Bethesda refusing to refund Fallout 76 (at least for one person)

[corrado33]

1 hour ago, williamcll said:

Hopefully it would be like no man's sky where they actually fixed the game.

No man's sky still runs like shit. 

[ZacoAttaco]

27 minutes ago, corrado33 said:

No man's sky still runs like shit. 

Does it really? I thought the main complaint with that game was just that it's boring.

[Doobeedoo]

First pre-orders are not a great idea, just boosts companies confidence to get away with BS over and over. 

As for F76 I knew Fallout game will go online one day, potential is there, execution could've been better though. For start certain bugs and limitations just shouldn't have been present at all. It's good they're acting on it. But some things are not acceptale for such a game. I get even when fanboys get mad over shit issues. To add too, game is badly packaged and requires practically a re-download for a patch. 

They need to repair their image and show they can do much better. It's getting better but just a start, what should've been from the beginning. 

[SolarNova]

From what i've seen of Fallout 76, it looks like a good game thats buggy ...from 5 or so years ago.

 

Its not fit to be released as a AAA title of late 2018, that along with the state of the bugs, is why sh*t has it the proverbial fan.

 

 

[AlTech]

Holy Crap. How is this even legal?

 

I understand for DLC why this is the case but for a game download this is ridiculous...

[Misanthrope]

7 hours ago, ZacoAttaco said:

Does it really? I thought the main complaint with that game was just that it's boring.

Well I did tried the "one year later it's finally good! Check out this great additions!" patch a while back. It actually was kinda running half way decent for a little bit then they released another minor update that for me came with a large regression.

 

I think this has been the average experience it's quite fiddly with the settings and prone to suffering regressions which to me says it hasn't been really fixed. But who knows? It might be worthwhile to download it and give it yet another try I'm just not sure I'm inclined to anymore.

 

Also it's not at all as advertised but if you're into simulation games it's decent but you were promised deep exploration not Minecraft in space which is kind of what the game is today.

[EarthWormJM2]

This is why you don't pre-order guys. NO, it is not as bad as NMS (as some ppl on here have stated), they didn't promise a bunch of content and "multiplayer" and not deliver. It's just a bit buggy and not as streamlined as everyone wants it to be. They are trying to fit a VERY single-player oriented game and mechanics into a MMO. Hopefully Bethesda patches it and fixes everything and adjusts/makes better content like they did with ESO, I have faith in them, just gonna be a few months...maybe a year, just like ESO. I really would like to get this game, so hopefully that does come true. That or they say the hell with it and release an offline patch that allows you to play solo (lol, but I doubt it)

[corrado33]

7 hours ago, ZacoAttaco said:

Does it really? I thought the main complaint with that game was just that it's boring.

Yep. I was playing it recently (the first 20 hours are... OK, not too boring.) and on a lot of planets it struggles to maintain 60 FPS, even dropping down to the low 40s sometimes. Not to mention the hitching (game will literally pause for a few seconds) and a lot of people experiencing stuttering. 

 

Through ini tweaks, I've managed to get it running OK, but it still doesn't maintain 60 fps. Without doing the tweaks, the game freaking drops below 30 fps OFTEN. It's stupid. 

 

After 20 hours I reached a point where I have the money to buy whatever I want, but since ships are randomly generated, I can't buy a nice ship until one decides to land near me.... 

 

Also the crafting is extremely stupid. You can duplicate almost every object without even cheating. If you start with 10 of each of the base ingredients (carbon, ferrite, sulfur) you can make every item in the game through duplication using "oxygen generators". (Oxygen generators give you a stack of "oxygen" every 10 minutes or so. In the game, carbon + oxygen = 3x as much carbon, therefore you can effectively duplicate all your materials.)

[suicidalfranco]

a buggy bethesda game?

I'm shocked.

 

Also: called it.

[SupremeGOAT]

13 hours ago, corrado33 said:

 

What... EXACTLY did they advertise that they didn't deliver on?

3:11 to 5:11 Class action lawsuit is what i want to see o.o

[Cyberspirit]

I'm not a developer and, I know nothing about making games but, for such a big company it shouldn't be all that big of a task to either create or, at least use a different engine.

I'm sure it's not all that easy but they really need to ditch this old one.

[vorticalbox]

16 hours ago, SolarNova said:

This is ofcourse refering to hardcopies. Not digital downloads in which if ur prompted to, u waive ur right.

Which brings up the question, why would it matter if the product is digital or not? It is still not fit for purpose.

[SolarNova]

3 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

Which brings up the question, why would it matter if the product is digital or not? It is still not fit for purpose.

Indeed its stupid.

 

I personaly always try to get hard copies, unless i can get a game significantly cheaper digitaly, which usualy only happens with places like cdkeys. For the most part a digital game purchase costs the same as a hardcopy unless their are sales on. Which is daft, BUT atleast ur protected by normal consumer rights if you buy a hardcopy.

[Brooksie359]

15 hours ago, ZacoAttaco said:

This is insane, Bethesda should be charged with false advertising then. This product is not complete. It's a good reminder NOT TO PRE-ORDER. The only time I pre-ordered was for 'Batman: Arkham Knight', on PC. Horrible experience.

They said it was an online version of fallout so they did deliver that. Does it have some bugs? Yes but not more so than any other game they have released. You don't see people claiming false advertisement on skyrim because it had bugs on release. Literally any game has bugs on release so to say having bugs means it's false advertising is completely BS. If they had advertised it as bug free then maybe you would be right. Hell they even said prior to release that it would have bugs so your entire argument is asinine. 

[Brooksie359]

14 hours ago, Thaldor said:

LGR has IMO great video about the Fallout 76.

 

What image I have gained. Fallout 76 is like those Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel spinoffs, it's a Fallout without The Fallout. Unlike Fallouts it's build to be more player "created" stuff than world rich of stories, quests and NPC to keep them coming. This approach has also made some "stupid" things that are normal in MMOs and other multiplayer games but never in Fallout, like you find a lamp or mug that you want to take to decorate your base, in Fallout 76 that turns into a bag when dropped and if you want something to decorate you need blueprints to craft it. Then there's that skill system, no more skill trees and leveling but "lootbox"-like cards which can be changed at any moment.

 

Performance issues were expected. Like it would be a suprise that new Bethesda game that uses still the same engine made for Oblivion, that has been heavily "modded" for new releases, wouldn't cause problems, for example, just see the Fallout 4 VR release, didn't go that well. And if anyone thought that Bethesda would put on their man pants and remake the engine at last, they don't have time for that (at least that what it seems like), so get ready to OC and buy a new GPU at least for the release of TES VI. And for the Fallout 76 especially, this time things look real bad, and I mean REAL bad, performance wise. Bethesda hasn't even fixed some bugs living in that engine since Oblivion and they are not that keen to fix things before a re-release and most of the bugs have been fixed by modders (like few mods and Fallout 4 runs butter smooth on minimum specs, few mods more and it even looks better, few extra mods to fix some quest problems and few to add some cut content, then a mod that stops shader cache from overflowing and another for fun because there's already enough needed mods), but not this time at least if Bethesda doesn't release private server pack where people could allow modding.

The perks systme isn't lootboxed based. You choose the perk card you want when you upgrade a special point until you hit lvl 50 after which you simply pick perk cards but don't get to increace a stat. They do give card packs every so many levels but they honestly don't serve a purpose other than you get extra cards for free. This is what I hate about people. They critisize game mechanics when they haven't played the game or understand them themselves. I have played the game alot and have only encountered one bad bug so far so I think people are making things seem bigger than they actually are. 

[Brooksie359]

13 hours ago, ZacoAttaco said:

Ok look, false advertising was a little much. I just hate it when company's release products they know are broken and that they know should be delayed. I mean, I suppose they never advertised a 'functional and finished product' so there's no legal jurisdiction.

I'm genuinely glad to hear it.

Are you playing on PC? I've only heard issues on PC so it's good you don't seem to be having issues. Do you know what framerates you're getting? Last I heard they capped it to 63FPS because it was tied to in-game physics.

 

They use vsync by default I believe or something weird. I had my fps capped at 1/2 my refreshrate so I assumed that was the case as my 240hz monitor was set to 120 fps while my 98hz monitor was capped at 50. Not able to hit 98 fps at 4k consistently or 240 fps at 1080p consistently so it probably defaulted to half the refresh rate. I had to override the settings in the nvidia control panel to have vsync off. Now I get anywhere from 80 to 100 fps at 4k and like 180 fps at 1080p. This is at high settings mind you as ultra just trashes performance with little noticeable difference. 

[niofalpha]

17 hours ago, ZacoAttaco said:

This is insane, Bethesda should be charged with false advertising then. This product is not complete. It's a good reminder NOT TO PRE-ORDER. The only time I pre-ordered was for 'Batman: Arkham Knight', on PC. Horrible experience.

Yes I agree having a game with glitches is false advertising.

I forgot how sheltered everyone remotely connected to anything relating to PCMR is.

[Lach1230]

20 hours ago, Thaldor said:

Source: Spiel Times

 

Everybody by now knows how "well" Fallout 76 has been taken and so it's just normal that people are demanding refunds. Apparently one redditor asked for a refund from Bethesda and while the initial asnwer was:

Next day Bethesda support had decided to turn their vehicle and answered:

 

The question seems to be that Bethesda directly says in their return policy:

So, if you paid for the digital copy and installed it, you have lost your right for a refund. This is pretty normal with digital codes and they are still in the grey area of consumer rights laws and will probably stay there until someone takes some company to a court to test wether or not you can return used digital codes (At least Valve was careful when some EU countries reviewed their consumer protection laws to digital era that Steam started to offer refunds without questions if game was owned less than 2 weeks and played less than 2 hours and if you have a good reason those are very flexible limits, ie. you can return games that you have played a lot more than 2 hours like NMS).

 

Personaly I was suprised that Fallout 76 wasn't available on Steam like everyother Bethesda game, but now I can understand [folio hat activated] I could swear that Bethesda knew that Fallout 76 might not be taken well and had learned from few other "promise-big-deliver-poop" games that selling a game through Steam would cause a massive amount of refunds. I personally think there should be an option to return digital games, because NMS and apparently now Fallout 76 are a thing, $60€ and the game is not worth even half of it and you're stuck with it because the company promised you the heavens and stars and delivered a pile of poo (this is why I don't pre-order anything and usually buy everything from sales, at least I'm not buying a pig in a bag).

Kappa, lets see what happens when they deny an aussie this.

 

Last time Steam tried this the ACCC sued/fined them, and thus caused the changes to refunding a game on Steam. (At least in the AU)

[ZacoAttaco]

5 hours ago, Brooksie359 said:

They said it was an online version of fallout so they did deliver that. Does it have some bugs? Yes but not more so than any other game they have released. You don't see people claiming false advertisement on skyrim because it had bugs on release. Literally any game has bugs on release so to say having bugs means it's false advertising is completely BS. If they had advertised it as bug free then maybe you would be right. Hell they even said prior to release that it would have bugs so your entire argument is asinine. 

EDIT: Turns out this was bogus and the sub-reddit removed this for spam. Some lawyers just trying to make a quick buck. My mistake. I think it's scummy that Bethesda will not refund you if you have downloaded the game, the only way you can get a refund, is if you never actually played the title...

 

Here's a video I found this morning, apparently a class action lawsuit is in the works and news of this has been received positively by those on Reddit (no surprise there). I don't know if it will accomplish anything, they rarely do, but there must be some legal jurisdiction after all.

The below AngryJoe review was very informative. I don't get how Todd Howard can say this was the most ambitious game they've ever developed. Skyrim and Fallout 4 seemed like they required much more effort than this most recent title.

 

6 hours ago, SupremeGOAT said:

3:11 to 5:11 Class action lawsuit is what i want to see o.o

 

[CarlBar]

15 hours ago, ZacoAttaco said:

Does it really? I thought the main complaint with that game was just that it's boring.

 

I've seen some recent video's on it and most of the actual release complaints where fixed, but the video's where done by someone with a GTX 1080ti.

[Arika]

 

 

[ARikozuM]

5 minutes ago, Arika S said:

 

You've activated my trap card!

 

Bethesda be like:

 

[Cyberspirit]

9 minutes ago, Arika S said:

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

This could be a rumor but, as far as I know, the next Elder Scrolls game and Starfield will use a modified version of the Creation Engine like all the other games so, add those series to the list.

[ZacoAttaco]

4 minutes ago, Cyberspirit said:

This could be a rumor but, as far as I know, the next Elder Scrolls game and Starfield will use a modified version of the Creation Engine like all the other games so, add those series to the list. 

No, I think for Elders Scrolls, it's more or less confirmed. Quote from Todd.

Spoiler

 

[Cyberspirit]

Well, that's a shame. Modding is a huge part of Bethesda games and, I understand why they would do this but, that engine isn't cutting it anymore.

I'm sure they could use a new engine and modify it to make it easier for the modding community.