Tesla, and only Tesla, May Repair their Cars

[Blitz4]

This video reminded me of how Apple and John Deere run their service industry.

 

 

[ARikozuM]

I think the main difference is that the Tesla is radically different. Consumers and small mechanics need more protections today than ever before. 

[PlayStation 2]

Welcome to the future of cars; it happened to computers and it's going to happen to vehicles. And the same people that shit on Apple for their devices being hard to repair will be right there defending the fact that Tesla's vehicles are hard to repair.

[CatTNT]

They are electric vehicles, what did you expect? Normal mechanics don’t know anything about electric cars. It’s like a saying a nuclear powered car company is bad for not letting anyone else repair their cars. Vastly different technologies call for different experts

[MattMatt]

This is what disappoints me so much with Tesla despite being a huge supporter of the electric vehicle revolution. If their reasons were purely safety related then it would be understandable but that's not the case.

 

They appear to operate in a very similar way to Apple, not letting you buy ANY spare parts, not just the dangerous electrical components. They must do everything themselves for a large premium and because the cars are linked on the network this can cause big problems, including buying second hand. I don't know specifics but the car needs to be linked with the network to use things like the supercharger stations so use caution if you plan to buy second hand.

 

I'm willing to let it slide slightly because they are at the front of new technology and changing the world, even the tiniest slip ups that aren't their fault are blown out of proportion by the media so keeping repairs in house mitigates the risk but in the future I'd like to see 3rd party serviceability or they'll be just as bad as Apple.

[Mira Yurizaki]

How do other manufacturers of purely electric vehicles handle this? Can you only take a Leaf to a Nissan mechanic? Can you only take a Bolt to a Chevrolet mechanic?

[Terryv]

31 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

How do other manufacturers of purely electric vehicles handle this? Can you only take a Leaf to a Nissan mechanic? Can you only take a Bolt to a Chevrolet mechanic?

Most independent shops will repair your EV for non power train related parts (brakes, suspension, etc), some will also service the power train (battery, motors, etc). Parts are easily aquired from GM and others. A friend of mine who has his own shop has received training for several manufacturers vehicles and routinely services them although they are almost all out of warranty.

[Mira Yurizaki]

10 minutes ago, Terryv said:

Most independent shops will repair your EV for non power train related parts (brakes, suspension, etc), some will also service the power train (battery, motors, etc). Parts are easily aquired from GM and others. A friend of mine who has his own shop has received training for several manufacturers vehicles and routinely services them although they are almost all out of warranty.

I feel it's a stretch to say this but it sounds more like Tesla is trying to be like a luxury car brand going this route. Like how you basically have to take a Ferrari to a Ferrari mechanic (I'm sure you can take it elsewhere, but the joke is no one will buy the Ferrari from you if you do)

[Terryv]

22 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

(I'm sure you can take it elsewhere, but the joke is no one will buy the Ferrari from you if you do)

Not true at all, a lot of older Ferrari's  are indie serviced exclusively. A lot of indie shops that work on them are usually run by former dealer techs, so knowledge isn't an issue. Ferrari will also sell you any part you desire, a few exceptions exist regarding FXX cars, but you can't even take those home.

 

Ferrari has other quirks regarding used sales of certain cars (F40, F50, etc). 

Ex: say you own an Enzo, you can't just sell it to anyone. The buyer has to be vetted and approved by Ferrari. Passing this vetting process involves you having lots of money, lots of other Ferrari's and Ferrari generally liking you. Bonus point are awarded for celebrities.

 

Those cars are only released from these restrictions when they get totaled.

[Mira Yurizaki]

4 minutes ago, Terryv said:

-Snip.-

That was the only company on my mind, but either way it doesn't sound like Tesla has a good enough excuse to bar third party mechanics from working on their cars other than just because.

[Terryv]

2 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

That was the only company on my mind, but either way it doesn't sound like Tesla has a good enough excuse to bar third party mechanics from working on their cars other than just because.

Agreed, they don't.

 

I'm in the market for an EV in the next couple of years. As long as they keep this behavior going, I will not be a customer.

 

Ferrari is as crazy as they come when it comes to protecting their image. If I could one day afford one, I would probably get a lambo instead.

[Beef Boss]

No matter the case, I still think it's bullshit that tesla doesn't allow people to work on their own cars without disabling features on the car. They bought that vehicle, you should not be able to just cancel support for it because you made some changes. Make the driver liable for any accidents sure but disabling features on it that's just bullshit. And don't give me some lame excuse that it's difficult to work on an electronic vehicle, its your vehicle why be punished for working on something you own. 

[pipnina]

One of the things with cars these days, at least combustion cars, is that they are practically unserviceable compared to cars 30/40 years ago. My dad's Triumph GT6 has loads of open space around the engine and all of the components - easy to access, tear apart and rebuild. Compare that to the new Honda Civic, where there's so little space between the engine components you can basically only check the radiator/brake/cleaning fluid without dismantling the whole engine. Of course, this mainly represents an increase in efficiency (more powerful engine in a smaller space) but it also makes it unservicable to all but the most determined.

 

I am no expert on Tesla engineering, but electric cars are way less complicated mechanically (much more complicated electrically and computationally). It may simply be less likely that the problem is resolvable by the average person. Beyond the more traditional systems (like brakes, tyres) how much can someone reasonably replace in a Tesla anyway?

 

Of course, people should still have the right to attempt self repair. If Tesla sold replacement parts I would imagine a determined enthusiast would be able to replace things like doors or motors or the batteries, I just doubt it would be easy.

[TetraSky]

It kind of make sense if they aren't letting others work on it.

Tesla vehicles are still technically "new", traditional mechanics may not have the knowledge to work on them, much less some guy in his home garage.  Especially considering this is high voltage stuff.
 

With that said out of the way, if they just cut off your support or sue you for fixing it yourself without passing through them, that's just scummy. (though with the tesla comment at the end of the video, I'm gonna assume they wouldn't do that.)

If there's a market for it, others like him will pop up all over the world, just like the unauthorized apple repair stores.

The guy in the video though, might have a hoarding problem.

 

[dfsdfgfkjsefoiqzemnd]

The one thing to keep in mind is that there's a small difference between a PC or tractor and a Tesla.  

If you make a mistake while working on the PC, you may damage the components or electrocute yourself.  With the Tesla the end result can be far more dramatic.  What if the car plows into a group of pedestrians because you messed up something related to the autopilot's sensors?

 

I can understand if Tesla would for instance disable certain features (autopilot being the most obvious for the reason mentioned above) if they know an untrained mechanic has worked on the car or when one is wrecked, but refusing to sell the parts should be illegal. 

[Taja]

20 hours ago, Dan Castellaneta said:

Welcome to the future of cars; it happened to computers and it's going to happen to vehicles. And the same people that shit on Apple for their devices being hard to repair will be right there defending the fact that Tesla's vehicles are hard to repair.

But Apple devices are NOT hard to repair. Or at least not as hard as Apple/the consumers think they are. The last LMG videos about that were very interesting.

The problem is not the thing being hard to repair - a CPU is basically impossible to repair, but that is inherent to the technology. The problem ia something being artificially made to be unrepairable, or almost. Is like putting a bomb inside a product that goes off when you open it... And then blaming the person who opened because fuck u.

 

I did not watch the video,so I dont know exactly what they are referring to, but considering it is a new technology (not the cars, but the autopilot), I guess it makes sense to be more firm and restrictive. 

[Beef Boss]

2 hours ago, Captain Chaos said:

The one thing to keep in mind is that there's a small difference between a PC or tractor and a Tesla.  

If you make a mistake while working on the PC, you may damage the components or electrocute yourself.  With the Tesla the end result can be far more dramatic.  What if the car plows into a group of pedestrians because you messed up something related to the autopilot's sensors?

 

I can understand if Tesla would for instance disable certain features (autopilot being the most obvious for the reason mentioned above) if they know an untrained mechanic has worked on the car or when one is wrecked, but refusing to sell the parts should be illegal. 

The whole crowd plow would be the drivers fault no matter what, you're supposed to be awake and fully aware of your surroundings. It's illegal to have the car driving and the driver be sleeping or distracted. So no matter if you fixed it or it was brand new, you cannot argue with sensor fails because the driver needs to be in control. It's not like these cars are allowed to be operated completely unassisted by a human driver capable of legally driving. 

[imreloadin]

2 hours ago, Captain Chaos said:

What if the car plows into a group of pedestrians because you messed up something related to the autopilot's sensors?

Uhh the same things that happen when you do your own maintenance improperly and it causes an accident? You are held responsible for what happened.

What is the difference between someone messing with the autopilot sensors improperly that causes an accident and someone who doesn't properly torque their lug nuts causing the wheel to fall off while the vehicle is in motion which causes it to careen into pedestrians? If you're going down that route nobody should be able to repair anything they buy.

[Velcade]

21 hours ago, LOOK OVER HERE said:

i also did not watch the video

welcome to most of the internet.

[ARikozuM]

I think the best remedy is for companies to be forced into offering low-cost training courses (over six months or so) with continuing education every few years much like the medical field. 

[Guest]

I service and fix my John Deere myself thanks I’m a man.

[Peskanova]

1 hour ago, TimsTips said:

It's a cultural shift. Fifty years ago any man driving a car knew how to change a flat. Now, you see the millennials helplessly waiting while clinging to their cell phones. That didn't happen by accident. Government wants you to reply on them and those manufacturers want you to reply on them.

 

I do not subscribe to the theory that only an electrician should replace an outlet, only a plumber should fix a sink and only a mechanic should fix a car. I don't agree with the trend of manufacturers building a "recycle and replace" cycle for their products.

 

I would bet that I am smarter and more competent that 90% of the people building Teslas and Apple devices. If the manufacturers would make service manuals and spare parts available, I guarantee that I and many others would be able to safely service and fix those products.

[asus killer]

games as a service... cars as a service

 

repairs are big money business, most dealers make more money repairing cars than selling them.

[Peskanova]

3 hours ago, TimsTips said:

I would bet that I am smarter and more competent that 90% of the people building Teslas and Apple devices

Wow thats too mucho assuming, and someone that smart wouldn't do those statements XDDDD  

 

And no we are not on a conspiracy to dont let people fix their things , just years ago we were savages without norms, regulations , rights or rules .... with that comes drowbacks , I can repair my own tesla no one will sue you for repair your own car, because we have a technical inspection to let cars drive on the road, we can repair everything but we will loose warranties (thats a right  you see? , well sure you are on top of the wisdom ) years ago you could repair a electrical failure by yourself ... and also years ago there was more electrical fires because of that, I want a doctor to fix me , When I go to the hairdresser and tells me what style you want? I tell allways the same, you know more than me what hair style fits my hair.... I know a lot of things I think that I'm smart but first of all you need to be humble...  

[Sfekke]

On 8/8/2018 at 7:17 AM, Dan Castellaneta said:

Welcome to the future of cars; it happened to computers and it's going to happen to vehicles. And the same people that shit on Apple for their devices being hard to repair will be right there defending the fact that Tesla's vehicles are hard to repair.

Well Tesla should provide a guide or course for smaller mechanics.