Elon Musk's Tesla to build world's biggest lithium ion battery to secure power for South Australia (SA)

[LooneyJuice]

1 minute ago, mr moose said:

Outside of the leftest BS numbers that do get posted all over the place, this sort of thing is actually well researched and peer reviewed by a variety of researchers from vairous fields of science:

 

http://www.catf.us/fossil/problems/power_plants/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16425664

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21463978

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11879110

 

In short, by taking large amounts of data from hospitalizations and comparing diagnosis and locality data including samples from the air they can accurately determine trends in disease and their causalities.  This is not an arbitrary study where there are too many factors to consider, the data is sufficiently accurate to actually list individual conditions and diseases rather than a blanket "respiratory" disease.

 

I'm with you on the leftist BS, they are the biggest hold back to the human race moving forward,  if the greeny propaganda machine stuck to the truth then we would have much less issues convincing people to support more appropriate action like nuclear power.  

Sources? Data? Peer review? Facts?

 

Surely, you must be joking, what is this? A civilized discussion? 

[mr moose]

3 minutes ago, LooneyJuice said:

Sources? Data? Peer review? Facts?

 

Surely, you must be joking, what is this? A civilized discussion? 

I know,  sorry I wasn't thinking. 

[LooneyJuice]

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

I know,  sorry I wasn't thinking. 

Quite right you weren't! Next time, buzzwords, personal attacks and name-calling only.

[Dabombinable]

8 minutes ago, LooneyJuice said:

Sources? Data? Peer review? Facts?

 

Surely, you must be joking, what is this? A civilized discussion? 

Sshhhh, you'l bring the 4chan down upon us

[mr moose]

53 minutes ago, LooneyJuice said:

Quit right you weren't! Next time, buzzwords, personal attacks and name-calling only.

Yes sir,  from now on only  global warming  hitler illuminati, tree hugger crusty parent uneducated bigot capitalist socialist scum. 

 

Some people only want to watch the world burn and you can't handle the truth. 

 

 

[Jito463]

2 hours ago, mr moose said:

Outside of the leftest BS numbers that do get posted all over the place, this sort of thing is actually well researched and peer reviewed by a variety of researchers from vairous fields of science:

 

http://www.catf.us/fossil/problems/power_plants/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16425664

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21463978

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11879110

 

In short, by taking large amounts of data from hospitalizations and comparing diagnosis and locality data including samples from the air they can accurately determine trends in disease and their causalities.  This is not an arbitrary study where there are too many factors to consider, the data is sufficiently accurate to actually list individual conditions and diseases rather than a blanket "respiratory" disease.

 

I'm with you on the leftist BS, they are the biggest hold back to the human race moving forward,  if the greeny propaganda machine stuck to the truth then we would have much less issues convincing people to support more appropriate action like nuclear power.  

Far too many maybes thrown around in there.  Not to mention, the whole thing relies on models from the EPA, which has been known to be strongly leftist for quite some time now.  Also, that last link tries to tie cancer in with it.  There's been so many "causes of cancer" over the years, I can't even keep them straight.  I stopped taking them seriously, when they accused bologna and red M&M's for causing cancer (yes, those really happened).  I'm still not convinced.  I appreciate your effort, but that's not sufficient for me to accept the results.

[mr moose]

1 hour ago, Jito463 said:

Far too many maybes thrown around in there.  Not to mention, the whole thing relies on models from the EPA, which has been known to be strongly leftist for quite some time now.  Also, that last link tries to tie cancer in with it.  There's been so many "causes of cancer" over the years, I can't even keep them straight.  I stopped taking them seriously, when they accused bologna and red M&M's for causing cancer (yes, those really happened).  I'm still not convinced.  I appreciate your effort, but that's not sufficient for me to accept the results.

 

If peer reviewed science is not enough then nothing is.  There is nothing on this planet that is under more independent/widespread scrutiny than the peer review process, especially for anything published in JAMA, Nature and the BMJ et al.

 

EDIT: just to add, becasue I know a lot of people don't really understand the peer review process or they see science as an institution rather than a method. But credibility is the currency for most scientists.  They in many ways are like tech enthusiasts on a tech forum, they can sniff out a dodgy meaningless benchmark from a hundred yards and believe you/me, scientists read all of them and will be the first to point out a flaw in something (especially if it is published in a prestigious journal like nature) as soon as they can prove it.

 

 

 

 

[vorticalbox]

On ‎07‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 1:24 PM, manikyath said:

my first thought: the biggest lithium chain reaction if that thing decides to go thermonuclear X number of years down the line

or someone decides to shoot it?

 

other questions i have:

How will they deal with over heating while charging?

 

how will they charge the thing?

 

Why not just use what you're Charing it with to power things? 

 

 

[manikyath]

1 minute ago, vorticalbox said:

or someone decides to shoot it?

 

other questions i have:

How will they deal with over heating while charging?

 

how will they charge the thing?

 

Why not just use what you're Charing it with to power things? 

 

 

- i'm sure they have extensive thermal monitoring and cooling systems on this thing

 

- windmills, as described in the article iirc

 

- because wind and people's need for vaccuum cleaners and light bulbs dont go up and down simultaniously. this is essentially a solution to fix the main issue with alternative energy: you cannot decide when you produce the energy.

[vorticalbox]

1 minute ago, manikyath said:

- i'm sure they have extensive thermal monitoring and cooling systems on this thing

 

- windmills, as described in the article iirc

 

- because wind and people's need for vaccuum cleaners and light bulbs dont go up and down simultaniously. this is essentially a solution to fix the main issue with alternative energy: you cannot decide when you produce the energy.

what about solar or tidal? both of which always happen.

[manikyath]

28 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

what about solar or tidal? both of which always happen.

because solar is only during the daytime, so they'd need "something like a battery backup"  at night, as for tidal, yeah sure, but you still cant process peaks or dips in power grid load.

 

i think most of us greatly underestimate the challenges a power grid has, because it's become the norm for it to be rock freaking solid.

[Dabombinable]

2 minutes ago, manikyath said:

because solar is only during the daytime, so they'd need "something like a battery backup"  at night, as for tidal, yeah sure, but you still cant process peaks or dips in power grid load.

 

i think most of us greatly underestimate the challenges a power grid has, because it's become the norm for it to be rock freaking solid.

This video should demonstrate to people the challenges some powergrids have:

Spoiler

Yes, ^that's^ true

 

[mr moose]

27 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

what about solar or tidal? both of which always happen.

It's  called load balancing.  The load on the grid goes up and down frequently. While it can be predicted to a degree, it is something that needs to be closely monitored and so Far the only production methods that can maintain a load balance are steam turbines and hydro turbines (the momentum of the turbine holds the production steady when there is a sudden change in load.

 

Here are some good videos that explain it better:

 

 

 

So as you can see it is not a simple produce power here and use it there scenario. Although I wish it was that simple.

[mr moose]

Just now, Dabombinable said:

This video should demonstrate to people the challenges some powergrids have:

  Reveal hidden contents

Yes, ^that's^ true

 

OMG, snap, that's just too freaky.

[LooneyJuice]

15 minutes ago, mr moose said:

OMG, snap, that's just too freaky.

I fink you freaky and I... Spontaneous die Antwoord, sorry about that.

 

Also, that video is way more interesting than I thought it would be. It made me feel stressed to be in a lot of operators' shoes. Having to account for climactic events in TV shows for crying out loud. That's freakin' cool and terrifying at the same time.

[mr moose]

4 minutes ago, LooneyJuice said:

I fink you freaky and I... Spontaneous die Antwoord, sorry about that.

 

Also, that video is way more interesting than I thought it would be. It made me feel stressed being in a lot of operators' shoes. Having to account for climactic events in TV shows for crying out loud. That's freakin' cool and terrifying at the same time.

when I first watched it I had the opposite, I had a small case of cognitive dissonance. I didn't want to believe it because of the way it was presented, but at the same time my personal experience (growing up and working in the power industry) told me that's actually quite true. 

 

EDIT: that should be like "reverse" cognitive dissonance, if such thing exists.

[LooneyJuice]

Just now, mr moose said:

when I first watched it I had the opposite, I had a small case of cognitive dissonance. I didn't want to believe it because of the way it was presented, but at the same time my personal experience (growing up and working in the power industry) told me that's actually quite true. 

Oh I totally could see how that would work, even if it had never occurred to me. I mean, it's millions of kettles! MILLIONS! I felt that tingle of "holy shit, what an insight, and what a set of metrics! A whole swarm of Homo Sapiens heading for their water heating appliances!". And I know that sort of thing happens during summer afternoon spikes in warm countries with all the AC units, but the kettle thing I just find amusing. And having to balance an entire grid using so many different mechanisms, that's just cool. All that for kettles... sort of.

[Dabombinable]

12 minutes ago, LooneyJuice said:

Oh I totally could see how that would work, even if it had never occurred to me. I mean, it's millions of kettles! MILLIONS! I felt that tingle of "holy shit, what an insight, and what a set of metrics! A whole swarm of Homo Sapiens heading for their water heating appliances!". And I know that sort of thing happens during summer afternoon spikes in warm countries with all the AC units, but the kettle thing I just find amusing. And having to balance an entire grid using so many different mechanisms, that's just cool. All that for kettles... sort of.

It wouldn't surprise me if its similar in Australia. All of those fridges having to kick in after people get a beer(s) from them during half time....

[LooneyJuice]

6 minutes ago, Dabombinable said:

It wouldn't surprise me if its similar in Australia. All of those fridges having to kick in after people get a beer(s) from them during half time....

Reminds me i have to burden the power grid myself *cough*

[mr moose]

4 minutes ago, Dabombinable said:

It wouldn't surprise me if its similar in Australia. All of those fridges having to kick in after people get a beer(s) from them during half time....

Fortunately we don't have the same population density here in Aus, for it to be that bad.  Even if everyone in Victoria went to the fridge or kettle at the same time, that's only 4 .4 million versus the 60 million in the UK.   Going on grid area size, that is UK from london to Endinburg is the same as from mallacoota to ballarat.  Yes you can fit nearly all of the UK into victoria. 

[Dabombinable]

2 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Fortunately we don't have the same population density here in Aus, for it to be that bad.  Even if everyone in Victoria went to the fridge or kettle at the same time, that's only 4 .4 million versus the 60 million in the UK.   Going on grid area size, that is UK from london to Endinburg is the same as from mallacoota to ballarat.  Yes you can fit nearly all of the UK into victoria. 

Don't forget the whole of Europe fits into Australia with room to spare for more countries....

[mr moose]

Just now, Dabombinable said:

Don't forget the whole of Europe fits into Australia with room to spare for more countries....

Mind you most of that is fucking desert,  like beach with no surf and half dozen snakes to boot.

[Teddy07]

On 7.7.2017 at 2:02 PM, Julian5 said:

I'm glad he's so confident about his products.

I don't like Musk but I agree. He has my respect for that 100 day guarantee move.

[abazigal]

21 hours ago, revsilverspine said:

We're talking about someone that started a company because he was stuck in traffic. Now we have the Boring Company. If that's not something Stark would do, I don't know what would.

I have never seen the point of the Boring company. A tunnel that vehicles move through. Isn’t that a subway? But then, what else is the owner of a car company supposed to say. 

 

On second thought, maybe you are right. Both seem to have more technological smarts than common sense in that regard. 

[You_are_a_cunt]

17 minutes ago, abazigal said:

I have never seen the point of the Boring company. A tunnel that vehicles move through. Isn’t that a subway? But then, what else is the owner of a car company supposed to say. 

 

On second thought, maybe you are right. Both seem to have more technological smarts than common sense in that regard. 

Shitloads of money, disregard for common sense and a general will to create advancements in technology for the greater good. Sound familiar?