"Brexit"

[juretrn]

It's only June, and the worst thing to have happenned this year is already here. This has a good chance of sparking "leave" movements in other countries as well, and bringing down the EU. And even if it doesn't, 1/6 of the EU economy is going to be missing, resulting in a weaker union. As someone from a small member state, this scares me. What is our economy to do if the free trade zone is no longer a thing? 

 

 

 

Thanks a lot, Britain, really. /s

[Misanthrope]

32 minutes ago, Quinnbeast said:

 

Is this still a thread on UK departure from the EU? 

Alright alright I've derailed a bit, but surely you know muslim immigration was a pivotal issue here for both sides.

[Misanthrope]

33 minutes ago, Trik'Stari said:

You forget, (most of) the left is completely and totally incapable of entertaining any thought that is counter to their world view.

 

Which is HILARIOUS, considering the shit they constantly accuse everyone else of.

I know is sat that most* of the right are the ones championing traditionally left values like freedom of speech and such.

 

Spoiler

In unnecessary fairness to their side you can also be easily triggered....BAN GUNS! 

 

[stconquest]

1 hour ago, Misanthrope said:

He also called 9/11 to declare allegiance to Isis. Being homosexual was not under his control. Being preached, from fucking bird, that his entire existence is an affront to Allah probably pushed him over the edge. How can anyone in good conscience say we shouldn't even focus on the fact that he's just following orders even if he was self loathing?

 

This is why it bothers me so much, religion IS an issue. Islam IS an issue. Refusing to even acknowledge, pretending is irrelevant, pretending unchecked immigration with 0 accountability is ok, pretending anyone who even has a slightly dissenting idea is instantly fucking Islamophobic it's a big part of the problem here. 

 

I am not saying you're necessarily promoting any of this but unbeknownst to you (or perhaps you do realize) you're basically promoting the accomplice behavior of the progressive left on this that constantly apologizes for this barbaric fucking religion bent on world domination and war. Saying Christians too diverts from the problem TODAY and not historically.

You misunderstand me.  I know his upbringing played a major role in his last act.  It might not have been the catalyst.  You assumed it is the absolute reason the act occurred instead of realizing that more than a single factor could be responsible.  Any one of the factors removed, could have kept him from acting out. 

 

1.  Religious upbringing.

 

2.  Homosexual desires.

 

3.  Being informed a partner of his was HIV positive.

 

4.  Access to guns.

 

5.  ???

 

What I am saying is this problem (believing homosexuality is wrong) is not exclusive to Islam, and was even part of the secular denomination of society in the past.  

 

Try telling me over and over again that homosexuality is wrong... will it ever be accepted as truth by me?  No, it won't.  Why is that?  It is because I have a sound understanding of what sexuality is. 

 

There is violence in this world.  All over the place and in many different ways.  Why should I have to demonize a religion beyond it's already apparent misuse.  When people commit acts of violence to promote a political point of view, it is terrorism.  This guy maybe had no political drivers, we don't know for sure.  There is evidence this was personal, fueled by hatred for himself and his upbringing... IDK.  I am not a psychiatrist. 

 

What are any of us to do about a belief to justify the killing of people just for being different from you?  Educate, nothing else.  You can try to kill them all... that is laughable.  Your anger is justified, and your assumption to always filter it back to what you think the root is (in this case) is just that:  an assumption.  I know it to be ethically wrong.  Knowing when you don't know is just as important as knowing when you do know. 

 

People can believe in what ever they want.  How they commune with the rest of us is all I am concerned with.

 

Side note:  I like when people assume I am on the left...  left of fucking what? 

 

One last thing:  That call to associate ISIS.  To me it sounds like he was trying to make his action matter.  I am guessing he could not really find a good reason to carry out the assault, other than an emotional driver.  Trying to latch on to a terrorist group could just have been an attempt to assimilate the act into modern narrative parameters.  Like, I said earlier... I really can't say for sure, IDK.

 

 

[Trik'Stari]

15 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

I know is sat that most* of the right are the ones championing traditionally left values like freedom of speech and such.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

In unnecessary fairness to their side you can also be easily triggered....BAN GUNS! 

 

At this point, I liken our societies to a dilapidated house.

 

You can't fix the house because it's actively trying to prevent itself from being fixed (the government in conjunction with the media and major corporations are "the house")

 

And you can't build a new house until you've demolished the old one. Can't build a new house somewhere else because those lots are all full, and one is frozen/melting, and the other neighborhoods are too far away.

[stconquest]

48 minutes ago, Quinnbeast said:

 

Is this still a thread on UK departure from the EU? 

Oh, that's what this thread is. 

[spartaman64]

1 hour ago, Misanthrope said:

Sure, 1 person. Is not like is an opinion held by up to 30 and 40% or more of all western based Muslims or anything:

 

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/articles/opinion-polls.aspx

 

Edit: if you (or anyone) is not easily triggered I've found this hilarious:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

seems like a completely unbiased website  if this is where you get your info on how muslims are i urge you to get to know some muslims why not get it from a primary source if you wonder what muslims are like and once again asking muslims if they want sharia law is like asking christians or jewish people if they want the 10 commandments

[stconquest]

56 minutes ago, Trik'Stari said:

At this point, I liken our societies to a dilapidated house.

 

You can't fix the house because it's actively trying to prevent itself from being fixed (the government in conjunction with the media and major corporations are "the house")

 

And you can't build a new house until you've demolished the old one. Can't build a new house somewhere else because those lots are all full, and one is frozen/melting, and the other neighborhoods are too far away.

Apparently 51% of the UK thinks the same thing

[awesomeness10120]

Look, secularism, humanism, and religion all have pros and cons. That's undeniable:

Radical Secularism: Soviet, Chinese, and North Korean dictatorships.

Radical religion: the Crusades, witch burnings, stoning, etc.

Radical Fundamentalism: Extreme hatred of LGBT people and other religions, Sharia law, creationism, biblical literalism, etc.

Humanism is noble in that it wants for what's best for humanity. (which is ironic if you're a humanist and pro choice.)

PEACEFUL religion is noble in that it also wants peace and wants best for humanity. (Tell me with a straight face that people like Pope Francis and Mother Teresa are full of hate and bigotry.)

Peaceful religion and secularism want what is best for all of mankind, but the main problem is what exactly IS best for humanity.

 

[pinksnowmanshandle]

@SurvivorNVL I recall you saying that the UK voting leave was democratic. But when literally the only part of the UK that majority voted leave was England itself.

 

[SurvivorNVL]

1 minute ago, wcreek said:

@SurvivorNVL I recall you saying that the UK voting leave was democratic. But when literally the only part of the UK that majority voted leave was England itself.

 

England held the majority.

Seems pretty Democratic to me.  52%, a majority, won.  Democracy isn't perfect, but it's better than every other form of governance out there.  Leave won by 1.4M. Democracy was had.  Scotland will likely vote again for their independence and people will probably let them leave.  They stomped their feet because they didn't get their independence.  They can have it, and England will still be one of the largest economies in the world.  

[ShadowDeity]

On 2016-06-23 at 5:05 AM, Centurius said:

I also remain baffled how people keep saying that their country isn't in charge of making its own rules. The UK just like every other member has a member on the European Committee, the European Council, the Council of the European Union, the European Parliament and even the European Court of Justice. Added to that the EU can only pass legislation on areas covered by its Treaties for which the Parliament of the United Kingdom already had to agree to in the first place or they would have never passed. So no, an accurate comparison for the Americans would be an organization in which the US is represented based on its population and economic size making rules for areas which congress already agreed to hand over to the organization.

 

 

So yeah, voting leave is the best way to make sure you can no longer make decisions. 

As far as I know, yes they have a member on the council, however they are un-elected.  Therefore it isn't truly democratic. 

 

I'm not too informed on this as I am Canadian (Thank God, seems like we are the only stable country along with Australia right now..) but I believe that's what it is.

[pinksnowmanshandle]

4 minutes ago, ShadowDeity said:

As far as I know, yes they have a member on the council, however they are un-elected.  Therefore it isn't truly democratic. 

 

I'm not too informed on this as I am Canadian (Thank God, seems like we are the only stable country along with Australia right now..) but I believe that's what it is.

Texas has a movement going on again that wants to succeed from the Union and frankly if they do gain traction that's fine by me. Because then shit, that means that we can tear ourselves apart too. Wonder if that'll inspire the Québécois to try their hand at succession again. I don't really want Québec leaving Canada but culturally French and English Canadian are quite a bit different, and it would seem that some English Canadians like to kinda mock the French Canadians. 

 

*Some, like I'm not really sure how much of a thing it is in Anglophone Canada to be rude towards Francophone Canada*

4 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

England held the majority.

Seems pretty Democratic to me.  52%, a majority, won.  Democracy isn't perfect, but it's better than every other form of governance out there.  Leave won by 1.4M. Democracy was had.  Scotland will likely vote again for their independence and people will probably let them leave.  They stomped their feet because they didn't get their independence.  They can have it, and England will still be one of the largest economies in the world.  

3.8% difference if I'm not mistaken in most cases that's still with in a margin of error barely, but still technically there.

 

Anyways, I wonder how well the English economy would do if it lost North Ireland and Scotland. Scotland would be most likely to get their independence back. But harder to say with North Ireland. I hear that a lot of British Oil comes from Scotland. So there goes a large revenue source for British Exports. 

[pinksnowmanshandle]

@SurvivorNVL 

Nevermind this...

[SurvivorNVL]

2 minutes ago, wcreek said:

Texas has a movement going on again that wants to succeed from the Union and frankly if they do gain traction that's fine by me. Because then shit, that means that we can tear ourselves apart too. Wonder if that'll inspire the Québécois to try their hand at succession again. I don't really want Québec leaving Canada but culturally French and English Canadian are quite a bit different, and it would seem that some English Canadians like to kinda mock the French Canadians. 

 

*Some, like I'm not really sure how much of a thing it is in Anglophone Canada to be rude towards Francophone Canada*

3.8% difference if I'm not mistaken in most cases that's still with in a margin of error barely, but still technically there.

 

Anyways, I wonder how well the English economy would do if it lost North Ireland and Scotland. Scotland would be most likely to get their independence back. But harder to say with North Ireland. I hear that a lot of British Oil comes from Scotland. So there goes a large revenue source for British Exports. 

Their foreign investment rates for the future will increase as they move out of the E.U. and regain full regulatory control.  With or without Scotland and Protestant Ireland, they'll still be the fifth largest economy.  Hell, it's kind of incredible how fast the market adjusted as per below.  And

 

As for Canada - French Canada is largely a joke to many English Canadians.  General hostility between the two.  Texas, surprisingly, if they ever did manage to secure their independence would be the worlds 12th largest economy, and likely an economic bastion given their adherence to free-market principles and the constitution.  Utah would probably join them quickly, the Union would fracture across the South and Mid-West.  Couldn't call it the Confederacy this time around.  Would be a Conglomerate or something along those lines.

[pinksnowmanshandle]

2 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

Their foreign investment rates for the future will increase as they move out of the E.U. and regain full regulatory control.  With or without Scotland and Protestant Ireland, they'll still be the fifth largest economy.  Hell, it's kind of incredible how fast the market adjusted as per below. 

Hummm because the thing is, it sounded like the UK voted in favor of most of things that the EU brought up.

 

True though...

 

4 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

As for Canada - French Canada is largely a joke to many English Canadians.  General hostility between the two.  Texas, surprisingly, if they ever did manage to secure their independence would be the worlds 12th largest economy, and likely an economic bastion given their adherence to free-market principles and the constitution.  Utah would probably join them quickly, the Union would fracture across the South and Mid-West.  Couldn't call it the Confederacy this time around.  Would be a Conglomerate or something along those lines.

But that's okay if Québec screws Canada and itself over?

It's okay if the US tears itself apart?

[ShadowDeity]

15 minutes ago, wcreek said:

Texas has a movement going on again that wants to succeed from the Union and frankly if they do gain traction that's fine by me. Because then shit, that means that we can tear ourselves apart too. Wonder if that'll inspire the Québécois to try their hand at succession again. I don't really want Québec leaving Canada but culturally French and English Canadian are quite a bit different, and it would seem that some English Canadians like to kinda mock the French Canadians.

It's a much bigger 'thing' for French Canadians to mock or hate on English Canadians.  SOME tend to me quite rude actually.  I live in Ontario, but when I've gone to Quebec and tried to order food in English or go to a small business and talk in English I've gotten many dirty looks and from friends' experiences, they've been mocked, insulted, and outright kicked out of stores.

 

That's focusing on a minority of people obviously.  However, if Quebec eventually does separate (in the last decade the separatist movement has died down drastically..)  they would be screwed.  They can't survive on their own and it would mess Canada completely because then we have another country stuck in the middle of all our provinces.

[SurvivorNVL]

1 minute ago, wcreek said:

Hummm because the thing is, it sounded like the UK voted in favor of most of things that the EU brought up.

 

True though...

 

But that's okay if Québec screws Canada and itself over?

It's okay if the US tears itself apart?

Canada doesn't matter to me.  As for the U.S. there're some issues with us splintering and fracturing the Union.  Conservatively inclined states would become bastion free-markets in all likelihood without a Federal Govt and states rights would thrive again.  Downside is that we'd be a river through the continent and some of the east coast, the end result is that many Democratically inclined states would continue on with status quo, and eventually run themselves in to the ground, or become categorically weaker with time, allowing foreign infiltration and espionage, and thus weakening the overall continent due to incompetence.  

Really, if secession does happen, it's the will of the people, and in terms of Texas and Utah, they're some of the economically most powerful states in the Union - New Mexico, Arizona, possibly Nevada would follow-suit and many of southern states as well, giving both a large swath of railroads, water-travel, and of course air.  It's morbidly curious on my part to see how it turns out if it happened.  I'd be very curious to see which one ends up the dominant force on the world-stage.  A schism would be damaging overall when most of the largest population centers of Liberally inclined voters are in the really big, urban cities like how London pretty much put Remain ahead for quite sometime, because it's a hot-spot of left-leaning support.  

It's a tossup.

[ShadowDeity]

I might also add that Quebec tries to push it's way for everything in parliament just because of their 'French culture'.  It's fine sometimes, but it tends to get very, very annoying for the English provinces.  For example, all the provinces pay subsidies to Quebec for no reason at all... They've become the richest province now while Ontario has the highest sub-national sovereign debt in the world.  Why are we still paying Quebec again?!

 

Sorry.... my rant for the day.

[SurvivorNVL]

2 minutes ago, ShadowDeity said:

It's a much bigger 'thing' for French Canadians to mock or hate on English Canadians.  SOME tend to me quite rude actually.  I live in Ontario, but when I've gone to Quebec and tried to order food in English or go to a small business and talk in English I've gotten many dirty looks and from friends' experiences, they've been mocked, insulted, and outright kicked out of stores.

 

That's focusing on a minority of people obviously.  However, if Quebec eventually does separate (in the last decade the separatist movement has died down drastically..)  they would be screwed.  They can't survive on their own and it would mess Canada completely because then we have another country stuck in the middle of all our provinces.

From what I understand as well, culturally, the work-ethic of French Canada is a lot less efficient and more lazy all around compared to the West of Canada and the more English parts of Canada.  Prince Edward is supposed to be great, cold as all hell, though.

[ShadowDeity]

3 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

Canada doesn't matter to me.

Thanks ;(

[SurvivorNVL]

1 minute ago, ShadowDeity said:

Thanks ;(

ILOVEYOUBBY.

[pinksnowmanshandle]

3 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

Canada doesn't matter to me.  

Poor Canada.

[ShadowDeity]

2 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

From what I understand as well, culturally, the work-ethic of French Canada is a lot less efficient and more lazy all around compared to the West of Canada and the more English parts of Canada.  Prince Edward is supposed to be great, cold as all hell, though.

Mhm, in the winter they get a sh*t load of snow.  It gets cooler summers too because it's right on the coast.

 

I hope, pray to God actually, you aren't one of those Americans that think we are cold and snowy all year round.....

[ShadowDeity]

3 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

ILOVEYOUBBY.

<3