney says that didnt happen.

 

 

If we drew from trek EU we could dig further too but I figured that was cheating a bit.

It was cannon before Disney took over though, or else I'd love to take from Star Wars legend. Then that'd make it a worth whiled battle!

[Mister Woof]

Just now, MarbleHornets said:

Actually, it is. Its not part of Star Wars Legends and is completely cannon. If we wen't by Legend's standards, it'd be much longer list than just this.

Obiwan said the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view.

 

To me, nothing that occurred after Return (in real time) counts at all

[MarbleHornets]

1 minute ago, Plutosaurus said:

Obiwan said the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view.

 

To me, nothing that occurred after Return (in real time) counts at all

I can't blame ya, everyone has their own opinion, hence the reason of this discussion 

[Mutoh]

I still want my Revan movie. Emo Revan light doesnt do it for me LOL

[PCGuy_5960]

Kirk, don't @ me

[Sauron]

3 hours ago, Tristerin said:

@Sauron after you read my response above - I have a question (and didn't want to keep editing) did Kirk travel to multiple Galaxies or is the Multiverse within the Trek fandom considered larger?

 

Now that Ive come to a conclusion that Solo only knew of his Galaxy likely...Im wondering if Kirk was a captain to the Universe travel.  VERY large delta between the two 

Kirk only travels within the Milky Way as far as I can remember - Picard at some point travels to another galaxy thanks to another character iirc but I haven't seen all TNG episodes. Generally speaking Star Trek is set within the Milky Way. They do have time travel and weird alternate universes tough, whereas Star Wars (mostly) doesn't.

 

To be clear, I'm not bashing Star Wars - I just think Kirk as a character is a better captain than Solo, at least as far as the movies go (I'm sure there's expanded canon where Solo commands the entire fleet but let's be honest, character traits in the expanded canon aren't exactly consistent - sometimes they aren't consistent even within the movies).

[Drak3]

33 minutes ago, PCGuy_5960 said:

Kirk, don't @ me

@PCGuy_5960

 

 

 

 

 

I'm a rebel.

[dalekphalm]

7 hours ago, 486DX Win3.1 said:

  Who is the better Captain Here- Really???

In a straight up fight? I’d bet on Solo every time. 

 

1. Solo has combat training, from both the naval academy and the infantry corps of a militaristic aggressive government. Kirk might have had pretty advanced combat training as far as Starfleet is concerned, but that’s a benevolent utopian-esque government. 

 

2. He isn’t above fighting dirty, or even outright dishonourably. 

 

Kirk will give it all he’s got once the fight starts, but Solo might shoot you in the back to entirely avoid the fight. 

 

3. He’s *incredibly* lucky. Like, unnaturally so. Kirk has his moments, but not that degree. 

 

If we are talking naval combat - particularly capital ship class or fleet class - Kirk was widely considered something of a tactical genius. Maybe not on Sisko’s level - but Han mostly relies on his innate skill and luck when flying in a larger battle, whereas Kirk is able to formulate complicated strategies and tactics and implement them on the fly. 

 

Legends Han Solo could do this too, but he was somewhat OP, and most of that history has been lost to the new EU, where his large scale tactical genius has never been displayed. 

[SansVarnic]

Most seems to forget that Han Solo was a General for a number of years after the Battle of Endor and commanded a fleet.

 

Not taking a side yet but I just wanted to point that out.

[dalekphalm]

4 minutes ago, SansVarnic said:

Every one seems to forget that Han Solo was a General for a number of years after the Battle of Endor and command a fleet.

 

Not taking a side yet but I just wanted to point that out.

Yes, but at least in Canon EU, we don’t really see any examples of him actually proving a tactical expert in capital ship warfare. 

 

We see many examples of this in Legends EU though. That particular period was fleshed out more and the civil war also went on for longer. 

 

Disney may well give further backstory to Solo to make this true again, but we shall have to see. 

[Mutoh]

Are we all saying that Kirk isnt beyond playing dirty? He might not shoot first but he'll find a way to shoot last. Ask the Kobayashi Maru test and Khan. 

 

 

Earth might be a Utopia but Qo'noS and Romulus arent! 

[dalekphalm]

1 minute ago, Mutoh said:

Are we all saying that Kirk isnt beyond playing dirty? He might not shoot first but he'll find a way to shoot last. Ask the Kobayashi Maru test and Khan. 

Oh he certainly will play dirty - but he still has a sense of honour about combat. Solo and Kirk are just as intelligent as one another, so that's not going to be the deciding factor.

 

We have to define the kind of encounter they have to determine who is likely to win. In starfighter combat (or small/freighter craft combat), Solo would walk all over Kirk (assuming equal technology).

 

In Naval combat - especially with larger ships, I think Kirk would gain the advantage.

 

In personal combat, I'd give the edge to Solo. But it could easily go either way depending on environmental factors.

[Mutoh]

4 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

Oh he certainly will play dirty - but he still has a sense of honour about combat. Solo and Kirk are just as intelligent as one another, so that's not going to be the deciding factor.

 

We have to define the kind of encounter they have to determine who is likely to win. In starfighter combat (or small/freighter craft combat), Solo would walk all over Kirk (assuming equal technology).

 

In Naval combat - especially with larger ships, I think Kirk would gain the advantage.

 

In personal combat, I'd give the edge to Solo. But it could easily go either way depending on environmental factors.

Kirk literally tricked Khan into letting himself being self destructed. I wouldnt say thats honorable. 

 

Starfleet H2H saved Kirk from super human aliens and genetically modified beings so I dont think its fair to dismiss his training vs something that is barely touched on in the current SW canon. Wookies are scary. So are Klingons and Augments.

 

 

Kirk also is a proven pilot and has maneuvers named after him. He is very adaptable and also uses his surroundings to his advantage. He isnt a slouch even if he does in the chair.

 

 

Mind you Star Wars ships teleport around with hyperdrive so there is always an in universe advantage in SW.

[kilgore_T]

16 hours ago, Drak3 said:

 

But Solo has a Wookiee.

kirk has a spock

[Drak3]

2 hours ago, kilgore_T said:

kirk has a spock

Meh.

[TacoSenpai]

Easy.

 

Captain Falcon.

 

 

[Drak3]

38 minutes ago, TacoSenpai said:

Captain Falcon.

 

If we're entering our own, then obviously Captain Jack Sparrow.

[dalekphalm]

12 hours ago, Mutoh said:

Kirk literally tricked Khan into letting himself being self destructed. I wouldnt say thats honorable.

None of what you just said invalidates any of my points.

 

Also Kirk didn't trick Khan into self destructing. Khan did that as a suicide attack to try and take Kirk out with him. He knew his ship was wrecked, half his crew were dead, and he himself was likely dying - they took a hit to the bridge, not many ways of coming out of that a victor.

 

Kirk outsmarted Khan. And that was mostly because Kirk has experience in Space Naval Warfare, something Khan has never done before. Khan was obviously far more intelligent than Kirk, but he thought in terms of 2D strategies, because that's the kind of warfare he has experience in from back on Earth during the Eugenics Wars.

12 hours ago, Mutoh said:

Starfleet H2H saved Kirk from super human aliens and genetically modified beings so I dont think its fair to dismiss his training vs something that is barely touched on in the current SW canon. Wookies are scary. So are Klingons and Augments.

I'd say that's pretty much a wash at best. The Star Wars galaxy (especially during the time Solo is alive) is simply a more dangerous place compared to the Federation.

12 hours ago, Mutoh said:

Kirk also is a proven pilot and has maneuvers named after him. He is very adaptable and also uses his surroundings to his advantage. He isnt a slouch even if he does in the chair.

We've basically never seen Kirk pilot a small craft (except for possibly in the Kelvin verse?), so while he's likely an excellent Starship pilot, as I previously said, if it was fighter craft or small craft (small freighters, etc), Solo is at a huge advantage here.

 

I'd say that at best, Kirk and Solo are equal pilots, if not Solo being the obvious superior pilot.

12 hours ago, Mutoh said:

Mind you Star Wars ships teleport around with hyperdrive so there is always an in universe advantage in SW.

Hyperdrive is exponentially faster than Warp Speed, so yes, that definitely gives Solo another advantage - though I prefer to assume they're using the same or similar technology when comparing them. I assume you were being hyperbolic with "Teleport around", but just in case people are less familiar with Star Wars, Hyperdrive does not utilize teleportation.